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specialguy
Banned
(11-12-2011, 12:24 AM)

Originally Posted by clutch.as.it.gets.

2GB for the whole system would be a major disapointment after 7 years, assuming 2012 is for real. MS would cheap out. The new box has to have 4GB of RAM, especially with all the multimedia stuff MS will bring to the new Xbox and Windows operating on it as well. I hope the 2 GB are only for the CPU and the GPU gets their own 2gigs of RAM.


The specs pretty much imply there would be separate VRAM. Probably 2GB. The DDR3 would just be system/CPU memory. It's far too slow for graphics anyway.

These specs are total bunk imo mind you, but just addressing it.

The main bunk thing is the AMD dual core GPU. There's zero need for dual core, as the most powerful single core GPU's will be too much (heat/power) to put in a console.
Proelite
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by clutch.as.it.gets.

2GB for the whole system would be a major disapointment after 7 years, assuming 2012 is for real. MS would cheap out. The new box has to have 4GB of RAM, especially with all the multimedia stuff MS will bring to the new Xbox and Windows operating on it as well. I hope the 2 GB are only for the CPU and the GPU gets their own 2gigs of RAM.

That and I don't think latest gpus can even use ddr3 ram.

Dual gpus are such a waste of silicon. Using the same budgets a single gpus solution will spank it.
Last edited by Proelite; 11-12-2011 at 12:28 AM.
infinityBCRT
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:26 AM)

Originally Posted by teh_pwn

No way that's possible. Too much power consumption and cost. The equivalent of that hardware won't be able to go into consoles until 2014-2015. It's basically 4 high end GPUs.

That doesn't mean its not true. Remember that the Xbox 360 Devkits were essentially G5 workstations. Its more of a performance target than a cost target at this point.
Proelite
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:29 AM)
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Originally Posted by infinityBCRT

That doesn't mean its not true. Remember that the Xbox 360 Devkits were essentially G5 workstations. Its more of a performance target than a cost target at this point.

I was actually just trolling nintex. :p
Louis Cyphre
Banned
(11-12-2011, 12:29 AM)
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2012 could be true but would Halo 4 still be coming to the Xbox 360 or the new system?
Hiro_Kunimi_80
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by Louis Cyphre

2012 could be true but would Halo 4 still be coming to the Xbox 360 or the new system?

or.. both ( like.. for example september for X360 an november with a next gen graphics version, fot the new system )
Mato
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:37 AM)
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Why can't they just call it Xbox 3. Watch wrong with simple numbers. Code names are becoming increasingly silly.
infinityBCRT
Member
(11-12-2011, 12:46 AM)

Originally Posted by Mato

Why can't they just call it Xbox 3. Watch wrong with simple numbers. Code names are becoming increasingly silly.

I wonder if they call it Xbox 4. They could spin 360S as being the 3rd one
Stinkles
sober, clothed, willing
(11-12-2011, 01:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by BruiserBear

This is what I've been wondering ever since 343 Studios declined to talk about the engine Halo 4 runs on when asked about it at E3.


Halo 4 will be on Xbox 360 and use a modified core of the Halo engine(s). Not really a singular engine since it goes through fairly radical evolutions all the time.
H_Prestige
Banned
(11-12-2011, 01:35 AM)

Originally Posted by Mato

Why can't they just call it Xbox 3. Watch wrong with simple numbers. Code names are becoming increasingly silly.

Same reason they didn't call the 360 the Xbox 2. They'd be one number behind playstation.
TheOddOne
Member
(11-12-2011, 01:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by OuterWorldVoice

Halo 4 will be on Xbox 360 and use a modified core of the Halo engine(s). Not really a singular engine since it goes through fairly radical evolutions all the time.

Confirmed.

Also it's weird seeing you around these parts :P
Proelite
Member
(11-12-2011, 01:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by OuterWorldVoice

Halo 4 will be on Xbox 360 and use a modified core of the Halo engine(s). Not really a singular engine since it goes through fairly radical evolutions all the time.

Notice how he doesn't say only. ;)
thuway
Member
(11-12-2011, 01:41 AM)
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I hope Sony goes balls out with hardware. I would love to see something with 4 gb of Ram, a Multi-Cell, and the ballziest GPU they can muster up.
CrunchinJelly
formerly cjelly
(11-12-2011, 01:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by OuterWorldVoice

Halo 4 will be on Xbox 360 and use a modified core of the Halo engine(s). Not really a singular engine since it goes through fairly radical evolutions all the time.

