[3N16MA]

Perhaps it was that one line in the trailer and Garfield does a better job throughout the film. That is what I am hoping for because it's going to be hard to listen to horrible deliveries every time he suits up.

[PhoncipleBone]

If this series wants to get dark, give me Carnage. Nobody else. No other side villains or stupid baddie motivations. I just want that insane crackpot Kassidy.

Carnage is a shit character. You want to do a dark story that is well regarded by fans, but would also be ten times harder to pull off than anything Carnage? Kraven's Last Hunt.

Kraven would be almost impossible to pull off in a movie and not be dumb as hell, but that story would be pretty fucked up if done right.

Or if they want dark, use the Death of Jean DeWolff storyline.

[apana]

If this series wants to get dark, give me Carnage. Nobody else. No other side villains or stupid baddie motivations. I just want that insane crackpot Kassidy.

Venom and Carnage together!

Carnage is a shit character. You want to do a dark story that is well regarded by fans, but would also be ten times harder to pull off than anything Carnage? Kraven's Last Hunt. Kraven would be almost impossible to pull off in a movie and not be dumb as hell, but that story would be pretty fucked up if done right. Or if they want dark, use the Death of Jean DeWolff storyline.

[Tobor]

Carnage is a shit character. You want to do a dark story that is well regarded by fans, but would also be ten times harder to pull off than anything Carnage? Kraven's Last Hunt. Kraven would be almost impossible to pull off in a movie and not be dumb as hell, but that story would be pretty fucked up if done right. Or if they want dark, use the Death of Jean DeWolff storyline.

You've got good taste as far as comics go, dude.

[jakncoke]

wow so avengers could do nothing today and tomorrow and still have the 5 and 6 day records. really curious how much weekend 2 will put up

[Scullibundo]

Carnage is a shit character. You want to do a dark story that is well regarded by fans, but would also be ten times harder to pull off than anything Carnage? Kraven's Last Hunt. Kraven would be almost impossible to pull off in a movie and not be dumb as hell, but that story would be pretty fucked up if done right. Or if they want dark, use the Death of Jean DeWolff storyline.

Well I can't really defend Carnage since my only exposure to him has been through those good ol' Sega Genesis titles Maximum Carnage and Separation Anxiety where they explain he's basically a lunatic. I got the impression he was Marvel's answer to the Joker.

[PhoncipleBone]

Venom and Carnage together!

Crowe would make a scary ass Kraven. But how to pull off that character and not look dumb would be tough.

But just imagine the mindfuck on the audience if they followed a lot of the beats of that comic. Especially the ending. Anyone that doesn't know, get it and read it immediately.

That story also has two of my favorite Spider Man covers of all time:


This one is especially eye catching. Would make a kick ass movie poster.

Well I can't really defend Carnage since my only exposure to him has been through those good ol' Sega Genesis titles Maximum Carnage and Separation Anxiety where they explain he's basically a lunatic. I got the impression he was Marvel's answer to the Joker.

The games were cool, but the character is ass.

Basically it's "Let's take Venom, but make him stronger. Oh, and just make him a psycho that kills people. It's EXTREME!" Yes, it was the 90s.

Venom used to be a great character. But then he got way overused.

[Tobor]

Well I can't really defend Carnage since my only exposure to him has been through those good ol' Sega Genesis titles Maximum Carnage and Separation Anxiety where they explain he's basically a lunatic. I got the impression he was Marvel's answer to the Joker.

Carnage was a lame attempt to make Venom into a tragic hero and still have an evil Venom at the same time. He's literally Venom 2.0.

[PhoncipleBone]

Carnage was a lame attempt to make Venom into a tragic hero and still have an evil Venom at the same time. He's literally Venom 2.0.

With NONE of the history or build up that made Venom great when he first appeared.

[Divvy]

Crowe would make a scary ass Kraven. But how to pull off that character and not look dumb would be tough.

