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RELAYER
Member
(04-09-2012, 04:46 PM)

Originally Posted by Cheebo

This is the dumbest thing I ever heard. At the time the Democrats were the Southern dominated extremely pro-states rights extremely religious party while the Republicans were the party dominated by the North, and strong backers of big government and federal government authority.

The Republican Party of the Civil War was the politically liberal party and Democrats were politically conservative. You can't use that label. I mean Teddy Roosevelt is one of the most liberal Presidents in American history yet he was a Republican.

Fox News has a CONSERVATIVE bias.

Seceding and starting your own country doesn't strike me as a politically conservative act.
DY_nasty
#notmine
(04-09-2012, 04:48 PM)
DY_nasty's Avatar
Being a republican in this generation is just... its a never ending headache.
LosDaddie
keeping Americuh safe
(04-09-2012, 04:52 PM)
LosDaddie's Avatar
eh, who cares. Conservatives flocked to the Repub party because they were against the Civil Rights ACt. That's why minorities greatly favor the Dem party.
hokahey
Member
(04-09-2012, 05:09 PM)
hokahey's Avatar

Originally Posted by Kusagari

Hey the Paulites are here.

Hey look no one can provide an actual rebuttal so they *insert snide comment here_____*

It's funny when liberals decry our loss of freedoms and then demand a bigger overreaching goverment.

I ultimately relate more to liberals than neocons but both are inconsistent and dangerous.
Enron
King of Twin-Tails
(04-09-2012, 05:11 PM)
Enron's Avatar
Maybe the OP can just call everyone racist and then call it a day. Since that's what this thread was created to say in the first place.
Sho_Nuff82
(04-09-2012, 05:18 PM)
Sho_Nuff82's Avatar
Oh, people are conflating Republican/Democrat with conservative/liberal while ignoring historical context? Fuck it, I'm out.
theignoramus
Junior Member
(04-09-2012, 05:26 PM)
theignoramus's Avatar

Originally Posted by Jason's Ultimatum

When you look at the dichotomy between MSNBC and Fox News on the handling of the Trayvon Martin case in Florida, it isn't hard to see past Fox New's thinly veiled mask on how they're reporting the news. Even in general, the blatant racism and fearmongering from the hosts on the network can make you sick.

It got me thinking that if Fox News were around during the Civil Rights movement and the push for passing the Civil Rights Act, would the network have been against the movement? Would they have called it "radicalized", and "dangerous" to the country? My answer is yes.

What say you?

The way they treat Barak Obama now would be saintly compared to the way they would treat MLK, who was not only an anti-racist, but against the Vietnam War. They would have attacked him on both fronts, questioned his patriotism and accused him of being pro-Communist and pro Soviet.
ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(04-09-2012, 05:33 PM)
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They'd frame it in the same way that Ron Paul supporters do. It's an attack on freedom and business.
theignoramus
Junior Member
(04-09-2012, 05:34 PM)
theignoramus's Avatar

Originally Posted by Dash27

Following this logic though Fox News would have been pro freeing the slaves to support Lincoln and later on pro desegregation and pro Eisenhower's civil rights legislation that Democrats largely opposed.

No. FoxNews and Roger Aisles just dont like black America. That trumps their support of the Republican party, it's a deep seeded contempt that goes deeper than political affiliation.
CHEEZMO™
Obsidian fan
(04-09-2012, 05:38 PM)
CHEEZMO™'s Avatar
This may be shocking to some people, and in fact I know it will be shocking to some people, but Martin Luther King Jr. was evil, and that is not hyperbole.

Just to get this out of the way, his fight against government segregation was a totally legitimate and morally praiseworthy fight. However, almost everything else he stood for, both concretely and philosophically, was totally corrupt.

First of all, let us be clear on what kind of “morality” MLK is talking about here. Do not delude yourself into making him a blank page on which to draw your own personal values. King was a socialist, avowedly, and certainly an anti-capitalist. He was pro-slavery at the most basic level, as evidenced by his attacking property rights as immoral.

“We must rapidly begin the shift from a “thing-oriented” society to a “person-oriented” society. When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered.”

That quote is disgusting, but consider what he is actually saying, and what he actually marched for. King is not simply proselytizing leftist and religious anti-capitalist falderal in an attempt to convert you; he wants the government to threaten you with a gun and throw you in jail, something he endured, if you do not agree with him. If you are morally repugnant enough to want to discriminate based on race, King does not just want to change your mind; he wants to steal your property and dictate how you use it. He places needs above rights, which is the primary moral principle underlying Christianity, Socialism, and Communism. What exactly does he mean when he says “people” should take priority over “property rights”? He means slavery. He means that if some people are unhappy, your right to your property must go; you must toil while others reap the benefit of your work, the very definition of slavery.

