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Gazzawa
Member
(05-10-2012, 07:37 PM)
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ive made a huge mistake. doing a mostly paragon run. killed the quarians. then watched tali killed herself. one of the most desperate scenes i have ever seen.
its like my renegade run all over again!
DMeisterJ
Banned
(05-10-2012, 10:02 PM)
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Wow.

I thought people were overblowing how terrible the ending was, but nope. Wow.
riceandbeans
Member
(05-10-2012, 10:13 PM)

Originally Posted by D23

so yea... i have liara and garrus in my party but how the fuck did they ended up with joker in the end at some mysterious planet? da fuk

o well.. at least the journey was fun lol

It's a bullshit move by EAware to force a sequel when the series should have ended like Halo 3.
Jake Tower
Banned
(05-10-2012, 10:22 PM)

Originally Posted by DMeisterJ

Wow.

I thought people were overblowing how terrible the ending was, but nope. Wow.

I know that feel, bro.
Nori Chan
Banned
(05-10-2012, 10:37 PM)
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I didn't find the ending bad myself when I first saw it until I went into the thread and saw the couple videos making me realize that there were so many questions unanswered

then I realized it was the same ending for every other choice and that made me rage
Rapstah
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(05-10-2012, 10:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by riceandbeans

It's a bullshit move by EAware to force a sequel when the series should have ended like Halo 3.

Halo 3, although I have no idea how that ended, is probably a bad example because of Halo Wars, Halo Reach and Halo 4.
diamondstar
Member
(05-11-2012, 12:00 AM)
So with ME3 barely hanging on to Top 10 in a slow sales month

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...s-during-april

And ME3 barely making Top 10 in XBox Live activity since launch

http://majornelson.com/2012/04/17/li...-of-april-9th/

Can we conclude that taking resources and time from single player to build multiplayer was a bad idea?
Bisnic
Really Really Exciting Member!
(05-11-2012, 12:08 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

So with ME3 barely hanging on to Top 10 in a slow sales month

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...s-during-april

And ME3 barely making Top 10 in XBox Live activity since launch

http://majornelson.com/2012/04/17/li...-of-april-9th/

Can we conclude that taking resources and time from single player to build multiplayer was a bad idea?

You crazy? I love multiplayer, i've put more hours into that than singleplayer.
diamondstar
Member
(05-11-2012, 12:37 AM)

Originally Posted by Bisnic

You crazy? I love multiplayer, i've put more hours into that than singleplayer.

I guess you and your fellow ten percenters are keeping ME3 from dropping out of the top 10.

Multiplayer is fine, I enjoyed it but not at the expense of single player. I'm just saying I think it is more clear the EA/Bioware clearly dropped the ball with ME3.
Bisnic
Really Really Exciting Member!
(05-11-2012, 12:44 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

I guess you and your fellow ten percenters are keeping ME3 from dropping out of the top 10.

Multiplayer is fine, I enjoyed it but not at the expense of single player. I'm just saying I think it is more clear the EA/Bioware clearly dropped the ball with ME3.

I don't even play on Xbox, so whatever. :P And multiplayer is played enough so that around 22.84 millions matches were played. Although i have no idea if that only include Xbox or not, since the same pic only showed the top N7 rating of Xbox. The top Xbox player would only be #9 on PC. :lol

http://blog.bioware.com/wp-content/u...-Telemetry.jpg
Last edited by Bisnic; 05-11-2012 at 12:47 AM.
PinkCrayon
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(05-11-2012, 02:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

So with ME3 barely hanging on to Top 10 in a slow sales month

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...s-during-april

And ME3 barely making Top 10 in XBox Live activity since launch

http://majornelson.com/2012/04/17/li...-of-april-9th/

Can we conclude that taking resources and time from single player to build multiplayer was a bad idea?

no because the multiplayer was made by a separate team.
rozay
Banned
(05-11-2012, 02:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

I guess you and your fellow ten percenters are keeping ME3 from dropping out of the top 10.

Multiplayer is fine, I enjoyed it but not at the expense of single player. I'm just saying I think it is more clear the EA/Bioware clearly dropped the ball with ME3.

I think there were bigger issues with the development of the game than the multiplayer that honestly didn't require a lot of time with 99% of assets directly pulled from the campaign (and development on the online code was handled by Bioware Montreal, not Edmonton)

The game needed another year in development and less input from EA's marketing and focus testing groups for the game to be excellent in my book.
Last edited by rozay; 05-11-2012 at 02:46 AM.
Zeitgeister
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(05-11-2012, 02:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

So with ME3 barely hanging on to Top 10 in a slow sales month

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/article...s-during-april

And ME3 barely making Top 10 in XBox Live activity since launch

http://majornelson.com/2012/04/17/li...-of-april-9th/

Can we conclude that taking resources and time from single player to build multiplayer was a bad idea?

