NeoGAF

NeoGAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/index.php)
-   Gaming Discussion (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Games Journalism! Wainwright/Florence/Tomb Raider/Eurogamer/Libel Threats/Doritos (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=497024)

papersleeves 10-25-2012 12:17 PM

Games Journalism! Wainwright/Florence/Tomb Raider/Eurogamer/Libel Threats/Doritos
 
[URL="http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-24-lost-humanity-18-a-table-of-doritos"]http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-24-lost-humanity-18-a-table-of-doritos[/URL]

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/kLHUo.png[/IMG]
[URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjXSI6O9lUo"]Yup, it's real.[/URL]

[QUOTE]One games journalist, Lauren Wainwright, tweeted: "Urm... Trion were giving away PS3s to journalists at the GMAs. Not sure why that's a bad thing?"

Now, a few tweets earlier, she also tweeted this: "Lara header, two TR pix in the gallery and a very subtle TR background. #obsessed @tombraider pic.twitter.com/VOWDSavZ"

And instantly I am suspicious. I am suspicious of this journalist's apparent love for Tomb Raider. I am asking myself whether she's in the pocket of the Tomb Raider PR team. I'm sure she isn't, but the doubt is there. After all, she sees nothing wrong with journalists promoting a game to win a PS3, right? [/QUOTE]

[QUOTE]Another journalist, one of the winners of the PS3 competition, tweeted this at disgusted RPS writer John Walker: “It was a hashtag, not an advert. Get off the pedestal.” Now, this was Dave Cook, a guy I’ve met before. A good guy, as far as I could tell. But I don’t believe for one second that Dave doesn’t understand that in this time of social media madness a hashtag is just as powerful as an advert. Either he’s on the defensive or he doesn’t get what being a journalist is actually about.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE]Geoff Keighley, meanwhile, is sitting beside a table of snacks. A table of delicious Doritos and refreshing Mountain Dew. He is, as you'll see on Wikipedia, "only one of two journalists, the other being 60 Minutes correspondent Mike Wallace, profiled in the Harvard Business School press book 'Geeks and Geezers' by noted leadership expert Warren Bennis." Geoff Keighley is important. He is a leader in his field. He once said, "There's such a lack of investigative journalism. I wish I had more time to do more, sort of, investigation." And yet there he sits, glassy-eyed, beside a table heaving with sickly Doritos and Mountain Dew.

It's an important image. Study it.[/QUOTE]


Youtube>GAF>Internet>GAF


Recap from shagg_187
[QUOTE]I'll do a short recap:
-Keighley surrounded by doritos followed by gaming bloggers retweeting a hashtag for advertising to win a PS3 makes Florence of Eurogamer curious.
-Florence writes an article saying how things are shady and some sound like straight up PR e.g. Wainright orgasms for everything Squenix.
-MVC/Wainwright send libel threats to Eurogamer, at which the article was edited to remove mentioning of Wainright.
-Wainwright responds in twitter "Apology accepted" and something in the vain of applying her law classes to use.
-Florence either steps down or is forced to resign to avoid any libel threat.
-Both sides deny any threat or are not talking about it directly, but twitter posts hint that such threat existed. Florence is not confirming or denying whether he was fired or he stepped down.
-GAF and 4chan combine forces to see this "standalone complex issue" alongside digital protest from Penny Arcade and more, showing what happened.
-Wainwright's profile shows she is a freelancer for Square Enix. She admitted it and denied doing any reviews for Square Enix or shilling (she is wrong. She reviewed Deus Ex, Tomb Raider and did countless previews).
-All this fiasco is too much for her and she privatize her twitter account. Next thing you know, she starts deleting tweets, videos and articles, and edits her profile to remove any mention of Square Enix freelancing.
-People find some comments of her thanking someone called Korina that used to work at Ubisoft.
-Korina Abbot used to work at Ubisoft and is currently the marketing executive at...Square-Enix.
-David Jaffe offers Keighley Mountain Dew.
-Gaming journalism.[/QUOTE]