After all, consider that the event in which King delivered the famous “I Have a Dream” speech was the also-famous “March on Washington for Freedom.” Oh, wait a minute, no it was not. It was actually called the “March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom.”

Notice the corruption of the word freedom. Freedom means you have individual rights, which consist of freedom from force. What King wanted was self-contradictory. He wanted the government to force the provision of jobs through either outright threats or the expropriation of wealth, and “freedom.” Of course, what King really wanted was Orwellian freedom. Freedom is Slavery in the most literal sense for King. You are not free unless you have enslaved another man to provide your needs.

There is of course far more to his horrid beliefs, such as his sickening view of the Vietnam War and his absurd conviction and out-of-context negative appraisal of the idea that the U.S. was the “greatest purveyor of violence in the world” in 1967.

School children have been inculcated for generations with the Trojan Horse idea that he was a great man, and so when they get older they must concede a little bit more and a little bit more to the left and the nihilist egalitarians whenever they bring up MLK. Martin Luther King Jr. was revoltingly anti-American, and it is shameful that a federal holiday was made of him, and even more shameful that he is used, as is Mahatma Gandhi, as a tool by which people get the government to force universal adoration of a freedom-hating icon in order to weaken the position of the freedom-defenders and make them break down in contradiction when they find themselves caught between what they implicitly recognize as the truth and the positive psychological associations for a monster forced on them from childhood.

The only “gap” between our technological progress and morality is the one he served in large part to widen, though, to be fair, he also shortened that gap by legitimizing socialist policies and thereby greatly slowing the technological growth of the United States and the world. Congratulations Dr. King, in the race to catch up to technology, your morality is running the course backwards, but at least it can never get too far behind, because it is dragging the goal post right along with it.

lol
ChiTownBuffalo
Either I made up lies about the Boston Bomber or I fell for someone else's crap. Either way, I have absolutely no credibility and you should never pay any attention to anything I say, no matter what the context. Perm me if I claim to be an insider
(04-09-2012, 05:39 PM)
ChiTownBuffalo's Avatar

Originally Posted by hokahey

Hey look no one can provide an actual rebuttal so they *insert snide comment here_____*

It's funny when liberals decry our loss of freedoms and then demand a bigger overreaching goverment.

I ultimately relate more to liberals than neocons but both are inconsistent and dangerous.

The Paulite concept of private property and the Civil Rights is ridiculous, that's why it goes straight to snide commentary.

Private residence is inherently difference than a business that serves the general public. The 4th Amendment provides you that privacy in your home to be as racist or non-racist as you want to be. A business that serves the general public is a different matter all together.

You cannot exclude a service to people based on intrinsic biology.

And I know Paulites will come with the free market argument that the market will eliminate businesses that discriminate. Uh...no. It won't. Jim Crow wasn't just a social system, it was also an economic system where discriminatory business owners colluded.

And I haven't even begun to touch on the Commerce Clause.

There is just some stuff where the government has the intervene. And the 1964 Civil Rights Act is a good example of such. You can't rely ona greater social movement to solve those evils. Look what happened in the south, institutional racism, terrorism, all the reinforce the status quo at the time. That type of Mississippi Burning behavior is what keep the market/local citizenry from being able to exert social pressure on businesses.

This is literally the only issue I have with Ron Paul and his son.
Last edited by ChiTownBuffalo; 04-09-2012 at 05:44 PM.
kame-sennin
Member
(04-09-2012, 05:44 PM)
kame-sennin's Avatar

Originally Posted by Kosmo

I say no, a higher percentage of Republicans were in favor of the Civil Rights act than Democrats:

Originally Posted by Cheebo

This is the dumbest thing I ever heard. At the time the Democrats were the Southern dominated extremely pro-states rights extremely religious party while the Republicans were the party dominated by the North, and strong backers of big government and federal government authority.

The Republican Party of the Civil War was the politically liberal party and Democrats were politically conservative. You can't use that label. I mean Teddy Roosevelt is one of the most liberal Presidents in American history yet he was a Republican.

Fox News has a CONSERVATIVE bias.

The "democrats were against civil rights and the republicans were for it" argument is a pretty cheap trick used by people who think their audience is be too dumb to catch on.
Dreams-Visions
I'm mad as hell but this sandwich is delicious
(04-09-2012, 05:44 PM)
Dreams-Visions's Avatar
^ certain posters specialize in intellectual dishonesty.

