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BadAss2961
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(03-03-2014, 04:16 AM)
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Originally Posted by Havel

I think GG made a bad move by trying to go for 60fps in the MP. The end result was pretty shoddy.

They should have kept it at 1920x1080, lowered some effects and try to get a solid 30fps.

Nah, it plays better than it otherwise would've.

I'm not even sweating this... It's Guerrilla Games. They were in a rush. Next time they do a multiplayer it'll look better than Shadow Fall's, and run at true 1080p/60fps.
darkwing
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:17 AM)
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somebodies tweet Yosp
HTupolev
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(03-03-2014, 04:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by Chobel

So not the same thing that's done in Shadowfall MP? disappointed

I thought we're on the verge for big discovery.

No, massive-scale temporal reprojection for achieving baseline resolutions would have been a huge deal last gen, and would not have flown totally under the radar for years and years. Devs would have wanted to talk about how cool it was, if it was a commonly-accepted thing.

It was a pretty big deal even when games used temporal antialiasing, and I'm not sure if any PS360 games even bothered to reproject with their motion buffers (Halo: Reach actually turned AA off for pixels with detected motion).
Doctor_Thomas
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by xkramz

A shooter at 30fps? Oh lawd.. bad idea

Killzone 2, 3 and Mercenary were all 30fps.
Havel
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by xkramz

A shooter at 30fps? Oh lawd.. bad idea

KZ2 was and it was arguably one of the best multilayer shooters of last gen.
Seance
Banned
(03-03-2014, 04:18 AM)

Originally Posted by 24FrameDaVinci

60fps is 60fps, yo.

Activate that motionflow yo. 200Hz is 200Hz after all.
GHG
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ethan18

It's a technical thread talking about the resolution of a game that is different than what we thought previously.

I suggest you don't enter these threads if it irks you so much.

Technical? Hahahaha. Sorry, must have missed it. It's gone way over my head. My diploma in CompSci isn't good enough to stand up to all the PhD level technical discussions in this thread.

This is not a technical discussion. If you want technical discussions, close the GAF tab on your browser and go to somewhere like beyond3D.
MavFan619
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by stfuppercut

Sorry, they still lied.

Shitty, still looks good all things considered but they should have been upfront about it as I said just to maintain good faith in a situation like this now they have yolk on their face deservedly so. I'm also confused SP is still 1080p what are you telling me they lied about I don't deny they clearly did regarding MP.
Last edited by MavFan619; 03-03-2014 at 04:24 AM.
Steffen
Banned
(03-03-2014, 04:19 AM)

Originally Posted by OldAsUrSock

Banderas: "Say whaaaaaaaa?" o_o
Mihael Mello Keehl
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by dallow_bg

Did you just ignore all the other posts that replied to you?
People DID notice! They just thought it was the AA solution, and didn't think GG was outright lying.

Resolution matters. If it's not native, it will look off on native displays.
This furthers proves that point.

No I read the posts, I understand you guys completly! Please dont think im saying something else, all Im saying is the resolution NOW matters because we know it. Yes the resolution was the issue all along....but some people though it was AA and NOT the resolution. Understand? Im not trying to prove a point just simply stating. It is what it is.
Surface of Me
Banned
(03-03-2014, 04:20 AM)

Originally Posted by Havel

KZ2 was and it was arguably one of the best multilayer shooters of last gen.

Not to mention Gears, Halo, BF on last gen. Only CoD did it then and it was only proposed as a standard on consoles recently.
Syphon Filter
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(03-03-2014, 04:20 AM)
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Originally Posted by Chobel

This tweet is really fitting

lol
darkwing
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(03-03-2014, 04:20 AM)
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GG should be ashamed of this, nobody will trust them anymore
Sho_Nuff82
(03-03-2014, 04:21 AM)
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Originally Posted by sp3000

Ryse was ripped apart for running at 900p, which is actually higher than this game

Double standard everywhere. At least Crytek had the courtesy to be honest.

Originally Posted by darkwing

so BF4 with dynamic environments and 64 players run better than this?

lol

Originally Posted by Garrett 2U

After all these months and so much focus on resolution, nobody noticed this.

Wait, so TitanFall beta is higher res than Killzone SF multiplayer? That is pretty funny.

This makes a lot of the last few months a lot more interesting.