Juxtaposition between conflicting images has always worked for this kind of thing. Show him wearing snazzy uberexpensive suits, hair primmed to perfection. Then show him as a crazy wild man. It's sort of how they do it in the comics, but I think it'd work even better on screen.

[KevinCow]

I understand why everybody hates the symbiotes, and I can't really disagree or tell them they're wrong because they make some fair points.

But I still love them. Venom and Carnage. I'd still love to see them done in live action properly.

[kswiston]

Venom used to be a great character. But then he got way overused.

They have done some interesting things with Venom ever since Eddie Brock lost the symbiote. Especially recently.

Also, if they ditched Kraven's goofy suit, they would have a lot easier time selling him to audiences.

[PhoncipleBone]

They have done some interesting things with Venom ever since Eddie Brock lost the symbiote. Especially recently.

The things with the symbiote after Brock's losing it is kind of cool. But once Venom became the "dark hero" bullshit and was everywhere, he lost his luster. A prime example of adding more "layers" and giving us more of him diminishing the character.

Venom was a fantastic villain when they were first on the scene. They were one of the extremely few people that knew Spidey was Peter Parker. They had all of Spidey's powers. They did not set off the Spider Sense. And all they wanted was Parker dead through a shared hatred. Brock wanted him dead for ruining his career. The symbiote wanted him dead for rejecting it like a spurned lover. The motivation was simple and understandable.

[Dead]

Pfttt.

Venom and Carnage?



Planet of the Symbiotes baby!

[Hawkian]

Carnage was a lame attempt to make Venom into a tragic hero and still have an evil Venom at the same time. He's literally Venom 2.0.

Um, well he's Venom's offspring, so I guess that's accurate?

Can't believe the hate. There are a lack of quality comic arcs with him but the concept of a symbiote bonding with a serial killer and Spidey needing to team up with Venom to stop him is absolute gold and it was my dream that it would be the plot of Spider-Man 3 when I walked out of the theater after SM1. And then...

Well.

Anyway. Yeah. Venom and Carnage are fucking awesome and I'll stand alone shouting it if I have to.

The things with the symbiote after Brock's losing it is kind of cool. But once Venom became the "dark hero" bullshit and was everywhere, he lost his luster. A prime example of adding more "layers" and giving us more of him diminishing the character. Venom was a fantastic villain when they were first on the scene. They were one of the extremely few people that knew Spidey was Peter Parker. They had all of Spidey's powers. They did not set off the Spider Sense. And all they wanted was Parker dead through a shared hatred. Brock wanted him dead for ruining his career. The symbiote wanted him dead for rejecting it like a spurned lover. The motivation was simple and understandable.

Fuck, you even know to refer to them in the plural o.o

Pfttt. Venom and Carnage? Planet of the Symbiotes baby!

I may be the only person in the world who also likes Hybrid in the aftermath of all this... :-[

[PhoncipleBone]

Pfttt. Venom and Carnage? Planet of the Symbiotes baby!

Even worse than Carnage.

[PhoncipleBone]

Um, well he's Venom's offspring, so I guess that's accurate? Can't believe the hate. There are a lack of quality comic arcs with him but the concept of a symbiote bonding with a serial killer and Spidey needing to team up with Venom to stop him is absolute gold and it was my dream that it would be the plot of Spider-Man 3 when I walked out of the theater after SM1. And then... Well. Anyway. Yeah. Venom and Carnage are fucking awesome and I'll stand alone shouting it if I have to.

Concept is good. Execution is ass.

I do have Carnage's first appearance signed by artist and co creator Mark Bagley though.

[Dead]

Considering the route they are taking with Peters parents in the new movie, Ultimate Venom is a shoe-in for future movies.

[PhoncipleBone]

Considering the route they are taking with Peters parents in the new movie, Ultimate Venom is a shoe-in for future movies.

I am getting confused as to which thread I am posting in lately. So many comic book discussions.

[Hawkian]

Concept is good. Execution is ass.

Well that's the point! Doesn't it just feel like it could be done justice in a film? The only issue is the whole Peter-wearing-the-suit-first-and-starting-to-lose-control aspect would have to be pretty glossed-over to fit everything in. But at least we were shown that that part could be done well on the big screen!

