There's no need to be vulgar.
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Batman [Mafia] |OT| The mafia game Gafia deserves , but not the one it needs
- Thread starter roytheone
- Start date
There's no need to be vulgar.
My main problem with Flux is that I know he is watching the thread, he's even said as much, but he is poking his head up only when someone says his name. It's an extremely defensive stance.
fireblend (0)
sorian 127 (146)
weemadarthur 147 (165)
karkador (1)
flame_ac 128 (439)
camjo-z 356
weemadarthur (0)
fireblend 139 (303)
sorian (1)
skyodin 141
trigger (0)
sorian 146 (239)
tl21xx (0)
weemadarthur 165 (304)
no lynch (0)
karkador 209 (226)
camjo-z (1)
karu 219
pop-o-matic (0)
trigger 236 (488)
thegoddamn (0)
sorian 239 (310)
mazre (4)
xamtheking 256
fireblend 303
thegoddamn 390
flame_ac 439
el topo (1)
weemadarthur 304
coppanuva (1)
sorian 310
fluxwavez (1)
ty4on 499
Day 1 ends:
10 votes for majority
karkador (1)
camjo-z 356
weemadarthur (0)
sorian (1)
skyodin 141
trigger (0)
tl21xx (0)
no lynch (0)
camjo-z (1)
karu 219
pop-o-matic (0)
thegoddamn (0)
mazre (4)
xamtheking 256
fireblend 303
thegoddamn 390
flame_ac 439
el topo (1)
weemadarthur 304
coppanuva (1)
sorian 310
fluxwavez (1)
ty4on 499
Day 1 ends:
10 votes for majority
weemadarthur
Member
Looking over the thread again, I see a behavior pattern I don't like.
Trigger
Starts with being down on read lists, but not quite committing to the opinion. A scummy attitude stated in a scummy way.
Straight up says he has no team behind him.
Posts a policy vote, blames rng.
Tunnels on Mazre, but only after a bunch of others have failed to defend him and basically seem ok to off him.
You're looking a lot like you did in Princess. Posting just enough to not be called out, offering safe opinions, never disagreeing with anyone.
Trigger
Starts with being down on read lists, but not quite committing to the opinion. A scummy attitude stated in a scummy way.
Straight up says he has no team behind him.
Posts a policy vote, blames rng.
Tunnels on Mazre, but only after a bunch of others have failed to defend him and basically seem ok to off him.
You're looking a lot like you did in Princess. Posting just enough to not be called out, offering safe opinions, never disagreeing with anyone.
You reminded me to post something about those read lists, thanks.
Anyone who thinks read lists are useless or shouldn't be made don't have town's best interests in their heart. For some people, that's the only way they can contribute. Any post which informs us of how two different people view each other is going to be very important later.
Anyone who thinks read lists are useless or shouldn't be made don't have town's best interests in their heart. For some people, that's the only way they can contribute. Any post which informs us of how two different people view each other is going to be very important later.
Alright, I'm all caught up.
Unvote
I should've removed my vote a while ago, Mazre responded to my vote against him adequately, and after reading the last couple of pages I'm siding with him not being the lynch target for today. I'm not super worried about we accidentally lynching a PR hiding behind an ordinary claim, Occam's Razor and all that, but he's put himself in a position of suspicion he won't be coming out of easily, and worst case scenario we can lynch him if we notice something doesn't fit later. Lynching an ordinary on D1 is a decent outcome, but in the case of a self-claimed ordinary it still feels like denying ourselves information and doing scum's job for them.
Onto some reads:
I always have a ton of trouble during early days because of the number of players, even during mid-season games, but I'm gonna give it a shot:
1. Camjo-Z [m] - Has said he's not a fan of D1, and feels unable to find a balance between his joke posts and the reactive ones which seem unusually hostile. Difficult read. I feel like after saying he wasn't fond of D1 he found a comfortable position in going after Kark in general, although he does agree in that maybe going after Mazre today would be a waste.
2. Coppanuva [m] - Very reactive, not terribly active, but at the same time he's been scrutinized for next-to-all his (very few) posts, and the way he's responded just doesn't strike me as that of someone who's playing with a team. That's very gut-based, but then again it's difficult to come up with more than that for someone with such few posts.
3. El topo [m] - Posted next to nothing but at least I knew he was playing because other players were mentioning him. His post about restricting information during D1 as that helped scum is very odd and I find it completely antithetical to town's role in any "informed minority vs. uninformed majority" game such as mafia. It'd be weird for scum to make a post that goes against town principles so obviously. But suspicious nonetheless.