Why you gotta be a Debbie downer?
Hiro_Kunimi_80
Member
(11-12-2011, 01:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by Proelite

Notice how he doesn't say only. ;)


Confirmed Xbox 360 games will run on Xbox next with hardware enhancements !

:D
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by Majanew

English (nice translation):



Surprised that it's rumored to have 2GB of DDR3. Figured it'd be more if it's using DDR3. Ah, so the 2GB's of DDR3 are on the CPU and the GPU will have its own?

So according to that Loop and Ten both apply to the console. Considering Live debuted a year after Xbox was released, the idea is plausible. Ten (Xbox3) comes out next year and Loop (XboxTV) comes out a year later.
Massa
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:04 AM)

Originally Posted by OuterWorldVoice

Halo 4 will be on Xbox 360 and use a modified core of the Halo engine(s). Not really a singular engine since it goes through fairly radical evolutions all the time.

Am I reading it wrong or are you saying that Halo 4 will be on a radical evolution of the Xbox 360?!?
duk
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:14 AM)
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Infinity Loop, sounds like a street name of MS HQ?

Next Xbox to be named Xbox Infinity... i like it!

2gb RAM is poopoo, Ram is dirt cheap, needs to be at least 3GB
H_Prestige
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:15 AM)

Originally Posted by duk

Infinity Loop, sounds like a street name of MS HQ?

Next Xbox to be named Xbox Infinity... i like it!

2gb RAM is poopoo, Ram is dirt cheap, needs to be at least 3GB

Sounds like just system RAM, since after the dual GPU part they say RAM is unknown, likely meaning VRAM.
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:18 AM)
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Yeah. I could see 2GB of DDR3 and 1GB of GDDR5.
clashfan
you are not alone
(11-12-2011, 02:22 AM)

Originally Posted by thuway

I hope Sony goes balls out with hardware. I would love to see something with 4 gb of Ram, a Multi-Cell, and the ballziest GPU they can muster up.

What dream world do u live in? Have u seen sony's financial's?
duk
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:23 AM)
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Originally Posted by bgassassin

Yeah. I could see 2GB of DDR3 and 1GB of GDDR5.

Is even DDR3 for main ram even that great? seems slow

edit: but if the gpu rumors are true ala dual core gpu, that's AWESOME and will need its own ram
SimpleDesign
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:23 AM)

Originally Posted by bgassassin

Yeah. I could see 2GB of DDR3 and 1GB of GDDR5.

Even mid-range GPUs will be carrying 2GB of GDDR5 next year. I guess if they're going after the Wii U and not the PS4 it would make sense.
Averon
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:25 AM)

Originally Posted by clashfan

What dream world do u live in? Have u seen sony's financial's?

Didn't stop them with the Vita. However, I doubt Sony will go so balls crazy that they will have another $599 on their hands.
duk
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by SimpleDesign

Even mid-range GPUs will be carrying 2GB of GDDR5 next year. I guess if they're going after the Wii U and not the PS4 it would make sense.

sorry for newbie q, but how much does a mid range gpu cost these days?

id wager at least 200-250? that's prob 75% the cost of the next xbox?
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:28 AM)
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Originally Posted by duk

Is even DDR3 for main ram even that great? seems slow

edit: but if the gpu rumors are true ala dual core gpu, that's AWESOME and will need its own ram

Depends on the interface. If they were to use a quad-channel interface (not to be confused with the misnomer we see for desktop memory), it could easily have more bandwidth than what PS360 have now with their memory.

Originally Posted by SimpleDesign

Even mid-range GPUs will be carrying 2GB of GDDR5 next year. I guess if they're going after the Wii U and not the PS4 it would make sense.

Cost. And with the PS4 possibly right around the corner as well we don't know what they'll be doing either to believe they would blow Xbox3 away.

And devs having access to that much memory in a console would be able to do some seriously awesome things.
McHuj
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:31 AM)
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Hex-a-core and two GPU's? So two 360's duct taped together?

But there's that multi-GPU rumor again. Either someone's trolling based on the previous rumor, or there's some truth to it.

I guess multi-gpu would make sense if they wanted a really powerful GPU but didn't think it was manufacturable at a reasonable cost. SLI/Crossfire could probably be made to work really well in a closed and optimized system like a console.
duk
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:33 AM)
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My bet is that Infinity and PS4 will be around same power again. Key is as always ram, if PS4 comes out later, it may have more.
McHuj
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:35 AM)
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Originally Posted by duk

sorry for newbie q, but how much does a mid range gpu cost these days?

id wager at least 200-250? that's prob 75% the cost of the next xbox?