I think the ending of the single player is a much bigger cause of the game losing steam than anything else. Why bother with the mp when it only reminds you of that awful ending?


Originally Posted by rozay

I think there were bigger issues with the development of the game than the multiplayer that honestly didn't require a lot of time with 99% of assets directly pulled from the campaign (and development on the online code was handled by Bioware Montreal, not Edmonton)

The game needed another year in development and less input from EA's marketing and focus testing groups for the game to be excellent in my book.

and that as well.
Dany M
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(05-11-2012, 03:43 AM)
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Because the multiplayer is awesome and is totally different from the single player. I wanted to go back in to start a new game but I can't its just boring to do it again, maybe in a few months but the MP is legitimately fun.
Bisnic
Really Really Exciting Member!
(05-11-2012, 04:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dany M

Because the multiplayer is awesome and is totally different from the single player. I wanted to go back in to start a new game but I can't its just boring to do it again, maybe in a few months but the MP is legitimately fun.

Try a melee focused Geth Infiltrator someday, they pretty much own anything. Make Silver too easy. Havent dare trying Gold with it yet.
Mutanthands
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(05-11-2012, 04:08 AM)
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Originally Posted by rozay

The game needed another year in development and less input from EA's marketing and focus testing groups for the game to be excellent in my book.


Honestly, Bioware didn't need muddling from EA to ruin the ending. That was all on the top guys on the team. If EA marketing was involved, we would have gotten a traditional ending with a clear path to sequels, don't you think?
rozay
Banned
(05-11-2012, 04:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mutanthands

Honestly, Bioware didn't need muddling from EA to ruin the ending. That was all on the top guys on the team. If EA marketing was involved, we would have gotten a traditional ending with a clear path to sequels, don't you think?

I can't think of a more logical reason as to why Jessica Chobot was fully rendered in game and Tali appeared as a stock photo. It's stuff like that I'm talking about, as well as some of the direction and the marketing for the game. The ending was a casualty of the limited dev time.
Scapegoat
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(05-11-2012, 05:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by rozay

I can't think of a more logical reason as to why Jessica Chobot was fully rendered in game and Tali appeared as a stock photo. It's stuff like that I'm talking about, as well as some of the direction and the marketing for the game. The ending was a casualty of the limited dev time.

They should have used Chobot's face for Tali with her mask off. Even better, they could have it if you get the Geth to make peace with the Quarians they could upgrade their suits and immune systems or something and so Tali would spend the rest of the game with her helmet off. Oh, and also Chobot would do the rest of Tali's dialogue cause her voice was like that because of suit speakers or synthesizers or something.

For the fans.
Dany M
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(05-11-2012, 05:48 AM)
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They got a 2 year cycle. It wasn't limited production time. It was a poor allocation of time and resources.
Complistic
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(05-11-2012, 05:49 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dany M

They got a 2 year cycle. It wasn't limited production time. It was a poor allocation of time and resources.

2 years is a limited production time for a RPG of ME's scope.
Dany M
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(05-11-2012, 05:52 AM)
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Originally Posted by Complistic

2 years is a limited production time for a RPG of ME's scope.

The scope of ME was cut back when they made ME2. They were able to make a great game out of ME2 in the 2 years they had.
HK-47
Oh, bitch bitch bitch.
(05-11-2012, 05:54 AM)
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Originally Posted by diamondstar

I guess you and your fellow ten percenters are keeping ME3 from dropping out of the top 10.

Multiplayer is fine, I enjoyed it but not at the expense of single player. I'm just saying I think it is more clear the EA/Bioware clearly dropped the ball with ME3.

Nothing wrong with the game was caused by MP.
Dany M
Member
(05-11-2012, 05:57 AM)
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Sometimes I think people are overestimating the involvement EA had in the production of mass effect. Like, sometimes it feels like it gets construed that bioware is the battered wife while EA is the drunk husband asking for more. I just don't think that is the relationship of developer and publisher.
rozay
Banned
(05-11-2012, 06:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dany M

Sometimes I think people are overestimating the involvement EA had in the production of mass effect. Like, sometimes it feels like it gets construed that bioware is the battered wife while EA is the drunk husband asking for more. I just don't think that is the relationship of developer and publisher.