(Thanks to Ledsen)
[B]Current articles/videos/podcasts[/B]
Wings over Sealand (Stuart Campbell) articles (second article has early summary) [URL="http://wosland.podgamer.com/a-table-of-cowards/"]1[/URL] [URL="http://wosland.podgamer.com/the-wainwright-profile/"]2[/URL] [URL="http://wosland.podgamer.com/the-players-and-the-game/"]3[/URL]
John Walker's (Rock Paper Shotgun) [URL="http://botherer.org/"]blog[/URL] (start with [I]Games Journalists, And The Perception Of Corruption[/I], includes guest post by Rab Florence)
[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S2keHyS_Ooo"]TotalBiscuit[/URL]
[URL="http://www.gamefront.com/critics-in-the-headlights/"]Jim Sterling[/URL]
Penny-Arcade [URL="http://penny-arcade.com/report/editorial-article/libel-alleged-legal-threats-and-conflicts-of-interest-the-twisted-story-of-"]1[/URL] [URL="http://penny-arcade.com/report/editorial-article/mcvs-lauren-wainwright-english-libel-law-and-the-gaming-press-why-this-stor"]2[/URL]
[URL="http://gamasutra.com/view/news/180134/It_takes_all_kinds_Video_game_cultures_weird_identity_crisis.php#.UIsiLkabGgc"]Gamasutra[/URL]
[URL="http://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2012/10/25/video-game-journalist-robert-florence-leaves-eurogamer-after-libel-complaints/"]Forbes[/URL]
[URL="http://worthplaying.com/article/2012/10/25/editorials/87350/"]Worthplaying[/URL]
[URL="http://www.giantbomb.com/news/worth-reading-102612/4426/"]GiantBomb[/URL]
[URL="http://checkthis.com/82qo"]Jason Lauritzen[/URL] editorial and [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43689232&postcount=4690"]GAF post[/URL]
[URL="http://www.rpgcodex.net/content.php?id=8579"]RPGCodex[/URL] writes an excellent summary
[URL="http://www.destructoid.com/from-a-bag-of-doritos-to-a-bag-of-dirty-laundry-237619.phtml"]Destructoid[/URL]
[URL="http://boingboing.net/2012/10/25/writer-out-of-a-job-after-crit.html"]BoingBoing[/URL]
[URL="http://www.thesixthaxis.com/2012/10/28/games-media-and-the-appearance-of-impropriety/"]TheSixthAxis[/URL]
[URL="http://www.edge-online.com/?p=70548&preview=true"]EDGE article [/URL]that was written a few weeks ago
[URL="http://www.playeronepodcast.com/2012/10/29/episode-314-102912-the-dew-ly-hallows/"]PlayerOne Podcast[/URL]
[URL="http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-10-30-editors-blog-lost-humanity-18-aftermath"]Eurogamer's Tom Bramwell[/URL] (editor who edited Rab's column) about the last few days
[URL="http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2012/10/30/rpss-position-on-the-eurogamerflorence-debacle/"]Rock Paper Shotgun [/URL]official stance
[URL="http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/gamesblog/2012/oct/30/video-game-journalism?CMP=twt_fd"]The Guardian[/URL] and a [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43779597&postcount=6783"]funny thing[/URL] related to the article
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43802552&postcount=7033"]Giant Bombcast[/URL]
[URL="http://www.vg247.com/2012/10/31/doritosgate-after-the-storm-lets-clean-ourselves-up"]VG247[/URL] on their new ethics statement
[URL="http://www.videogamesinteractive.com/2012/10/in-defence-of-lauren-wainwright.html#.UJBO4lOQmTY.twitter"]Video Games Interactive[/URL]
Kotaku [URL="http://updates.kotaku.com/post/34700873618/a-note-to-readers-about-a-story-we-have-not-yet-covered"]1[/URL] [URL="http://kotaku.com/5957810/the-contemptible-games-journalist-why-so-many-people-dont-trust-the-gaming-press-and-why-theyre-sometimes-wrong"]2[/URL]
[URL="http://www.pocketgamer.biz/r/PG.Biz/PocketGamer.biz/feature.asp?c=46231"]Pocketgamer[/URL]
[URL=”http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43850603&postcount=7574”]Videogamer.com[/URL]
Gamesindustry.biz [URL=”http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-11-02-the-games-media-must-renew-the-trust-of-its-audience”]1[/URL] [URL=”http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2012-10-31-careers-in-games-pr-and-journalism”]2[/URL]

