• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Halo 4 |OT2| TURBO

Dongs Macabre

aka Daedalos42
Was wondering that too.

You have Auto Sentry and swap out for someones jetpack

GET SHIT ON RANDOM!

It happened in Reach, too, if I remember correctly. I think the AAs drop at the beginning and you pick them up instantly. Never tried switching with someone else, though.
 
I never understood why AA's were exempt from dead body pickup. I can understand it to some degree in Reach, where weapons are littered everywhere for a long time. But with the insanely short weapon timer in 4, it's not like it will make the game any more unpredictable.
 

Tawpgun

Member
I never understood why AA's were exempt from dead body pickup. I can understand it to some degree in Reach, where weapons are littered everywhere for a long time. But with the insanely short weapon timer in 4, it's not like it will make the game any more unpredictable.

I was kinda hoping thats how they would have worked. Bungie said they made AA's because a lot of people (read: BK's) would either die before they could use equipment or would use equipment at the wrong time and it wouldn't be effective.

I thought the logical progression would be that there would be these sweet armor abilities on the map, and you can pick them up. When you die they are dropped like weapons are and someone else can pick them up.


NAH BUT FUCK EQUAL STARTING GROUND. THAT SHIT IS SO 2007.
 
NAH BUT FUCK EQUAL STARTING GROUND. THAT SHIT IS SO 2007.
Everybody's special now, and they need their rewards before they earn them.
When you have games like Ryse that seemingly play themselves, it becomes depressing to think what future Halo titles will have in store for people that long for the days of equal footing and battles for upgrades.
 
I never understood why AA's were exempt from dead body pickup. I can understand it to some degree in Reach, where weapons are littered everywhere for a long time. But with the insanely short weapon timer in 4, it's not like it will make the game any more unpredictable.

Just rename Grenadier to Skullduggery and let it pick up AAs off of corpses too.
 
The binary rifle swords start in action sack is godly, it's like i'm some thruster king skating around ice, and dem quick scopes feel so good.

Why is there no forge made btb maps in matchmaking? Or am I just not noticing? Settler doesn't count.

BTB seems to be the forgotten child even though it has the biggest user base, no dlc maps ever pop up and no forge layouts makes me a sad panda.
 
Just showing what we've been up to over the past week...
This pretty much puts together everything that we know about gametypes so far. Everything you see in that video was made entirely from scratch - this is not a mod of another gametype (even though I used CTF as a base variant because our tool can't generate new gametypes on-the-fly yet, I deleted everything that was in it).

Expect a release within the next few days or so.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=6z_ysbXQprI

This is a knockoff of the Black Ops gametype "Gun Game". Players cycle through a randomized set of 18 weapons and must get kills with all of them to win. Players can also be demoted by being assasinated or getting stuck. This was accomplished using the power of Megalo, Bungie's and 343's gametype scripting engine.

This mod was created by amd42 and will be available soon for download.
 

malfcn

Member
I am confused by this Megalo stuff. Did it leak, or is any of these gametypes or modes/mods supported? Can you be banned for this kind of stuff.
 
What do you mean? I think making it 1 point is in the regular settings.

You only get points by each kill, no extra points for assists and others. You also get +1 instead of +10.

I am confused by this Megalo stuff. Did it leak, or is any of these gametypes or modes/mods supported? Can you be banned for this kind of stuff.

It did not leak. The modders took the gametypes and looked into their script, then reverse engineered the code.

They can create new gametypes from scratch using the same tools as 343/Bungie, which will work on a retail xbox.
 
You might get banned for distributing the modded gametypes on your File Share, but not for just playing it.

Technically yes, it hasn't happened yet to any modder since I think they pulled some wizardy with their gamertags.

Dunno what will happen to the average joes putting modded content in their fileshare, hopefully when the gametype editor is released and new gametypes start showing up 343 will look away. They aren't doing any bad.

Plus you could beg for a modder to put your gametype up for download into their "inmune" fileshares.

amd was kind enough to put a list of changes for me, pretty interesting read.

amd42 from se7ensins said:
Sure, here's what I can think of right now:

The "fancy green effect" is the Regicide armor effect. I created a hidden trait set which is set up to give you that effect, and the trait set gets applied for a short moment of time to create the flash. It's actually somewhere around 5 game ticks right now, but I'm having issues getting it to sync over the network sometimes, so I might just make it one second (if that still looks good).