4. Fireblend [m] - Left as an exercise to the reader.
7. Karkador [m] - Leaving alone for now. He's a daring player, not afraid to provoke reactions, and even if (as I'm 99% sure) the batcomputer stuff is some RNG thing, I can see value in the conversations it sparked. Much like Sorian, he's someone whose posts hold a ton of weight and create narrative, which is very useful. Someone to look out for, but who town wants to see sticking around at the moment, IMO.
8. Karu [m] - When catching up just before starting to read this post, I noticed Karu was playing this game. Honest. I even thought "well, there's an easy inactivity vote for today", but I see he's checked out of the game for now so... yeah. He better catch up in terms of activity quick day 2 if he makes it out of this one. I disagree with him on Mazre, too.
9. Mazre [m] - I've said my piece on him. I'm gonna trust him for now and assume he's ordinary town, while keeping other possibilities in the back of my mind. To be revisited at a later date.
10. Pop-o-matic [m] - Not much to say. All he has is a small reads list that doesn't say much, except it seems like he misread my interactions with Weemad because he says we seemed close, so I'm guessing he didn't catch some of the sarcasm between our posts. Other than that... echoed my opinion on reads list and complained about Kark's quirkiness, very fluffy.
11. SkyOdin [m] - I like SkyOdin. I see an active player who's not afraid to question others and provide opinions openly. He's been insightful throughout the day and brushed hints of suspicion aside like they were nothing. Very well-thought out arguments. Reading him as town for now.
12. Sorian [m] - I'm gonna echo what he's said about me and say it's really hard for me to read him. I'm always suspicious of Sorian since his activity tends to steer the conversation, and what I always say about that is it's not worth going after someone who contributes to town so well during the early-game just because they might be scum. If anything, I'd say I'm even hesitating to say that in this instance because he feels truly helpful this time around. Town for now.
17. weemadarthur [-] - Very active and prodding, though I feel like she's taken a step back since people other than me started looking into her. Difficult read; I feel like she's either a very eager townie who trusts her gut waaay more than I do which creates tension and uneasiness between us, or confident scum. I feel like her techniques and the way she plays is opposite of mine in some ways, and it makes things difficult.
18. Xamtheking [m] - For someone who had been begging for the game to begin, oddly quiet and even... shy? Totally not what I was expecting, and that's brewing some confusion in me. He's been inactive, very reactive, quick to fall into usual town patterns (I was expecting some initiative, but so far he's regurgitated other people's thoughts without much effort). He even posted a super uninspired list in an effort to make up for his lack of presence I suppose? Suspicious.
No reads / insufficient data for a meaningful answer:
5. Flame_AC [m]
6. FluxWaveZ [m]
13. The Goddamn [m]
14. TL21xx [m]
15. Trigger [m]
16. Ty4on [m]
Unvote
I should've removed my vote a while ago, Mazre responded to my vote against him adequately, and after reading the last couple of pages I'm siding with him not being the lynch target for today. I'm not super worried about we accidentally lynching a PR hiding behind an ordinary claim, Occam's Razor and all that, but he's put himself in a position of suspicion he won't be coming out of easily, and worst case scenario we can lynch him if we notice something doesn't fit later. Lynching an ordinary on D1 is a decent outcome, but in the case of a self-claimed ordinary it still feels like denying ourselves information and doing scum's job for them.
Onto some reads:
I always have a ton of trouble during early days because of the number of players, even during mid-season games, but I'm gonna give it a shot:
1. Camjo-Z [m] - Has said he's not a fan of D1, and feels unable to find a balance between his joke posts and the reactive ones which seem unusually hostile. Difficult read. I feel like after saying he wasn't fond of D1 he found a comfortable position in going after Kark in general, although he does agree in that maybe going after Mazre today would be a waste.
2. Coppanuva [m] - Very reactive, not terribly active, but at the same time he's been scrutinized for next-to-all his (very few) posts, and the way he's responded just doesn't strike me as that of someone who's playing with a team. That's very gut-based, but then again it's difficult to come up with more than that for someone with such few posts.
3. El topo [m] - Posted next to nothing but at least I knew he was playing because other players were mentioning him. His post about restricting information during D1 as that helped scum is very odd and I find it completely antithetical to town's role in any "informed minority vs. uninformed majority" game such as mafia. It'd be weird for scum to make a post that goes against town principles so obviously. But suspicious nonetheless.
