Nah, more like Wakka is a giant asshole and the group have to tip toe around him. He's responsible for 70% of the drama in the game. Then again, that's exactly how the writer intended him to be.
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Dinner at the Final Fantasy X table must be awkward (spoilers inside)
- Thread starter Amir0x
- Start date
Nah, more like Wakka is a giant asshole and the group have to tip toe around him. He's responsible for 70% of the drama in the game. Then again, that's exactly how the writer intended him to be.
HawthorneKitty
Sgt. 2nd Class in the Creep Battalion, Waifu Wars
I will never get this salty taste out of my mouth.
Except the FFX characters individually have more meat to their characters than pretty much any other game in the series
DiipuSurotu
Banned
Dinner is even more awkward one year after FFX-2:
Yuna is keeping it secret from Tidus that he will never be a real person.
Tidus is keeping it secret from Yuna that he is injured and constantly losing energy.
Auron kept it secret from everyone that he had a daughter.
Lulu is keeping Yuna's secret from Tidus about who is her new boyfriend.
Yuna is keeping it secret from Tidus that he will never be a real person.
Tidus is keeping it secret from Yuna that he is injured and constantly losing energy.
Auron kept it secret from everyone that he had a daughter.
Lulu is keeping Yuna's secret from Tidus about who is her new boyfriend.
Except the FFX characters individually have more meat to their characters than pretty much any other game in the series
Hey, hey , hey. Squall would like to have a word with you
(Just Squall though, the rest of the FF8 is... less than desirable)Wow. I didn't know that. Explains a question i had while i was playing the HD version.
I noticed there were like 3 or 4 (can't remember) summoner statues in the temples to honor the 3-4 who managed to kill sin and bring the Calm. I had wondered "wait if Zanarkand fell 1000 years ago and Sin comes every decade, how the hell are there so little celebrated summoners?". Haha the Calm lasting more then a decade explains this xD
Just take it with you.
Member
What's all this about Auron's daughter?
*googles*
Okay...
The Xeno games covered Gnosticism well enough, so I'm not in a particular hurry on that account. SMT have had elements pop up from time to time though.
*googles*
Okay...
The Xeno games covered Gnosticism well enough, so I'm not in a particular hurry on that account. SMT have had elements pop up from time to time though.
It wouldn't be so bad if it weren't so predictable. It's not a twist to reveal the organized religion is evil and God is the final boss guys. That's almost as cliche as "the rebels you were fighting were actually the good guys!"
I think it's a natural epic conclusion to world spanning 40 hour RPG quests. Like, ok, how much bigger can you get than fighting God?
Fimbulvetr
Member
I sorta see his logic. At the start Yuna, Lulu, and Wakka are pretty set in their ways as far as Yevon goes. If he told them before they'd rejected Yevon, they probs woulda been like "that sucks, but two years without Sin is still worth it". He wanted them to reject Yevon on their own terms before he let them in on Sin's secret.
Still extremely stupid, since his plan hinged on Seymour just happening to be the biggest, nihilist idiot in the universe and targeting Yuna for his dumb evil plan, which just coincidentally lead to Yevon revealing itself as a gaggle of corrupt dickbags.
You also forgot that Auron and Tidus kept "my old man is Sin" a secret from the party until just before they reached Zanarkand.
She only kept that secret from the time they left Guadosalam until Macarena Temple. It's probably the world record for shortest kept secret in Spira history, tbh.
Short in player time (a few hours?) but what is the time actually measured in the game world? This is supposed to be a journey, so I imagine a trip from Guadosalam to a freezing cold winterland wouldn't be short.
FFX is really bad at conveying the passage of time in the game world as it is, so it's hard to tell. If you look at the world map though, there is actually quite significant geographical gap between Guadosalam and Lake Macalania. The walk would probably take weeks, unless the FFX world is some type of tiny super small planet.
It may be about 5 years since I've last played this but I believe even Auron did not know that Yu Yevon is residing inside Sin. The only reason he went for Yunalesca in the first place is to probably defeat Yunalesca so that the final summoning may not happen again, thus ending the Sin cycle when Jecht is killed as Sin, which he planned on doing so that's why he brought Tidus to Spira.
how much bigger can you get than fighting God?
