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FightyF · May 5, 2007

nelsonroyale said:
GT has never been 1 car per track...the game will have at least 6....it would be the biggest load of trash ever if it had...and it should have damage...its about time for this series.

But GT played best as a 1 car per track racer. So it's just playing to it's strengths.

With 1 car per track you don't really need damage...you only take tires into account and that would be good enough.

GT:HD is something I consider a good evolution for the GT series...online leaderboards and such give you all the replayability you need.

tha_con said:
As for Tire physics, Forza is garbage, just as GT is garbage. Neither of them handle heat up well, or lose traction appropriately according to the weight and force of the car. I doubt, HIGHLY doubt, that Forza 2 is going to be much different.

Read the FM 2 thread...the tires went an extreme overhaul, they spent 3 months redoing the tire physics. I expect GT5 to do the same.

Forsete · May 5, 2007

To hell with pixel shaders and so on.. Polyphony has invented something new, per-pixel-perfect-models.

tha_con · May 5, 2007

Fight for Freeform said:
Read the FM 2 thread...the tires went an extreme overhaul, they spent 3 months redoing the tire physics. I expect GT5 to do the same.

That isn't going to change much.

No matter what you do, there will ALWAYS be situations that will be extremely ridiculous in videogames compared to real life. In order for a tire model to function correctly, it would have to calculate temp, surface composition, speed, force, and the weight of the car. I am pretty sure, no matter how much research they've done in what, the 3 months they "overhauled" it, they haven't made any earth shattering developments in tire simulation. For the most part, their tire model will still take temp / speed / weight (force) and create a pretty standard rate of wear for most situations, while giving "more" wear during some situations. But, it's not going to be entirely accurate, or even that far ahead of what Forza 1 had. You just don't make progress like that in a mere 3 months.

Ploid 3.0 · May 5, 2007

I did a lot of messing around in GTHD yesterday. Spinning and having the view facing my car. It looks exactly like the replay *minus the crap load of motion blur on the background, and that stuff where your car color bleeds on the edges (See yellow car pic just posted above). And I don't see how PD can only do one car with this detail >.> Well I guess the people that are saying it's only one car are giving complements. Yea PS2's physics might not have been that great, but PD was working with what they had. The interviews they had on GT3, and GT4 were about limits they were reaching on either the physics or the detail of the car on, get this, PS2 (i no longer have those magazines).

People saying with the power of the cell, aren't that far from the truth. It's not like PD wont use the cell, it's not like they have a option to use PC processors or anything. Cell is pretty good with physics also I hear. I just hope, no I demand they have sick online play features on GT5. If they do that, they can have my money.

Lord Error · May 5, 2007

I've never hear/read anything about GT4s physics sampling rate. Even if it's just 60FPS that by itself means little. Sampling is just one part of the physics calculation, and if the calculating algorithms themselves are not good, it doesn't matter much at what rate you sample.

I also don't see how is GT4 physics even relevant in the discussion about GTHD. GTHD is very clearly different when it comes to car handling than GT4, so it's not doing things the same way, it's not the same exact underlying engine.

Ploid 3.0 · May 5, 2007

Also I even see the interior of the car. The same as SSX posted with the shading and such. Maybe that's the only reason they modeled that. Maybe we won't exactly get a in car cam view.

SolidSnakex · May 5, 2007

Ploid 3.0 said:
Also I even see the interior of the car. The same as SSX posted with the shading and such. Maybe that's the only reason they modeled that. Maybe we won't exactly get a in car cam view.

Yeah but then why release shots like this?

FightyF · May 5, 2007

tha_con said:
That isn't going to change much.

No matter what you do, there will ALWAYS be situations that will be extremely ridiculous in videogames compared to real life.

Wait, I thought you were comparing it against PC sims? Which is it now?

In order for a tire model to function correctly, it would have to calculate temp, surface composition, speed, force, and the weight of the car. I am pretty sure, no matter how much research they've done in what, the 3 months they "overhauled" it, they haven't made any earth shattering developments in tire simulation. For the most part, their tire model will still take temp / speed / weight (force) and create a pretty standard rate of wear for most situations, while giving "more" wear during some situations. But, it's not going to be entirely accurate, or even that far ahead of what Forza 1 had. You just don't make progress like that in a mere 3 months.

There are some things they've taken into account that you didn't. FM2 will also take into account tire pressures at different points in the tire.