Originally Posted by ToxicAdam

Would a conservative news organization give more voice to conservative southern concerns? Yes.

So, now what?

This.
Ghost_Protocol
Member
(04-09-2012, 05:45 PM)
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Considering they rally against civil rights today, why not?
Trent Strong
Banned
(04-09-2012, 05:58 PM)
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You're happy with MSNBCs handling of the case? The guys who altered that 911 call?
empty vessel
Member
(04-09-2012, 06:03 PM)
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The Republican party was taken over by the political faction that most strenuously opposed integration and civil rights: southern conservatives. So, yes, obviously. Some Republicans expressly oppose civil rights for African-Americans still today.
Last edited by empty vessel; 04-09-2012 at 06:28 PM.
kame-sennin
Member
(04-09-2012, 06:05 PM)
kame-sennin's Avatar

Originally Posted by hokahey

Your problem is that you equate someone being against big government as for racism. That's poor logic.

If I am for the first amendment I have to agree that the KKK has a right to espouse their beliefs. Does it then make me racist for being pro constitution?

A privately owned business should not be forced to accept clientelle they dont want. Just like you, in your private residence, should not be forced to allow people in your home that you dont want.

The argument for states rights has often been used in the defense of discriminatory practices, as it is in your post.

Originally Posted by Htown

The Republican party then is different from the Republican party now. Largely because many of the white Southern Democrats moved over to the Republican party after the civil rights movement.

From the link:

Southern Democrats are members of the U.S. Democratic Party who reside in the American South. In the 19th century, they were the definitive pro-slavery wing of the party, opposed to both the anti-slavery Republicans (GOP) and the more liberal Northern Democrats.

Eventually "Redemption" was finalized in the Compromise of 1877 and the Redeemers gained control throughout the South. As the New Deal began to move Democrats as a whole to the left (at least economically), Southern Democrats largely stayed as conservative as they had always been, with some even breaking off to form farther right-wing splinters like the Dixiecrats. After the Civil Rights Movement successfully challenged the Jim Crow laws and other forms of institutionalized racism, and after the Democrats as a whole came to symbolize the mainstream left of the United States, the form, if not the content, of Southern Democratic politics began to change. At that point, most Southern Democrats defected to the Republican Party, and helped accelerate the latter's transformation into a more conservative organization.

ClovingWestbrook
Banned
(04-09-2012, 06:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by CHEEZMO™

This may be shocking to some people, and in fact I know it will be shocking to some people, but Martin Luther King Jr. was evil, and that is not hyperbole.

Just to get this out of the way, his fight against government segregation was a totally legitimate and morally praiseworthy fight. However, almost everything else he stood for, both concretely and philosophically, was totally corrupt.

First of all, let us be clear on what kind of “morality” MLK is talking about here. Do not delude yourself into making him a blank page on which to draw your own personal values. King was a socialist, avowedly, and certainly an anti-capitalist. He was pro-slavery at the most basic level, as evidenced by his attacking property rights as immoral.

“We must rapidly begin the shift from a “thing-oriented” society to a “person-oriented” society. When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered.”

That quote is disgusting, but consider what he is actually saying, and what he actually marched for. King is not simply proselytizing leftist and religious anti-capitalist falderal in an attempt to convert you; he wants the government to threaten you with a gun and throw you in jail, something he endured, if you do not agree with him. If you are morally repugnant enough to want to discriminate based on race, King does not just want to change your mind; he wants to steal your property and dictate how you use it. He places needs above rights, which is the primary moral principle underlying Christianity, Socialism, and Communism. What exactly does he mean when he says “people” should take priority over “property rights”? He means slavery. He means that if some people are unhappy, your right to your property must go; you must toil while others reap the benefit of your work, the very definition of slavery.

After all, consider that the event in which King delivered the famous “I Have a Dream” speech was the also-famous “March on Washington for Freedom.” Oh, wait a minute, no it was not. It was actually called the “March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom.”

Notice the corruption of the word freedom. Freedom means you have individual rights, which consist of freedom from force. What King wanted was self-contradictory. He wanted the government to force the provision of jobs through either outright threats or the expropriation of wealth, and “freedom.” Of course, what King really wanted was Orwellian freedom. Freedom is Slavery in the most literal sense for King. You are not free unless you have enslaved another man to provide your needs.