[B]Old (but still relevant) articles/videos/podcasts[/B]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43658880&postcount=3881"]Rab Florence[/URL] (the guy who started all this) criticizing games writing since 2008
An [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43656138&postcount=3844"]old episode of CGW Radio[/URL] discussing Gerstmann-gate
Old [URL="http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/1542/pr_and_the_game_media_how_pr_.php"]Gamasutra article [/URL]on the influence of PR
Old [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43749113&postcount=5879"]GFW radio bits[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43800996&postcount=7007"]1up Yours[/URL]Shawn Elliot and Shane Bettenhausen

[B]Comments from the industry[/B]
Shawn Elliot - [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43615161&postcount=2028"]1[/URL] (aegies is Arthur Gies of polygon.com) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43616867&postcount=2084"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43616958&postcount=2086"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43641254&postcount=3019"]4[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43646003&postcount=3353"]5[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43662915&postcount=3955"]6[/URL] on the psychology of PR etc
and some more Arthur Gies - [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43651969&postcount=3722"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43653066&postcount=3754"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43653790&postcount=3785"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43654011&postcount=3795"]4[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43654269&postcount=3801"]5[/URL] and some replies [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43652978&postcount=3750"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43652697&postcount=3742"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43653773&postcount=3783"]3[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43641225&postcount=3014"]Jeff Green [/URL] on the way it actually works, and [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43736865&postcount=5590"]another[/URL] post, an [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43746659&postcount=5829"]another[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43643019&postcount=3112"]ShockingAlberto[/URL] on his view as a former games writer
Jason Schreier (Kotaku) - [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43644673&postcount=3234"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43646607&postcount=3393"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43647907&postcount=3463"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43648609&postcount=3517"]4[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43649198&postcount=3570"]5[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43649272&postcount=3580"]6[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43649402&postcount=3593"]7[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43662305&postcount=3935"]8[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43662726&postcount=3948"]9[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43663069&postcount=3961"]10[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43664591&postcount=4000"]11[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43666768&postcount=4152"]12[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43668311&postcount=4261"]13[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43716124&postcount=5259"]14[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43716607&postcount=5265"]15[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43720538&postcount=5324"]16[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43720045&postcount=5316"]17[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43719721&postcount=5306"]18[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43718513&postcount=5295"]19[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43716991&postcount=5274"]20[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43721679&postcount=5344"]21 [/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43756221&postcount=6027"]22[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43756684&postcount=6043"]23[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43757677&postcount=6069"]24[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43757769&postcount=6073"]25[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43757839&postcount=6077"]26[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43758248&postcount=6086"]27[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43758873&postcount=6104"]28[/URL] and [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/search.php?searchid=698544"]many more[/URL]
[URL="http://i.imgur.com/TQA4D.jpg"]N'Gai Croal[/URL] initial reaction on Twitter
[URL="http://i.imgur.com/JaRFA.jpg"]Chris Schilling [/URL](freelance) likes both people involved and so doesn't want to write about it
Danny O'Dwyer (Gamespot UK) on why his site won't cover this (audience is not interested) - [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43624389&postcount=2307"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43624759&postcount=2317"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43624894&postcount=2326"]3[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43652165&postcount=3728"]pastapadre [/URL]on being shunned by the industry
[URL="http://kotaku.com/5955226/?post=53920616"]Stephen Totilo [/URL](Kotaku) [strike]doesn't think this is an important story[/strike] (has changed his mind about that part, read post 9). Wants to focus on good games journalism, this prompted a [URL="http://i.imgur.com/zLQmg.jpg"]pretty funny picture[/URL] and a [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43668362&postcount=4264"]comment[/URL] about it, then Stephen Totilo enters the thread [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43674455&postcount=4491"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43675124&postcount=4501"]2[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43676667&postcount=4545"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43677149&postcount=4553"]4[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43680943&postcount=4606"]5[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43681865&postcount=4612"]6[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43682224&postcount=4616"]7[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43683020&postcount=4645"]8[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43691201&postcount=4737"]9[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43702835&postcount=4984"]10[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43706224&postcount=5054"]11[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43721055&postcount=5330"]12[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43721598&postcount=5341"]13[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43722351&postcount=5358"]14[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43722896&postcount=5372"]15[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43723375&postcount=5384"]16[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43745632&postcount=5794"]17[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43748409&postcount=5852"]18[/URL] (ignore the comment on 18, couldn't find a direct link to Totilo's comment) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43767710&postcount=6284"]19[/URL] [URL=”http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43855384&postcount=7612”]20[/URL] (in reply to [URL=”http://i.imgur.com/FPa2k.jpg”]this[/URL]
Weekend Confirmed [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43665914&postcount=4097"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43702835&postcount=4984"]2[/URL] (these two are from the podcast) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43780824&postcount=3066"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43776218&postcount=3045"]4[/URL] (comments from Garnett) [URL=”http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43896605&postcount=7919”]5[/URL] (podcast #2)
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43670253&postcount=4382"]Syriel [/URL]on his experiences of PR
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43672668&postcount=4464"]Jeff Gerstmann [/URL]short comment on swag
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43689298&postcount=4692"]Christian Donlan and Simon Parkin of Eurogamer[/URL] want to change how they do things[/QUOTE]
Nert on his experience as PR in the tech industry [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43710980&postcount=5168"]1 [/URL][URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43721357&postcount=5336"]2[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43708440&postcount=5101"]John Walker [/URL](RPS) on [strike]why the site won't cover it[/strike] (they did anyway) like his blog did
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43747929&postcount=5845"]Rab Florence [/URL]tweets
Jeff Gerstmann [URL="http://jeffgerstmann.tumblr.com/post/34442351017/do-you-plan-on-writing-anything-about-the-rab-florence"]1[/URL] (1 is from Tumblr) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43764178&postcount=6174"]2[/URL] (2 via EternalGamer, highlights some other stuff) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43764728&postcount=6189"]3[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43765457&postcount=6231"]4[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43765770&postcount=6242"]5[/URL] (3-5 are comments by Jeff in this thread)
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43780098&postcount=6798"]Christian Spicer[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43807845&postcount=7135"]MaxwellGT2000[/URL] talks about his experiences as a writer for a small site that got bigger
Dave Long [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43813232&postcount=7251"]1[/URL] [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43813526&postcount=7262"]2[/URL]
Brad Shoemaker [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43821740&postcount=7339"]1[/URL] (in reply to [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43815955&postcount=7300"]this[/URL]) [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43822100&postcount=7341"]2[/URL]
[URL=”http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43852478&postcount=7589”]Brad Lawrence (2K games UK PR)[/URL]