I'm sure a lot of it is a change in mindset with the heads of the studio, but I refuse to believe it was Bioware's idea to put Chobot in the game.
hateradio
The Most Dangerous Yes Man
(05-11-2012, 06:25 AM)
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I still don't know who she is*. While playing, I was confused why they got such a terrible voice actress to be in the game.


*Well, from the threads I gathered that she was some blogger for IGN that wrote some stupid thing that she then took down.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
(05-11-2012, 06:49 AM)
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Originally Posted by rozay

I'm sure a lot of it is a change in mindset with the heads of the studio, but I refuse to believe it was Bioware's idea to put Chobot in the game.

Supposedly it was Ray Muzikya (sp) who personally asked her to be in the game.

I wonder if this was done before or after they decided to kill Emily Wong on twitter.

And I agree that it was on Bioware's end, not EA's. EA may have killed the production cycle time, but Bioware should have been aware of how to write a damn ending. The game was arguably fine (not amazing after the initial wowness wears off and the other flaws become apparent) except for the last elements of the plot line.
Last edited by Metroidvania; 05-11-2012 at 06:52 AM.
Ushojax
Should probably not trust the 7-11 security cameras quite so much
(05-11-2012, 10:35 AM)
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Originally Posted by Metroidvania

And I agree that it was on Bioware's end, not EA's. EA may have killed the production cycle time, but Bioware should have been aware of how to write a damn ending. The game was arguably fine (not amazing after the initial wowness wears off and the other flaws become apparent) except for the last elements of the plot line.

I agree with this. It was rudimentary but entertaining until the post-beam stuff.
The Broken Ska Record
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(05-11-2012, 11:45 AM)
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I did really like the Quarian/Geth bit, but coupled with the Genophage seemed like Shepard was the cure for everything relating to the Galaxy's biggest issues.
spekkeh
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(05-11-2012, 12:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by PinkCrayon

no because the multiplayer was made by a separate team.

Well the separate team could've been added to the main team. Of course it's not a simple question of adding more programmer = better program in less time, but when you hear that Martin Sheen was still recording lines slightly over two months before the game was finished, because they ditched an indoctrination ending shortly before that because they couldn't get it working from a gameplay perspective.. Then it's quite clear that they were starved for time or resources. And having the other team prototyping and testing could've helped in this regard.
spekkeh
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(05-11-2012, 12:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by The Broken Ska Record

I did really like the Quarian/Geth bit, but coupled with the Genophage seemed like Shepard was the cure for everything relating to the Galaxy's biggest issues.

Sadly if Legion died in ME2, they handled the Legion replacement very poorly. Made it that much easier for me to gethicide everyone.
riceandbeans
Member
(05-11-2012, 12:59 PM)

Originally Posted by Dany M

Sometimes I think people are overestimating the involvement EA had in the production of mass effect. Like, sometimes it feels like it gets construed that bioware is the battered wife while EA is the drunk husband asking for more. I just don't think that is the relationship of developer and publisher.

I think the complaints sound fair. We wouldn't have the Galactic Readiness bullshit mess up the single-player if it wasn't for EA forcing their "Play Anywhere" thing, originally Javik was a regular crew member in the story who mysteriously turned into DLC, and a strict deadline doesn't help much either.

Reading the leaked script bits and listening to the cut content, it sounds like the game didn't have enough time to bake and resources may have been stretched thin.
Last edited by riceandbeans; 05-11-2012 at 01:02 PM.
Rapstah
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(05-11-2012, 01:06 PM)
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I imagine Galaxy at War was one of the first things about the game decided, and that the thresholds and gains were decided quite early on.
Arabian Mage
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(05-11-2012, 02:19 PM)
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Guys it just hit .

isn't it ironic that Conrad Verner had the best story arc of all the characters ?
Clockblockers
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(05-11-2012, 04:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by Noriega

I didn't find the ending bad myself when I first saw it until I went into the thread and saw the couple videos making me realize that there were so many questions unanswered

then I realized it was the same ending for every other choice and that made me rage

Yeah, I haven't read through everything because I wanted to avoid spoilers, but I thought this was a great game with some weaknesses that I loved up until the end. I just wish they handled the ending better.
Levyne
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(05-11-2012, 04:11 PM)
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I watched that 20 minute IT video.

Lots of assumptions and foggy ideas, but parts of it do make you think. Like how Synthesis=Saren (indoctrinated) and Control=TIM (indoctrinated), which both result in Shepard dying no matter what.