There is of course far more to his horrid beliefs, such as his sickening view of the Vietnam War and his absurd conviction and out-of-context negative appraisal of the idea that the U.S. was the “greatest purveyor of violence in the world” in 1967.

School children have been inculcated for generations with the Trojan Horse idea that he was a great man, and so when they get older they must concede a little bit more and a little bit more to the left and the nihilist egalitarians whenever they bring up MLK. Martin Luther King Jr. was revoltingly anti-American, and it is shameful that a federal holiday was made of him, and even more shameful that he is used, as is Mahatma Gandhi, as a tool by which people get the government to force universal adoration of a freedom-hating icon in order to weaken the position of the freedom-defenders and make them break down in contradiction when they find themselves caught between what they implicitly recognize as the truth and the positive psychological associations for a monster forced on them from childhood.

The only “gap” between our technological progress and morality is the one he served in large part to widen, though, to be fair, he also shortened that gap by legitimizing socialist policies and thereby greatly slowing the technological growth of the United States and the world. Congratulations Dr. King, in the race to catch up to technology, your morality is running the course backwards, but at least it can never get too far behind, because it is dragging the goal post right along with it.

lol

*Applause*
Clevinger
Member
(04-09-2012, 06:22 PM)
Clevinger's Avatar

Originally Posted by Kosmo

I say no, a higher percentage of Republicans were in favor of the Civil Rights act than Democrats:

Fun fact: A vast majority of the racist (and conservative) Democrats who hated the CRA jumped ship to the Republican Party after it was passed, resulting in the sane and tolerant GOP we all know and love today.
Last edited by Clevinger; 04-09-2012 at 06:29 PM.
Dude Abides
Member
(04-09-2012, 06:26 PM)
Dude Abides's Avatar

Originally Posted by CHEEZMO™

This may be shocking to some people, and in fact I know it will be shocking to some people, but Martin Luther King Jr. was evil, and that is not hyperbole.

Just to get this out of the way, his fight against government segregation was a totally legitimate and morally praiseworthy fight. However, almost everything else he stood for, both concretely and philosophically, was totally corrupt.

First of all, let us be clear on what kind of “morality” MLK is talking about here. Do not delude yourself into making him a blank page on which to draw your own personal values. King was a socialist, avowedly, and certainly an anti-capitalist. He was pro-slavery at the most basic level, as evidenced by his attacking property rights as immoral.

“We must rapidly begin the shift from a “thing-oriented” society to a “person-oriented” society. When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered.”

That quote is disgusting, but consider what he is actually saying, and what he actually marched for. King is not simply proselytizing leftist and religious anti-capitalist falderal in an attempt to convert you; he wants the government to threaten you with a gun and throw you in jail, something he endured, if you do not agree with him. If you are morally repugnant enough to want to discriminate based on race, King does not just want to change your mind; he wants to steal your property and dictate how you use it. He places needs above rights, which is the primary moral principle underlying Christianity, Socialism, and Communism. What exactly does he mean when he says “people” should take priority over “property rights”? He means slavery. He means that if some people are unhappy, your right to your property must go; you must toil while others reap the benefit of your work, the very definition of slavery.

After all, consider that the event in which King delivered the famous “I Have a Dream” speech was the also-famous “March on Washington for Freedom.” Oh, wait a minute, no it was not. It was actually called the “March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom.”

Notice the corruption of the word freedom. Freedom means you have individual rights, which consist of freedom from force. What King wanted was self-contradictory. He wanted the government to force the provision of jobs through either outright threats or the expropriation of wealth, and “freedom.” Of course, what King really wanted was Orwellian freedom. Freedom is Slavery in the most literal sense for King. You are not free unless you have enslaved another man to provide your needs.

There is of course far more to his horrid beliefs, such as his sickening view of the Vietnam War and his absurd conviction and out-of-context negative appraisal of the idea that the U.S. was the “greatest purveyor of violence in the world” in 1967.

School children have been inculcated for generations with the Trojan Horse idea that he was a great man, and so when they get older they must concede a little bit more and a little bit more to the left and the nihilist egalitarians whenever they bring up MLK. Martin Luther King Jr. was revoltingly anti-American, and it is shameful that a federal holiday was made of him, and even more shameful that he is used, as is Mahatma Gandhi, as a tool by which people get the government to force universal adoration of a freedom-hating icon in order to weaken the position of the freedom-defenders and make them break down in contradiction when they find themselves caught between what they implicitly recognize as the truth and the positive psychological associations for a monster forced on them from childhood.