FM2 will actually show this info to you in real time so you can make proper adjustments to your camber. It's pretty sweet.

Also it takes into account the temperature outside and inside of the tire as well. This important because they've also taken into account tire load sensitivity. They got real world data from Yokohama, Toyo, Michelin and Bridgestone.

They've also recorded the air pressure and temperature at all the tracks as well...because that would of course affect the tires to some degree.

Then gen is nothing like last gen, and I think even comparing GT:HD to PC sims would be a mistake because all indications are that GT5 will be a complete overhaul.

InterMoniker · May 5, 2007

Jack B said:
Car physics in GT Concept and GT Four "perfect"? Don't embarrass yourself with that comment. GT 4 used 60pfs for physics calculations. Forza 240fps and Forza 2 360fps. I'm not sure about GTR 2 and Live for Speed on the PC.

PD makes the best car models in the world, but they've weak in the physics (60fps sampling) and realism category (tire smoke and no skid marks???). You make like how it handles and that's fine, but it's far from "perfect". Saying GT 4's physics were "perfect" is assinine and reeks of fanboy.

/\ /\ What the hell does the physics calculations per second have to do with the game play when calculations are over 60fps? It just doesn't make any sense :lol Forza 1 calculated the car "physics" at 240fps, but how was the game FPS? Maybe if the framerate was also up in the hundreds it would make sense.

Forza 2 at 360fps sounds like sound stupid marketing PR Bullshit. 360fps physics calculations only on the Xbox 360 Lol. Tire smoke and no skid marks doesn't affect the game play one bit.

alterno69 · May 5, 2007

That's not GTHD, i believe that's a PGR3 car photoshoped into the GTHD track.

WHOAguitarninja · May 5, 2007

InterMoniker said:
/\ /\ What the hell does the physics calculations per second have to do with the game play when calculations are over 60fps? It just doesn't make any sense :lol Forza 1 calculated the car "physics" at 240fps, but how was the game FPS? Maybe if the framerate was also up in the hundreds it would make sense.

Forza 2 at 360fps sounds like sound stupid marketing PR Bullshit. 360fps physics calculations only on the Xbox 360 Lol. Tire smoke and no skid marks doesn't affect the game play one bit.

It calculates your car's precision at 6 different times between each frame that you see. This takes into account very small details that would have to be averaged or approximated (atleast approximated less accurately) in a physics model running at a lower framerate.

An example I use is this. Imagine you are driving your real car and you blink. During the time you spend blinking, do your tires stop interacting with the road, your suspension stop adjusting, etc just because you're not receiving visual feedback? No, of course not. The same applies here. Like someone said above, at 60fps and 200mph, you cover 5 feet or so per frame. That means every force felt during those 5 feet would be averaged to create one general calculation. Forza does it at 6 times the precision, so while yes, there is still averaging, it's far more precise.

If you're familiar at all with differential calculus I'm sure you know how in numerical approximations the sample rate can dramatically affect the outcome. It's a concept similar to that.

FightyF · May 5, 2007

InterMoniker said:
/\ /\ What the hell does the physics calculations per second have to do with the game play when calculations are over 60fps? It just doesn't make any sense :lol Forza 1 calculated the car "physics" at 240fps, but how was the game FPS? Maybe if the framerate was also up in the hundreds it would make sense.

Forza 2 at 360fps sounds like sound stupid marketing PR Bullshit. 360fps physics calculations only on the Xbox 360 Lol. Tire smoke and no skid marks doesn't affect the game play one bit.

Wow...oh well I suppose you are serious and so I should respond with something serious as well...

Physics calculations can occur and will occur at 360 Hz, that is, 360 times per second.

What you see on the screen runs at 60 fps, as in the screen is updated 60 times per second.

When you are travelling at 250km per hour, 0.07km per second, that's 70 metres per second. If you were driving that fast in a 60 Hz physics and 60fps game, that's a sampling of physics for more than every 10 metres! So what if you are racing on Sebring, where the track is made up of distinct slabs of concrete?

Gotta go...will finish this later.

SolidSnakex · May 5, 2007

alterno69 said:
That's not GTHD, i believe that's a PGR3 car photoshoped into the GTHD track.

What? Polyphony released that shot on their site.

MickeyKnox · May 5, 2007

alterno69 said:
That's not GTHD, i believe that's a PGR3 car photoshoped into the GTHD track.

:lol :lol :lol
You're a funny guy.