4. Fireblend [m] - Left as an exercise to the reader.
7. Karkador [m] - Leaving alone for now. He's a daring player, not afraid to provoke reactions, and even if (as I'm 99% sure) the batcomputer stuff is some RNG thing, I can see value in the conversations it sparked. Much like Sorian, he's someone whose posts hold a ton of weight and create narrative, which is very useful. Someone to look out for, but who town wants to see sticking around at the moment, IMO.
8. Karu [m] - When catching up just before starting to read this post, I noticed Karu was playing this game. Honest. I even thought "well, there's an easy inactivity vote for today", but I see he's checked out of the game for now so... yeah. He better catch up in terms of activity quick day 2 if he makes it out of this one. I disagree with him on Mazre, too.
9. Mazre [m] - I've said my piece on him. I'm gonna trust him for now and assume he's ordinary town, while keeping other possibilities in the back of my mind. To be revisited at a later date.
10. Pop-o-matic [m] - Not much to say. All he has is a small reads list that doesn't say much, except it seems like he misread my interactions with Weemad because he says we seemed close, so I'm guessing he didn't catch some of the sarcasm between our posts. Other than that... echoed my opinion on reads list and complained about Kark's quirkiness, very fluffy.
11. SkyOdin [m] - I like SkyOdin. I see an active player who's not afraid to question others and provide opinions openly. He's been insightful throughout the day and brushed hints of suspicion aside like they were nothing. Very well-thought out arguments. Reading him as town for now.
12. Sorian [m] - I'm gonna echo what he's said about me and say it's really hard for me to read him. I'm always suspicious of Sorian since his activity tends to steer the conversation, and what I always say about that is it's not worth going after someone who contributes to town so well during the early-game just because they might be scum. If anything, I'd say I'm even hesitating to say that in this instance because he feels truly helpful this time around. Town for now.
17. weemadarthur [-] - Very active and prodding, though I feel like she's taken a step back since people other than me started looking into her. Difficult read; I feel like she's either a very eager townie who trusts her gut waaay more than I do which creates tension and uneasiness between us, or confident scum. I feel like her techniques and the way she plays is opposite of mine in some ways, and it makes things difficult.
18. Xamtheking [m] - For someone who had been begging for the game to begin, oddly quiet and even... shy? Totally not what I was expecting, and that's brewing some confusion in me. He's been inactive, very reactive, quick to fall into usual town patterns (I was expecting some initiative, but so far he's regurgitated other people's thoughts without much effort). He even posted a super uninspired list in an effort to make up for his lack of presence I suppose? Suspicious.
No reads / insufficient data for a meaningful answer:
5. Flame_AC [m]
6. FluxWaveZ [m]
13. The Goddamn [m]
14. TL21xx [m]
15. Trigger [m]
16. Ty4on [m]
Xamtheking
Member
I found my kryptonite
It's D1 Karkador
weemadarthur
Member
Ok....do you have reads on other players? You can't just Not Play because someone else took the spotlight with a faster gambit.
Man, what? Where's that confidence, that spark, that spring in your step?
Seriously tho. Give us something.
Ah, admits he may not be here before the end of the day phase but continues to leave a worthless vote on me to prevent others from getting a sense of who he actually wants to vote today. Interesting (and by interesting I mean very scummy), but I have other matters to attend to.
1. He wasn't "down on read lists". He said a list of your top suspects is more to the point and less of a slog considering D1's light amount of early info.
2. Funny that you'd get on him about a policy RNG vote when Sorian also started the game with one. I don't recall hearing any complaints about that.
3. Trigger has done the opposite of tunneling, unless you're trying to say that he's focused on him not being mafia. And even then, it's not especially controversial to be talking about someone with four votes already on them if you think there are better ways to be voting.
Anyway, these inconsistencies are just a few of the reasons why I'm voting you. As mentioned before, I suspect that mafia's has tried to get someone out in front very early, and there's no easier way to do it than with someone who's "just asking questions". Unfortunately for your team, you've made a few contradictions.
For example, you say that you normally wouldn't poke a breadcrumb and only poked TL's because he was being hypocritical by saying that town shouldn't claim... then proceed to poke Kark about his role with no such provocation.
Here, you claim that you mistakenly posted notes in this thread when you meant to post them elsewhere.
Said "notes" are quite blatant fingerpointing at who wee wants to push as mafia. Does anyone really believe they weren't meant to be posted here? Last I checked, NeoGAF's quoting syntax doesn't directly carry over to Outer Gafia. These mistakes, and wee's posts in general, read to me like mafia who wants to get as much info as they can while also setting up suspicion against certain others for later when they need justification to push an lynch.