What do you mean cost? The actual GPU chip? Probably under 50 bucks. When buying a card, you're paying for a lot more than just the GPU, there's the ram, pcb with all the components, cooling system, retail costs (cards aren't subsidized like consoles), etc. All those combined add a lot to the cost of the GPU.
gaming_noob
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:35 AM)
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In terms of games, Microsoft should NOT even try to pursue the Japanese market this time around IMO. It's a lost cause and the money would be better spent funding other games. Japanese games have really regressed this generation and I don't see them improving.
SimpleDesign
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:38 AM)

Originally Posted by bgassassin

Depends on the interface. If they were to use a quad-channel interface (not to be confused with the misnomer we see for desktop memory), it could easily have more bandwidth than what PS360 have now with their memory.



Cost. And with the PS4 possibly right around the corner as well we don't know what they'll be doing either to believe they would blow Xbox3 away.

And devs having access to that much memory in a console would be able to do some seriously awesome things.

That's true, we don't know if either company is willing to sell at a massive loss for the first year or two. 128-bit GDDR5/XDR2 would still be a larger leap in bandwidth than the Xbox to Xbox 360.
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 02:38 AM)
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Originally Posted by McHuj

But there's that multi-GPU rumor again. Either someone's trolling based on the previous rumor, or there's some truth to it.

I considered both of those as well. So I'm going to humor it till something proves it false.

Originally Posted by SimpleDesign

That's true, we don't know if either company is willing to sell at a massive loss for the first year or two. 128-bit GDDR5/XDR2 would still be a larger leap in bandwidth than the Xbox to Xbox 360.

Could be 192 or 256 for all we know.
H_Prestige
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:39 AM)

Originally Posted by gaming_noob

In terms of games, Microsoft should NOT even try to pursue the Japanese market this time around IMO. It's a lost cause and the money would be better spent funding other games. Japanese games have really regressed this generation and I don't see them improving.

They shouldn't even release the new system there. Waste of resources. Try to strengthen Europe instead, since Sony still dominates them there.
duk
Banned
(11-12-2011, 02:44 AM)
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agree - release in japan only if it makes sense

need japanese devs not the consumers
AlStrong
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:08 AM)
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Originally Posted by bgassassin

Depends on the interface. If they were to use a quad-channel interface (not to be confused with the misnomer we see for desktop memory), it could easily have more bandwidth than what PS360 have now with their memory.

Each "channel" on PC CPUs has been defined as being 64-bit I/O to RAM. Quad-channel i.e. combined 256-bit I/O would be pretty expensive, requiring the chip to be a certain size to accommodate the I/O. N-channel -> Nx64-bit I/O on the CPU die, requires minimum N DIMMs.

Not sure what you mean by misnomer.
Last edited by AlStrong; 11-12-2011 at 03:13 AM.
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:13 AM)
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Originally Posted by AlStrong

Each "channel" on PC CPUs is 64-bit wide. 256-bit would be pretty expensive. Not sure what you mean by misnomer.

Didn't we have part of this discussion before. :P

As for the misnomer, I'm talking about how they call a four-stick ram kit quad channel.

EDIT: I beat your edit, but to respond I know there would be an added cost. I was just giving a reason why DDR3 could be used and not be as much of a bottleneck.
Marco1
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:28 PM)

Originally Posted by Louis Cyphre

2012 could be true but would Halo 4 still be coming to the Xbox 360 or the new system?

What better way to show what the new hardware can do?
Imagine the before and after promos running side by side?
The nextbox version running at higher res, framerate, greater draw distance, better textures etc.
Vormund
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by H_Prestige

They shouldn't even release the new system there. Waste of resources. Try to strengthen Europe instead, since Sony still dominates them there.

They just need to make it region free (which benefits everyone) and ship a few over. Easy.

I still think they need some official presence there, even a small amount, rather than abandoning Japan outright.
snoopeasystreet
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:56 PM)
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What are the chances that Japanese gamers become more interested in western games? I think that's the only chance Microsoft have in the east.
Raide
Member
(11-12-2011, 03:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by snoopeasystreet

What are the chances that Japanese gamers become more interested in western games? I think that's the only chance Microsoft have in the east.

MS need to lock down a Monster Hunter game, mainline FF game, a mainline DQ, to be even looked at in Japan.
Manp
(11-12-2011, 04:02 PM)
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after two generations with unified memory (which provided advantages in pretty much every multiplatform game) sounds kind of strange they're going to drop it.

