[EloquentM]

Keep in mind that that would have no bearing on system power whatsoever, but how much money was put into the game's development. Nintendo doesn't tend to put huge amounts of money into their games, except maybe Zelda, and without those high dev costs, system power means zilch.

I realize that which is why (as stated earlier) if retro was presenting a game it'd most likely be a main contender against GoW.

[HylianTom]

so if Sony is in such good developer support in Japan what happened to Vita? again are you serious? MS is dead in Japan and even they are able to money hat projects for the 360 that hardly leave the country you have Dragon Quest now stuck on Nintendo platforms I won't be shocked to see a Monster Hunter 4 wiiu edition Fatal Frame is pretty much Nintendo exclusive lots of boobie games have come up on 3DS WiiU is basicly a DS in its design WiiU allows you to play your games without you needing your TV I am having a hard time seeing the trend of a problem in Japan, just because Nintendo has everyone shushed under NDA does not mean we have to believe there is no support

I tend to think that after the PS2, developers placed their bets on PS3 and came-up snake-eyes.. but they had to stick with where they'd placed their money (well, at least somewhat). We started to see more of a shift after everyone realized what was happening sales-wise, but because of momentum from the previous generation, the Wii never really had the full backing of developers over there.

This time, there may be hope that developers at least hedge their bets a bit more. I'd take that as being Nintendo's worst case scenario with Japanese developers this time around.

[Truth101]

I tend to think that after the PS2, developers placed their bets on PS3 and came-up snake-eyes.. but they had to stick with where they'd placed their money (well, at least somewhat). We started to see more of a shift after everyone realized what was happening sales-wise, but because of momentum from the previous generation, the Wii never really had the full backing of developers over there. This time, there may be hope that developers at least hedge their bets a bit more. I'd take that as being Nintendo's worst case scenario with Japanese developers this time around.

Yes, developers invested too much money into HD engines and that tied their hands when it came to development.

[-Pyromaniac-]

I tend to think that after the PS2, developers placed their bets on PS3 and came-up snake-eyes.. but they had to stick with where they'd placed their money (well, at least somewhat).

not ENTIRELY true (I agree that they got stuck in HD dev though) considering the support for the PS3 has gotten stronger in its latter years, meaning their bets are obviously paying off. Even games like Tales of Graces which originally found a home on the wii made their way onto PS3 to find better success.

Like I keep saying, it's the exact same perception problem in both regions. The people...they don't buy zee games.

[BurntPork]

Aww man. Aww shucks. Avatars are disabled during e3 Edit: thank you rösti

Well, if you could think of a less subjective bet, I might consider it.

[Skiesofwonder]

Speaking of Call of Duty, if we see a FPS demoed at Nintendo's Press Conference, what would it be?

A. Call of Duty
B. Battlefield
C. Killer Freaks
D. Internal FPS (Retro, NST, etc.)
E. Other (Generations,Timesplitters 4, new IP, etc.)

I'm going with A, but C or even D seem more likely.

[Cheesecakebobby]

Speaking of Call of Duty, if we see a FPS demoed at Nintendo's Press Conference, what would it be? A. Call of Duty B. Battlefield C. Killer Freaks D. Internal FPS (Retro, NST, etc.) E. Other (Generations,Timesplitters 4, new IP, etc.) I'm going with A, but C or even D seem more likely.

Maybe James Bond?

[-Pyromaniac-]

It won't be call of duty me thinks because Microsoft is in bed with them in all marketing aspects. Killer Freaks I think it is.

[guek]

not ENTIRELY true (I agree that they got stuck in HD dev though) considering the support for the PS3 has gotten stronger in its latter years, meaning their bets are obviously paying off. Even games like Tales of Graces which originally found a home on the wii made their way onto PS3 to find better success. Like I keep saying, it's the exact same perception problem in both regions. The people...they don't buy zee games.

Actually, wii software is still pretty steady in japan, even if hardware is at Vita levels. But it's almost all evergreen nintendo titles. I would agree that there are some perception problems, sure, but it's nowhere near what's present in the west. The DS/3DS has retained a lot of nintendo's status and image in Japan.

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Speaking of Call of Duty, if we see a FPS demoed at Nintendo's Press Conference, what would it be? A. Call of Duty B. Battlefield C. Killer Freaks D. Internal FPS (Retro, NST, etc.) E. Other (Generations,Timesplitters 4, new IP, etc.) I'm going with A, but C or even D seem more likely.