VOTE: weemadarthur
It was enough of a commitment to the idea that you made it. I mean, I understand that a joke is a joke, but I'm wondering if there's something indicative about your frame of mind between suggesting I'm Batman (essentially outing a PR) and then voting on me.
If I was really out to lynch you today, I'd have made an actual effort to convince others (see above).
weemadarthur
Member
That IS being down on read lists without committing.
I think you may have misunderstood my point. I'm not against rng votes. I'm not against policy votes. I AM against lying. Trigger seemed to be making a safe policy vote on an inactive, while Claiming it was the will of randomness. Seems scummy.
Talking about people on a sort of bandwagon conversation looks scummy to me.
Karkador isn't posting a breadcrumb. He is straight up role playing batman. He's talking to alfred, Robin and the batcomputer. It is un-missable to anyone, not a subtle hint nobody is supposed to notice until the speaker points back at it.
It puts the quote in a quote box! It leaves off the username though.
1. I'm reading his quote and trying to find the part where he says we shouldn't post reads but I can't seem to find it! Please, assist me!
2. I guess he could be lying? It seems like a pretty weak thing to lie about though, especially considering Sorian literally did the same thing to Trigger but claimed he was RNG voting based on who was inactive.
3. Maf, please start a vote on whoever you want. Nobody dissent unless you wanna look scummy!
4. It's clear that Karkador's Batman shenanigans are unmissable. Do you actually want him to outright claim Batman? Do you want him to confirm he's not? If it's yes to either, how would knowing this now benefit town more than it benefits mafia? If it's no to both, why did you even ask him?
5. I know it puts the quote in the box without the username. That's why I know they weren't intended strictly for yourself, because you'd have made a note of who actually said the quote before putting it there. Hm, who's lying now...
weemadarthur
Member
1. Saying people shouldn't at all post reads would be committing to a strong opinion. As a scum in Princess, he didn't commit to things. He supported arguments that were inaccurate and hedged when scum was found.
2. It's scummy of Sorian too if he's lying. I can't tell. Apart from that point, I found sorian scummy for using other people's arguments as a jumping off point instead of being original. I'm not defending him. You're free to think he's scummy. I don't quite have a read on Sorian or I'd post it.
3. I get it. You think I'm wrong.
4. I want him to not bait power roles, batman in particular. I posted that he could be drawing out batman. He's a good enough player that he shouldn't forget this, but if he was mafia he might be pretending to forget. I wanted that point out in the open so he couldn't pretend in that case, and to remind the batman player to not respond to the bait. Just in case, you know?
5. It's good policy not to believe anything anyone says in a mafia game. The points were fine to share with the thread eventually. I just would have explained my arguments better is all.
6. I don't expect you to automatically agree with everything I say or anything. I'm doing my best to hunt scum. I'm used to players telling me my arguments are weird, but it's good for someone to keep an eye on everyone.
You sure are invested in protecting trigger from suspicion.
Committing to a strong opinion =/= being totally for or against something
I presume I'll be seeing you make a push for Trigger's lynch today and voting me tomorrow when he flips maf then? Wouldn't want to look like you're not committing to a strong opinion, after all.
The assumption that I was targeting someone for being inactive was Sorian's. I provided the explanation for my vote. We're all on an honor system when it comes to RNG voting. You don't have to believe me, but that's what happened.
Trigger, I'm curious why you decided to retract your vote then. At the time you unvoted, you said it was because Pop-O-Matic finally posted. Can you explain your thoughts on why you kept the RNG vote and then removed it a little more?
weemadarthur
Member
Isn't it?
Very possibly. I will have my vote on the player I find scummiest. However, just because I think I've found one scum doesn't mean I stop looking for another scum.
I see.
I will go back and read those pages again and consider what you're saying.
I agree those are some weak responses from Weemad. In particular...
I just don't believe good policy is not believing anything anyone says. Of course you don't trust anyone straight away, but distrusting everything from the get go puts you in such a bad position to do any actual reasoning on the game it's just not worth it. You can't win this game on gut feelings alone. Think about it: approximately 4 of every 5 players here are town, and thus are either plain telling the truth, or working with town's best interest in mind. If they're that 1 scum player in 5, they may not even be lying to gain some points with town, or lying by omission (I mean of course they're doing that). Either way, you have to work with the information others give you, not twist it further. Looking for contradictions or behavioral oddities is a different thing from total distrust.
