[Wiz]

I'm standing by my prediction of 349.99 with them taking a loss on the system, and the wii-u tablet not costing them to make as much as people think it will. I'm also calling most if not all the Demos shown at E3 will end up being pre-installed "games". *edit* And yeah, no fucking way the tablet has an OLED screen. Come on people.

I think $299 is pretty reasonable for a price. They'd have to be extremely confident like they were with the 3DS at launch to price it anything higher.

If that's the case, some Ambassador Gamecube games don't sound too bad. :P

[methodman]

And yeah, no fucking way the tablet has an OLED screen. Come on people.

Of course it won't have an Oled, but it will have haptic feedback that only works with your feet. Someone in Nintendo has a foot fetish

[AceBandage]

I believe Lherres comments suggested the devkit had more than 2GB but he didnt go any further than that.

Correct.
Which is why he was putting it at 1GB Min.
I personally believe, and have for ages now, that it'll be 1.5GB.

The real question is if it's 1GB main and 512MB video or a shared pool.

[HylianTom]

I'm standing by my prediction of 349.99 with them taking a loss on the system, and the wii-u tablet not costing them to make as much as people think it will.

$349.99 would be Nintendo telling me, "yeah, it has some power to it, and yeah, we intend on carrying-on the tradition of making profit on hardware."

I'd be surprised and happy about that price point.. but I'd also be a bit nervous about the price making it too high for wide consumer appeal. Especially if (when) Sony & Microsoft have price drops on their systems for the week of launch.

[Fourth Storm]

Correct. Which is why he was putting it at 1GB Min. I personally believe, and have for ages now, that it'll be 1.5GB. The real question is if it's 1GB main and 512MB video or a shared pool.

I have a feeling it's a shared pool. The question I have is if it's GDDR3 or GDDR5. If it's GDDR3, I'm not sure why they wouldn't just go with 2 GB on a 128-bit bus (and lherre never technically discounted this option - we've just learned to temper our expectations here). Of course, there's the issue of price but that type of RAM is really old at this point.

Someone correct me if I'm off here, but 1.5 GB of GDDR3 on a 96-bit bus could possibly end up being slower than 360's memory. Of course, with 3x the L2 cache and 3x the framebuffer, this might not be an issue.

Hey IdeaMan, you said we're talking at least 2x 360, right? Does that include RAM bandwidth?

[AceBandage]

I have a feeling it's a shared pool. The question I have is if it's GDDR3 or GDDR5. If it's GDDR3, I'm not sure why they wouldn't just go with 2 GB on a 128-bit bus (and lherre never technically discounted this option - we've just learned to temper our expectations here). Of course, there's the issue of price but that type of RAM is really old at this point. Someone correct me if I'm off here, but 1.5 GB of GDDR3 on a 96-bit bus would probably end up slower than 360's memory. Of course, with 3x the L2 cache and 3x the framebuffer, this might not be an issue. Hey IdeaMan, you said we're talking at least 2x 360, right? Does that include RAM bandwidth?

He said 2x in visuals on screens.
But that on paper it would be more powerful.

[sfried]

What are the advantages of having a split pool over a shared pool and vise versa?

[AceBandage]

What are the advantages of having a split pool over a shared pool and vise versa?

From what I understand, have a shared pool means you can dedicate more memory to the GPU if needed, but it's slower.
While having dedicated VRAM is faster but a fixed amount.

[IdeaMan]

So, as promised, i'll give you an information concerning the Wii U ram.

This is heavily linked to my initial post

In the specific context where i gathered this information (read the Warning part here), i can say that the retail version of Wii U will absolutely not have less than 1 GB of ram. You can ditch this 760mb of ram rumor and never look back.

The exciting bonus: From what i know, i'm also pretty sure that it will not have just 1 GB.

This is reported in a Rev4 dev kit frame, so maybe the later versions will change even more the ram situation. But whatever the amount of memory current dev kits have, i'm talking of the retail version*

*Yes, dev kits often have a different amount of ram for debugging and other things, but even if it may be the case for Wii U, my sources are able to know how much ram the real Wii U is expected to have, for the moment ! You can guess how.

Edit: more hints a few posts below :p

More to come about the padlet, before the end of the week :)

[Azure J]

The system obviously has plenty of main RAM, although to run two GameCube/Wii games simultaneously the system would need at least 48 MB of eDRAM. I think it was mentioned more recently that the eDRAM might actually be higher than the rumored 32 MB, so that aspect isn't necessarily an issue either.

Wait, seriously? :D

That's exceptionally good news imo. The closer we get to good free MSAA @ 1080p, the better. Of course, that's if this is all true.