RobertM · May 5, 2007

SolidSnakex said:
Yeah but then why release shots like this?

They scan the entire car, the inside view will come soon.

InterMoniker · May 5, 2007

WHOAguitarninja said:
It calculates your car's precision at 6 different times between each frame that you see. This takes into account very small details that would have to be averaged or approximated (atleast approximated less accurately) in a physics model running at a lower framerate.

An example I use is this. Imagine you are driving your real car and you blink. During the time you spend blinking, do your tires stop interacting with the road, your suspension stop adjusting, etc just because you're not receiving visual feedback? No, of course not. The same applies here. Like someone said above, at 60fps and 200mph, you cover 5 feet or so per frame. That means every force felt during those 5 feet would be averaged to create one general calculation. Forza does it at 6 times the precision, so while yes, there is still averaging, it's far more precise.

If you're familiar at all with differential calculus I'm sure you know how in numerical approximations the sample rate can dramatically affect the outcome. It's a concept similar to that.

Fight for Freeform said:
Wow...oh well I suppose you are serious and so I should respond with something serious as well...

Physics calculations can occur and will occur at 360 Hz, that is, 360 times per second.

What you see on the screen runs at 60 fps, as in the screen is updated 60 times per second.

When you are travelling at 250km per hour, 0.07km per second, that's 70 metres per second. If you were driving that fast in a 60 Hz physics and 60fps game, that's a sampling of physics for more than every 10 metres! So what if you are racing on Sebring, where the track is made up of distinct slabs of concrete?

Gotta go...will finish this later.

Oh shit thanks Fight for Freeform and WHOAguitarninja you really put it into context for me.

Ploid 3.0 · May 5, 2007

Yea I really really hope in car view is in GT5. About dmg, some car dmg in other games don't effect the performance (Motorstorm -the fact you can crash out for example). It's usually for visual unless you gotta pay for repairs after a race. If GT do dmg I hope it effect you throught the race. It will give a consequence for playing dumb. Get off the track? Sand all over your tires + you lost time/speed.

JeStaH · May 5, 2007

tha_con said:
Saying GT4 had perfect physics is stupid, but thinking that Forza (even Forza 2 for that matter) can even be GROUPED with GTR or LFS is just as stupid.

Forza and GT are both bullshit when it comes to physics, and NEITHER of them come close to PC sims, pull your head out of your ass.

As for Tire physics, Forza is garbage, just as GT is garbage. Neither of them handle heat up well, or lose traction appropriately according to the weight and force of the car. I doubt, HIGHLY doubt, that Forza 2 is going to be much different.

Have you even played forza for any period of time? EVERY car handles differently. Each has a subtle but distinct feel. Even minor modifications to the same car comes through in the physics model. Heat of the tires if modeled as well as tire wear with a bunch of other things all you have to do is view the telemetry data and play the game with all aids off and an open mind.

I've played and enjoyed PC sims since Indy Car racing and up to GPL, GTR, LFS etc and I love them. But this elitist PC sim shit is just ridiculous. Just because it's on a console you can't accurately "simulate" car physics? Why is that? Because of power of the PC's versus consoles? I call bullshit.. The Xbox was what a P3 700 plus a Gforce 2/3 card? Grand Prix Legends arguably still one of the best simulations out there ran on much, much weaker hardware.

As far as GTHD it looks ****ing amazing!!!! They obviously are the best at "simulating" what cars looks like. If they are able to put this type of attention to detail in their physics model and game play, which I'm confident they will. Then I'll be all over a PS3 when GT5 releases.

We should embrace and welcome competition instead of shitting on it. It's us racing fans who benefit in the end!

Ranger X · May 5, 2007

THEY BETTER PUT A COCKPIT VIEW IN GT5.

It's been since the early years of the PS1 decent racers are having a cockpit view. They absolutely need to get with the times there.
Anyways, there supposedly is a cockpit view in GT5.

(Just warning you as i am passing by you Polyphony guys.)

SolidSnakex · May 5, 2007

Ploid 3.0 said:
Yea I really really hope in car view is in GT5. About dmg, some car dmg in other games don't effect the performance (Motorstorm -the fact you can crash out for example). It's usually for visual unless you gotta pay for repairs after a race. If GT do dmg I hope it effect you throught the race. It will give a consequence for playing dumb. Get off the track? Sand all over your tires + you lost time/speed.