[B]Comments from others[/B]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43651299&postcount=3695"]GillianSeed79 [/URL] and [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43653352&postcount=3762"]firehawk12[/URL] on how journalist do criticize their peers
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43721515&postcount=5340"]voodoopanda[/URL] highlights that the issue is not in any way black or white
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43678091&postcount=4582"]Snowden's Secret [/URL]comments on gaming press reactions
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43723863&postcount=5396"]Zissou [/URL]weighs in

[B]Other relevant/interesting links and examples of PR[/B]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43645970&postcount=3350"]Examples of various press kits[/URL]
[URL="http://www.giantbomb.com/the-3ds-comes-to-giant-bomb/17-3905/"]The 3DS comes to GiantBomb[/URL]
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43699911&postcount=4941"]Letter [/URL]sent to reviewers from UbiSoft along with their press copy of Assassin's Creed 3
How [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43714935&postcount=5236"]Rockstar [/URL]handled the reviews for GTA4
[URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=43770955&postcount=6418"]Battlefield 3 review questionnarie[/URL]

Sojgat 10-25-2012 12:21 PM

"Hi my name's Rab Florence, but damn I wish it was Geoff Keighley."

madmackem 10-25-2012 12:25 PM

[QUOTE=Sojgat;43585228]"Hi my name's Rab Florence, but damn I wish it was Geoff Keighley."[/QUOTE]

How dare you use rabs name in such a sentence.