Your absolutist views on Trigger's position regarding lists (which i agree with - obscuring your actual thoughts under a heap of hollow reads is useless), what you make of Sorian's having opinions on others' thoughts or "people discussing bandwagon votes" seem weakly supported, and odd points overall to go through all this trouble for. Do you really think those are points worth defending, or are you just trying to avoid being backed into a corner because it might make you look bad?
I just don't believe good policy is not believing anything anyone says. Of course you don't trust anyone straight away, but distrusting everything from the get go puts you in such a bad position to do any actual reasoning on the game it's just not worth it. You can't win this game on gut feelings alone. Think about it: approximately 4 of every 5 players here are town, and thus are either plain telling the truth, or working with town's best interest in mind. If they're that 1 scum player in 5, they may not even be lying to gain some points with town, or lying by omission (I mean of course they're doing that). Either way, you have to work with the information others give you, not twist it further. Looking for contradictions or behavioral oddities is a different thing from total distrust.
Your absolutist views on Trigger's position regarding lists (which i agree with - obscuring your actual thoughts under a heap of hollow reads is useless), what you make of Sorian's having opinions on others' thoughts or "people discussing bandwagon votes" seem weakly supported, and odd points overall to go through all this trouble for. Do you really think those are points worth defending, or are you just trying to avoid being backed into a corner because it might make you look bad?
This hear is the sum total of El topo's contributions to the game so far. Some fluff at the start, getting defensive from some early prodding by other players, what appears to be some inexplicable attempt to scare people off from making read lists, and a few vague assurances that he is paying attention to the thread and will post soon. None of it is particularly meaty.
Now, El topo went onto my potential scum list early in this Day phase because of his posts about read lists up there. I've noticed that a few other people here have gotten the same vibe about them too. I can't definitively say that El topo is scum based just on this, but we are creeping closer and closer to the end of Day 1. We now have less than 24 hours to make our votes, so I though that I should start making a more decisive vote for the day. So here it is:
VOTE: El topo
There are other people on my radar too, of course. Mazre's vote claim is highly suspicious, and has made me wary of him. Camjo-Z and Trigger have also been acting a little strangly in my opinion. And of course there are way too many people who have barely been active at all. However, El topo is the person who seems most actively scummy to me so far.
So just some food for thought. Reactions to my activity so far in general.
The above shows who directly commented on my claim, and the circumstances around there reaction. What isn't shown is when chronologically or whether a vote was cast that can be analyzed and cross referenced if someone feels like doing the leg work (I probably should have but it didn't occur as I was going through. The +/- in the first column indicates the tenor of their reaction towards me. + for positive, - negative, and no mark for a null reaction.
So a few take aways:
el topo and tl21xx were the only ones to to make no comment at all. El topo was apparently busy Friday but otherwise hasn't done much, tl21xx has barely registered any activity in the game period.
I have Karkador unmarked (that should probably have a mark but I already uploaded the image). We did have a back and forth and he did include me in his read list, but surprisingly he hasn't said a single word in regard to my claim.
Karu seems to be the only one who had anything resembling a favorable reaction to my claim. OMGUR (oh my god you rule)?
There were 2 points where wee directly asked about others about my claim, answered in most cases and sometimes by people not directly asked. The group of players who responded to prodding is a bit murky. Yes the provided a reaction but would they have if not prompted? Grab another box of wine for the table I guess.
No comment.
weemadarthur
Member
This whole thing seems to suggest that you hate my play style.
I choose not to believe things by default. From my reading, Gafia could stand to believe a lot less than it does. I'm amazed at what people got away with in star wars and ace attorney for instance. You feel free to believe parts, or nothing, or everything.
I may sound absolutist. Personality differences shouldn't be an argument though. I sincerely believe people use hating on read lists when they're scum. Naturally for read lists to be valuable they have to be sincere, not like that crap xam posted. Posting bad read lists is a scumtell too.
For the other bits, I drew attention to things that make the inside of my head itch. You can say the game doesn't go on gut, but it often comes down to that. If you think I'm not supporting my arguments well enough, ok, I'll try to improve. But if I resorted to saying "this bothers my gut" instead of pointing out a specific little thing that's bothering me, would you be more ready to consider it? That's a common statement which seems to get an infinite free pass.
It's interesting, isn't it? You're willing to openly claim your supposed role as though you have nothing to hide, but then you clamp down when it comes to people questioning it as though you have something to hide.
I see.
You know, I'm reading each post as they come in, and I feel like there's not much I can add at this point.