Ghost Recon?

[ElTopo]

Maybe James Bond?

Good God, no. They wouldn't be that stupid, right ?

[Skiesofwonder]

Maybe James Bond?

That would be E (Generations). With the more then likely Nintendo Power reveal, that does seem possible.

[tkscz]

Ghost Recon?

Isn't that third person?

[Smiles and Cries]

I was talking about the PS3. Handhelds are a different ball game and everyone knows that. Nintendo OWNS that market. But when it comes to consoles, Sony always gets the most developer support. So I'm saying they don't just have to win the western developers back but they also have some work in Japan. Nintendo has DQ, I'll give them that. But Sony has just about every niche japanese developer working for them, and it's working. Didn't tales of Graces F sell more on PS3 than on Wii? That in a nut shell is the problem with the wii in japan, same with the wii in NA. Not enough people buying games.

the fact that the Wii sold so much in Japan should have been enough to not even raise this as a question then you went and said a Wii tales game redone in HD for PS3 sold more... :|

It is expected no? did you forget how crap Wii 3rd party games look compared to the same game on PS3? Then you go and take a Wii game and redo it in HD and a TALES game at that! The are big on Sony platforms.

I still believe Sony is in worst trouble in Japan with HOME Consoles than Nintendo is at this point. Nintendo is in much better shape when you leave the crap SD graphics excuses behind.

guess who you will be hard pressed to find on WiiU? KONAMI (I don't see how that company is still in business)

[BD1]

So, out of the games that we definitely know are coming around launch, what are people interested in? Ive got my eye on: Aliens: Colonial Marines Assassin's Creed III Darksiders II Killer Freaks From Outer Space (pending more impressions) Pikmin 3 Rayman Legends Sonic & SEGA All-Stars Racing Transformed Lego City Stories Its a pretty healthy list. Not sure what will be day one, though. Plus there is always the chance of more at E3. ;)

Batman: AC, ACIII and Pikmin 3 are the leading candidates right now. I'm the same with Killer Freaks; I need to see more impressions first. I won't buy a game just because it's a new IP on a Nintendo platform.

Plus all the unannounced Nintendo games there are sure to be. Plus I'll probably want to pick up CoD BLOPS 2, Madden NFL 13 and WWE 13, maybe. And assuming 007 Legends is there, I'll probably pick up that as well.

Ugh, my wallet weeps already.

Speaking of Call of Duty, if we see a FPS demoed at Nintendo's Press Conference, what would it be? A. Call of Duty B. Battlefield C. Killer Freaks D. Internal FPS (Retro, NST, etc.) E. Other (Generations,Timesplitters 4, new IP, etc.) I'm going with A, but C or even D seem more likely.

I think Killer Freaks or 007 Legends most likely, if there is not a Nintendo developed FPS. Nintendo and Bond have had a long love affair, so that would be the front runner I think.

I think Microsoft money hats CoD for their conference, don't they?

[Cerebral Assassin]

http://www.wmdportal.com/wp-content/...iew_160212.pdf

Thanks.

[EloquentM]

Well, if you could think of a less subjective bet, I might consider it.

Haha wouldn't the bet be more objectifiable with a larger pool sample of opinion? A majority consensus of graphical superiority for instance? Although, that could lead to catastrophic levels of bias thanks to Gafs affinity for groupthink against all Nintendo products. Nah, you're right better off not betting.

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

Isn't that third person?

yea but you shoot in first person..or choose to I think.

[Conor 419]

If Nintendo show an FPS it'll be Prime 4 or Killer Freaks.

Hopefully the former.

[Skiesofwonder]

It won't be call of duty me thinks because Microsoft is in bed with them in all marketing aspects. Killer Freaks I think it is.

Well the main thing having me thinking a Call of Duty demonstration is even possible is because Iwata name dropped it last year at a financial meeting in titles the Wii-U needs to succeed overseas. He spoke about how the Call of Duty games on Wii sold well but the graphics hindered it in being as popular as the other versions.

[Cheesecakebobby]

Good God, no. They wouldn't be that stupid, right ?