The only “gap” between our technological progress and morality is the one he served in large part to widen, though, to be fair, he also shortened that gap by legitimizing socialist policies and thereby greatly slowing the technological growth of the United States and the world. Congratulations Dr. King, in the race to catch up to technology, your morality is running the course backwards, but at least it can never get too far behind, because it is dragging the goal post right along with it.

lol

You forgot to mention that he was in Memphis to support striking sanitation workers. AKA parasites.
Jason's Ultimatum
Americans out of Mexico! The Border Tax Equity Act
(04-09-2012, 06:34 PM)
Jason's Ultimatum's Avatar

Originally Posted by hokahey

Hey look no one can provide an actual rebuttal so they *insert snide comment here_____*

It's funny when liberals decry our loss of freedoms and then demand a bigger overreaching goverment.

I ultimately relate more to liberals than neocons but both are inconsistent and dangerous.

It doesn't make economic sense to turn away customers for one thing. It has a mutliplier effect.
Oblivion
Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
(04-10-2012, 06:28 AM)

Originally Posted by zomaha

Would NBC have edited video during the Civil Rights movement?

I see this has become the new "Bill Maher said bad words to Sarah Palin one time!" right wing debate trump card.
Trent Strong
Banned
(04-10-2012, 06:47 AM)
Trent Strong's Avatar

Originally Posted by Oblivion

I see this has become the new "Bill Maher said bad words to Sarah Palin one time!" right wing debate trump card.

I don't see how those two things are really comparable. Besides, the OP specifically talks about "the dichotomy between MSNBC and Fox News handling of the Martin case". I don't watch fox news, so I have no idea how they are handling the case, but MSNBCs handling of it is clearly reprehensible.
speculawyer
clairvoyancy is no excuse for trollin'
(04-10-2012, 06:49 AM)
speculawyer's Avatar
Of course. I don't see how anyone could argue otherwise. r

evil solrac v3.0
(04-10-2012, 07:00 AM)
evil solrac v3.0's Avatar

Originally Posted by CHEEZMO™

This may be shocking to some people, and in fact I know it will be shocking to some people, but Martin Luther King Jr. was evil, and that is not hyperbole.

Just to get this out of the way, his fight against government segregation was a totally legitimate and morally praiseworthy fight. However, almost everything else he stood for, both concretely and philosophically, was totally corrupt.

First of all, let us be clear on what kind of “morality” MLK is talking about here. Do not delude yourself into making him a blank page on which to draw your own personal values. King was a socialist, avowedly, and certainly an anti-capitalist. He was pro-slavery at the most basic level, as evidenced by his attacking property rights as immoral.

“We must rapidly begin the shift from a “thing-oriented” society to a “person-oriented” society. When machines and computers, profit motives and property rights are considered more important than people, the giant triplets of racism, materialism, and militarism are incapable of being conquered.”

That quote is disgusting, but consider what he is actually saying, and what he actually marched for. King is not simply proselytizing leftist and religious anti-capitalist falderal in an attempt to convert you; he wants the government to threaten you with a gun and throw you in jail, something he endured, if you do not agree with him. If you are morally repugnant enough to want to discriminate based on race, King does not just want to change your mind; he wants to steal your property and dictate how you use it. He places needs above rights, which is the primary moral principle underlying Christianity, Socialism, and Communism. What exactly does he mean when he says “people” should take priority over “property rights”? He means slavery. He means that if some people are unhappy, your right to your property must go; you must toil while others reap the benefit of your work, the very definition of slavery.

After all, consider that the event in which King delivered the famous “I Have a Dream” speech was the also-famous “March on Washington for Freedom.” Oh, wait a minute, no it was not. It was actually called the “March on Washington for Jobs and Freedom.”

Notice the corruption of the word freedom. Freedom means you have individual rights, which consist of freedom from force. What King wanted was self-contradictory. He wanted the government to force the provision of jobs through either outright threats or the expropriation of wealth, and “freedom.” Of course, what King really wanted was Orwellian freedom. Freedom is Slavery in the most literal sense for King. You are not free unless you have enslaved another man to provide your needs.

There is of course far more to his horrid beliefs, such as his sickening view of the Vietnam War and his absurd conviction and out-of-context negative appraisal of the idea that the U.S. was the “greatest purveyor of violence in the world” in 1967.