Mazre clamping down on his silence about his role is only bad for town, the more unwilling he is, the more likely it is we're hitting someone with a PR, that or scum will kill him to make sure.
Mazre clamping down on his silence about his role is only bad for town, the more unwilling he is, the more likely it is we're hitting someone with a PR, that or scum will kill him to make sure.
I'll only comment on (I think all) the posts directed at me first. Didn't have too much time yesterday/today due to Good Friday/Easter.
This is nonsensical. Your conclusion, "No (read) list => No reads, Only Power Role Talk", is simply false. It is one thing to investigate posts, to give general thoughts, to provide a read on a single player. A read list is a very different thing. It is an easy way to bond with other players, seem active and involved, yet it (most of the time) offers little tangible value, even moreso on D1. Focus on players (and give proper explanations/links to posts), don't spread this stuff out, because really what is the value of telling us (in particular on D1) stuff like "ABC is neutral" or "I have no read on XYZ"? I will add though that I am not a fan of reading too much into D1 behavior. Look where that got us in Love Boat or Archer.
If you want to make a list, by all means go ahead, do what you must, but I have made my opinion on them clear. Do I think read lists provide value? No. I do think however that read lists distract us and I don't think it is debatable that a team of several players (with their own chat) can make use of them. I much favor if players focus their attention.
Nonsense. I have expressed my dislike of (read) lists and I have pointed out that discussions about game mechanics are premature. Unlike Archer (or Love Boat), there is no additional game mechanic that might warrant a discussion. In addition, we have had (fortunately) no role reveal yet, other than (I think) Mazre claiming to be an ordinary cop. I don't think I have taken a stance against anything else.
I simply find these intricate reads on D1 behavior a bit pointless because we have very, very little to go on. Some people here have expressed utterly nonsensical opinions towards me, completely misunderstanding/misinterpreting what I wrote. Does that make them scum? Is it just because it is D1? Did they misread it and simply make an honest mistake? Is it to poke a response?
I have explained why discussing game mechanics is rather pointless at this point and I have taken a stance against read lists. I have said what I think of reading too much into D1 behavior, but obviously we need to lynch someone today (so we need a candidate from *somewhere*).
Good Friday/Easter. I also did not vote on anyone and it goes without saying that I am town.
I don't get where that whole restricting information thing comes from. That is a wrong generalization, when I have only taken a stance regarding read lists and mechanics discussion (on D1). I have also, I think in every game, said what I think of reading too much into D1 behavior. I think the only time mafia got lynched on D1 was due to a fuck up, which caused a restart of the game.
This is nonsensical. Your conclusion, "No (read) list => No reads, Only Power Role Talk", is simply false. It is one thing to investigate posts, to give general thoughts, to provide a read on a single player. A read list is a very different thing. It is an easy way to bond with other players, seem active and involved, yet it (most of the time) offers little tangible value, even moreso on D1. Focus on players (and give proper explanations/links to posts), don't spread this stuff out, because really what is the value of telling us (in particular on D1) stuff like "ABC is neutral" or "I have no read on XYZ"? I will add though that I am not a fan of reading too much into D1 behavior. Look where that got us in Love Boat or Archer.
If you want to make a list, by all means go ahead, do what you must, but I have made my opinion on them clear. Do I think read lists provide value? No. I do think however that read lists distract us and I don't think it is debatable that a team of several players (with their own chat) can make use of them. I much favor if players focus their attention.
Nonsense. I have expressed my dislike of (read) lists and I have pointed out that discussions about game mechanics are premature. Unlike Archer (or Love Boat), there is no additional game mechanic that might warrant a discussion. In addition, we have had (fortunately) no role reveal yet, other than (I think) Mazre claiming to be an ordinary cop. I don't think I have taken a stance against anything else.
I simply find these intricate reads on D1 behavior a bit pointless because we have very, very little to go on. Some people here have expressed utterly nonsensical opinions towards me, completely misunderstanding/misinterpreting what I wrote. Does that make them scum? Is it just because it is D1? Did they misread it and simply make an honest mistake? Is it to poke a response?
I have explained why discussing game mechanics is rather pointless at this point and I have taken a stance against read lists. I have said what I think of reading too much into D1 behavior, but obviously we need to lynch someone today (so we need a candidate from *somewhere*).
Good Friday/Easter. I also did not vote on anyone and it goes without saying that I am town.