More Fun To Compute 10-25-2012 12:26 PM

[QUOTE=Sojgat;43585228]"Hi my name's Rab Florence, but damn I wish it was Geoff Keighley."[/QUOTE]

But Rab is a sexy beast.

Wolves Evolve 10-25-2012 12:26 PM

[QUOTE=Sojgat;43585228]"Hi my name's Rab Florence, but damn I wish it was Geoff Keighley."[/QUOTE]

Rab has done more for games journalism than Geoff.

ThaneKrios 10-25-2012 12:26 PM

[URL="http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/11wtpy/pretty_much_sums_up_the_modern_gaming_industry/"]http://www.reddit.com/r/gaming/comments/11wtpy/pretty_much_sums_up_the_modern_gaming_industry/[/URL]

Aegus 10-25-2012 12:26 PM

[QUOTE=Sojgat;43585228]"Hi my name's Rab Florence, but damn I wish it was Geoff Keighley."[/QUOTE]

Geoff wishes he could put out a show that's a millionth as good as Consolevania/Video-gaiden.

Zeliard 10-25-2012 12:27 PM

The image really, truly is hilarious, and very telling. Rab Florence wrote a solid article but nothing even necessarily had to be written about it. The image completely speaks for itself.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/kLHUo.png[/IMG]

Deepack 10-25-2012 12:29 PM

Read it yesterday, pretty good article. He's got a point.

Love/hate that image too.

specialguy 10-25-2012 12:29 PM

of all the problems in the world, this ranks really high on the list.

no wonder the world is in shambles.

Shurs 10-25-2012 12:29 PM

Great article.

Keighley has been a joke for years.

mxgt 10-25-2012 12:30 PM

The image cracks me up

Hero 10-25-2012 12:30 PM

So Geoff is a sell out, right?

Empty 10-25-2012 12:31 PM

rab is so great

TheOddOne 10-25-2012 12:31 PM

Hearing Geoff speak on the Giantbomb E3 podcast really suprised me, I thought the way he acted was just for show... then found out that he is that way. Like half of the people there were all looking at him like "This guy must know he is a joke, right?".

LabouredSubterfuge 10-25-2012 12:32 PM

[QUOTE=Zeliard;43585343]The image really, truly is hilarious, and very telling. Rab Florence wrote a solid article but nothing even necessarily had to be written about it. The image completely speaks for itself.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/kLHUo.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]

"Games Journalism"

Impartial and consumer focussed.

Omikaru 10-25-2012 12:36 PM

What's even worse is Rab has been taking [URL="https://twitter.com/robertflorence/status/261370457587073024"]a lot of flak[/URL] for this over the last 24 hours.

[QUOTE=@robertflorence] I'm a "piece of shit", an "arrogant troll" and will have to be wary of "enemies" if I attend any games PR events. A disappointing 24 hours.[/QUOTE]

It was a good read, and a necessary article. It's sad that the inner circle of games press has rounded on him for calling it as it is.

Larsen B 10-25-2012 12:37 PM

The article is not so much about Geoff Keighley as how the lines between journalists and PR have become so blurred that it means impartiality will always be called into question.

Games journalism is a circle jerk. Friends with PR, friends with other journalists, friends with developers.

Dantis 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

People dislike Geoff Keighley? I think he's a pretty cool guy...

HTuran 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

[QUOTE=papersleeves;43585156]GAF>Internet>GAF?[/QUOTE]

Huh? Twitter > GAF > GAF.

Can't help but smile every time I see that image!

aeolist 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

To be fair Keighley has written some really good stuff.

But that doesn't excuse shit like promising every single year than the VGAs will be better and they've heard and taken into account criticism about the show.

I don't even blame him for the VGAs being shit, God knows they'd make it the way they want to with or without him, but lending his name to it and publicly backing it every year just makes him a joke.

Castor Krieg 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

[QUOTE=Hero;43585400]So Geoff is a sell out, right?[/QUOTE]

You noticed that now?

[QUOTE=aeolist;43585560]To be fair Keighley has written some really good stuff.
[/QUOTE]

That is the sad truth - his Final Hours of... are better than 99% of material we read on the Internet.