It's going to have damage the question is how much. Since though manufacturers have started to allow damage they put restrictions on what they allow.

alterno69 · May 5, 2007

SolidSnakex said:
What? Polyphony released that shot on their site.

Oh then sorry, i saw it on another board weeks ago and had the idea it was photoshoped cause it looks a lot like the PGR3 interiors. I had no idea it was taken from the developers site

PjotrStroganov · May 5, 2007

Ranger X said:
THEY BETTER PUT A COCKPIT VIEW IN GT5.

It's been since the early years of the PS1 decent racers are having a cockpit view. They absolutely need to get with the times there.
Anyways, there supposedly is a cockpit view in GT5.

(Just warning you as i am passing by you Polyphony guys.)

Like Forza 2 no?

mr_nothin · May 5, 2007

PjotrStroganov said:
Like Forza 2 no?

jett · May 5, 2007

PjotrStroganov said:
Like Forza 2 no?

ahuahuahua

I remember when someone said there was no way GT5 would ever have rendered interiors. Funny times.

SolidSnakex · May 5, 2007

Racing games should have incar views now. It makes a big difference in the immersion you get when playing a racer and given that more and more racers are going realistic that should be as important as some other features. I'm sure it takes awhile though (Kaz has mentioned they up to a car taking over a month to model).

nelsonroyale · May 5, 2007

Ranger X said:
THEY BETTER PUT A COCKPIT VIEW IN GT5.

It's been since the early years of the PS1 decent racers are having a cockpit view. They absolutely need to get with the times there.
Anyways, there supposedly is a cockpit view in GT5.

(Just warning you as i am passing by you Polyphony guys.)

yes!

Doom_Bringer · May 5, 2007

when your game has about 300 cars it's impossible to have the interiors UNLESS PD's got some sweatshop where modelers are whipped into modeling all the different interiors

BTW this game needs soft shadows. Those jaggy shadows are annoying! It's also funny how many 360 games use soft shadows while PS3 game don't xD

antiloop · May 5, 2007

Doom_Bringer said:
when your game has about 300 cars it's impossible to have the interiors UNLESS PD's got some sweatshop where modelers are whipped into modeling all the different interiors

BTW this game needs soft shadows. Those jaggy shadows are annoying! It's also funny how many 360 games use soft shadows while PS3 game don't xD

See NGS. 60 FPS, soft and self shadows too.

360 game that beats that?

Edit: I agree about GT. But I wouldn't complain if they concentrated on content instead.

WHOAguitarninja · May 5, 2007

antiloop said:
See NGS. 60 FPS and self shadows too.

360 game that beats that?

Edit: I agree about GT. But I wouldn't complain if they concentrated on content instead.

He said soft, not self. Plenty of games have self shadows.

Ynos Yrros · May 5, 2007

WHOAguitarninja said:
He said soft, not self. Plenty of games have self shadows.

He said self shadows too, meaning that it has them AND soft shadows.

JeStaH · May 5, 2007

SolidSnakex said:
Racing games should have incar views now. It makes a big difference in the immersion you get when playing a racer and given that more and more racers are going realistic that should be as important as some other features. I'm sure it takes awhile though (Kaz has mentioned they up to a car taking over a month to model).

Agreed cockpit views should be standard now as an option. Too bad Forza 2 doesn't have it, though personally It hardly bothers me. PG3's cockpit view while amazing looking is still too limiting. I try it for a while but always end up switching to first person view because sometimes you just can't see shit!

I think outside of open wheel racer cockpits, F355 challenge has the best semi/cockpit view. It gave you the best field of view and yet still made you feel like you were inside the car. I'm hoping someone will try to copy that instead of "boxing" you in a 3d cockpit.

disappeared · May 5, 2007

bouc_emissaire said:
Comparison Updated (and i deleted the Skyline, sorry) :

That is absolutely insane. I'm not a big car (game) fan myself, but the attention to detail is just amazing. Polyphony works in mysterious ways.

Fun Factor · May 6, 2007

disappeared said:
That is absolutely insane. I'm not a big car (game) fan myself, but the attention to detail is just amazing. Polyphony works in mysterious ways.

yeah I completely agree, Polyphony is on another level.

If you replace the GTHD pics with the current Forza 2 pics, then you can clearly see which is a video game & which is a photo of real life.

