The US New York to be specific, and I know what your argument will be. Don't even waste it with me.
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Polygon: Xbox Scorpio will be a ~6 TFLOP system (v PS4K's 4.14), unveil soon, Fall 17
- Thread starter BUNTING1243
- Start date
The US New York to be specific, and I know what your argument will be. Don't even waste it with me.
BabyFaceKillah
Member
I don't believe this is real
Obscuritas
Member
We won't probably see Neo at E3 and the later release date of Scorpio won't definitely help Microsoft against Sony.
A premium Xbox sku will be released sooner or later, that's for sure.
Very well-said.
Of course, none of us have seen sales numbers for the Win 10 UWP versions of AAA titles like RoTR, Quantum Break, and Gears, but I suspect they are a tiny fraction of the sales numbers of the Xbox One and Steam versions of those titles.
This is mainly a US only thing, though. I'm not sure about all of EU, but cable TV nowadays is sold to you via Phone-, Internet-, Multimedia- companies and they have their own boxes and they're offering complete packages with mobile, phone, inet and TV. This is one of the reasons why XboxOne's usp doesn't work over here. The Xbox + Windows ecosystem won't give us anything we don't already have or we have waited for.
And I don't see MS ever trying to get the FIFA/UEFA/National soccer league broadcasting licences either for example. We're talking several billion $s here.
I yet fail to see the major selling-point of the windows ecosytem. Please explain anyone.
I can watch TV shows, movies on all of my devices already. Same thing with music.
Apps for everyday usage like Nav-systems, little tools, funny gadgets...I have those on my smart-phone. What am I missing? After installing W10 this March and visiting the W10 store out of curiosity, there's nothing that strikes my eye. Even the XboxOne exclusives are rather hidden and all I see is shovelware games plus all the things I already have.
So when do you presume we see the Neo?
GhostTrick
Banned
Obscuritas
Member
Gamescom, (most unlikely) TGS, Paris Games Week. Pick one.
It's basically a premium (and more expensive) PS4, they don't need to advertise it like they would with a new console.
geordiemp
Member
Exactly, MS have a nice strategy for good ol USA and watercoolers.
Nobody else in the rest of the world knows what you are even talking about, and that is MS problem as appealing to USA only will still fail as they wont be able to get a big enough chunk of the market to dominate.
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
They are definitely necessary for Hype though. Look at UC4 and Horizon. You need IP that pushes your system and offers something different.
How is this a problem, you invest where you see return. This is business, How much did they sink last gen trying to get japanese gamers, but they didn't budge. No one cared about the xbox. You grow your brand slowly, spread your resources to thin and you will pay the price. I've worked with ceo's in different industries, you guys are asking for things to be done that don't make sense.
Obscuritas
Member
From now on they'll try to use their IPs to make the W10 store more appealing. "System" would just be a volatile concept.
Here is something else I don't get, I thought everyone hated the xbox because you know media and tv are all they are about. Why is not having these features such an issue. I loved the xbox because it brought everything together from the beginning.
If my playstation doesn't have a title that I'm interested in release it goes unused for months. This is an issue for me. As someone in finance, not using an item for a few months straight is a big issue for me. My money is being wasted if can't get use out of my device.
If I'm MS, I focus on those countries that show promise. I don't sink my money into countries that don't. This isn't a rant about how they should ignore the rest of the world, this more about appealing to certain markets and taking majority control, then expanding.
When you tie resources up in investments that don't produce nothing good comes of it. I've seen it to many times.
Wow, need to catch up on the last few pages, but...
Holy shit at that bandwidth. Then yes, eSRAM through the hypervisor is definitely feasible.
As far as the TFLOP number is concerned, aren't Polaris 10 and 11 technically two different chips? Higher TFLOP numbers generally indicate a larger die size and higher complexity, hence higher cost.
I will concede that if they aren't integrating eSRAM that the production costs will be much lower -- that is, if HBM2 costs fall dramatically by next year.
Holy shit at that bandwidth. Then yes, eSRAM through the hypervisor is definitely feasible.
As far as the TFLOP number is concerned, aren't Polaris 10 and 11 technically two different chips? Higher TFLOP numbers generally indicate a larger die size and higher complexity, hence higher cost.
I will concede that if they aren't integrating eSRAM that the production costs will be much lower -- that is, if HBM2 costs fall dramatically by next year.
jimbobsmells
Member
Iwannaseethereceipts.gif
They said they would unite the stores and I "assume" clean it up at the same time. The point is that they push for things that sony or nintendo don't. I agree it's limited but unfortunately this is the business side of things. Do you think they don't want their device to have all similar features available everywhere? These things take time to build, MS is an american company. There's different rules in each country of what you can and can't do. However if the system is not selling well, why invest more and more. Best thing to do is take your money hold out build something like a premium device start fresh clean and everything united. Just tossing money around to win over a few people and is not a smart way to run a business. Spending millions and millions so that what another 20 or 30k people buy your device. Sorry I would never make that bet, I'd prefer a new vision and unification.
