[Envelope]

Well, I mean look at how fans used to be! It is. As a resident of the south, I promise you that using electric fans is not hazardous to your health or I would have been dead years ago. It is an essential part of living here. Unless you want to sleep in a room like a sauna.

I always thought about sticking a finger in there and seeing what would happen when I was little.

In the end I just used a stick instead.

[Dresden]

The myth of fan death is basically perpetuated by the government.

Beware of Summer Hazards! The Korea Consumer Protection Board (KCPB) issued a consumer safety alert after analyzing injury data related to summer accidents collected for the past three years through its Consumer Injury Surveillance System (CISS). The top five recurring accidents are ▲ asphyxiation from electric fans and air conditioners ▲ children’s asphyxiation inside cars ▲ explosions inside cars ▲ air conditioner explosions and ▲ sanitary accidents at home. ■ Doors should be left open when sleeping with the electric fan or air conditioner turned on If bodies are exposed to electric fans or air conditioners for too long, it causes bodies to lose water and hypothermia. If directly in contact with a fan, this could lead to death from increase of carbon dioxide saturation concentration and decrease of oxygen concentration. The risks are higher for the elderly and patients with respiratory problems. From 2003~2005, a total of 20 cases were reported through the CISS involving asphyxiations caused by leaving electric fans and air conditioners on while sleeping. To prevent asphyxiation, timers should be set, wind direction should be rotated and doors should be left open.

[cajunator]

Maybe I'll get a little bit of pizza hut while watching Code Geass....For C.C.

Japan can really make anything look cute.

[Lafiel]

First promotional video for Tari Tari: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOgdQaYzqqo

Looks like exactly what I expected. Hope it's good, since it's up my alley in terms of taste!

[Mad Pierrot]

I think enjoying something "ironically" makes sense if your source of enjoyment was unintended by the creators. Like people who watch super serious shows/movies to laugh at the hammy acting and poor writing. It gets misused a lot, though. Mostly, as Envelope said, to justify liking shows that you feel you shouldn't.

I think that this is a fair statement. Many of us simply try to dissociate ourselves with the concept of doing anything ironically due to the recent negative association with hipster culture, where doing something ironically is often a self-indulgent expression of contempt or smug superiority. Upper middle-class kids wearing shabby clothing, drinking cheap beer, or engaging in working-class social activities are common examples because they're all done as a mockery of what they emulate. The AnimeGAF parallel to this would probably be a shounen-hater deciding to marathon Naruto out of active dislike for the genre with the expectation that they'll eviscerate every episode and generally make the marathon about how much they personally hate the show and how much better the things that they like are.

When people watch things like Yami, there's no attempt to prove anything or generally draw attention to the irony of watching a show that's beneath their status as a critical viewer. They watch these shows because they want to enjoy them and because they accept the concept of "so bad it's good" as a valid kind of humor. Because they're still deriving enjoyment from something for the opposite reason intended by the creators this certainly falls under the definition of watching something ironically, but it's purely good-intentioned and shouldn't be confused with the negative kind of ironic behavior that many are more familiar with.

[dakkumauji]

so you didn't notice the rape background story for her?

Oh that? Didn't even really gave it a second thought.

I mean I guess it's quite different from pretty much everyone else's background. Depends on how much they'll spend on it though. I mean, it was brought up for two episodes or so and promptly dropped.

[Envelope]

Oh that? Didn't even really gave it a second thought. I mean I guess it's quite different from pretty much everyone else's background. Depends on how much they'll spend on it though. I mean, it was brought up for two episodes or so and promptly dropped.

It totally messes up the atmosphere of the show, they don't handle it and it's implications well at all.

[Branduil]

So you don't know what it means and choose to lash out at it anyways? Okay.

I don't know why you always get so upset when your dismissive one-off remarks are met with dismissive replies.