Oh wait.


*sigh*

I do have Carnage's first appearance signed by artist and co creator Mark Bagley though.

Jealous.

[Tobor]

I am getting confused as to which thread I am posting in lately. So many comic book discussions.

Yeah, this should be taken somewhere else. Lol.

[Hawkian]

Lol, crap. Yes. I thought this was the Avengers thread, which wouldn't even have been appropriate This should be in the MCU future thread...

[PhoncipleBone]

Lol, crap. Yes. I thought this was the Avengers thread, which wouldn't even have been appropriate This should be in the MCU future thread...

MOVING NOW!

[shira]

I understand why everybody hates the symbiotes, and I can't really disagree or tell them they're wrong because they make some fair points. But I still love them. Venom and Carnage. I'd still love to see them done in live action properly.

Have they mastered drippy slimelike cg yet?
Carnage is instant R rating.

[Hawkian]

Saw the avengers at noon yesterday (1st showing) theater was crowded. Hot damn

Whoa, noon on a Tuesday? Where are you?

I'm still deciding when to go for my third time (can't believe I even want to, but I can't deny it). It'll either be a fairly early weeknight or a prime showing this weekend. Stupid Dark Shadows with its Dark Shadow...ness

[planar1280]

Avatar 2 might break it. not because it will sell more tickets than any movie but because everyone will only want to see it in 3D.

[Tom_Cody]

Any thoughts on how high this will go for its final international gross?

I think it is a given that it will pass Deathly Hallows II for number 3 all time, but does anyone this it has a chance of beating Titanic for number 2 all time?

[artist]

Any thoughts on how high this will go for its final international gross? I think it is a given that it will pass Deathly Hallows II for number 3 all time, but does anyone this it has a chance of beating Titanic for number 2 all time?

DH2 is not guaranteed and you can just about forget Titanic.

[planar1280]

The Record Breakers (post 100 Million OW)


Spiderman 2002 - 114 Million OW. First time ever a movie did more than 100 OW

Pirates: Dead Man's Chest 2006 135.6 Million OW

Spiderman 3 2007 151 Million OW. First time a movie did more than 150 million OW

The Dark Knight 2008 158.1 Million OW.

Harry Potter 7.5 2011 169.2 Million OW

Avengers 2012 207.4 OW. First time a movie did more than 200 Million OW


so the gap from 100-150 was 5 years

the gap from 150-200 was also 5 years


first 250 Million Movie in 2017? 300 Million in 2022?

[Tom_Cody]

DH2 is not guaranteed and you can just about forget Titanic.

To this point, have you (or anyone else) been tracking the pace of the international returns? We will have a better sense of how high the Avengers will go domestically after this weekend, but the international picture is much more complicated.

I have no idea, but if you have been looking into this, I would love to hear about your methodology.

[artist]

To this point, have you (or anyone else) been tracking the pace of the international returns? We will have a better sense of how high the Avengers will go domestically after this weekend, but the international picture is much more complicated. I have no idea, but if you have been looking into this, I would love to hear about your methodology.

It has opened in all markets except for Japan, foreign cume so far is 475M. It needs twice of that to catch up to DH2. I'm not saying its impossible but difficult and far from a given. Titanic is at 1.5B, so it needs 1B more which is just not happening.

Foreign markets tend to burn off very quickly compared to domestic i.e weaker legs because there is competition from local language films.

edit: Boxofficemojo is suggesting the same;

Including the domestic opening, the movie has so far made $641.8 million worldwide. That tops all of the franchise's previous movies including former top entry Iron Man 2 ($624 million). It's a foregone conclusion at this point that The Avengers winds up with over $1 billion worldwide, and it could get as high as fourth on the all-time chart ahead of Transformers: Dark of the Moon ($1.12 billion). It's unlikely that Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2's $1.33 billion is in reach, but crazier things have happened.