Assassinations, beat downs, and stick kills demote the player you killed. Suicides also demote you. You get a Vengeance medal for demoting someone (because it sounds cool and can't normally be obtained in this gametype since ordnance is disabled), and there's a custom stat for how many vengeances a player earns. I've seen games where people have gotten as many as 7 vengeances; they make the game a lot tougher especially considering how easy it is to stick someone sometimes.
Players only get promoted if they get weapon kills or assassinate someone. This means that melees or grenade kills won't promote you.

There's a bug in the game engine apparently (as far as I can tell, at least) where Sticky Detonator kills from the grave don't register as being Sticky Detonator kills, so you don't get promoted for that (and it actually happens somewhat often). I'm still considering what I want to do about this, but I may just end up making all kills from the grave promote you if I can't find a decent workaround.

On the topic of bugs, I encountered a bug during testing where you can't drop someone's weapon in the middle of an assassination animation (when the kill event occurs). In order to get around this, I had to make it repeatedly try to drop your weapon and then check if it actually dropped before giving you your new one (with the exception of the Extractor and the Flagnum, there's no "replace weapon" feature in MegaloScript - you have to drop the player's old weapon and give them their new one).

The video doesn't show this because I added it after we made it, but if you're on level 0 and another player demotes you (meaning that you can't just suicide to get this), then you go to level -1 and get an Incineration Cannon as a handicap. (Just for fun.)

There's supposed to be an overtime system where you get 10 (again, this will be configurable) seconds to try and demote someone after they go through all 18 levels in case they got stuck with a plasma grenade or something (yes, it actually is possible to do, someone managed it in a real game once), but it's broken in the version that was shown in the video (you hear the announcer say "overtime" and then the round immediately ends...oops). There will be an "Overtime Leader Traits" trait set so you could stick a waypoint over the person.

There are three modes of weapon progression which can be set from the game options menu: Weak to Strong, Strong to Weak, and Random. The video shows the Random progression mode, where the weapon progression is randomized every game (everyone in the game gets weapons in the same order though, and each weapon still appears once). Random is generally the most fair way of playing, because with the Weak to Strong mode, for example, whoever can get kills the fastest gets a huge advantage over other players and you end up having games where someone just destroys everyone else. The Random mode also keeps things interesting because then you never know what weapon you're going to get next or what weapon someone who's ahead of you might have.

I'm not currently planning on adding any ability to customize the weapon progression beyond that because adding it in would be too complicated and the game limits you to only 16 custom menu options. As much as I would love to add this, I'm not sure how feasible it would be.

There's obviously the "development build" HUD widget, but if you look closely, the text changes to ">>> New Weapon Incoming <<<" during the cooldown period (this is actually a second widget). This will become much more apparent when the "development build" watermark is removed.

We found through testing that the gametype works best on a small map. Abandon, Adrift, Haven, and Solace work really well. If anyone would be interested in forging a map just for this gametype, I would be very excited. Remember that weapon pickup and vehicles are obviously disabled.

I went through the entire process of designing, creating, and testing an entirely new gametype. As an overall statement, gametype creation is actually a lot harder than it looks. I'm not even talking about the scripting part of it - in general, gametypes have to be tested extensively and have to constantly be modified in order to ensure that they're fun to play and that they're fair for everyone. The gametype you saw in the video is actually very different from what we originally had - the testers who played the original version had to completely re-adapt to it. I have an understanding now of the kind of crap that 343/CA has to go through to make these things, and it really gave me a different perspective on them and how hard they're working to improve this game. They pretty much put their testers through hell in order to make Dominion, and I couldn't even imagine how much testing they had to do with the weapon tuning in order to make sure that it actually improved things. I'm just gonna be straight up honest here, people really don't appreciate everything that 343 has been doing for this game, and I'm hoping that this will change things.
 

Dongs Macabre

aka Daedalos42
Technically yes, it hasn't happened yet to any modder since I think they pulled some wizardy with their gamertags.

Dunno what will happen to the average joes putting modded content in their fileshare, hopefully when the gametype editor is released and new gametypes start showing up 343 will look away.

Yeah, I haven't heard of anyone getting banned for putting modded maps and gametypes on their File Shares, but it's always a possibility.
 