[Envelope]

I think that this is a fair statement. Many of us simply try to dissociate ourselves with the concept of doing anything ironically due to the recent negative association with hipster culture, where doing something ironically is often a self-indulgent expression of contempt or smug superiority. Upper middle-class kids wearing shabby clothing, drinking cheap beer, or engaging in working-class social activities are common examples because they're all done as a mockery of what they emulate. The AnimeGAF parallel to this would probably be a shounen-hater deciding to marathon Naruto out of active dislike for the genre with the expectation that they'll eviscerate every episode and generally make the marathon about how much they personally hate the show and how much better the things that they like are. When people watch things like Yami, there's no attempt to prove anything or generally draw attention to the irony of watching a show that's beneath their status as a critical viewer. They watch these shows because they want to enjoy them and because they accept the concept of "so bad it's good" as a valid kind of humor. Because they're still deriving enjoyment from something for the opposite reason intended by the creators this certainly falls under the definition of watching something ironically, but it's purely good-intentioned and shouldn't be confused with the negative kind of ironic behavior that many are more familiar with.

Right, it's not that your enjoyment itself is ironic, but it's derived in an ironic way. But going back to the Nyaruko example, that still doesn't fit that particular case, because people's enjoyment of it comes exactly the way the creators intended.

[Risette]

I don't know why you always get so upset when your dismissive one-off remarks are met with dismissive replies.

You should probably know what auteur means before using the word and calling it BS though. Just saying.

[cajunator]

The myth of fan death is basically perpetuated by the government.

This is ridiculous. air conditioner explosions? in-car explosions? What the fuck are Koreans doing? Also I kind of want to go to Korea, setup a bunch of fans in a room and go to sleep and freak people out.

I think that this is a fair statement. Many of us simply try to dissociate ourselves with the concept of doing anything ironically due to the recent negative association with hipster culture, where doing something ironically is often a self-indulgent expression of contempt or smug superiority. Upper middle-class kids wearing shabby clothing, drinking cheap beer, or engaging in working-class social activities are common examples because they're all done as a mockery of what they emulate. The AnimeGAF parallel to this would probably be a shounen-hater deciding to marathon Naruto out of active dislike for the genre with the expectation that they'll eviscerate every episode and generally make the marathon about how much they personally hate the show and how much better the things that they like are. When people watch things like Yami, there's no attempt to prove anything or generally draw attention to the irony of watching a show that's beneath their status as a critical viewer. They watch these shows because they want to enjoy them and because they accept the concept of "so bad it's good" as a valid kind of humor. Because they're still deriving enjoyment from something for the opposite reason intended by the creators this certainly falls under the definition of watching something ironically, but it's purely good-intentioned and shouldn't be confused with the negative kind of ironic behavior that many are more familiar with.

I watched Yami because I wanted to experience yuri and pain. but I ended up getting Yuri and pleasure from it. Its such a fun show. Lilith is so cute too.

[Hitokage]

I think that this is a fair statement. Many of us simply try to dissociate ourselves with the concept of doing anything ironically due to the recent negative association with hipster culture, where doing something ironically is often a self-indulgent expression of contempt or smug superiority. Upper middle-class kids wearing shabby clothing, drinking cheap beer, or engaging in working-class social activities are common examples because they're all done as a mockery of what they emulate. The AnimeGAF parallel to this would probably be a shounen-hater deciding to marathon Naruto out of active dislike for the genre with the expectation that they'll eviscerate every episode and generally make the marathon about how much they personally hate the show and how much better the things that they like are. When people watch things like Yami, there's no attempt to prove anything or generally draw attention to the irony of watching a show that's beneath their status as a critical viewer. They watch these shows because they want to enjoy them and because they accept the concept of "so bad it's good" as a valid kind of humor. Because they're still deriving enjoyment from something for the opposite reason intended by the creators this certainly falls under the definition of watching something ironically, but it's purely good-intentioned and shouldn't be confused with the negative kind of ironic behavior that many are more familiar with.

<3

[Mad Pierrot]

Right, it's not that your enjoyment itself is ironic, but it's derived in an ironic way.

And that's my whole post summed up in a sentence. Man, I'm stupidly longwinded today.

[Branduil]

You should probably know what auteur means before using it and calling it BS though. Just saying.

Games can't have auteurs -- they're not art.

I'm pretty sure I'm not the one who doesn't know what it means.