Aegus 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

[QUOTE=Omikaru;43585520]What's even worse is Rab has been taking [URL="https://twitter.com/robertflorence/status/261370457587073024"]a lot of flak[/URL] for this over the last 24 hours.



It was a good read, and a necessary article. It's sad that the inner circle of games press has rounded on him for calling it as it is.[/QUOTE]

Not surprising at all. Need to keep that Mountain Dew flowing.

[QUOTE]Everyone stays friendly. It's a steady flow of Mountain Dew pouring from the hills of the money men, down through the fingers of the weary journos, down into your mouths[/QUOTE]

Class_A_Ninja 10-25-2012 12:38 PM

What is he waiting for in the image? Is this from a video?

CrunchinJelly 10-25-2012 12:39 PM

Read it bottom up. They should have stuck with the original article, IMO.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/rvzhX.png[/IMG]

madmackem 10-25-2012 12:40 PM

That covers about 90% of air quotes journalists in the games media, its what i hate that and the hive mind that seems to cover alot of the games media. You can almost see the weaker ones waiting for the bigger ones to ok a score for them to follow.

Dennis 10-25-2012 12:40 PM

[url=http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=untitled-129u2uwq.gif][img]http://www.abload.de/img/untitled-129u2uwq.gif[/img][/url]

Ath 10-25-2012 12:40 PM

This is a terrific article, very brave of Rab Florence to write it.

Zeliard 10-25-2012 12:43 PM

[QUOTE=CrunchinJelly;43585574]Read it bottom up. They should have stuck with the original article, IMO.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/rvzhX.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Looks like they also removed Dave Cook's inclusion, lol. He wasn't taking kindly to it. Shame them acquiesced.

Omikaru 10-25-2012 12:43 PM

[QUOTE=CrunchinJelly;43585574]Read it bottom up. They should have stuck with the original article, IMO.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/rvzhX.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]

Jesus fucking Christ.

Here's what they've added to the story as an "Editor's Note".

[QUOTE]Following receipt of a complaint from Lauren Wainwright, Eurogamer has removed part of this article (but without admission of any liability). Eurogamer apologises for any distress caused to Ms Wainwright by the references to her. The article otherwise remains as originally published.[/QUOTE]

WoodenLung 10-25-2012 12:44 PM

[QUOTE=Dantis;43585552]People dislike Geoff Keighley? I think he's a pretty cool guy...[/QUOTE]

GAF seems to have disliked him for some time, his announcements of announcements hype tweets are pretty fucking stupid.

Corto 10-25-2012 12:44 PM

If what transpires from that pic is true, to Geoff's credit, he seems rather disconsolate in that set.

Cartman86 10-25-2012 12:45 PM

[QUOTE=CrunchinJelly;43585574]Read it bottom up. They should have stuck with the original article, IMO.

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/rvzhX.png[/IMG][/QUOTE]

So what happened? I've come in mid movie.

CrunchinJelly 10-25-2012 12:45 PM

His last article for Eurogamer.

Again, bottom-to-top cos I can't be arsed to edit. :P

[IMG]http://i.imgur.com/xjj1j.png[/IMG]

madmackem 10-25-2012 12:46 PM

He just tweeted he wont be writing anymore for eurogamer since they amended the article. Understand it.

disco 10-25-2012 12:47 PM

I don't know who this Geoff guy is but he's kinda buff. Wouldn't kick him out of my bed.

Zeliard 10-25-2012 12:47 PM

Holy shit, they've lost Rab Florence now because of the editorial capitulation.

Good work Eurogamer.

Dennis 10-25-2012 12:48 PM

bye bye Eurogamer.

How nice of you to follow Geoff down the shitter.

CrunchinJelly 10-25-2012 12:48 PM

This is a really sad turn of events, IMO.

Bony Manifesto 10-25-2012 12:49 PM

Y'see, now I really want to know what he said about Lauren Wainwright...

Hero 10-25-2012 12:49 PM

Wow, Eurogamer refusing to stand by their guy and amending the article? Fuck that.

[QUOTE=Castor Krieg;43585561]You noticed that now?