Yu Yevon is far from a God in Spira.He's merely an empty shell going on an eternal loop of summoning and crazy magic ,by the time you meet him.
He's a central figure in the religion of spira ,but not really as a God in the traditional Judeo Christian sense.
He's more like a Buddha of sorts,one whose teachings are vital ,but he's not credited with any traditional God properties.
ShinMaruku
Member
Yup. The killing god theme is NOT in FFX at all. I would argue FF does not go in that angle but rather just poking orgianized religion.
Auron had no intention of allowing Yuna to be sacrificed. His intention was to kill Yunalesca and defeat Sin without the Final Aeon to avenge Jecht/Yuna's father and end the sham Calm.
Damn, they really need to make an FFX game where you play as Jecht and Anya's father's pilgrimage. That should have been FFX-2.
Damn, they really need to make an FFX game where you play as Jecht and Anya's father's pilgrimage. That should have been FFX-2.
Fimbulvetr
Member
I think the landmass in Spira is just tiny.
Most areas are cut up by loading screens, but the length from the beginning of Mushroom Rock Road to Djose Temple is almost completely uncut and still manages to be extremely short.
Could just be game design or hardware limitations.This was also the first FF to actually attempt to convey a "realistically" scaled world and this was before all the massive 3D open worlds we see today.
Yup..Idk why people insist you fight God in FFX.Similar to how some think Tidus traveled a 1000 years into the future.
But that doesn't add up with how long the sea trips in the beginning are depicted as, when you consider the distance they cover on the map.
FlashbladeGAF
Member
Solid Samus
Banned
You want fucking awkward? Check out a translation of that X-2 sequel audio drama.
I used to think that way as well
but I mean my first FFX playthrough was when I was like fifteen... I played it through again recently and everything makes just enough sense
I used to think that way as well
but I mean my first FFX playthrough was when I was like fifteen... I played it through again recently and everything makes just enough sense
DiipuSurotu
Banned
To be fair most RPG characters tend to be idiots regardless. Also, I liked Wakka's generall upbeatness but I can't deny that his extremism was irritating. It's also weird that he ends up with his brother's wife/fiance or whatever. I mean Lulu is amazing but still.
Except that the cast of the game previous to this one is pretty much better in every way. Also Tidus is discount bro-fied Zidane. I said it.
Except the FFX characters individually have more meat to their characters than pretty much any other game in the series
Except that the cast of the game previous to this one is pretty much better in every way. Also Tidus is discount bro-fied Zidane. I said it.
Apart from Garnet and Vivi,the cast is pretty damn shallow compared to FFX's.
I love Steiner though.He's a funny,likeable character.
How can you say that about Zidane and Freya though? Also I love Amarant but I admit that they really didn't develop his story at all. Quina was great too but its story is basically: fuck you I do what I want.
ShinMaruku
Member
You mean the god who has a mother goddess he sealed?
Galactic Barret
Member
Didn't Auron keep that Final Aeon secret because of how precious-tier Yuna was, and no one on the whole team would have the balls to sacrifice her until they had already went to far and learned too many things to turn back?
Tidus didn't know until he spoke with the Fayth(?) that he was a pawn, and even after, what kind of douche dumps that kind of steaming pile on the girl you're crushing on? "Hey, I know you have this job to do, and I'mma let you finish, but I ain't really real." That would be Wakka-tier.
Lulu didn't tell Wakka about Chappu because Wakka is all emotional and shit. Who wants that liability?
Everything else is self-explanatory. Except why Auron didn't tell Tidus that Sin was his dad.
Tidus didn't know until he spoke with the Fayth(?) that he was a pawn, and even after, what kind of douche dumps that kind of steaming pile on the girl you're crushing on? "Hey, I know you have this job to do, and I'mma let you finish, but I ain't really real." That would be Wakka-tier.
Lulu didn't tell Wakka about Chappu because Wakka is all emotional and shit. Who wants that liability?
Everything else is self-explanatory. Except why Auron didn't tell Tidus that Sin was his dad.
Zidane is like downgraded Tidus.Sure he's a smartass ,but he hasn't much going for him except for his Dynamics with Garnet.
Then at the end of the game we find out he's an alien without any forshadowing whatsoever ,and that he's the Villain's brother.