Apple built they're brand little by little, it wasn't done overnight.
sorry can't reveal myself any further. Already have weird people asking me for money and following me on twitch. Should have done things anonymously but that was my mistake. People are well aware that money doesn't mean anything to me. Don't want to speak on this matter anymore.
It's not worth making a console that only sells decently in a handful of markets.
44 Compute Units at 1GHz
2816 Stream processors
5.6 TFlops
16 ACE
176 TMU
64 ROP
8GB GDDR5X at 900MHz
288GB/s
Add in the flops from Zen cores and you're pretty close to the high end of the internal target of 6TFlop. If it's just 4x Durango, then they can clock the GPU at 900MHz.
2816 Stream processors
5.6 TFlops
16 ACE
176 TMU
64 ROP
8GB GDDR5X at 900MHz
288GB/s
Add in the flops from Zen cores and you're pretty close to the high end of the internal target of 6TFlop. If it's just 4x Durango, then they can clock the GPU at 900MHz.
longdi
Banned
Do you guys see MS marketing Scorpio as an Xbox 1+ or Xbox 2?
If it is coming in late 2017, i feel MS will just fuck it and sell it as Xbox 2 with not only a 6Tflops GPU but a fully upgraded CPU/RAM.
Xbox 1 is just not selling well enough, and even in my usually stingy country, MS is offering 18% cash back for new Xbox 1 purchase.
Scorpio will playback all Xbox 1 games, but it will also have exclusives games targeted for its specs.
It will be interesting if we can get wind of whether Neo is a reaction to Scorpio or the other way round. I feel the reactant will do less well than the leader.
If it is coming in late 2017, i feel MS will just fuck it and sell it as Xbox 2 with not only a 6Tflops GPU but a fully upgraded CPU/RAM.
Xbox 1 is just not selling well enough, and even in my usually stingy country, MS is offering 18% cash back for new Xbox 1 purchase.
Scorpio will playback all Xbox 1 games, but it will also have exclusives games targeted for its specs.
It will be interesting if we can get wind of whether Neo is a reaction to Scorpio or the other way round. I feel the reactant will do less well than the leader.
Batman?
Mass Effect
Member
Now imagine what the Wii U's sales would be without any of those exclusives.
If anything, Nintendo's franchises are what's keeping them in the hardware game (at least when it comes to their consoles).
I doubt we'll see the PS4K at E3. Announcing it there would tank sales for months until it releases.
Of course I could be wrong.
geordiemp
Member
Do people really hate Xbox ?
360 was doing well - I had 2 360's - it did great party features, good controller and it played 3rd party games very well for a console (better than Ps3 for sure). It was a leading product when it came out. Could not give a damn about the apps, Sky app was OK but it was a GAMES CONSOLE first and foremost,a nd was top notch for its year of release.
Then came Xb1, Ghosts ran at 720p (My god), and the marketing was about USA TV and watercoolers (whatever they are) and complete shit. Sony made a games console, fast installs, quick access, sensible choice of hardware. yeah it was a bit weak imo, but compared to Xb1.... Ps4 was a beast and Sony got it.
People dont hate MS imo, the console was just a shit idea for a gaming console with execs lost up their own ....I feel sorry for Spencer trying to right the ship.
They just lost there way with Kinect, voice apps and TV apps. I think Sony benefited by listening and spreading themselves around the world.
Nintendo are too Japan Centric and MS too USA centric, they get poor market vision based on their immediate surroundings..
Lets hope the console devs listen again...If you read GAF, its clear that many posters would like their current games with a 1080p60 option. That means concentrating on CPU and bandwidth more than just making a bigger GPU - you cant put 12 inch tyres on a Porsche....
You can make a profit though. Sustainable profits mean more than anything in the business world.
OK, so why do you think they are trying to unite the windows and xbox store? The point is get people into the ecosystem and stop wasting tons of money making consoles that may or may not see a return. That's the point. To the average person that says an xbox doesn't appeal to me and then turn around and say I'll just buy their titles on the window store since their releasing there anyway. That's what they want, they in affect want out of the race to see who sells more consoles. They don't care about that they care you getting onto their platform.
BeforeU
Oft hope is born when all is forlorn.
Pretty much what I think too
The system would literally have no games (haha); I deifnitely understand your point though, and agree.