Apex · May 6, 2007

Doom_Bringer said:
when your game has about 300 cars it's impossible to have the interiors UNLESS PD's got some sweatshop where modelers are whipped into modeling all the different interiors

BTW this game needs soft shadows. Those jaggy shadows are annoying! It's also funny how many 360 games use soft shadows while PS3 game don't xD

GT5 car conversion:
http://www.gametrailers.com/viewnews.php?id=4134

Always soft shadowns = unrealistic cloudy lighting, no thanks.

About the physics rate:

With the next generation of technology almost upon us, how do you hope to use that to push the envelope of the driving genre?

Kazunori: Let's take the category of car physics: currently in GT4 on the PS2, the calculations for car physics are done sixty times a second, the same as the framerate. But with the next generation coming and higher specifications, we think this could change to 300 times per second or even 600 times per second.

Those changes will be significant in how players relate to car physics, car simulation and feedback. link

He says Polyphony is already experimenting with running its current physics simulation at many more cycles per second -- 300 or 600, compared to 60 in GT4 -- and getting impressive results in the process, but current hardware can't handle that and draw a good-looking game at the same time. link

Stabby McSter · May 6, 2007

kiz_ said:
GT:HD> F:MS 2

why can't we have a gt thread without mentioning forza, and vice versa?

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

Apex said:
GT5 car conversion:
http://www.gametrailers.com/viewnews.php?id=4134

Always soft shadowns = unrealistic cloudy lighting, no thanks.

About the physics rate:

I hope they really push for the 600times per second. That should be insane.

PjotrStroganov · May 6, 2007

Really, Forza 2 doesn't seem to be suffering from the lack of a cockpit view. It adds to the immersiveness of a game but in reality it really doesn't seem to work on a console. Unless they made the view fully customisable it would be nice but most devs seem quite hesitant to implement some custom camera control.

The energy, time and money spend making cockpit views for cars would be much better spend for other things. I'd rather have 8/10+ cars on track instead of 6 cars if it means the cockpit view isn't in the game.

It would be nice however, to see the cockpit view being combined with the sixaxis controls. A free-look option would add immensely to the immersive feeling during racing. I would also counter the limited field of view that comes with playing a racing game from a bumper or cockpit view.

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

I'm not sure why having an incar view would ever have any effect on how many cars you have a track at one time. Polyphony seems to be big enough to handle doing alot of different functions for the game at a time, so its not like the incar view is going to hurt another part of the game. They seem to be looking to add alot of what people have asked for with this game and incar views should be near the top of the list.

PjotrStroganov · May 6, 2007

Just a matter of more textures and whatnot that have to be loaded in the memory is it not? In the end you are going to be limited by it.

Ah I now see what you mean. When it comes to manpower I guess it wouldn't matter when they can make the team larger when they want it.

I kind of screwed op my post by editing it wrongly. I meant that a combination of hardware limitation (memory etc) and manpower will cause the game to be better of without a cockpit view.

JeStaH · May 6, 2007

Apex said:
GT5 car conversion:
http://www.gametrailers.com/viewnews.php?id=4134

Always soft shadowns = unrealistic cloudy lighting, no thanks.

About the physics rate:

Wow they scan the whole car? That's crazy... Is that how they all do it or is this something PD does to get ultra detailed and accurate car models?

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

Better shots of that car that'll be in GT5

Kaz

ThirdEye · May 6, 2007

Apex said:
GT5 car conversion:
http://www.gametrailers.com/viewnews.php?id=4134

Always soft shadowns = unrealistic cloudy lighting, no thanks.

About the physics rate:

That interview is from 2004, the "current gen" he talks about is PS2. And I'm impressed by his another comment:

Kazunori: Let's take the category of car physics: currently in GT4 on the PS2, the calculations for car physics are done sixty times a second, the same as the framerate. But with the next generation coming and higher specifications, we think this could change to 300 times per second or even 600 times per second.

Those changes will be significant in how players relate to car physics, car simulation and feedback. Another aspect is the graphics: for GT4 it's nice, it's very pretty... For a game.

Yes, just a little...

Kazunori: But again in the next generation the target will obviously be to bring that to another stage, another step, where it will be prettier than reality. What I mean by that is, for example, take the environment and atmosphere seen in the Grand Canyon course. There's times when you can see the same scenery with perfect lighting and maybe only once in a hundred years do you see something like that.

We have the advantage of being able to provide that in a virtual world and that supercedes reality in those terms. We hope to recreate a very beautiful atmosphere with the advantages of next generation technology.