[cajunator]

Also what does "beneath status as a critical viewer" mean?

It makes it sound like some shows are unworthy to be enjoyed by anyone. But there are fans of everything. EVERYTHING.

[Envelope]

Also what does "beneath status as a critical viewer" mean? It makes it sound like some shows are unworthy to be enjoyed by anyone. But there are fans of everything. EVERYTHING.

But many people do think that way! They'll say, "Sure, I might have enjoyed xyz, but it's not like it was actually good or anything."

So basically, they're being tsundere. :)

[Mad Pierrot]

Also what does "beneath status as a critical viewer" mean? It makes it sound like some shows are unworthy to be enjoyed by anyone. But there are fans of everything. EVERYTHING.

Replace "critical" with "discerning", that should probably make the meaning more clear. Not everyone here may be critical, but they do have personal standards regarding what they do and don't watch.

[Brazil]

Also what does "beneath status as a critical viewer" mean? It makes it sound like some shows are unworthy to be enjoyed by anyone. But there are fans of everything. EVERYTHING.

Not everyone is a critical viewer.

[Ryuukan]

terrible scifi gif

So are you speechless because you're a hypocrite whining about fan service all the time and you've just realized that?

[dakkumauji]

It totally messes up the atmosphere of the show, they don't handle it and it's implications well at all.

That's pretty much true. It was like a point in the story and completely forgotten by the next episode. It doesn't really look like we'll actually return back it to either.

[Risette]

I'm pretty sure I'm not the one who doesn't know what it means.

No I'm pretty sure it's you:

If art requires auteurs then I guess filmmaking isn't art, either.

[Thoraxes]

Well, I mean look at how fans used to be! It is. As a resident of the south, I promise you that using electric fans is not hazardous to your health or I would have been dead years ago. It is an essential part of living here. Unless you want to sleep in a room like a sauna.

The future:

[Envelope]

The future:

I think that's too much fanservice for a SFW thread.

[Femmeworth]

So are you speechless because you're a hypocrite whining about fan service all the time and you've just realized that?

That GIF isn't from Firefly. :P

[Dresden]

The future:

Bladeless fans are pretty popular in Korea, although I remember Dyson suing a few of the manufacturers recently.

[duckroll]

The future:

That's not the future. It already exists.

http://www.dyson.com/fans/

[Brazil]

The future:

It's kind of the present.

But that thing's dangerous. You may lose your arm if you put it through the hole.

[Branduil]

No I'm pretty sure it's you:

You claimed games can't have auteurs because they're not art. This doesn't really make any sense unless you're discriminating against games on the basis of their collaborative nature, but films are also a collaborative media, so your argument was self-defeating. I shouldn't have had to explain this.

[cajunator]

But many people do think that way! They'll say, "Sure, I might have enjoyed xyz, but it's not like it was actually good or anything." So basically, they're being tsundere. :)

I see shows like that as "good" in that they entertained me, not qualitywise. Is that what you're talking about? Obviously a show like Yami isnt made with high production values as far as I can tell, but it is stupidly fun to watch. In a way I enjoy it more than much better crafted shows.

Replace "critical" with "discerning", that should probably make the meaning more clear. Not everyone here may be critical, but they do have personal standards regarding what they do and don't watch.

I suppose you're right. even I have "standards" though not many. Pretty much I just don't watch something if its boring. It can insult my intelligence, have awful art, and be written like a fifth grader, but Ill watch it if its fun.

[Risette]

You claimed games can't have auteurs because they're not art. This doesn't really make any sense unless you're discriminating against games on the basis of their collaborative nature, but films are also a collaborative media, so your argument was self-defeating. I shouldn't have had to explain this.

It's nothing to do with their collaborative nature. Games are not art -- they are games. Is basketball art?

[Thoraxes]

That's not the future. It already exists. http://www.dyson.com/fans/

It's kind of the present. But that thing's dangerous. You may lose your arm if you put it through the hole.

I mean to say we're presently living in the future.

Or rather I want them to not be $400 so there can be mass-market adaptation so I can buy one.