TCKaos

Member
The binary rifle swords start in action sack is godly, it's like i'm some thruster king skating around ice, and dem quick scopes feel so good.



BTB seems to be the forgotten child even though it has the biggest user base, no dlc maps ever pop up and no forge layouts makes me a sad panda.

It's because none of the interesting Forge canvasses are large enough for BTB maps and Forge Island is too flat to make an interesting map. I still think Apex and some other SpOps maps should be retooled and released as Forge canvasses with Forge Island's pallet.

Yeah, I haven't heard of anyone getting banned for putting modded maps and gametypes on their File Shares, but it's always a possibility.

It's happened to a few people. I've seen posts here and there, specifically one person attempted to appeal their ban and were told by a Microsoft rep that they were cheating for hosting Promod on their fileshare.
 

Gui_PT

Member
343 should just hire modders to make their playlist/gametype/weapon and player trait decisions.

Or just give them the money.
 
343 should just hire modders to make their playlist/gametype/weapon and player trait decisions.

Or just give them the money.

There is no shame in paying modders for their work if it's good enough, if the gun game gametype is really well done and plays great in halo 4, 343i really should look into it.
 

Gui_PT

Member
The problem is since they hired people that didn't like Halo, instead of having "let's keep what is good and improve it" mentality, they had a "let's change everything we don't like and introduce new stuff we're not sure will work" mentality(I assume). Which resulted in a less than fun to play game.
 
The problem is since they hired people that didn't like Halo, instead of having "let's keep what is good and improve it" mentality, they had a "let's change everything we don't like and introduce new stuff we're not sure will work" mentality(I assume). Which resulted in a less than fun to play game.
Sorry, going to have to disagree. You don't move to Seattle and kill yourself with crunch for 2+ years because you "don't like Halo".
 

daedalius

Member
The problem is since they hired people that didn't like Halo, instead of having "let's keep what is good and improve it" mentality, they had a "let's change everything we don't like and introduce new stuff we're not sure will work" mentality(I assume). Which resulted in a less than fun to play game.

Yep. Assuming, what is it when you do it?
 

Gui_PT

Member
Sorry, going to have to disagree. You don't move to Seattle and kill yourself with crunch for 2+ years because you "don't like Halo".


You can disagree all you want but what I said was based on what Frankie(I think) mentioned in an interview. He said they hired people that didn't like Halo.
 

Deadly Cyclone

Pride of Iowa State
The problem is since they hired people that didn't like Halo, instead of having "let's keep what is good and improve it" mentality, they had a "let's change everything we don't like and introduce new stuff we're not sure will work" mentality(I assume). Which resulted in a less than fun to play game.

It was definitely a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't situation though. A lot of people were pretty much done with Halo after 3 and even more after Reach as they felt the series had stagnated. 343 picked up the IP in a position that they needed to breathe some life back into it, and took the criticisms that Halo hadn't changed over the years to heart. They just went a bit too far with their new interpretation, and borrowed a bit too much from the current "kings" of multiplayer gaming.

I think Halo 5 will show that 343 has the ability to adapt to the fans and will cater more to the old school Halo base, as they've seen how quickly the game has fallen off (and started reacting to that trend with updates refining the core gameplay).

If they would have just made Halo 3.5 or something they would have lost people due to series fatigue, but they went a bit too far on the other end, revamping pretty much everything except the very very base of the game. I think Halo 5 will be a more refined, better Halo experience.
 

Gui_PT

Member
It was definitely a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't situation though. A lot of people were pretty much done with Halo after 3 and even more after Reach as they felt the series had stagnated. 343 picked up the IP in a position that they needed to breathe some life back into it, and took the criticisms that Halo hadn't changed over the years to heart. They just went a bit too far with their new interpretation, and borrowed a bit too much from the current "kings" of multiplayer gaming.

I think Halo 5 will show that 343 has the ability to adapt to the fans and will cater more to the old school Halo base, as they've seen how quickly the game has fallen off (and started reacting to that trend with updates refining the core gameplay).

If they would have just made Halo 3.5 or something they would have lost people due to series fatigue, but they went a bit too far on the other end, revamping pretty much everything except the very very base of the game. I think Halo 5 will be a more refined, better Halo experience.

Definitely. Can't blame them for trying but unfortunately it did not turn out well.
 