That is the sad truth - his Final Hours of... are better than 99% of material we read on the Internet.[/QUOTE]

I don't pay too much attention to him but I didn't understand why people seemed to like him.

[QUOTE=Dennis;43585603][url=http://www.abload.de/image.php?img=untitled-129u2uwq.gif][img]http://www.abload.de/img/untitled-129u2uwq.gif[/img][/url][/QUOTE]

Perfect. Do movie critics ever do similar shit?

Empty 10-25-2012 12:51 PM

what the fuck eurogamer. pathetic.

honestly that the article caused such a reaction is more damning than the original article itself.

Ath 10-25-2012 12:51 PM

OK I take back my previous statement about Eurogamer being brave. They should have stood by the article and Rab Florence. What the hell are they doing?

TheOddOne 10-25-2012 12:52 PM

[QUOTE=Class_A_Ninja;43585565]What is he waiting for in the image? Is this from a video?[/QUOTE]
[URL="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rbU0mzoMyw"]Video[/URL].

Castor Krieg 10-25-2012 12:52 PM

So who is the woman that complained and what was the original part that was removed?

PaulLFC 10-25-2012 12:52 PM

What was originally written that led to the complaint(s)?

Shame that he won't be writing any more articles, I enjoyed that one.

Empty 10-25-2012 12:53 PM

rab just tweeted that eurogamer pulled it because they faced threats of legal action

jesus christ. the people named and shamed in his article are ridiculous.

Ikuu 10-25-2012 12:53 PM

[QUOTE]There is an image doing the rounds on the internet this week. It is an image of Geoff Keighley, a Canadian games journalist, sitting dead-eyed beside a garish Halo 4 poster and a table of Mountain Dew and Doritos. It is a tragic, vulgar image. But I think that it is the most important image in games journalism today. I think we should all find it and study it. It is important.

Geoff Keighley is often described as an industry leader. A games expert. He is one of the most prominent games journalists in the world. And there he sits, right there, beside a table of snacks. He will be sitting there forever, in our minds. That's what he is now. And in a sense, it is what he always was. As Executive Producer of the mindless, horrifying spectacle that is the Spike TV Video Game Awards he oversees the delivery of a televisual table full of junk, an entire festival of cultural Doritos.

How many games journalists are sitting beside that table?

Recently, the Games Media Awards rolled around again, and games journos turned up to a thing to party with their friends in games PR. Games PR people and games journos voted for their favourite friends, and friends gave awards to friends, and everyone had a good night out. Eurogamer won an award. Kieron Gillen was named an industry legend (and if anyone is a legend in games writing, he is) but he deserves a better platform for recognition than those GMAs. The GMAs shouldn't exist. By rights, that room should be full of people who feel uncomfortable in each other's company. PR people should be looking at games journos and thinking, "That person makes my job very challenging." Why are they all best buddies? What the hell is going on?

Whenever you criticise the GMAs, as I've done in the past, you face the accusation of being "bitter". I've removed myself from those accusations somewhat by consistently making it clear that I'm not a games journalist. I'm a writer who regularly writes about games, that's all. And I've been happy for people who have been nominated for GMAs in the past, because I've known how much they wanted to be accepted by that circle. There is nothing wrong with wanting to belong, or wanting to be recognised by your peers. But it's important to ask yourself who your peers are, and exactly what it is you feel a need to belong to.
2

Just today, as I sat down to write this piece, I saw that there were games journalists winning PS3s on Twitter. There was a competition at those GMAs - tweet about our game and win a PS3. One of those stupid, crass things. And some games journos took part. All piling in, opening a sharing bag of Doritos, tweeting the hashtag as instructed. And today the winners were announced. Then a whole big argument happened, and other people who claim to be journalists claimed to see nothing wrong with what those so-called journalists had done. I think the winners are now giving away their PS3s, but it's too late. It's too late. Let me show you an example.

[B]One games journalist, Lauren Wainwright, tweeted: "Urm... Trion were giving away PS3s to journalists at the GMAs. Not sure why that's a bad thing?"