[Envelope]

It's kind of the present. But that thing's dangerous. You may lose your arm if you put it through the hole.

But it's bladeless, there aren't invisible blades waiting to delimb you!

[cajunator]

The future:

these weak pieces of shit don't cut it here :(

Also I stuck my arm through it at the store. nothing happens :(

[Femmeworth]

It's nothing to do with their collaborative nature. Games are not art -- they are games. Is basketball art?

Perhaps we should just refer to them as interactive visual media.

[Brazil]

But it's bladeless, there aren't invisible blades waiting to delimb you!

Or are there?

[Risette]

Perhaps we should just refer to them as interactive visual media.

Or computer programs, like Photoshop. Is Photoshop art?

[Envelope]

I see shows like that as "good" in that they entertained me, not qualitywise. Is that what you're talking about? Obviously a show like Yami isnt made with high production values as far as I can tell, but it is stupidly fun to watch. In a way I enjoy it more than much better crafted shows. I suppose you're right. even I have "standards" though not many. Pretty much I just don't watch something if its boring. It can insult my intelligence, have awful art, and be written like a fifth grader, but Ill watch it if its fun.

It's not that we shouldn't be critical, but that shouldn't be an excuse to deceive yourself or prevent yourself from enjoying something.

[cajunator]

Or are there?

there aren't. I checked.
Several times. In reckless ways.

[Branduil]

It's nothing to do with their collaborative nature. Games are not art -- they are games. Is basketball art?

Video games are not sports. A video of a basketball game can indeed be art. The interactive nature of video games does not invalidate or negate the visual or audio natures.

[Brazil]

there aren't. I checked. Several times. In reckless ways.

Dammit, cajun. I'm trying to start a new fear here.

[Risette]

Video games are not sports. A video of a basketball game can indeed be art. The interactive nature of video games does not invalidate or negate the visual or audio natures.

Maybe basketball was a poor example.

Is Monopoly art?

[dakkumauji]

Ookami-san to Shichinin no Nakama-tachi 09

More frills!
So we get Snow White, the Seven Dwarves, indoor pool and almost drowning. At least we get some Ringo backstory so yay for more building them characters up. I don't really have any confidence that this show will actually conclude anything expect maybe a not real love confession and even that is doubtful.

[Branduil]

Maybe basketball was a poor example. Is Monopoly art?

I do not think Monopoly itself would qualify, but a video game version of Monopoly certainly could. That's not to say a board game couldn't be art, I just don't think it's likely that Monopoly is.

[cajunator]

Dammit, cajun. I'm trying to start a new fear here.

Isn't the point of that thing to be a safer alternative to whirring fan blades? Its notl ikely to cause fear unless someone fears technology itself.

[Femmeworth]

Or computer programs, like Photoshop. Is Photoshop art?

Photoshop is a tool, though the GUI could be considered art. Are you suggesting that a program could never be art?

[Envelope]

Isn't the point of that thing to be a safer alternative to whirring fan blades? Its notl ikely to cause fear unless someone fears technology itself.

The point of the Dyson fan is to charge customers lots of money for something that isn't as effective as conventional fans, but looks cool.

[Hitokage]

It's kind of the present. But that thing's dangerous. You may lose your arm if you put it through the hole.

No you won't. It'll just appear inside the corresponding orange fan.

[cajunator]

The point of the Dyson fan is to charge customers lots of money for something that isn't as effective as conventional fans, but looks cool.

If that was true, I would have bought one already :(

No you won't. It'll just appear inside the corresponding orange fan.

OH SHIT. BEST ANSWER.

[dimb]

It's nothing to do with their collaborative nature. Games are not art -- they are games. Is basketball art?

Movies are not art -- they are movies. What are you trying to pull here pizzaroll?

[Andrew J.]

It's nothing to do with their collaborative nature. Games are not art -- they are games. Is basketball art?

Oh, fuck. Were you actually serious when you said that games aren't art? I thought you were just teasing us.

Look, you are on a video game forum. You are going to be torn apart while dragging the thread through pages of off-topic discussion. Learn to read the fucking room.