Stinkles

Clothed, sober, cooperative
It was definitely a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't situation though. A lot of people were pretty much done with Halo after 3 and even more after Reach as they felt the series had stagnated. 343 picked up the IP in a position that they needed to breathe some life back into it, and took the criticisms that Halo hadn't changed over the years to heart. They just went a bit too far with their new interpretation, and borrowed a bit too much from the current "kings" of multiplayer gaming.

I think Halo 5 will show that 343 has the ability to adapt to the fans and will cater more to the old school Halo base, as they've seen how quickly the game has fallen off (and started reacting to that trend with updates refining the core gameplay).

If they would have just made Halo 3.5 or something they would have lost people due to series fatigue, but they went a bit too far on the other end, revamping pretty much everything except the very very base of the game. I think Halo 5 will be a more refined, better Halo experience.

I think you're right.
 

daedalius

Member
It was definitely a dammed if you do, dammed if you don't situation though. A lot of people were pretty much done with Halo after 3 and even more after Reach as they felt the series had stagnated. 343 picked up the IP in a position that they needed to breathe some life back into it, and took the criticisms that Halo hadn't changed over the years to heart. They just went a bit too far with their new interpretation, and borrowed a bit too much from the current "kings" of multiplayer gaming.

And yet, everyone I know who isn't a big halo fan says its still basically the same thing(gameplay wise anyway). Even the reviewers said it.
 
Mini slayer hit boxes are up the wazoo, I like it but it's like I can snipe 2 foot above someone and get a headshot, or completely miss with my AR up close.
 

Deadly Cyclone

Pride of Iowa State
And yet, everyone I know who isn't a big halo fan says its still basically the same thing(gameplay wise anyway). Even the reviewers said it.

That's the odd thing for sure, people still say "same old Halo" when in reality it's a vastly different Halo to people like us, who play the series a ton. So what do you do? You can't take it further. The series needs something new. Something that reinvigorates Halo and the FPS market overall. Something that's not borrowed from other games, but is entirely new to the genre.

Who knows what 343 has going, but I can only guess it'll be much more to our liking that 4 was (even though I like aspects of 4).
 

daedalius

Member
That's the odd thing for sure, people still say "same old Halo" when in reality it's a vastly different Halo to people like us, who play the series a ton. So what do you do? You can't take it further. The series needs something new. Something that reinvigorates Halo and the FPS market overall. Something that's not borrowed from other games, but is entirely new to the genre.

Who knows what 343 has going, but I can only guess it'll be much more to our liking that 4 was (even though I like aspects of 4).

I think if H4 had of launched as it is in multiplayer now(including hidden CSR, etc), it probably would have retained a bit more of its population.
 

Tawpgun

Member
Gun Game? Fun, good. We should look at it conceptually.

Modding? Where do you draw the line?

Matchmaking is a good spot to draw the line. If you mod in actual games then you get banned. If you create sweet gametypes then you should be able to play and share them freely.
 
Gun Game? Fun, good. We should look at it conceptually.

Modding? Where do you draw the line?

Yeah, I meant the gametype mods, nice to see you guys are still taking and looking for ideas :)

Aimbots and other kinds of modding/cheating are a whole new story since they ruin the game instead of adding replayability to it.

Edit: what tawpgun said too.
 
Matchmaking is a good spot to draw the line. If you mod in actual games then you get banned. If you create sweet gametypes then you should be able to play and share them freely.
Here here.

Its almost like everyone in console land forgets that mods on PC are a wonderful thing that extends longevity. Just because dicks used mods to "win" in previous games doesn't mean shit like this should be discouraged. I think the line to draw would be quite simple.
 
Team mates, how do they work?

Mu9kpH3.jpg

I think if H4 had of launched as it is in multiplayer now(including hidden CSR, etc), it probably would have retained a bit more of its population.

I agree, from day 1 the DMR was the go to weapon and it's taken half a year to fix that, since the update I been playing halo 4 every other day and enjoying it all over again.
 

Dongs Macabre

aka Daedalos42
Yeah, I meant the gametype mods, nice to see you guys are still taking and looking for ideas :)

Aimbots and other kinds of modding/cheating are a whole new story since they ruin the game instead of adding replayability to it.

Edit: what tawpgun said too.

It's the same in tons of PC games, like Minecraft or Half-Life 2. Mods that make the game more enjoyable are good, aimbots and stuff are bad.
 
Top Bottom