Edit: Greater than 1GB. Thank you based IdeaMan. :lol

[AceBandage]

So, as promised, i'll give you an information concerning the Wii U ram. This is heavily linked to my initial post In the specific context where i gathered this information (read the Warning part here), i can say that the retail version of Wii U will absolutely not have less than 1 GB of ram. You can ditch this 760mb of ram rumor and never look back. The exciting bonus: From what i know, i'm also pretty sure that it will not have just 1 GB. This is reported in a Rev4 dev kit frame, so maybe the later versions will change even more the ram situation. But whatever the amount of memory current dev kits have, i'm talking of the retail version* *Yes, dev kits often have a different amount of ram for debugging and other things, but even if it may be the case for Wii U, my sources are able to know how much ram the real Wii U is expected to have, for the moment ! You can guess how. More to come about the padlet, before the end of the week :)

Yeah, nothing ground breaking.
1.5GB is what I've been expecting and that is definitely good news.

[-Pyromaniac-]

So, as promised, i'll give you an information concerning the Wii U ram. This is heavily linked to my initial post In the specific context where i gathered this information (read the Warning part here), i can say that the retail version of Wii U will absolutely not have less than 1 GB of ram. You can ditch this 760mb of ram rumor and never look back. The exciting bonus: From what i know, i'm also pretty sure that it will not have just 1 GB. This is reported in a Rev4 dev kit frame, so maybe the later versions will change even more the ram situation. But whatever the amount of memory current dev kits have, i'm talking of the retail version* *Yes, dev kits often have a different amount of ram for debugging and other things, but even if it may be the case for Wii U, my sources are able to know how much ram the real Wii U is expected to have, for the moment ! You can guess how. More to come about the padlet, before the end of the week :)

pretty much what we've been thinking all along, but confirmation doesn't hurt. Keep on digging sir!

[IdeaMan]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version.

I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

[Fourth Storm]

From what I understand, have a shared pool means you can dedicate more memory to the GPU if needed, but it's slower. While having dedicated VRAM is faster but a fixed amount.

I've read Skyrim's "performance issues" on PS3 are a result of the split pool, so I doubt Nintendo would go this route. It's also possible that Nintendo go w/ different bus widths from RAM to CPU and RAM to GPU. That second patent bg posted seems to indicate that the original plan for GCN was to have a 128-bit bus to the GPU and a 64-bit bus to the CPU. AFAIK, the end configuration ended up being 64-bit buses for all, but they may have revisited the original plan in designing Wii U.

[AceBandage]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

So...
8GB confirmed?
Crytek vindicated?!

[Anth0ny]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

[Grampa Simpson]

So... 8GB confirmed? Crytek vindicated?!

[IdeaMan]

So... 8GB confirmed? Crytek vindicated?!

lol, no, not THAT surprised :D

My guesstimates were in the 1GB, maybe a bit more, range. And it's more than that, for the moment.

[-Pyromaniac-]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

I think 2gb would be QUITE surprising....so I'll assume that's what you mean, and if so that would be amazing.

[AceBandage]

lol, no, not THAT surprised :D My guesstimates were in the 1GB, maybe a bit more, range. And it's more than that, for the moment.

Right, gotcha...
7.5

[Mr Swine]

Wait, why do dev kits have around 2x the amount of ram that the consoles have? N ever understood that

[ozfunghi]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

Look man, i know where you live (France)! It's only a 2 hour drive away from where i live! I suggest you spill the beans!

*shakes fist in the direction of France*

[TheExplodingHead]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

Glad to hear this, been wanting to know a bit more about the memory myself.

[tkscz]

Wait, why do dev kits have around 2x the amount of ram that the consoles have? N ever understood that

Mainly for debugging and running other things that are dev kits only.

[EloquentM]

2 gigs. It seems that maybe Nintendo isn't exactly half-stepping the console like originally thought. Little by little everything seems to be leaning farther and farther away from current gen.

[Fourth Storm]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

lol, no, not THAT surprised :D My guesstimates were in the 1GB, maybe a bit more, range. And it's more than that, for the moment.

So 2GB confirmed? :P

This is the Nintendo that slapped an even 128MB in 3DS when everyone on these boards was saying there was no chance. Part of me says they'd go w/ an even 2GB on a 128-bit bus over 1.5 GB on a 96-bit bus - especially if they're sticking w/ the GDDR3 (which has a lower latency than GDDR5, something Nintendo has been fanatical about in their hardware design, especially now with having to stream to the pad).

[StreetsAhead]

So 2GB confirmed? :P This is the Nintendo that slapped an even 128MB in 3DS when everyone on these boards was saying there was no chance. Part of me says they'd go w/ an even 2GB on a 128-bit bus over 1.5 GB on a 96-bit bus - especially if they're sticking w/ the GDDR3 (which has a lower latency than GDDR5, something Nintendo has been fanatical about in their hardware design, especially now with having to stream to the pad).

Wait, the 3DS has more RAM than the Wii?

Oh my jesus.

[bgassassin]

So 2GB confirmed? :P This is the Nintendo that slapped an even 128MB in 3DS when everyone on these boards was saying there was no chance. Part of me says they'd go w/ an even 2GB on a 128-bit bus over 1.5 GB on a 96-bit bus - especially if they're sticking w/ the GDDR3 (which has a lower latency than GDDR5, something Nintendo has been fanatical about in their hardware design, especially now with having to stream to the pad).