School children have been inculcated for generations with the Trojan Horse idea that he was a great man, and so when they get older they must concede a little bit more and a little bit more to the left and the nihilist egalitarians whenever they bring up MLK. Martin Luther King Jr. was revoltingly anti-American, and it is shameful that a federal holiday was made of him, and even more shameful that he is used, as is Mahatma Gandhi, as a tool by which people get the government to force universal adoration of a freedom-hating icon in order to weaken the position of the freedom-defenders and make them break down in contradiction when they find themselves caught between what they implicitly recognize as the truth and the positive psychological associations for a monster forced on them from childhood.

The only “gap” between our technological progress and morality is the one he served in large part to widen, though, to be fair, he also shortened that gap by legitimizing socialist policies and thereby greatly slowing the technological growth of the United States and the world. Congratulations Dr. King, in the race to catch up to technology, your morality is running the course backwards, but at least it can never get too far behind, because it is dragging the goal post right along with it.

lol


who wrote this? this is.... profound. or disturbing. LOL. wow.
Htown
STOP SHITTING ON MY MOTHER'S HEADSTONE
(04-10-2012, 07:04 AM)
Htown's Avatar
Looks like a comment someone left on a Gizmodo blog entry.

http://gizmodo.com/5734598/a-few-wor...74027#comments
Korey
Juniored for the safety and protection of the United States of America. U S A U S A U S A
(04-10-2012, 07:07 AM)
Korey's Avatar
I'm pretty sure Republicans/Conservatives are "against progress" by definition so yea, they would have been.
Oblivion
Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
(04-10-2012, 07:10 AM)

Originally Posted by Trent Strong

I don't see how those two things are really comparable. Besides, the OP specifically talks about "the dichotomy between MSNBC and Fox News handling of the Martin case". I don't watch fox news, so I have no idea how they are handling the case, but MSNBCs handling of it is clearly reprehensible.

Wait, what? How is MSNBC being reprehensible with this?
Trent Strong
Banned
(04-10-2012, 07:13 AM)
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Originally Posted by Oblivion

Wait, what? How is MSNBC being reprehensible with this?

MSNBC = NBC
Oblivion
Fetishing muscular manly men in skintight hosery
(04-10-2012, 07:14 AM)

Originally Posted by Trent Strong

MSNBC = NBC

Oh you meant the editing thing. Yes, I think we all agree that they shouldn't have done that, and it IS reprehensible. But my point was that it was a one time thing where the guy in question got punished and it was done with. It's a little bit different from Fox race baiting pretty much every single day they're on the air.
Trent Strong
Banned
(04-10-2012, 07:19 AM)
Trent Strong's Avatar

Originally Posted by Oblivion

Oh you meant the editing thing. Yes, I think we all agree that they shouldn't have done that, and it IS reprehensible. But my point was that it was a one time thing where the guy in question got punished and it was done with. It's a little bit different from Fox race baiting pretty much every single day they're on the air.

Maybe it's a one time thing, but who knows? Maybe they falsify stuff all the time and just never get caught. (Probably not.) They have a narrative that they want to push, and who knows how far they'll go to push it.
PhoenixDark
(04-10-2012, 07:20 AM)
PhoenixDark's Avatar
I'm sorry but the thread premise is idiotic. Fox News is a far right conservative media outlet. More than 80% of republicans in the house and senate voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964, compared to about 64-65% of the democrat party; and even that percentage was a struggle to achieve as LBJ had to threaten and cajole quite a few votes from southern democrats.

The republican party supported abolishing slavery, voting rights for blacks, and the early tenets of the Civil Rights movement. It serves no purpose to demonize one side or another based on today's republican or democrat parties. The dixiecrats who dominated the democrat party largely switched to the republican party after the 1964 vote, and LBJ famously lamented he signed away the south by passing the bill.

As the Civil Rights movement became more violent and controversial (note: I am not blaming this on the protestors), many on the far right became more suspicious and hostile towards it, culminating in Nixon's southern strategy for "law abiding Americans" ie white people in 1968 and 1972. Meanwhile the democrat party became more liberal on Civil Rights, and blacks who had once been republicans became lifelong democrats - a trend that lasts to this day.

Just as asking whether today's democrats and liberal news outlets would have supported slavery would be out of bounds, so is this thread. Things change.
Last edited by PhoenixDark; 04-10-2012 at 07:26 AM.
LuCkymoON
Banned
(04-10-2012, 07:21 AM)
LuCkymoON's Avatar

Originally Posted by CHEEZMO™

how would a house negro get a news anchor job?