I don't get where that whole restricting information thing comes from. That is a wrong generalization, when I have only taken a stance regarding read lists and mechanics discussion (on D1). I have also, I think in every game, said what I think of reading too much into D1 behavior. I think the only time mafia got lynched on D1 was due to a fuck up, which caused a restart of the game.
Last time you were this quiet is when we played Final Fantasy.
You said this before but I pointed to a few examples of me doing my own legwork, one of which was my argument against Flux and how reserved he has been since this game started. Also on Coppa, which only becomes more and more interesting as no one else is really interested in pursuing that one. I would tell you your thought on Trigger is good but you might tell me that I'm using someone else's idea as a way to spark my own (oh wait, that's usually how mafia is played).
True, I did assume as a prod vote and you never once said that to justify it but it's as Sky says here:
You straight said that you pulled if off because Pop posted. Sounds like you were prodding inactivity to me.
weemadarthur
Member
I get the feeling you're hearing a different argument than I made.
I didn't think you wanted to talk about power roles. I thought you wanted to wait through night one and see if they provide information.
So, since we clearly won't agree on the list point, what do you think should be done? Currently I find you to be the scummiest player. Do you have a solid read on an individual?
Flame, yesterday you said I was playing pretty much like normal town me would. Could you please elaborate? I personally disagree with that as I've been quieter than normal and I still haven't voted. Part of this is just general busyness, but it seems odd to me you'd comment on my playing like I was town despite my non presence.
SkyOdin, you've had your vote on Sorian since early and haven't let up. If you were to vote on anyone else right now, who would it be?
SkyOdin, you've had your vote on Sorian since early and haven't let up. If you were to vote on anyone else right now, who would it be?
I just changed my vote to El topo earlier this page, actually. If I had to change it off him.... Mazre or Camjo-Z, I suppose.
He was chosen randomly. I kept the vote on him because it didn't seem like a bad idea to leave a vote on an inactive player. I'm still not sure why it's so strange,but I'll leave it at that.
Hey guys.
I was AFK, same deal as El Topo but for different reasons.
I've been keeping quiet today to just patiently read out what's been going on. I have done day 1 read lists in the past, but they usually are so off the mark that it makes it tough to really rely on them so early in the game. Plus they tend to make it easier for scum to sneak their way early into a false town read. As a result, I won't be compiling one until the next phase.
I get where these sentiments are coming from, and I agree with them to a point, but I do buy into your reasoning for not divulging Mazre. We still have a little bit of time left in the day; there's no need to rush.
Also, I believe Trigger's explanation, it checks out to me.
I was AFK, same deal as El Topo but for different reasons.
I've been keeping quiet today to just patiently read out what's been going on. I have done day 1 read lists in the past, but they usually are so off the mark that it makes it tough to really rely on them so early in the game. Plus they tend to make it easier for scum to sneak their way early into a false town read. As a result, I won't be compiling one until the next phase.
I get where these sentiments are coming from, and I agree with them to a point, but I do buy into your reasoning for not divulging Mazre. We still have a little bit of time left in the day; there's no need to rush.
Also, I believe Trigger's explanation, it checks out to me.
fireblend (0)
sorian 127 (146)
weemadarthur 147 (165)
karkador (0)
flame_ac 128 (439)
camjo-z 356 (511)
weemadarthur (1)
fireblend 139 (303)
camjo-z 511
sorian (0)
skyodin 141 (523)
trigger (0)
sorian 146 (239)
tl21xx (0)
weemadarthur 165 (304)
no lynch (0)
karkador 209 (226)
camjo-z (1)
karu 219
pop-o-matic (0)
trigger 236 (488)
thegoddamn (0)
sorian 239 (310)
mazre (3)
xamtheking 256
fireblend 303 (506)
thegoddamn 390
flame_ac 439
el topo (2)
weemadarthur 304
skyodin 523
coppanuva (1)
sorian 310
fluxwavez (1)
ty4on 499
xamtheking (1)
fireblend
10 votes for majority!
karkador (0)
weemadarthur (1)
camjo-z 511
sorian (0)
trigger (0)
tl21xx (0)
no lynch (0)
camjo-z (1)
karu 219
pop-o-matic (0)
thegoddamn (0)
mazre (3)
xamtheking 256
thegoddamn 390
flame_ac 439
el topo (2)
weemadarthur 304
skyodin 523
coppanuva (1)
sorian 310
fluxwavez (1)
ty4on 499
xamtheking (1)
fireblend
10 votes for majority!
Bolded. I don't have anything to really say you're town other than that I feel you're town. Your lack of voting is the only thing that would give me pause, but I assume and you now say busyness, so that's fine.