I agree except that the latency is only an issue when GDDR5 is clocked the around the same as GDDR3. So the choice would depend on the clock speed Nintendo is going for.

[Mr Swine]

Mainly for debugging and running other things that are dev kits only.

Ok, that makes sense

[AceBandage]

Wait, the 3DS has more RAM than the Wii? Oh my jesus.

And more VRAM, I believe.

[GDGF]

Three GB?

That would be surprising.

[Fourth Storm]

I agree except that the latency is only an issue when GDDR5 is clocked the around the same as GDDR3. So the choice would depend on the clock speed Nintendo is going for.

Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification. It's hard to find info on latency online...although IBM's eDRAM does seem to have the 1t-SRAM used in GCN/Wii handily beat, which is exciting.

[StreetsAhead]

Wait, if it's 2GB of total RAM then it's ~22X the amount in the Wii, right?

Take that, 10X jump-wanters. :P

[InsaneZero]

IdeaMan, you're just too good for this thread.

2GB of RAM should be about right.

[Mr Swine]

Three GB? That would be surprising.

You would need a bigger bus to use 3GB, would make the Wii U much more expensive. So no, either a 96 bit bus or ra 128 bit bus

[Azure J]

To be more precise, i was quite surprised by the amount of ram expected in the retail version. I think this message is a bigger hint that the previous one :p

Oh wow, it's even better than expected. 2GB optimistic goal seems that much closer now.

@ StreetsAhead: Yup, it has 40MB up on it. I'm wondering if in theory it's possible to put out some awesome GCN+ stuff on it with consideration of its dual core CPU nearing 300MHz and that amount of RAM.

[EloquentM]

Arkam, come back please. Shoot down our dreams, kill our optimism.

[bgassassin]

Gotcha. Thanks for the clarification. It's hard to find info on latency online...although IBM's eDRAM does seem to have the 1t-SRAM used in GCN/Wii handily beat, which is exciting.

Yeah. I saw your post about that and forgot to respond. Also here is the comparison talking about the latency.

http://www.madshrimps.be/vbulletin/f...s-gddr3-45988/

[Luigiv]

Correct. Which is why he was putting it at 1GB Min. I personally believe, and have for ages now, that it'll be 1.5GB. The real question is if it's 1GB main and 512MB video or a shared pool.

It'll be a shared pool with pool with eDRAM dedicated to the GPU. That's how Nintendo's always rolled. I don't see them changing course now.

[IdeaMan]

I must sleep now, have fun fellow gafers :)

Hint-Fatality: the amount of ram that i've heard has been guessed :p

[Fourth Storm]

Oh wow, it's even better than expected. 2GB optimistic goal seems that much closer now. @ StreetsAhead: Yup, it has 40MB up on it. I'm wondering if in theory it's possible to put out some awesome GCN+ stuff on it with consideration of its dual core CPU nearing 300MHz and that amount of RAM.

Where are you getting that 40MB number from? I've never heard it, which is surprising considering how much time I spend reading this thread. haha

[Jocchan]

People, don't jump to conclusions with the 2 GB.

[bgassassin]

People, don't jump to conclusions with the 2 GB.

I agree. I'm sticking with 1.5GB till the final shows otherwise.

[StreetsAhead]

Where are you getting that 40MB number from? I've never heard it, which is surprising considering how much time I spend reading this thread. haha

If it's 128MB vs 91MB then it's technically 37MB the 3DS has over the Wii.

And curse you IdeaMan! (But seriously, most of the tech stuff, while interesting, means nothing to me).

[-Pyromaniac-]

Keep in mind ideaman was implying that it COULD ship with 2gb, which makes 1.5 seem like a definite, at the least. Which is still amazing compared to this gen.

[AceBandage]

I must sleep now, have fun fellow gafers :) Hint-Fatality: the amount of ram that i've heard has been guessed :p

8GB confirmed!

[EloquentM]

I agree. I'm sticking with 1.5GB till the final shows otherwise.

How will we even know? Nintendo doesn't usually release their specs, right?

[Azure J]

Where are you getting that 40MB number from? I've never heard it, which is surprising considering how much time I spend reading this thread. haha

Oh I'm talking about 3DS RAM vs. Wii RAM. Wii has something like 88MB total, right? (64GDDR3, 24MB 1T-SRAM) I just did 128MB-88MB. :P

Edit: You guys are playing so cautiously with the 1.5GB and not getting jumpy for the possibility of 2GB. That said, I'm with you guys. XD

[Jocchan]

I agree. I'm sticking with 1.5GB till the final shows otherwise.

I mean, it's not impossible but it's not certain either. 1.5 GB for the retail unit is far more reasonable from what has been suggested (of course, a late bump is still possible but shouldn't be expected).

[AceBandage]

How will we even know? Nintendo doesn't usually release their specs, right?

Once the unit is released, we'll be able to find out.