Goldeneye launching as a Wii exclusive shows stupidity is an unknown concept when you're making Bond games

[-Pyromaniac-]

the fact that the Wii sold so much in Japan should have been enough to not even raise this as a question then you went and said a Wii tales game redone in HD for PS3 sold more... :| It is expected no? did you forget how crap Wii 3rd party games look compared to the same game on PS3? Then you go and take a Wii game and redo it in HD and a TALES game at that! The are big on Sony platforms. I still believe Sony is in worst trouble in Japan with HOME Consoles than Nintendo is at this point. Nintendo is in much better shape when you leave the crap SD graphics excuses behind. guess who you will be hard pressed to find on WiiU? KONAMI (I don't see how that company is still in business)

Konami is still in business because Kojima is a god.

Anyway all I'm saying is developers in japan have found a home on the PS3, whether they bet on HD or chose to go there because they wanted to, it's hard to deny that they got the lions share of the developer support.

Once again, I'm not denying that an HD nintendo console could solve the problems. BUT, I've said this before and I'll say it again, THE biggest mistake Nintendo can make would be to create the console and be like "there are ya happy now bitch" to the developers. Not literally of course. Offering the tools is only half the story imo. Same applies for the west.

Well the main thing having me thinking a Call of Duty demonstration is even possible is because Iwata name dropped it last year at a financial meeting in titles the Wii-U needs to succeed overseas. He spoke about how the Call of Duty games on Wii sold well but the graphics hindered it in being as popular as the other versions.

doesn't change that activision is in bed with microsoft. I say it's the longest shot of them all. Iwata can mention it all he wants but when it comes to footage and all that, there's a reason it's ALL 360 branded. Even the tv commercials, not a single one for PS3 or Wii. Even leading up to release every single piece of footage I believe was 360, all the official stuff that is.

[Smiles and Cries]

I wonder how PS4 will be in Japan
will it be Kojima's next big title as PS4 exclusive to makes us all envy this time around?

Sony has some great ties I don't count them out they do need these ties far more than Nintendo does in Japan though.

[Cheesecakebobby]

That would be E (Generations). With the more then likely Nintendo Power reveal, that does seem possible.

Oh right, wasn't sure if that was the name of it. And I also seem to remember some rumour about a Skyfall game - I guess Generations is instead of a mere tie-in?

[ElTopo]

Goldeneye launching as a Wii exclusive shows stupidity is an unknown concept when you're making Bond games

Hopefully they have more than enough to show so they can just skip that Bond game no one really gives a shit about. At least for now, maybe the game will be great, who knows ?

[guek]

If Nintendo show an FPS it'll be Prime 4 or Killer Freaks. Hopefully the former.

I had a dream last night that unreal tweeted that an UE4 game would be shown at E3. Sony and MS' press conferences came and went without any dramatic reveal, and people thought Epic was going to have something in a roundtable or on the show floor until Nintendo's show where they pulled back the curtain on a new Metroid Prime in 3rd person developed by retro running on UE4.

I woke up not really know what to think about that.

[Dreamwriter]

Haha wouldn't the bet be more objectifiable with a larger pool sample of opinion? A majority consensus of graphical superiority for instance? Although, that could lead to catastrophic levels of bias thanks to Gafs affinity for groupthink against all Nintendo products. Nah, you're right better off not betting.

Well, the problem is, "graphical superiority" is rather insane to compare when, say, comparing God of War with Kirby or even Mario. Gritty fantasy realism is quite different from cartoony 3D, so that even if a Mario game came out that was a technical marvel and looked like a Pixar movie, people might still call God of War better looking because it looks more real.

[guek]

Anyway all I'm saying is developers in japan have found a home on the PS3, whether they bet on HD or chose to go there because they wanted to, it's hard to deny that they got the lions share of the developer support.

No one is denying that, it's just that PS3 3rd party software performed pretty poorly overall, even with all that extra support.

[-Pyromaniac-]

No one is denying that, it's just that PS3 3rd party software performed pretty poorly overall, even with all that extra support.

I want to agree but then I see like sequels and sequels and sequels of super niche games continuously coming up. They're obviously getting something out of it.

[Smiles and Cries]

you guys don't worry about games like COD on WiiU?

what if they are found not to see on WiiU? Was this not the whole question besides the Wii being SD? That all the cool kids that play COD only own Sony/MS/PC

can Nintendo even get the Core over to WiiU?

this is the most interesting thing I want see

[NeoGohan]

I want to agree but then I see like sequels and sequels and sequels of super niche games continuously coming up. They're obviously getting something out of it.

can i have a list of this?