Even if Avenger's WW beats DH2's WW gross and ends up at 1.4B, it will still have a smaller foreign gross than DH2. (DH2 did only 381M domestic)

[Tom_Cody]

It has opened in all markets except for Japan, foreign cume so far is 475M. It needs twice of that to catch up to DH2. I'm not saying its impossible but difficult and far from a given. Titanic is at 1.5B, so it needs 1B more which is just not happening. Foreign markets tend to burn off very quickly compared to domestic i.e weaker legs because there is competition from local language films. edit: Boxofficemojo is suggesting the same; Even if Avenger's WW beats DH2's WW gross and ends up at 1.4B, it will still have a smaller foreign gross than DH2. (DH2 did only 381M domestic)

Interesting. I guess we will just have to see how the foreign returns continue to roll in.

[TrumanBurbank]

The Record Breakers (post 100 Million OW) Spiderman 2002 - 114 Million OW. First time ever a movie did more than 100 OW Pirates: Dead Man's Chest 2006 135.6 Million OW Spiderman 3 2007 151 Million OW. First time a movie did more than 150 million OW The Dark Knight 2008 158.1 Million OW. Harry Potter 7.5 2011 169.2 Million OW Avengers 2012 207.4 OW. First time a movie did more than 200 Million OW so the gap from 100-150 was 5 years the gap from 150-200 was also 5 years first 250 Million Movie in 2017? 300 Million in 2022?

2017 - Avatar 2

[kswiston]

It has opened in all markets except for Japan, foreign cume so far is 475M. It needs twice of that to catch up to DH2. I'm not saying its impossible but difficult and far from a given. Titanic is at 1.5B, so it needs 1B more which is just not happening. Foreign markets tend to burn off very quickly compared to domestic i.e weaker legs because there is competition from local language films. edit: Boxofficemojo is suggesting the same;

Foreign holds have actually been pretty good for the Avengers, and Boxofficemojo has off on a few of their predictions lately.

I agree that it is unlikely that the Avengers will reach Deathly Hallows' $950M overseas. However, the Avengers is stacking up pretty well to Pirates 4, which had a foreign total of $475M after its second Sunday. Pirates 4 also had the early advantage of launching in China, Japan and Russia week 1. As such, the Avengers had a better second weekend take overseas, and will get a late boost from Japan in a couple months.

Pirates 4 made $69M in its third international weekend, which Avengers should easily top. Since Pirates 4 had a final cume of $800M internationally, I see no reason why the Avengers won't reach at least that figure.

Domestically, there is almost no way the Avengers will fail to break $450M, and based on the Monday total and Tuesday's estimate (17M+), I think that $500M+ is pretty likely.

800M + 450M = 1.25B
800M + 500M = 1.3B

Deathly Hallows pt 2 is at 1.328B. At worst the Avengers will make slightly less than it.

[Busty]

Space year 2217 - Avatar 2

Fixed.

[planar1280]

Tuesday Box Office for Avengers:

Exhibitor Relations ‏ @ERCboxoffice THE AVENGERS amassed an estimated $17.5M on Tuesday. Total for earth's mightiest is now $244M

[Solo]

$350M in 10 days, how are ya?

[Jacob]

2017 - Avatar 2

I don't think Avatar 2 will break the record, not if it comes out in the same December slot as the original Avatar. December movies generally open to comparatively small opening weekends (next to summer blockbusters, that is) and then hold well throughout the holiday season. While I'm sure that Avatar 2 will be very successful and that lots of people will be interested in seeing it, I don't think it has the sort of passionate fanbase like HP, Twilight, or most superheros that will drive up the opening weekend numbers. I could see it having very good legs though.

[planar1280]

$350M in 10 days, how are ya?