GT5 will be incredible, no doubt.

p3tran · May 6, 2007

Apex said:
GT5 car conversion:
http://www.gametrailers.com/viewnews.php?id=4134

Always soft shadowns = unrealistic cloudy lighting, no thanks.

About the physics rate:

With the next generation of technology almost upon us, how do you hope to use that to push the envelope of the driving genre?

Kazunori: Let's take the category of car physics: currently in GT4 on the PS2, the calculations for car physics are done sixty times a second, the same as the framerate. But with the next generation coming and higher specifications, we think this could change to 300 times per second or even 600 times per second.

Those changes will be significant in how players relate to car physics, car simulation and feedback. link

He says Polyphony is already experimenting with running its current physics simulation at many more cycles per second -- 300 or 600, compared to 60 in GT4 -- and getting impressive results in the process, but current hardware can't handle that and draw a good-looking game at the same time. link

Click to expand...

I guess kazunori says 60 frames physics for GT4.

gthd doesnt seem to have more than that, too.
300 or 600 for GT5 would be really sweet!! 8)
also I was unaware of the laser scanning shit! very cool. 8)

ty apex

Apex · May 6, 2007

p3tran said:
gthd doesnt seem to have more than that, too.

I don't think 60 frames the handling feel smother in GTHD, better feel of the car too.

BTW a work in progress new engine.

On the topic of the GTHD Concept demo itself, Yamauchi revealed that the Christmas Eve download will include Polyphony's next generation driving simulation engine. According to the producer, this engine fixes such areas as drift control and drift angle. link

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

This should make alot of people happy, Kaz confirming there will be body mods in GT5 (note this was an interview for GTHD)

IGN: What kind of customization will we be able to see in Gran Turismo HD? Will we be able to see a deeper level of customization than what has been seen in previous GT games? Like, will we be able to tune the aero parts of the car and add vinyls? Or will this newest GT continue to focus mainly on engine and suspension tuning?

Kazunori: (Brings up GT HD's car-select screen and selects a Skyline - which just so happens to fill up the entire screen.) We may not be able to provide this immediately off the bat when we launch, but the cars we are designing/modeling for PS3... you see that line separating the bumper from the body? That (bumper) comes off. Again, previously a car model in GT 4, it was one skin. Now you can take parts off, because the cars are made up of components. So for this Skyline, for instance, you can take off the front bumper and replace it with something else.

IGN: Is the plan to get licensed aero kits like C-West and Mugen? Or will all the aero kits be GT-original designs?

Kazunori: It would be a combination of both, actually.

New varities of racing that he's thinking about as well as graphic touches

IGN: You mentioned your love for Le Mans and Formula 1. Previous GT games have had an unlockable F1-style car, but no real F1-style race. Will we be seeing more Le Mans-style and F1 cars in GT HD?

Kazunori: My goal is to try to expand even further than where we are now... I'd like to include vehicles like the midget race cars...

IGN: Really? I bet no one would have thought you'd want to include midget race cars in the GT series... Speaking of cars that go sideways, previous GT games have featured real-life D1 cars. I guess that this is more of a PS3 technical question, but many of today's D1 cars use chrome/reflective vinyl graphics. Do you think that the PS3 will be able to accurately replicate these chrome graphics?

Kazunori: Yes. PS3 should allow for that.

About his car collection

IGN: Last thing we can think of... we know you're a huge car nut. We know all about your Ford GT - especially as the Ford people always drop your name when we talk with them...

Kazunori: I'm waiting on my second GT, actually...

IGN: A second one? Wow! We also know that you have an EVO 5... What other cars do you have in your personal collection? And what are you hoping to buy next?

Kazunori: I have a 350Z. It's a high-tune machine, is naturally-aspirated and puts out 350 horsepower. It's not bad.

IGN: No. Not bad at all.

Kazunori: I have an S2000, it a full racing car. It has a full carbon fiber body - the works. I also have a Mercedes AMG SL55, Porsche GT3...

And about the next car he wants and Nissan

IGN: That's quite a car collection. So what's the next vehicle you'd like to add to your garage?

Kazunori: I'm having a hard time choosing. I'm still waiting for that second GT, but after that I'd have to say the new Nissan GT-R.

IGN: Have you had a chance to drive the new GT-R yet?

Kazunori: Not yet.

IGN: Really? We hear that you get all of this top-level access to all these cars. We figured you'd have already driven the car by now.