[-Pyromaniac-]

you guys don't worry about games like COD on WiiU? what if they are found not to see on WiiU? Was this not the whole question besides the Wii being SD? That all the cool kids that play COD only own Sony/MS/PC can Nintendo even get the Core over to WiiU? this is the most interesting thing I want see

I think it's all on nintendo's marketing. To capture the core audience requires a completely different kind of marketing than to capture than casual audience. Which is why I still say nintendo won't be able to capture both, if they want casual they're gonna take a hit on core, if they want core they're gonna take a hit on casual. Can't have your cake and eat it too me thinks.

can i have a list of this?

Won't get into list wars but just go look at the mountains of niche games from devs like NIS, or Gust. Then there's obviously the bigger titles in Kojima(mgs)/Sega (yakuza). But yeah those niche developers especially. They keep pumping them out, obviously because they can afford to and it's working for them on some level. I'd even throw FromSoft into niche.

[StevieP]

Oh my lawdy 45 pages in 1 weekend... I don't know what the heck you guys talk about to make these threads move so fast. Seriously. lol Anyone know where I can find the latest GameplayWhore summary? =\

I just went through GPW's post history and he hasn't done any of these summaries since about 1600 posts ago, in which there was only 1 item (ShockingAlberto saying that SK employees were asked to sign NDAs even when being canned)... GPW, you around? lol

Man I miss when these threads used to be about actual speculation - before they became a community thread/Gaming OT-type thing. They were a lot easier to follow.

[Christberg]

it's all about NDAs Yes, it sucks!

Yep. Especially when somebody inevitably asks about the Wii U version and they get a canned STFU response that people read way, way too far into...

[-Pyromaniac-]

I just went through GPW's post history and he hasn't done any of these summaries since about 1600 posts ago, in which there was only 1 item (ShockingAlberto saying that SK employees were asked to sign NDAs even when being canned)... GPW, you around? lol Man I miss when these threads used to be about actual speculation - before they became a community thread/Gaming OT-type thing. They were a lot easier to follow.

nothing has happened, ideaman teased that there have been significant controller changes. That and the rayman leak are about everything.

[ElTopo]

Won't get into list wars but just go look at the mountains of niche games from devs like NIS, or Gust. Then there's obviously the bigger titles in Kojima(mgs)/Sega (yakuza). But yeah those niche developers especially. They keep pumping them out, obviously because they can afford to and it's working for them on some level. I'd even throw FromSoft into niche.

Isn't the problem that there's really no alternative for the studios ? Many have lost money or have closed, the others seem to have quite some trouble making money, I'm really not sure if much of the market is that lucrative anymore. But then again what else should they do ?

[Smiles and Cries]

I think it's all on nintendo's marketing. To capture the core audience requires a completely different kind of marketing than to capture than casual audience. Which is why I still say nintendo won't be able to capture both, if they want casual they're gonna take a hit on core, if they want core they're gonna take a hit on casual. Can't have your cake and eat it too me thinks.

I agree they are going to take a huge hit if they try to go after the core with marketing

they can't give up the casual dude that segment of the market is easy cash and everyone wants in.

the core is people like us on this board who play these CoD games. Nintendo should not be the ones marketing them they should support the devs who make this games by getting the hardware right but as far as we can tell Nintendo is just being Nintendo

WiiU pad can prove to be another huge revolution in console gaming or turn against them.
I like seeing h take these crazy chances but them marketing to the broody angst of core gamers will not fool anyone - Nintendo needs to leave that to EA/RockStar/Activision/THQ to do... start slow and win over everyone but pretending to be suddenly dark and mature will backfire

[-Pyromaniac-]

Isn't the problem that there's really no alternative for the studios ? Many have lost money or have closed, the others seem to have quite some trouble making money, I'm really not sure if much of the market is that lucrative anymore. But then again what else should they do ?

I'm just saying, at the rate they are pumping them out they're obviously getting something out of it the point where they are able to continue to do so. I mean aren't they at 4 Atelier games or something, good lawdd. I'm sure it also has to do with the fact that they invested in the engine and are now milking it, but they wouldn't continue to release the same games over and over if it wasn't profitable for them in some sense. This is speaking on niche devs. The big ones certainly have a choice.