Heck I liked Cecil,Kain,Rosa and Golbez better than that.
Freya had dramatic scenes in Burmecia and something about sir fratley and then immediately becomes irrelevant..At least that's from memory.
Quina is a legitmately a great character simply because of how awesome her scenes are.
Wat. That's like the first thing he tells him when they reunite in Spira.
Tidus_Great
Banned
most of these secrets are only kept to avoid hurting the other person, or causing confrontation.
FFX group is pretty tight, one of the best examples of a fellowship in gaming.
FFX group is pretty tight, one of the best examples of a fellowship in gaming.
The Mad Draklor
Member
Heh, if you think the FFX table will be awkward, it'll be more awkward post-FFX 2.5 & FFX -Will-
Tidus_Great
Banned
at least they'll know tidus is dead
SolVanderlyn
Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
First thing that came to mind were the dinner scenes from the Grandia series. Yeah, those would be awkward if inserted into FFX.
Also, Wakka is not an asshole. He's extremely devoted to his religion. It's not his fault that the religion he's following is a load of crock. He honestly believed he was bringing about peace, and hated Al Bhed because he thought they were responsible for not only Sin, but his brother's death. Can you really blame him?
I forget this part of Xenogears. When does the Soylent Green ripoff happen?You want to talk about characters keeping secrets from their comrades:
"No, please... continue eating that mysterious substance in convenient canned form. I'll just watch."
Also, Wakka is not an asshole. He's extremely devoted to his religion. It's not his fault that the religion he's following is a load of crock. He honestly believed he was bringing about peace, and hated Al Bhed because he thought they were responsible for not only Sin, but his brother's death. Can you really blame him?
I'm aware, I was just making a general point about jRPGs. In FFX you get a lot of people worshiping someone (or listening intently to someone's teachings) which can happen with or without a God. So the themes of corruption in religion still exist, just without a true God to fight at the end. Functionally, that makes it not so dramatically different than the themes of most jRPGs which have bad/corrupt religions as a central theme
Not that tiny. If you took the FFX traveling time literally - as in what you see is what you get - you'd be jumping from a region of warmth to a region of freezing cold in seconds. The world of FFX would be so tiny that everyone would weigh like 50lbs
It's clear from the world map this is a world of some size, and that SquareEnix obviously couldn't render all the vast distances that exist between places. But the distance between Guadosalam and Macalania is quite considerable on the map.
SolVanderlyn said:
Yes. If a religion on Earth had you being incredibly hateful toward a group of people for just being part of a group of people, what do you think we'd call that here? >
Blind devotion is not an excuse for hate. It just means you're an unthinking moron worthy of scorn. And notice, Lulu never expressed that overt hate despite the teachings. Wakka is just an asshole.
Tidus_Great
Banned
yeah wakka is only an asshole because yevons teachings were shoved down his throat all his life, also chappus death made him resent the al bhed and strengthened his faith in yevon. BUTTT later in the journey his eyes are opened he realizes al bhed can be good and yevonites can be bad. He sees that Yevon isn't the truth like he thought it was and starts to think for himself. He's a well done character. I wonder if some of you even play the games to completion that you bash? You certainly don't udnerstand them enough to criticize them anyways :/
I've played and beat FFX some eight times already. Please don't go into a turtle shell and start making accusations because you don't like the conclusions people reach about irrelevant media you happen to enjoy. For christ's sake, you have a Wakka avatar. Blind devotion may be a theme here.
Weltall Zero
Member
Allow me to express skepticism regarding the existence any possible criticism of FFX's story that you might find entirely acceptable.
Tidus_Great
Banned
you said "Blind devotion is not an excuse for hate" but the thing is people grow up under different circumstances. Not everyone reacts the same way. Wakka wanted to end sin in spira too and he was tought that complete atonement would do that so that is what he followed. He saw al bhed as a threat to what he saw as good (yevon) You're missing the bigger picture and not appreciating his character growth.
I'm aware, I was just making a general point about jRPGs. In FFX you get a lot of people worshiping someone (or listening intently to someone's teachings) which can happen with or without a God. So the themes of corruption in religion still exist, just without a true God to fight at the end. Functionally, that makes it not so dramatically different than the themes of most jRPGs which have bad/corrupt religions as a central theme
Its a good theme right ? religion does suck so I don't see the problem Dx
Hardware limitations and their first ever attempt at properly scaled 3D world would be my guess for why they couldn't portray the world properly.