She's half black/white and works for CNN not Fox.
Face it Tiger..
Member
(04-10-2012, 07:23 AM)
Face it Tiger..'s Avatar
Fox News is against the Gay Rights Movement? :/
ivysaur12
a real-life Hollywood big shot
(04-10-2012, 07:33 AM)
ivysaur12's Avatar

Originally Posted by Tiger uppercut

Fox News is against the Gay Rights Movement? :/

It's complicated. Not as much as people in here might suppose. It's an interesting dynamic that goes on behind the scenes.

Originally Posted by Trent Strong

Maybe it's a one time thing, but who knows? Maybe they falsify stuff all the time and just never get caught. (Probably not.) They have a narrative that they want to push, and who knows how far they'll go to push it.

Honestly, it was almost worse in the original version.
Last edited by ivysaur12; 04-10-2012 at 07:35 AM.
YoungHav
Banned
(04-19-2012, 05:17 PM)
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Hahahaha, !OF COURSE! Fox News would be against the Civil Rights movement.
SouthernDragon
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(04-19-2012, 05:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by CHEEZMO™

Oh great, Kosmo and the Paulestinians are here.

Sounds like an awesome band.
Megadragon15
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(04-19-2012, 05:43 PM)
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I don't think Twentieth Century-Fox Film Corporation was owned by Rupert Murdoch's News Corp in the 1950s-1960s so I don't know what political affiliation Fox had during that era.
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Benedict Arnold's 5th Cousin
(04-19-2012, 05:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by PhoenixDark

I'm sorry but the thread premise is idiotic. Fox News is a far right conservative media outlet. More than 80% of republicans in the house and senate voted for the Civil Rights Act of 1964, compared to about 64-65% of the democrat party; and even that percentage was a struggle to achieve as LBJ had to threaten and cajole quite a few votes from southern democrats.

The republican party supported abolishing slavery, voting rights for blacks, and the early tenets of the Civil Rights movement. It serves no purpose to demonize one side or another based on today's republican or democrat parties. The dixiecrats who dominated the democrat party largely switched to the republican party after the 1964 vote, and LBJ famously lamented he signed away the south by passing the bill.

As the Civil Rights movement became more violent and controversial (note: I am not blaming this on the protestors), many on the far right became more suspicious and hostile towards it, culminating in Nixon's southern strategy for "law abiding Americans" ie white people in 1968 and 1972. Meanwhile the democrat party became more liberal on Civil Rights, and blacks who had once been republicans became lifelong democrats - a trend that lasts to this day.

Just as asking whether today's democrats and liberal news outlets would have supported slavery would be out of bounds, so is this thread. Things change.

Great post PD.
Zabka
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(04-19-2012, 06:02 PM)
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Of course they would be. Fox News is not a Republican organization. It's a corporate and ideological organization that caters to a specific audience of old frightened white people.
YoungHav
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(04-19-2012, 06:06 PM)
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There should be a new Republican party movement to leave the right-wingers behind.
WillyFive
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(04-19-2012, 06:13 PM)
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To figure this out, we'd have to know if Fox News allegiance lies with either the GOP or conservatism.

Although today the two go hand in hand, it wasn't the case a decade or so before Fox News even premiered.

Rupert Murdoch (who founded the channel) was a huge fan of Ronald Reagan, and since he was both a Republican and somewhat conservative, the channel took that influence to it's content.

If we say Fox News would go with the Republican party, then they would have been a liberal network back during the Civil Rights era, since the party hadn't shifted to the southern evangelical conservative base they have now (back then that was the Democrat base).

This would have the most precedent, since Fox News went from hating the government during the Clinton years, to being it's biggest defender during the Bush years, and went back to hating it during Obama. Back during the Bush years they treated anti-government rallies to be "traitors", while they now consider those same rallies to be "patriots".

However, if they instead sided with conservatives, then they would obviously have always been a conservative network no matter what political party was in power. In this case, they would have been against the Civil Rights Movement and sided with the Democrats. Ronald Reagan used to be a Democrat, so there's that going for it.

It could also help if we look at Rupert Murdoch's political positions were back then. From his Wikipedia page:

Murdoch found a political ally in John McEwen, leader of the Australian Country Party (now known as the National Party of Australia), who was governing in coalition with the larger Menzies-Holt Liberal Party. From the very first issue of The Australian Murdoch began taking McEwen's side in every issue that divided the long-serving coalition partners. (The Australian, 15 July 1964, first edition, front page: "Strain in Cabinet, Liberal-CP row flares.") It was an issue that threatened to split the coalition government and open the way for the stronger Australian Labor Party to dominate Australian politics. It was the beginning of a long campaign that served McEwen well.[24]

After McEwen and Menzies retired, Murdoch threw his growing power behind the Australian Labor Party under the leadership of Gough Whitlam and duly saw it elected[25] on a social platform that included universal free health care, free education for all Australians to tertiary level, recognition of the People's Republic of China, and public ownership of Australia's oil, gas and mineral resources. Rupert Murdoch's backing of Whitlam turned out to be brief. Murdoch had already started his short-lived National Star[24] newspaper in America, and was seeking to strengthen his political contacts there.[26]

As we see here, Murdoch was very liberal back then. He supported universal free health care, free education, recognition of China, and more. As he got older he became friends with people that were conservative, and wanting to support them, he used his newspapers to promote conservative views in Britain.