[StevieP]

"Core" titles don't sell 20 million copies. "Casual" ones do.
(god these labels are so dumb)

[-Pyromaniac-]

"Core" titles don't sell 20 million copies. "Casual" ones do. (god these labels are so dumb)

I think games like COD and GTA are exceptions. Yes the titles are stupid titles, can't deny that. But games like COD and GTA are part of popular culture. They've hit the mainstream. The mainstream is where both the core and casual intersect. The point where lots of developers wish to be.

[Christberg]

you guys don't worry about games like COD on WiiU? what if they are found not to see on WiiU? Was this not the whole question besides the Wii being SD? That all the cool kids that play COD only own Sony/MS/PC can Nintendo even get the Core over to WiiU? this is the most interesting thing I want see

They could definitely get the core gamers on there. IF they have the most powerful system by a fair amount AND the third party support to back it up for a year or two the cognitive dissonance that's present will almost certainly evaporate.

Something as simple as having the best console version of Call of Duty this Fall would matter. A LOT.

It's all about the software.

[Berg]

http://www.wmdportal.com/wp-content/...iew_160212.pdf

Just read "Pose for the podium"
Hopefully we don't get a podium full of frontal nude shots.

[StevieP]

I think games like COD and GTA are exceptions. Yes the titles are stupid titles, can't deny that. But games like COD and GTA are part of popular culture. They've hit the mainstream. The mainstream is where both the core and casual intersect. The point where lots of developers wish to be.

CoD and Mario Kart are pretty much the same thing in the eyes of the market at large. Though Nintendo's "mainstream" hits generally sell better than the CoD's/GTAs/etc

[GameplayWhore]

Fuck it, going full revolution. By 2021, I expect to see 300,000 player F-Zero. These matches are yearly events, the winner gets showered in absolute glory.

It would be kind of cool to have massively huge, hour-long, one-lap tournament races. They'd have to do a lot of procedural generation for the tracks mixed in with some good, old-fashioned high class level design here and there.

Have a few thousand racers but allow any number of audience members to connect up to watch the race from any vantage point they desire.

Has anything like this ever been actually done in a video or computer game?

[RedSwirl]

Japanese developers didn't really do much on consoles at all this gen. The few that did, bet on Sony (except when they got subsidized by Microsoft) kind of by default, but they didn't show the PS3 anywhere near the loyalty they showed the PS2. I also actually think Japan showed some pretty decent support for the Wii, partly because it was the only console a lot of them could afford to develop for.

For some reason I get the feeling Japanese console development might shift towards the Wii U this gen because Nintendo is a console manufacturer sensitive to the problem of rising development costs, but that's just me. I also get the feeling Japanese devs might have a bit of an easier time acclimating to the Wii U because many of them have had experience developing on the DS.

[-Pyromaniac-]

CoD and Mario Kart are pretty much the same thing in the eyes of the market at large. Though Nintendo's "mainstream" hits generally sell better than the CoD's/GTAs/etc

Using my definition of mainstream I totally agree that Mario/Mario Kart/ whatever else that is a super crazy seller for nintendo is mainstream. Definitely a part of popular culture.

[Nibel]

Call Of Duty presentations are an essential part of Microsoft's conferences

[Mihael Mello Keehl]

It would be kind of cool to have massively huge, hour-long, one-lap tournament races. They'd have to do a lot of procedural generation for the tracks mixed in with some good, old-fashioned high class level design here and there. Have a few thousand racers but allow any number of audience members to connect up to watch the race from any vantage point they desire. Has anything like this ever been actually done in a video or computer game?

Heh I dont know, It would be huge with sports games though. Fighters have like speculate mode with like 6 players but will be better if sports games had like 100s of spectators like actual sports events. ahh we're getting off topic here though lol..

"Core" titles don't sell 20 million copies. "Casual" ones do. (god these labels are so dumb)

CoD and GTA Wii U confirmed

[Anth0ny]

Call Of Duty presentations are an essential part of Microsoft's conferences

This. It will probably be a part of Nintendo's in the form of a mention or a logo.

[guek]

I want to agree but then I see like sequels and sequels and sequels of super niche games continuously coming up. They're obviously getting something out of it.

I really don't think the support has been as great as you're making it out to be. It sounds more like you're describing the PSP's success in Japan.