And by interesting, I mean hilarious.
VanWinkle
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by darkwing

GG should be ashamed of this, nobody will trust them anymore

They're still tech beasts, and the SP in the game is still the best looking next-gen game, but I think this may indeed make people question Guerilla's truthfulness about this stuff from now on.
LookAtMeGo
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(03-03-2014, 04:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by sp3000

Ryse was ripped apart for running at 900p, which is actually higher than this game

Double standard everywhere. At least Crytek had the courtesy to be honest.

To be fair we are only talking about the MP here. The SP is a native 1080p.
cchum
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:22 AM)
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Isn't this also similar to that Lucasarts guy who figured out you could boost framerate by interpolation? That was a huge deal when it happened.

Here: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/di...terview?page=2
coolasj19
Why are you reading my tag instead of the title of my post?
(03-03-2014, 04:23 AM)
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Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?
pompidu
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by sp3000

Ryse was ripped apart for running at 900p, which is actually higher than this game

Double standard everywhere. At least Crytek had the courtesy to be honest.

Shadow Fall is native 1080p in single player.
dallow_bg
nods at old men
(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mihael Mello Keehl

No I read the posts, I understand you guys completly! Please dont think im saying something else, all Im saying is the resolution NOW matters because we know it. Yes the resolution was the issue all along....but some people though it was AA and NOT the resolution. Understand? Im not trying to prove a point just simply stating. It is what it is.

The issue wasn't AA or resolution, the issue was MP looking worse and blurry compared to SP.

The difference today is we now know the true cause.
Havel
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by coolasj19

Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?

Downloading now, give me a minute to check.
badb0y
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by sp3000

Ryse was ripped apart for running at 900p, which is actually higher than this game

Double standard everywhere. At least Crytek had the courtesy to be honest.

For multi-player you are right but single player was still native 1080p.

Originally Posted by darkwing

so BF4 with dynamic environments and 64 players run better than this?

lol

Yep, lol.

Originally Posted by Garrett 2U

After all these months and so much focus on resolution, nobody noticed this.

Wait, so TitanFall beta is higher res than Killzone SF multiplayer? That is pretty funny.

1.) People did notice this but thought it was because of some other reasons since we were told KZSF MP was 1080p native.
2.) Yep, Titanfall beta is higher resolution, LOL.
chubigans
y'all should be ashamed
(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by coolasj19

Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?

Oh nice! They say this footage is native 1080p. Downloading now.
msdstc
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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The whole thing has been handled poorly in terms of the MP, you can tell it was absolutely squeezed out at the last second. The current issue I'm having now is unplayable lag.
LookAtMeGo
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(03-03-2014, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by TheRealTalker

Aw what a great urban word

very fascinating


sorry about the language in the meme. This is where i first heard the term cray
VanWinkle
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by coolasj19

Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?

Woah, so about 10 days before launch Guerilla themselves said that the MP runs at native 1080p. That really kind of irks me.
TheD
The Detective
(03-03-2014, 04:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by GHG


All of this zooming in to images to spot flaws really irks me. Who sits that close to their tv/monitor to even see games like that. It's a pointless exercise. If you're going to be so concerned about this stuff to a point where your zooming into images and looking at them that closely, do yourself a favour and get a gaming PC. That way you can spend more time actually gaming rather than bitching about this pointless shit in DF threads.

People that are sitting the correct distance from a screen! (if you could not see the differences between a 1080P screen and a 720P screen at your viewing distance, you have just wasted money buying the higher res screen FFS!).

Originally Posted by GHG

All of the hyperbole in this thread is killing me.

The game looks awful all of a sudden now?

Nobody even knew or noticed this before today, and for all intents and purposes, everyone was saying the game looked awesome and how it was one of the, if not the, best looking next gen title... Now we are inspecting 100x zoomed in images looking for artifacts?

Like seriously?

That is OBJECTIVELY WRONG!, sangreal posted half an hour before you did, linking to one of his posts with screenshots from last year, in it he complained about the IQ of the multiplayer!
TheRealTalker
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by LookAtMeGo


sorry about the language in the meme. This is where i first heard the term cray

aaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnd my fascination for the urban word has ended
fastballspecial
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by coolasj19

Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?

I'm just curious what this matters now. No one even knew or bothered to find out for over three months.
Mihael Mello Keehl
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:28 AM)
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Originally Posted by dallow_bg

The issue wasn't AA or resolution, the issue was MP looking worse and blurry compared to SP.

The difference today is we now know the true cause.