So if we go by following Murdoch's tastes, Fox News would have been very liberal at first, but slowly evolve into a conservative network into what we have today.
thekad
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(04-19-2012, 06:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bulbo Urethral Baggins

Great post PD.

Huh? He contradicts himself.
Kad5
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(04-19-2012, 06:18 PM)
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People in this thread are forgetting that during the 1800s the Democratic party was a southern party and the republican party was a northern party.

Technically both parties had liberal AND conservative factions. They just represented different regional interests.
FStop7
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(04-19-2012, 06:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by Cheebo

This is the dumbest thing I ever heard. At the time the Democrats were the Southern dominated extremely pro-states rights extremely religious party while the Republicans were the party dominated by the North, and strong backers of big government and federal government authority.

The Republican Party of the Civil War was the politically liberal party and Democrats were politically conservative. You can't use that label. I mean Teddy Roosevelt is one of the most liberal Presidents in American history yet he was a Republican.

Fox News has a CONSERVATIVE bias.

I think his post was very revealing. He's a partisan hack. He doesn't give a shit about values or ideology. All he cares about is his "team".
Jason's Ultimatum
Americans out of Mexico! The Border Tax Equity Act
(04-19-2012, 06:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Willy105

To figure this out, we'd have to know if Fox News allegiance lies with either the GOP or conservatism.

As I've said in an earlier post, during the Nixon Administration, RogerAiles wanted to create a conservative media outlet.
Bulbo Urethral Baggins
Benedict Arnold's 5th Cousin
(04-19-2012, 06:20 PM)
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Originally Posted by Willy105

To figure this out, we'd have to know if Fox News allegiance lies with either the GOP or conservatism.

Although today the two go hand in hand, it wasn't the case a decade or so before Fox News even premiered.

Rupert Murdoch (who founded the channel) was a huge fan of Ronald Reagan, and since he was both a Republican and somewhat conservative, the channel took that influence to it's content.

If we say Fox News would go with the Republican party, then they would have been a liberal network back during the Civil Rights era, since the party hadn't shifted to the southern evangelical conservative base they have now (back then that was the Democrat base).

This would have the most precedent, since Fox News went from hating the government during the Clinton years, to being it's biggest defender during the Bush years, and went back to hating it during Obama. Back during the Bush years they treated anti-government rallies to be "traitors", while they now consider those same rallies to be "patriots".

However, if they instead sided with conservatives, then they would obviously have always been a conservative network no matter what political party was in power. In this case, they would have been against the Civil Rights Movement and sided with the Democrats. Ronald Reagan used to be a Democrat, so there's that going for it.

It could also help if we look at Rupert Murdoch's political positions were back then. From his Wikipedia page:



As we see here, Murdoch was very liberal back then. He supported universal free health care, free education, recognition of China, and more. As he got older he became friends with people that were conservative, and wanting to support them, he used his newspapers to promote conservative views in Britain.

So if we go by following Murdoch's tastes, Fox News would have been very liberal at first, but slowly evolve into a conservative network into what we have today.

Great post Willy105
Zabka
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(04-19-2012, 06:23 PM)
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Wikipedia has a good breakdown of votes for the Civil Rights Act by region

By party and region

Note: "Southern", as used in this section, refers to members of Congress from the eleven states that made up the Confederate States of America in the American Civil War. "Northern" refers to members from the other 39 states, regardless of the geographic location of those states.

The original House version:

  • Southern Democrats: 7–87 (7%–93%)
  • Southern Republicans: 0–10 (0%–100%)
  • Northern Democrats: 145-9 (94%–6%)
  • Northern Republicans: 138-24 (85%–15%)
The Senate version:
  • Southern Democrats: 1–20 (5%–95%)
  • Southern Republicans: 0–1 (0%–100%)
  • Northern Democrats: 45-1 (98%–2%)
  • Northern Republicans: 27-5 (84%–16%)


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