Its probably meant to be a large distance.You bring an interesting point though,I wonder if the devs answered this question about world scale.
Tidus_Great
Banned
He hated them for their beliefs more than anything.
But racism is a theme in FFX. Maester Seymour suffered greatly in his life due to this.
Listen to what you're saying here. Let's say there is a faith on Earth (and actually there are lol) where one of the central teachings led you to believe to a specific group of people were responsible for many of the problems on the planet. What would happen? Well, exactly what did happen - hate and violence against that specific group of people. We'd call that racism or genocide if there's enough killing involved against that group. We don't afterwards say "well consider their upbringing and what they were taught." Plenty of people are taught hateful shit and don't turn into hateful people, because they think for themselves.
This isn't even necessarily a criticism of FFX. It's a way of thinking about morally reprehensible actions. A better argument from you would be that by the time he gets to Yunalesca, he has progressed to the point where he casts that hate off - and that forgiveness should be involved at that point. I wouldn't disagree with that entirely, but Wakka is still a true asshole.
I am going to look it up. See if there's any real answers. Maybe Kagari knows haha
He didn't give a damn about the Al Bhed scarifices and was heavily opposed to their participation at the Operation Mi'ihen,where the Al Bhed displayed a sincere will to cooperate with the crusaders just to rid people of Sin.
Wakka was too stuck up his ass to see properly,even in a situation where his Yevonite Maesters approved of the machinca use and Al Bhed cooperation.
He was racist.
Haha looking up the size of Spira I just found out that apparently the entire game series is a prequel to Final Fantasy VII.
SquareEnix smh
Apparently shinra in FFX-2 is the start of what leads to the shit fest in FF7 lol
Zuhzuhzombie!!
Member
Keeping secrets from friends seems to be a theme of RPGs, but man as I run through FFX for the umpteenth time it really struck me how awkward it must be by the end of the game for everyone.
Lulu was keeping it secret from Wakka that Luzzu convinced Chappu to get into the Crusaders (where he then was killed). She along with the rest of the group kept Tidus in the dark about what was to happen at the end of the journey.
Auron was keeping it secret from Tidus and others that he is really dead (unsent). He also kept it secret from everyone that the whole journey was one big fucking sham and that one of them would need to become the Final Aeon if they were to defeat sin (and thereby become Sin, whilst Yuna dies), which seems to me pretty fucking mean spirited. I still can't see an advantage to him doing that, his nonsense about them needing to see this for themselves just rung hollow.
Tidus is keeping it secret from everyone but especially Yuna that he is actually a dream of the Fayth who will disappear if they kill Yu Yevon.
Yuna was keeping it secret from Tidus that she would die at the end after summoning the Final Aeon. She also kept it secret from Wakka that she was Cid's niece. Although that makes sense, Wakka was an asshole. And she was keeping it secret from everyone for the longest time that Seymour was a total asshole who killed his father.
Rikku was keeping it secret from Wakka that she was an Al Bhed. Also understandable with Wakka being asshole-tier.
Kimahri kept Auron's secret from everyone about being an unsent.
And gamers everywhere are left in the dark as to why Lulu would ever marry and have a kid with asshole dumbass Wakka. Maybe they both had the whole blindly following the teachings of Yevon thing for the longest time going for them?
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So like if after the game ended they all sat down to dinner and talked, I think it'd probably be a pretty silent dinner. I mean it just seems like it'd take a little while to get past that shit, but maybe defeating Yu Yevon allows you to see what's important or some shit.
I'm thinking of other Final Fantasy games, but I don't know if the secrets-from-friends thing is as ever-present as it becomes in FFX. Most FF characters have secrets about their upbringing and past, and of course sometimes those secrets effect the others... but it seems like in FFX they all just happily keep shit that would like obviously negatively effect the others if revealed. Seems like a poor foundation for friendship.
FFX is a bad game OP
Lumination
'enry 'ollins
Very amusing topic. Never thought about it that way haha.
Thanks for the food for thought.
Thanks for the food for thought.