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Vice news - What It Costs To Live In San Francisco

S

simplayer

Member
Gully State said:
Lack of housing is just one of the factors. You still have foreign investors, huge booming industry, naturally desirable living region etc...Building a ton of housing is obviously going to help but the property value for the current places aren't going to drop because of it (they'll still go up). Vancouver is a good example. Owning property is ridiculously expensive but renting is affordable because of all the apartment complexes that keep springing up.
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There are lots of reasons for high demand for housing, but high demand for housing only becomes an issue if the supply doesn’t keep up, which it hasn’t for a few decades.

I doubt prices will go down until there’s a large drop in demand, but we can certainly build a lot more housing to stabilize prices
 
G

Gully State

Member
simplayer said:
There are lots of reasons for high demand for housing, but high demand for housing only becomes an issue if the supply doesn’t keep up, which it hasn’t for a few decades.

I doubt prices will go down until there’s a large drop in demand, but we can certainly build a lot more housing to stabilize prices
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I didn't say anywhere that there shouldn't be more housing built (there definitely should be more housing projects- especially affordable ones). This is the point I agree with you. Prices will never go down but an increase in housing will stabilize it from continually increasing (which I totally agree with you). I'm just addressing the assertion that people seem to think housing prices are bound to plummet to be in line with the rest of the US.
 
T

therealist

Member
The question I have to ask is is she and her husband happy living like this? I understand the allure of being in the city, but she can get a teaching job in Sacramento and then she'd have a house there and way more space. She can still drive or take a train to visit her family in SF it's only 2 hours.
 
B

BotoxAgent

Member
I lived there for two years, paid 4k a month in rent. I didn't mind, but I couldn't stand the shit and piss in the market street and Mission street area whenever i hung out there since that's where most of my friends were. I am back in NY, living in Brooklyn in a much nicer smelling neighborhood.
 
E

Easy_G

Member
i3allistic said:
she can easily live outside SF for $2400 a month instead of her whole family cramping in one bed room apartment ... what a dummy , I guess it the quality of life they want ....I grew up in the city btw and moved out to Oakland a few yr ago ....not looking to move back
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Based on the video it looks like they are living in the apartments adjacent to SFSU, and hence the subsidized cost. That also allows them to easily have one car, drop their kids off at day care down the street, and have time for their home life. You won't find a very significant price break for a 2 bedroom apartment that doesn't severely alter that situation and add to her costs, such as a possible second car with bridge tolls or $20/day in public transit costs.

Lil'DigiOp said:
You guys really sound like you honestly haven't struggled in your lives.....

I'm not talking college..... I'm talking struggle....

Please correct me if I'm wrong
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I haven't struggled the way you're talking. But please explain how brown bag lunches will make SF affordable. Saving $2700 a year is a huge deal, but it's barely a dent in her overall situation. And the video also stated they spend $80-$100 a week for a family of 4 in groceries, which is roughly $3/meal per person. So they're doing well there.



I should step back from these arguments though. Everyone is caught up in what she is doing wrong instead of on how absurd the costs are in the area and how it likely won't be fixed any time soon. There just aren't enough houses or apartments to come close to satisfying demand, and forcing low wage workers to commute 45 minutes to an hour is not a way to build a city. There's almost no major home development in the area except in a few select cities nearby.
 
I

i3allistic

Member
CherryWoodFuton said:
Yea it's the stupid zoning laws that are part of the problem

Don't blame us transplants for finding better opportunities
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nah, chill i don't blame yall ...i dont care tbh ....the thing that do bugs me are the city politician that put the blame on home owners instead of fixing there trash rules and regulation for developers to develop more homes ...if i own a home i better be able to do what i want to do with it ...rising rent or kicking people out so i can move in without a fee ...ain't my fault for housing shortage, that the politician job, i didn't work hard to own a property and someone tell me what i can do and can't do too it...
 
C

CherryWoodFuton

Member
i3allistic said:
nah, chill i don't blame yall ...i dont care tbh ....the thing that do bugs me are the city politician that put the blame on home owners instead of fixing there trash rules and regulation for developers to develop more homes ...if i own a home i better be able to do what i want to do with it ...rising rent or kicking people out so i can move in without a fee ...ain't my fault for housing shortage, that the politician job, i didn't work hard to own a property and someone tell me what i can do and can't do too it...
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It's all good i mean I just registered to vote in my city so I'll do my part to vote those greedy fucks out

I'm all for building more affordable housing and if it needs to be 100 stories so be it NIMBYs be damned
 
S

simplayer

Member
Gully State said:
I'm just addressing the assertion that people seem to think housing prices are bound to plummet to be in line with the rest of the US.
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Ya, for sure not. We could create a lot more “missing middle” though. There’s no reason single family detached housing should exist in SF or it’s burbs. While not being per square foot cheaper than SFD die to market pressures, they would be per unit cheaper
 
S

schwabdizzle

Banned
just getting a hotel there is fucking ridiculous. We are going there in October, I hope my GF doesn't want to move there or we will be poor.
 