_______________________
I'm feeling the same. I think Xbox models will just be identified/known by the year they release.
lol, not even close
kingwingin
Member
If scorpio is a new gen i hope they allow us to preload launch games on our xbox one and just plug in the external when we all get home with the system
Ur Xbox one will be able to play those games still.
It's not a new gen though. So this question is DoA.
dragonelite
Member
I think after next year we can stop thinking about console generations.
...Scatter...
Banned
So you think people are going to rush out and build gaming PCs to play Madden, FIFA, and COD?
I don't see ESVI until 2018-2019 at the earliest honestly.
wapplew
Member
They just don't rush out and buy Scorpio.
...Scatter...
Banned
Those are the best selling titles. It's like every generation. First early adopters and enthusiasts buy up the volume for the first 3-4 months. Then gen pop stars to get word of mouth and commercials do their thing. If the press is good and the word of mouth is good then you start pulling more and more in. Will your console resonate with pop culture? Athletes. Celebrities. Conan O'Brien. Twitch. YouTube. Will the kids be talking about it at recess? That's how you sell. First thing first though. YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR CORE GAMER. Build a beast and support it well.
BeforeU
Oft hope is born when all is forlorn.
Wrong, thats the exact audience who will go out and buy the console
Night Angel
Member
Not if the investment could be better spent elsewhere. Most businesses think in terms of NPV and ROI, and they're always ranking investments against others to determine the best area to spend.
While they may scrape together a profit on the XBox brand in a handful of markets, I'd imagine that path won't compete with other opportunities MS has in the long run.
Fox Mulder
Member
I can't wait, will buy day one.
I just prefer the Xbox more and want to get past the xb1's weaknesses.
I just prefer the Xbox more and want to get past the xb1's weaknesses.
VincentMatts
Member
Yep and i thought this was obvious, especially after the 360. You would think that Microsoft, a software company would know this by now. They did everything wrong this generation from day 1. They made a console for the casuals and promoted it to the hardcore. Then after all that, took a page out of Nintendo's book in terms of power and made something that was guaranteed to fail compared to what Sony did.
At launch youre absolutely right, you need to make something powerful that will for one, have longevity and also you need to sell it to the core, not the casuals. The casuals will jump into wherever everyone is playing eventually. Having the TV stuff wasn't bad, i use it daily but promoting it like they did it was obvious that they were going for the casual audience at launch. Youll never get them on day one so i dunno why they wasted their time on that.
Then to top it all off, they made all the mistakes Sony did last generation and made a console that was more complex to develop for than what its competition did. When Sony (a hardware company) has a console that easier to develop for than Microsoft (a software company), you deserve to lose.
edit: they had an amazing opportunity to gain all these new customers they got from 360 and keep them on this new generation and just grow from there. They blew it hard.
TheLaughingStock
Member
How many Surface 3 tablets were sold/shipped vs RT models?
BeforeU
Oft hope is born when all is forlorn.
lol i dont think they will ever give out numbers but RT took 1 Billion $ write off. So ya it was a bif fail. But Surface Pro 1-2 were successful, no idea what the poster is trying to say
Depends on the purpose of the business is in their minds. Do I think they want to reach more markets, that's obvious. I was just saying that they can focus in certain markets and make sure that they are profitable...especially before trying to move to other markets.
Seems pretty obvious to me. That RT and Surface 2 (not the Surface Pro 1 & 2) failed because they could only access WinRT software, rather than all x86 programs. The Pro 1 and 2 being comparatively successful is kinda the point. The Surface 3 (non-Pro) on the other hand can run all Windows software, and performed far better.
I don't agree with the comparison itself though, as the Windows Store was completely bare of compelling software, which the Xbox console isn't, and so throwing that near-guaranteed revenue (plus XBL subs) away in favor of selling generic hardware, where Valve will eat your lunch, doesn't seem like a very sensible idea. They're not in this to sell PCs.
I think they may need to number it or otherwise name it in a way that clearly differentiates it if they plan on new games still working on the old X1 for a while. That way those games can be labeled as such, and then if eventually games only work on the new system, they can be labeled properly also.
kingwingin
Member
i didnt know they were doing forwards compatabilty, thought it was just backwards. Good to know!
Yeah. It's going to get quite confusing otherwise.
"So which Xbox do you have?"
"Err..."
Numbering seems like the logical thing to do now, but they have wisely avoided that so as to not be seen as "less than the PlayStation number". You can get away with it when the numbers are far different, but PS4 is way too close to 1 or 2 for that. No idea how they'll handle it, to be honest.
Alpha, beta, gamma, delta...?
Xbox One being "beta", obviously...
Half-Life 3, exclusive to Xbox Lambda.