Boxoffice trackers are predicting 15.5 million on Wednesday and 13.9 on Thursday (bringing it to 273 Million before next weekend)

Next weekend predictions range from 80 Million to 102 million according to trackers which would bring it total by end of week 2 at between 353 Million Low end to 375 High end)


If it gets 100 Million next weekend, 600 Domestic is a LOCK. If it gets 80 Million then 550 Million is a lock

regardless to say the Minimum Avengers will amass Domestically is 550 Million

[VisionaryQuest0]

Boxoffice trackers are predicting 15.5 million on Wednesday and 13.9 on Thursday (bringing it to 273 Million before next weekend) Next weekend predictions range from 80 Million to 102 million according to trackers which would bring it total by end of week 2 at between 353 Million Low end to 375 High end) If it gets 100 Million next weekend, 600 Domestic is a LOCK. If it gets 80 Million then 550 Million is a lock regardless to say the Minimum Avengers will amass Domestically is 550 Million

Redonk.

[Phoenician_Viking]

Battleship crossed 200$ million internationally.

[kswiston]

Tuesday Box Office for Avengers:

So, here are the first two weekday totals for the Avengers:

Monday - 18.9M (down 67% from Sunday)
Tuesday - 17.5M (down 8% from Monday)

For comparison, here are the Mon/Tues number from Spider-man 3, released 5 years ago on the same weekend.

Monday - 10.3M (down 74% from Sunday)
Tuesday - 8.0M (down 22% from Monday)


Spider-man 3 made 2.23x its first weekend total. If The Avengers followed Spider-man 3's run exactly after that first weekend, it would make $462M total (domestically).

Considering that the Avengers has had a better Saturday, Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday hold than Spider-man 3 (often much better), I think that $500M is pretty close to a certainty. It only needs a 2.42x first weekend multiplier. $550M is pretty likely as well. Spider-Man 3 also had a lot more competition. May 2007 had three 120M openers.

[JdFoX187]

Battleship crossed 200$ million internationally.

Too bad that's probably the last milestone it's going to hit. Movie is going to be a failure for Universal.

[artist]

Foreign holds have actually been pretty good for the Avengers, and Boxofficemojo has off on a few of their predictions lately. I agree that it is unlikely that the Avengers will reach Deathly Hallows' $950M overseas. However, the Avengers is stacking up pretty well to Pirates 4, which had a foreign total of $475M after its second Sunday. Pirates 4 also had the early advantage of launching in China, Japan and Russia week 1. As such, the Avengers had a better second weekend take overseas, and will get a late boost from Japan in a couple months. Pirates 4 made $69M in its third international weekend, which Avengers should easily top. Since Pirates 4 had a final cume of $800M internationally, I see no reason why the Avengers won't reach at least that figure. Domestically, there is almost no way the Avengers will fail to break $450M, and based on the Monday total and Tuesday's estimate (17M+), I think that $500M+ is pretty likely. 800M + 450M = 1.25B 800M + 500M = 1.3B Deathly Hallows pt 2 is at 1.328B. At worst the Avengers will make slightly less than it.

The foreign drops or holds for Avengers has been good because of the staggered release schedule & Pirates 4 didnt have that.

But yeah, your estimates and mine almost match up. I think 700M + 500M = 1.2B is a lock right now.

[Speedymanic]

Tuesday Box Office for Avengers:

Second weekend record is in the bag. Now the question is will it be able to do it again WE #3.

[artist]

Second weekend record is in the bag. Now the question is will it be able to do it again WE #3.

No.

[Superman00]

Second weekend record is in the bag. Now the question is will it be able to do it again WE #3.

Pretty low chance, Avatar currently hold it at $68.5 million.

[zero_suit]

Second weekend record is in the bag. Now the question is will it be able to do it again WE #3.

Hell no.

[Speedymanic]

No.

Pretty low chance, Avatar currently hold it at $68.5 million.

Hell no.

Yeah, probably not doable, but it will be interesting to see if it comes close.

[Tom_Cody]

Made up a quick chart to predict The Avengers 10 day total based off of the trajectory of the Hunger Games. I have considered the Hunger Games to be the best model since 1) it came out so recently and 2) it similarly a non-summer release (kids are still in school).



I expect the Avengers will drop off more in the future due to loss of 3D screens, but I think this is a good bet for now. I will adjust it as the days pass.