Now, a few tweets earlier, she also tweeted this: "Lara header, two TR pix in the gallery and a very subtle TR background. #obsessed @tombraider pic.twitter.com/VOWDSavZ"

And instantly I am suspicious. I am suspicious of this journalist's apparent love for Tomb Raider. I am asking myself whether she's in the pocket of the Tomb Raider PR team. I'm sure she isn't, but the doubt is there. After all, she sees nothing wrong with journalists promoting a game to win a PS3, right?

Another journalist, one of the winners of the PS3 competition, tweeted this at disgusted RPS writer John Walker: "It was a hashtag, not an advert. Get off the pedestal." Now, this was Dave Cook, a guy I've met before. A good guy, as far as I could tell. But I don't believe for one second that Dave doesn't understand that in this time of social media madness a hashtag is just as powerful as an advert. Either he's on the defensive or he doesn't get what being a journalist is actually about.[/B]

I want to make a confession. I stalk games journalists. It's something I've always done. I keep an eye on people. I have a mental list of games journos who are the very worst of the bunch. The ones who are at every PR launch event, the ones who tweet about all the freebies they get. I am fascinated by them. I won't name them here, because it's a horrible thing to do, but I'm sure some of you will know who they are. I'm fascinated by these creatures because they are living one of the most strange existences - they are playing at being a thing that they don't understand. And if they don't understand it, how can they love it? And if they don't love it, why are they playing at being it?
3

This club, this weird club of pals and buddies that make up a fair proportion of games media, needs to be broken up somehow. They have a powerful bond, though - held together by the pressures of playing to the same audience. Games publishers and games press sources are all trying to keep you happy, and it's much easier to do that if they work together. Publishers are well aware that some of you go crazy if a new AAA title gets a crappy review score on a website, and they use that knowledge to keep the boat from rocking. Everyone has a nice easy ride if the review scores stay decent and the content of the games are never challenged. Websites get their exclusives. Ad revenue keeps rolling in. The information is controlled. Everyone stays friendly. It's a steady flow of Mountain Dew pouring from the hills of the money men, down through the fingers of the weary journos, down into your mouths. At some point you will have to stop drinking that stuff and demand something better.

Standards are important. They are hard to live up to, sure, but that's the point of them. The trouble with games journalism is that there are no standards. We expect to see Geoff Keighley sitting beside a table of s***. We expect to see the flurry of excitement when the GMAs get announced, instead of a chuckle and a roll of the eyes. We expect to see our games journos failing to get what journalistic integrity means. The brilliant writers, like John Walker for example, don't get the credit they deserve simply because they don't play the game. Indeed, John Walker gets told to get off his pedestal because he has high standards and is pointing out a worrying problem.

Geoff Keighley, meanwhile, is sitting beside a table of snacks. A table of delicious Doritos and refreshing Mountain Dew. He is, as you'll see on Wikipedia, "only one of two journalists, the other being 60 Minutes correspondent Mike Wallace, profiled in the Harvard Business School press book 'Geeks and Geezers' by noted leadership expert Warren Bennis." Geoff Keighley is important. He is a leader in his field. He once said, "There's such a lack of investigative journalism. I wish I had more time to do more, sort of, investigation." And yet there he sits, glassy-eyed, beside a table heaving with sickly Doritos and Mountain Dew.

It's an important image. Study it.[/QUOTE]

That's the original article, pretty sure the bolded was removed.

Omikaru 10-25-2012 12:55 PM

Apparently, it wasn't just a "complaint", but a threat of legal action.

[url]https://twitter.com/robertflorence/status/261434116224974848[/url]

[QUOTE]Also, don't blame Eurogamer for this. The [B]threat of legal action[/B] brings unbelievable pressure. I am clear on who the bad guys are in this.[/QUOTE]

John Walker (from RPS) is less ambiguous about who made what threats:

[url]https://twitter.com/botherer/status/261433971878031361[/url]

[QUOTE]Wainwright threatened Eurogamer for quoting her, and making an observation. Utterly astonishing. Utterly pathetic. Wretched.[/QUOTE]

So now we have game journalists threatening to sue other outlets for quoting them. What the fucking fuck?

This is an absolute fucking disgrace.

Aegus 10-25-2012 12:56 PM

So people now sue when they get called out on their shit?


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 10:55 AM.