And thats what is blowing my fucking mind
chubigans
y'all should be ashamed
(03-03-2014, 04:28 AM)
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Originally Posted by fastballspecial

I'm just curious what this matters now. No one even knew or bothered to find out for over three months.

It doesn't matter now. We know what the PS4 is capable of.

It's just pretty nuts that we didn't find out until now. That no one caught it!
badb0y
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:29 AM)
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Not only that, but the fact that they can't get it to run at a solid 60 FPS with such a low resolution is laughable.
Havel
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(03-03-2014, 04:29 AM)
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Originally Posted by coolasj19

Hey, someone do me a biggy. Remember this direct feed video they released before the game came out? They said not to host streaming because it would compress it.
http://blog.us.playstation.com/2013/...layer-footage/

Can someone download that and see if the same problem we're seeing now exists in this video?

Just watched it, and I'm pretty damn sure the same problems exist here. It looks identical to those direct feed shots from a few pages back.

Pre-release:



Post release:
Last edited by Havel; 03-03-2014 at 04:35 AM.
BuggeryBugz
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(03-03-2014, 04:29 AM)
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Originally Posted by GHG

Technical? Hahahaha. Sorry, must have missed it. It's gone way over my head. My diploma in CompSci isn't good enough to stand up to all the PhD level technical discussions in this thread.

This is not a technical discussion. If you want technical discussions, close the GAF tab on your browser and go to somewhere like beyond3D.

Thanks, but maybe you should take your own advice.
HTupolev
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(03-03-2014, 04:29 AM)
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Originally Posted by TheD

People that are sitting the correct distance from a screen! (if you could not see the differences between a 1080P screen and a 720P screen at your viewing distance, you have just wasted money buying the higher res screen FFS!).

In terms of native render resolutions over the content of most modern games, if you're sitting so far from your screen that the difference isn't evident, you probably aren't seeing much of anything at all. Clarity issues become irrelevant after fairly* short distances, but aliasing is some pretty crazy stuff. You can sit 15 yards from your TV, barely be able to play anything, and Halo 3's specular aliasing is still going to stick out very obviously.

*Hehehehe
fastballspecial
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(03-03-2014, 04:30 AM)
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Originally Posted by chubigans

It doesn't matter now. We know what the PS4 is capable of.

It's just pretty nuts that we didn't find out until now. That no one caught it!

Yeah. Absolutely. Golf clap to Guerilla for pulling one over on everyone? Haha.
ZehDon
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(03-03-2014, 04:33 AM)
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As I mentioned in the other thread, this explains to me why the game looks blurry and worse than SP. I've always just assumed terrible AA was used to claw back the FPS, and left it at that. However, now that we know we're dealing with low pixel counts and some temporal witchcraft I don't understand, it makes me question why the game cannot retain a constant 60FPS.

I shrugged off the performance fluctuations because hey, a 1080p next-gen launch title is gonna have some issues. I questioned the "AA problems" and wished for a crisper image, but hey - 1080p next-gen launch title, right? But... it's not 1080p. And it's not 60FPS. And the maps aren't all that big. And the player count isn't all that large.

I still love the game, but trading a Full HD image for a fluctuating 30-60 FPS doesn't feel like the right decision to me, given that this was supposed to be the first title to really push the visual standard on PS4. For me, it's pretty disappointing that they didn't come clean. I'm not gonna go all "FUCK YOU PS4", I love my console, but I'm certainly not going to buy into the hype next time. Is this a sign of things to come?
andycapps
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(03-03-2014, 04:33 AM)
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Launch title, not surprised compromises were made. That explains why multiplayer looks a little off to me.
BlackBuzzard
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(03-03-2014, 04:33 AM)
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DF is so dropping the ball.
JPHJ
Junior Member
(03-03-2014, 04:35 AM)
Ok sorry to be OT but had no idea where to post these, if anyone was interested and if their thread worthy?

Wii u a powerhouse :)

http://www.cinemablend.com/m/games/W...ios-62554.html

Microsoft never responded with slightest bit of professionalism

http://gamingbolt.com/dev-on-c4-engi...Dg1oKOLVWim.99
hawk2025
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:35 AM)
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I don't want to overstate this too much, but it's disgusting how we were straight up lied to by the constant claims of NATIVE 1080p on the multiplayer.

It does explain a lot about how off and weird the multiplayer looked.
Loudninja
No oxygen in space?
How does the sun burn?
Food for thought.
(03-03-2014, 04:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by BlackBuzzard

DF is so dropping the ball.