Ahh right, overlooked it. Thanks for the insight.
Fair enough. I need to look over the thread closer, but I believe there's a few other players i would like to hear more from before days end as well as provide my take on all our discussions since I haven't really been able to.
I won't continue the list talk since I've made my thoughts clear, but it's not that I hate you or your playstyle, it's just I'm trying to translate what you're saying into things to read into and having a hard time.
I definitely don't take "gut feeling" posts as seriously as I take posts that point to something in particular bothering them and why. It's the why part that's important, and if that's "gut feeling" then they fall in the first category again.
Fair enough. I'm also against mechanics discussion early in the game (although that's more because I dislike baseless theories getting in the way of actual discussion, not because I believe a decent town would be foolish enough to give scum info on actual mechanics when doing so), so I know there's stuff Town wants to avoid discussing, but maybe your phrasing sounded a lot more aggressive than that, and it was the most meaningful thing you'd said, so that's where I got my read from.
I don't mind you not doing a complete reads post, but I do request that you tell us who would be your top town/scum at least before the day is over. If you don't and get NK'd that's one excellent way for scum to deny us of information, by killing an inactive non-contributive player. I know you already said some stuff on Mazre in this post but yeah, don't hand scum an easy kill pls.
That I can do. Be on the lookout.
Xamtheking
Member
Shut up, Cloud.
---
I haven't really come up with anything new, I still find Mazre scummy the same reason I initially found Starsketch to be scummy in PW.
Weemad is starting to pop up on my radar because of her general bouncing all over the place when it come to her posts, maybe a newbie scum? Also stresses scum hunting a lot, and while I like scum hunting, I personally think that's a given thing every townie should do
I'd have to disagree with you and that's why I've been fine with weemad so far. Generally, scum forgets that they have to "scum hunt" and while weemad has pressed at weird times she seems to actually be genuinely scum hunting. It's the same reason that I gave Fireblend a town-ish nod earlier on in the day phase. That being said, this is what I tend to look for when I am trying to find scum, the people who aren't focused on scum hunting. I'm removing my vote from Coppa because, while I still think his attitude is off, he's claiming real life busyness and I'm not chasing that day 1. So I will point to these two posts of mine:
It's pretty much the opposite of what I said about weemad in the first half of this post. Only speaking when spoken too. Staying in the background. Mild pressing here and there to look good but nothing I would feel is genuine. This post worst of all. I've seen this from scum time and time again:
It's a vague promise of more to come later. But nothing ever really comes, it just appeases those watching because if something else interesting happens then you can slip to the background again. Now has he posted since this post? Yes, he's nipping at Mazre's heels incessantly, but I'm still convinced that Mazre is the choice for a lazy policy lynch or a last minute swing to save a claimed PR. The people that want to chase Mazre into the ground are who I am interested in right now, especially if Mazre ends up being town. We'll have to deal with Mazre in a more absolute way eventually but hiding in that easy vote is more worrisome than Mazre's bad play.
VOTE: FluxWaveZ
I haven't voted on Mazre and I do not intend on doing so for this Day phase.
weemadarthur
Member
My eyes are up here xam
So your argument is that I sound like I have a team coaching me?
<_<
You're actually suggesting less scum hunting? What's your alternative plan for winning the game?
Sometimes a vote isn't required. Aside from this post, here is your last 3 from the thread:
You're probing. And the fact that he didn't give a real answer got an "I see" It's very wishy-washy terms where, sure, you can now say you never had any intention of voting for Mazre but I'm sure it's not lost on you that these posts can go either way, you could just as easily say you had been intending to vote for Mazre if the climate moved in that direction. This is defensive play where you have set yourself up in a position where you can't lose unless someone points out what you are doing. This isn't scum hunting, this is positioning.
fengshuifever
Member
Oh god, am I too late?
I would also like to participate and join the Phoenix Wright one if it still exists
I would also like to participate and join the Phoenix Wright one if it still exists
YesNOnoNOYes
Member
you're late for batman, yep
and way late for Phoenix Wright :>
but you can still join Gods
This is a game thread, dedicated entirely to this game. Sadly, sign-ups are done for this game, and the game has already started. If you want to sign up for Mafia games, you should go to [URL="http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?]this thread right here[/URL]. That is the main discussion and sign-up thread for all Season 5 Mafia games. There is another mid-season game that might still have a few slots open for players. You might also be able to get in on the list of alternates in case one of the players in this game has to drop out.