S

simplayer

Member
i3allistic said:
nah, chill i don't blame yall ...i dont care tbh ....the thing that do bugs me are the city politician that put the blame on home owners instead of fixing there trash rules and regulation for developers to develop more homes
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The politicians are listening to their constituents, and the constituents want to keep the zoning, ceqa, and discretionary rules in place.

There’s certainly some issues regarding how democratic the process really is (rich old people have a lot of time on their hands, so they can make their voice heard more easily), but the overall issue is a reflection of voter preference
 
J

jamsy

Member
IISANDERII said:
75k is still really good. I would've been outta there instantly. Why do you stay?
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Where is $75k considered "good"? Oklahoma? Mississippi? Nowhere on the west coast surely.

A lot of people here talk about moving to other places just like that. But the truth of it is that most folks don't live on an island. There is family, friends, etc to consider. I moved to Europe for 5 years so I know all about that, and there's all sorts of things to take into account.

Right now I'm saving the vast majority of my paycheck since I don't have to pay for rent. Is that a bad situation?
 
G

Google

Member
jamsy said:
Where is $75k considered "good"? Oklahoma? Mississippi? Nowhere on the west coast surely.
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Yeah. When I look at a $75k (all in) yearly wage on the west coast it feels like a decent, average wage.

Certainly, nothing to be sniffed at but it wouldn't be considered a good salary.
 
G

Gully State

Member
IISANDERII said:
75k is still really good. I would've been outta there instantly. Why do you stay?
Click to expand...

A 75k job that exists in California probably doesn't exist or pays significantly less in a state with a low living cost. A lot of these tech companies and opportunities only exist there.
 
M

Magni

Member
Gully State said:
A 75k job that exists in California probably doesn't exist or pays significantly less in a state with a low living cost. A lot of these tech companies and opportunities only exist there.
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Or you can find a company that hires remote. I live in Tokyo, make 95% of what I would be making working at the same company in SF (well, I also miss out on employee perks since I'm a contractor, but 95% in terms of gross salary), and live quite comfortably without any roommates, just my wife and cat.

Despite what some tech companies try to tell themselves (and everyone else), it's very feasible to build a remote company in 2017. There are tons of successful examples out there (GitHub, Heroku, Automattic for some of the bigger names).

edit: my wife and I are thinking of moving to the West Coast in 4-5 years (once Trump & co are out of the picture, we'll see how that goes...), and while I love the Bay Area, I can't imagine living in the city. I grew up in Seattle but that's quickly becoming SF bis in terms of home prices getting out of hand. Vancouver has been wild in that domain for a while now, and I can see Portland no longer being "cheap" in five years. Gonna be hard to accept someplace without public transit after Tokyo though, so not sure what else there is.
 
Madventure

Madventure

Member
An hour north of SF and it's 3k a month and growing for places where it used to be the cheap area. But with the SMART train just coming up now (Only took them almost a decade) that will go directly to the ferry terminal sometime in 2018, it will be a almost 80-90 mph line with minimal stops that goes directly to SF so prices are going to go even higher
 
S

scitek

Member
I work in TV, so moving to SF would put me in the 6th market in the country. I have a friend working there right now and he's making like mid-90s. I'd rather go to LA instead, where I'd make like 120k, and pay less in rent.
 
Jzero

Jzero

Member
Someone I was seeing moved to San Francisco for school and I have no clue how she can afford rent with only one job and one roommate 🤔
 
L

Lupercal

Banned
bobbytkc said:
What is the point of becoming a professor if you are going to live the life of a phd student your whole life?

Are we really arguing that buying a fucking sandwich with iced coffee is a luxury? holy crap.
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Well, if they're complaining about struggling but have enough to splurge 10$? on lunch every day.
 
S

SonicXtreme

Member
ah, yet another 'I spend less money on lunch than you do and that's why I can retire early' topic.

I'm sure all the shitbag landlords who've tripled their rents in the past decade are thrilled the masses are still arguing about who eats PB&J and who spends $5 at starbucks instead of the real problem.
 
H

HarryHengst

Member
SonicXtreme said:
ah, yet another 'I spend less money on lunch than you do and that's why I can retire early' topic.

I'm sure all the shitbag landlords who've tripled their rents in the past decade are thrilled the masses are still arguing about who eats PB&J and who spends $5 at starbucks instead of the real problem.
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Yeah its always amazing how people go ''well dont buy all those avocados!'' instead of ''this system is shit''.
 
M

Marty Chinn

Member
HarryHengst said:
Yeah its always amazing how people go ''well dont buy all those avocados!'' instead of ''this system is shit''.
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Why can't it be both? You can complain how the system is fucked up but also realize you still have to work in the system so complaining about not being able to afford it while splurging on things that you can circumvent easily is something to point out as well.
 