Kazunori: I'm very close with the people who develop the car, so I do get the opportunity to talk with them and I do get input.

http://cars.ign.com/articles/744/744294p3.html

DieH@rd · May 6, 2007

^ Good interview. But old...

Jack B · May 6, 2007

Originally Posted by Forsete:
What? Im asking you. You claim something, prove it.

Click to expand...

Originally Posted by Jack B:
Fair enough. I'll see if I can find a URL, that isn't forum posters... Until, then I'll take it back. It could be urban legend. I've not seen that challenged before, but it's a fair request.

Click to expand...

Quote:
Ok, waste of time confirmed.

Click to expand...

Originally Posted by Jack B:
This part is not fair enough, IMO. If Borys hasn't changed much from his Evil Avatar days, then he makes short snotty posts and has no time for facts. A long post for Borys is about 3 sentences. He has plenty of opinion, he just doesn't have much time for research or quality discussion.

Click to expand...

Originally Posted by Jack B:
Case in point. His comments about me.

Click to expand...

Forsete, I wasn't able to find the Polyphony Digital verification on GT 4 being 60fps sampling rate for physics, so I did the right thing and took it back.

Now, it has been found, courtesy of Apex above. from a 2004 interview (post #1890 in this thread). In the quote it's also confirmed that a goal of 300-600fps physics sampling would be beneficial for GT 5. The original Forza had 240fps physics sampling. Forza 2 has 360fps physics sampling. It does make a difference. It does make a difference, that's been now verified by both Turn 10 and Polyphony Digital.

GT HD has the best car models and lighting. Amazing. Forza and especially Forza 2 have focused on physics and car handling. Granted the graphics haven't been as good. Especially with GT 4's 60fps when Forza had only 30fps. Forza 2 has upped graphics to 60fps and physics to 360 fps.

Both are good games. Give credit where credit it due.

I now take back my taking back of the comment until proven...

I took my comment about 60fps physics in GT 4 back, because I couldn't prove it. I took the high road. You should take back your comment about me too. I didn't deserve your "waste of time" comment.

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

Jack B said:
Forsete, I wasn't able to find the Polyphony Digital verification on GT 4 being 60fps sampling rate for physics, so I did the right thing and took it back.

Now, it has been found, courtesy of Apex above. from a 2004 interview. In the quote it's also confirmed that a goal of 300-600fps physics sampling would be beneficial for GT 5. The original Forza had 240fps physics sampling. Forza 2 has 360fps physics sampling. It does make a difference. It does make a difference, that's been now verified by both Turn 10 and Polyphony Digital.

GT HD has the best car models and lighting. Amazing. Forza and especially Forza 2 have focused on physics and car handling. Granted the graphics haven't been as good. Especially with GT 4's 60fps when Forza had only 30fps. Forza 2 has upped graphics to 60fps and physics to 360 fps.

Both are good games. Give credit where credit it due.

I now take back my taking back of the comment until proven... I took my comment about 60fps physics in GT 4 back, because I couldn't prove it. I took the high road. You should take back your comment about me too. I didn't deserve your "waste of time" comment.

The quote was posted earlier with Kaz confirming that it does run at 60fps physics, Kaz says they're looking into 300-600 fps physics for GT5.

Jack B · May 6, 2007

SolidSnakex said:
The quote was posted earlier with Kaz confirming that it does run at 60fps physics, Kaz says they're looking into 300-600 fps physics for GT5.

Thanks SolidSnakex. I was starting the think it was urban legend. I hadn't been asked to prove it before, but had seen many posts about the comparison. When I tried to Google it, yesterday I had a hell of a time finding it anywhere.

Glad to know, I wasn't quoting an urban legend.

I think with the PS3's potential for physics calculations, anything is possible with GT 5. I'd love to see 600fps physics sampling and a solid physics model. If PD can keep the current level of graphics and car modeling while upping the physics model and allowing for 20 cars online compared to Forza 2's 8, they could raise the bar.

I'm skeptical, but if they have enough time with the PS3, they may be able to pull it off. I hope so, it would be the killer app for the PS3 and I'd buy one in a heartbeat to get the best console sim. Competition is good for gamers. I want the bar to be raised with each new version.

SolidSnakex · May 6, 2007

I thought my expecations for GT5 were high. 20 cars on track at that detail? I'm thinkign they'll do 12 at the most. The game isn't releasing until sometime next year so they've got plenty of time to get everything in the game. They know they've got alot of expectations to meet.

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