:)
alphaNoid
Banned
(11-12-2011, 04:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by thuway

I hope Sony goes balls out with hardware. I would love to see something with 4 gb of Ram, a Multi-Cell, and the ballziest GPU they can muster up.

that didn't work out too well for them this gen and as a company they aren't so hot right now. expect moderate hardware at best. if you expect more you will be let down.
infinityBCRT
Member
(11-12-2011, 04:14 PM)

Originally Posted by clutch.as.it.gets.

2GB for the whole system would be a major disapointment after 7 years, assuming 2012 is for real. MS would cheap out. The new box has to have 4GB of RAM, especially with all the multimedia stuff MS will bring to the new Xbox and Windows operating on it as well. I hope the 2 GB are only for the CPU and the GPU gets their own 2gigs of RAM.

Remember that for Devkits MS has a history of taking off the shelf parts. You can't get more than 2gb vram right now on off the shelf parts.
royalan
Lotus Member
(11-12-2011, 04:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by Raide

MS need to lock down a Monster Hunter game, mainline FF game, a mainline DQ, to be even looked at in Japan.

And that still wouldn't be enough.

I agree with shipping a few over to have a presense, and then focusing most of their resources on regions they actually have a shot in hell in.
infinityBCRT
Member
(11-12-2011, 04:51 PM)

Originally Posted by royalan

And that still wouldn't be enough.

I agree with shipping a few over to have a presense, and then focusing most of their resources on regions they actually have a shot in hell in.

You know what though? MS was actually making a good run at some point with all of the JRPG's that they had. I think if they have that type of stuff at launch and have the system at a reasonable price they have a bigger shot at making inroads. They still won't be #1 but instead of selling like 1.5 million consoles in a generation they could sell 4 or 5 million.
H_Prestige
Banned
(11-12-2011, 04:55 PM)

Originally Posted by infinityBCRT

You know what though? MS was actually making a good run at some point with all of the JRPG's that they had. I think if they have that type of stuff at launch and have the system at a reasonable price they have a bigger shot at making inroads. They still won't be #1 but instead of selling like 1.5 million consoles in a generation they could sell 4 or 5 million.

But why spend all that money just to get a few extra million sales.
thuway
Member
(11-12-2011, 05:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by alphaNoid

that didn't work out too well for them this gen and as a company they aren't so hot right now. expect moderate hardware at best. if you expect more you will be let down.

Wrong. What made the PS3 so expensive was the Cell Processor, Bluray, and a whole host of stupid features that could have easily been stripped (SACD Playback?). A PS4, with a 50 dollar a year online, a 399 launch with a 100 dollar loss, can easily recoup the money back in no time.
sooperkool
Member
(11-12-2011, 05:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by duk

Infinity Loop, sounds like a street name of MS HQ?

Next Xbox to be named Xbox Infinity... i like it!

2gb RAM is poopoo, Ram is dirt cheap, needs to be at least 3GB


Apples address is: 1 Infinite Loop Cupertino, Ca
bgassassin
Member
(11-12-2011, 05:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Manp

after two generations with unified memory (which provided advantages in pretty much every multiplatform game) sounds kind of strange they're going to drop it.

:)

To me the split pool would have work if Sony had a larger amount for the GPU or at least an OS that wasn't so bloated that it was eating up available memory. I lean toward the split pool being better as long as there is enough memory for it.

Originally Posted by thuway

Wrong. What made the PS3 so expensive was the Cell Processor, Bluray, and a whole host of stupid features that could have easily been stripped (SACD Playback?). A PS4, with a 50 dollar a year online, a 399 launch with a 100 dollar loss, can easily recoup the money back in no time.

You do know you essentially said the same thing he did right? And what you described doesn't sound like something that could be built for $500.
RyL
Banned
(11-12-2011, 07:33 PM)
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Originally Posted by duk

Infinity Loop, sounds like a street name of MS HQ?

Next Xbox to be named Xbox Infinity... i like it!

2gb RAM is poopoo, Ram is dirt cheap, needs to be at least 3GB

Consoles do NOT use RAM sticks, I hope you know that.

some guys never heard of custom-made products, even if you buy lots and lots of them, it is still very expensive

(remember the microsoft/epic games RAM story before 360 launch, 256MB vs. 512MB ... it just cost them 1 billion... hint: it's not dirt cheap)

also, most people forget that it's just a Codename... you know like Project Natal
Last edited by RyL; 11-12-2011 at 07:46 PM.

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