A

Antagon

Member
I said before that I consider buying a 10$ lunch a luxury. Doesn't mean that I don't believe people shouldn't be able to do it. People should be able to afford luxuries and the housing market in San Francisco is awful.
 
A

apieceofstrange

Member
Spending 10-15 bucks on lunch and coffee everyday may not seem like much, but it certainly adds up. If both her and her husband are spending that much a day, that's around $500 a month on average, or almost 10% of their take home pay.

I quickly learned packing a lunch was a necessity when I started my job. I don't see it as a luxury, but it's certainly not responsible when you're scraping by.
 
M

MC Safety

Member
What it costs: Too much.

San Francisco is overpriced and overhyped. I enjoyed my stay there, but I'll never forget almost getting into a fight on MUNI for "looking at someone," the horrible, tense, and stuffed to the gills "Dirty-Eight" bus rides, and how my apartment was looted.

The best thing about San Francisco was leaving. The second best thing was the burritos.
 
G

Gully State

Member
Magni said:
Or you can find a company that hires remote. I live in Tokyo, make 95% of what I would be making working at the same company in SF (well, I also miss out on employee perks since I'm a contractor, but 95% in terms of gross salary), and live quite comfortably without any roommates, just my wife and cat.

Despite what some tech companies try to tell themselves (and everyone else), it's very feasible to build a remote company in 2017. There are tons of successful examples out there (GitHub, Heroku, Automattic for some of the bigger names).

edit: my wife and I are thinking of moving to the West Coast in 4-5 years (once Trump & co are out of the picture, we'll see how that goes...), and while I love the Bay Area, I can't imagine living in the city. I grew up in Seattle but that's quickly becoming SF bis in terms of home prices getting out of hand. Vancouver has been wild in that domain for a while now, and I can see Portland no longer being "cheap" in five years. Gonna be hard to accept someplace without public transit after Tokyo though, so not sure what else there is.
Click to expand...

Not all tech is consumer stuff. San Francisco (one of the biggest in fact) is a huge biotech hub . That's a field you can't work remotely.
 
O

Ogodei

Member
bobbytkc said:
What is the point of becoming a professor if you are going to live the life of a phd student your whole life?

Are we really arguing that buying a fucking sandwich with iced coffee is a luxury? holy crap.
Click to expand...

On a daily basis? I'd say so. Assuming you only did it on weekdays, you're still looking at $150/month on lunch.
 
N

Nafai1123

Banned
Madventure said:
An hour north of SF and it's 3k a month and growing for places where it used to be the cheap area. But with the SMART train just coming up now (Only took them almost a decade) that will go directly to the ferry terminal sometime in 2018, it will be a almost 80-90 mph line with minimal stops that goes directly to SF so prices are going to go even higher
Click to expand...

Yup, glad I bought a townhouse with a 10 min walk from the SMART train station :p Commuting to work is a dream now.
 
Subpar Spatula

Subpar Spatula

Banned
$42.00 ($2.10 a day) for coffee every morning
$180.00 ($9.00 a day) for lunch every month
$1,400.00 on child care
$2,400.00 on rent
$400.00 a week on groceries
$120.00 a month on gas

Spend less on candles.

I don't get why they put up with low conditions like that for their kids just to live in San Francisco. Kind of neglectful in a way.
 
K

Kambing

Member
Yeah it ain't cheap. We live in the north bay, about 10-15 mins past the GG bridge. Wife used to commute to the city for work. That shit was costing something like $500-700/month. Toll, parking garage and extra gas. Taking the ferry wasn't that much cheaper, about $400-500/month, and took longer!

Her firm opened an office about 7 mins away from our house and lord, I'm really happy how much her quality of life has improved with the shorter commute. I'm equally as happy cause we now only spend $150/month on parking and gas. Glad i work from home. Makes me sick thinking how much money we'd be spending just getting to work if both her and i had to commute to the city.
 
G

GrooveCommand

Member
That's so crazy! My wife and I bought our first home last year in Seattle. 3BR house (~1000 Sq Ft) and our mortgage is about $1700/mo. Previously we were in a studio apartment for $1400/mo - getting the house was a no brainer! We are luck that we bought when we did, housing costs are rising here too and when I checked zillow recently everything in our area is now out of our price range!
 
E

Earthbound64

Banned
GrooveCommand said:
That's so crazy! My wife and I bought our first home last year in Seattle. 3BR house (~1000 Sq Ft) and our mortgage is about $1700/mo. Previously we were in a studio apartment for $1400/mo - getting the house was a no brainer!
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*Assuming you can get approved.

Sure, I would rather my rent be going into a house payment. That would be nice.
 
I

III-V

Member
One of a few cities for the 1%, and as income inequality grows, I expect to see more cities like this.

I'll pass, thanks.
 
K

KevinRo

Member
The government should subsidize your child care because you refuse to move and find a job in a different area?

Sounds like your fault.
 
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