Yeah,they have been pretty bad with this stuff.
Liabe Brave
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(03-03-2014, 04:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by VanWinkle

Man, look at this pre-release MP screenshot:



The game doesn't look even CLOSE to that level of clarity. It makes me mad now knowing that the resolution is so low.

Interestingly, this does pixel count as 1920x1080--but the interlacing artifacts are there too (though very mild). It might be a bullshot, but another possibility is that the temporal effect achieves better results with less camera motion. Maybe in certain circumstances the resolution truly is almost indistinguishable from native...only in MP, you're basically never going to be sitting still. Just a guess.
Sho_Nuff82
(03-03-2014, 04:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by TheRealTalker

aaaaaaaaaaaaannnnnd my fascination for the urban word has ended

If you were serious, the phrase was made popular by the song "N****s in Paris" by Kanye West & Jay Z, where "cray" is short for "crazy".
ArchedThunder
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(03-03-2014, 04:39 AM)
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Some people seem to be a little confused at the resolution thinking that it upscales from 960x1080 to 1920x1080 like you would upscale a sub 1080p game to 1080p, it doesn't. I made some images to help.

Okay, so let's say the red lines are what is being updated while the black lines are empty space.

Now this is what it looks like on frame 1
On frame 2 this is what it looks like

And when frame 2 comes it it blurs the information from frame 1 to fill in the black spaces. This is why it looks fine when standing still but looks blurry and odd in motion. If we could take a single frame of KZSF's multiplayer with this effect turned off it would look something like this.
Zoom in to see the full effect.

The grey lines are dead space where nothing is being rendered on this frame.

So techinically the game is rendering at 1920x1080, just not on each frame.
MeBecomingI
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(03-03-2014, 04:39 AM)
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Originally Posted by BadAss2961

So now we have to shit on Killzone's multiplayer?

Shit still looks cray.

Of course. People are so picky about everything now that this type of thing is turned into a huge fucking deal and everyone loses their minds over it. Put Killzone and this type of thing together and... anarchy.

Originally Posted by GHG

All of the hyperbole in this thread is killing me.

The game looks awful all of a sudden now?

Nobody even knew or noticed this before today, and for all intents and purposes, everyone was saying the game looked awesome and how it was one of the, if not the, best looking next gen title... Now we are inspecting 100x zoomed in images looking for artifacts?

Like seriously?

Because everyone needs something to bitch about. You mean it isn't 1920x1080?! Just fire everyone and close the studio! I'm so angry at Guerrilla! Mrgrgr, those no talent hacks! Worst game ever, it bombed and they should never make a game again! I'm selling this crappy, technical shitshow of a game! My ignore list grows pretty quickly in threads like this.

That type of shit is ridiculous. But I digress. This is going to happen throughout this generation. The multiplayer still looks fucking fantastic and better than almost everything else out there. Whatever method they are using does a pretty good job all things considered.
Last edited by MeBecomingI; 03-03-2014 at 04:43 AM.
Frayne Daddy
Banned
(03-03-2014, 04:39 AM)

Originally Posted by hawk2025

I don't want to overstate this too much, but it's disgusting how we were straight up lied to by the constant claims of NATIVE 1080p on the multiplayer.

It does explain a lot about how off and weird the multiplayer looked.

Agreed this is the biggest concern. Being lied to. having Sony straight up lie to consumers is shady.
beast786
Member
(03-03-2014, 04:40 AM)
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yea, shouldn't lie to your consumer. Fix this shit GG
skyfinch
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(03-03-2014, 04:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by badb0y

.
2.) Yep, Titanfall beta is higher resolution, LOL.

Wtf, really?! Wasnt titanfall being crapped on for its resolution?
VanWinkle
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(03-03-2014, 04:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by Liabe Brave

Interestingly, this does pixel count as 1920x1080--but the interlacing artifacts are there too (though very mild). It might be a bullshot, but another possibility is that the temporal effect achieves better results with less camera motion. Maybe in certain circumstances the resolution truly is almost indistinguishable from native...only in MP, you're basically never going to be sitting still. Just a guess.

Interesting. I, and I'm sure others, have brought up before how the game is significantly less blurry while standing still than with any movement at all.
Last edited by VanWinkle; 03-03-2014 at 04:42 AM. Reason: made mistake

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