Hopefully the dlc clears things up.
The Broken Ska Record
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(05-11-2012, 05:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by spekkeh

Sadly if Legion died in ME2, they handled the Legion replacement very poorly. Made it that much easier for me to gethicide everyone.

I guess it's good if the conditions lined up.
PinkCrayon
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(05-11-2012, 06:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dany M

The scope of ME was cut back when they made ME2. They were able to make a great game out of ME2 in the 2 years they had.

They had over 2 years to make ME2. That's why it was so polished. ME3 was made in 18 months, that's why they couldn't even come up with a decent ending.
Bisnic
Really Really Exciting Member!
(05-11-2012, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by PinkCrayon

They had over 2 years to make ME2. That's why it was so polished. ME3 was made in 18 months, that's why they couldn't even come up with a decent ending.

I don't think the lack of time was the reason the ending sucked. It was more because Walters and Casey didnt want feedback from the other writers, am i right?

All the bugs that both the singleplayer and multiplayer have on the other hand... definitely due to a rushed game where they didnt even bother to fixed most of them before the release. ME2 had some bugs when i bought it last year(mostly Shepard getting stuck in midair for some reason), but that's nowhere near what ME3 have.
Last edited by Bisnic; 05-11-2012 at 07:13 PM.
RedRedSuit
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(05-11-2012, 07:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bisnic

I don't think the lack of time was the reason the ending sucked. It was more because Walters and Casey didnt want feedback from the other writers, am i right?

Partially, yes. Partially the endgame suffered because war assets (that is to say, the rest of ME1-ME3) had so little visible impact on it. That had to be a result of lack of time. They undoubtedly wanted an ME2-like effect of war assets on the ending, but it's hardly there at all.
Rodhull
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(05-11-2012, 07:37 PM)
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Originally Posted by PinkCrayon

They had over 2 years to make ME2. That's why it was so polished. ME3 was made in 18 months, that's why they couldn't even come up with a decent ending.

Both sequels were released about 26 months after their predecessor so that's not that valid a reason. Obviously I wish they'd delayed ME3 a few months at least now though. :(
nel e nel
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(05-11-2012, 07:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by PinkCrayon

They had over 2 years to make ME2. That's why it was so polished. ME3 was made in 18 months, that's why they couldn't even come up with a decent ending.

Mass Effect: November 20, 2007
Mass Effect 2: January 26, 2010

Probably right around 2 years development time since it takes about 2-3 months for certification.
Whooter
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(05-11-2012, 07:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by hateradio

I still don't know who she is*. While playing, I was confused why they got such a terrible voice actress to be in the game.


*Well, from the threads I gathered that she was some blogger for IGN that wrote some stupid thing that she then took down.

She got Internet Famous for licking a PSP back in the day...
Ronabo
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(05-11-2012, 08:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by Gazzawa

ive made a huge mistake. doing a mostly paragon run. killed the quarians. then watched tali killed herself. one of the most desperate scenes i have ever seen.
its like my renegade run all over again!

I just did this too. I didn't even know it could happen. Weird thing is I'm full Paragon and almost full Renegade. I at first wanted to destroy the Geth. Then I changed my mind when Legion said it wasn't justice. But it still happened anyways. Kinda bummed.
Bisnic
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(05-11-2012, 09:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ronabo

I just did this too. I didn't even know it could happen. Weird thing is I'm full Paragon and almost full Renegade. I at first wanted to destroy the Geth. Then I changed my mind when Legion said it wasn't justice. But it still happened anyways. Kinda bummed.

I heard that you kinda need to do have done a perfect Paragon run in ME2 to be able to save both party in ME3.
Amagon
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(05-11-2012, 10:06 PM)
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I ask this in a other thread but I'm like 23 hours in on Insanity mode and I think I'm at the half way point. If somebody can tell me how far I am in, I appreciate it. I'm at the part after Cerberus attacked the Citadel. And just discover the docking bay map with all the refugees are staying at the first time. I guess I missed a couple of missions after finding this area just now.
Rufus
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(05-11-2012, 10:19 PM)
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Wrong thread? No need to spoiler tag anything here.
Ronabo
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(05-11-2012, 10:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bisnic

I heard that you kinda need to do have done a perfect Paragon run in ME2 to be able to save both party in ME3.

That may be true then. Because on my male true ParagonShep play through I saved them both.
PinkCrayon
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(05-11-2012, 10:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bisnic

I heard that you kinda need to do have done a perfect Paragon run in ME2 to be able to save both party in ME3.

No, you can get it through a renegade run as well.
GSR
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(05-11-2012, 10:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by PinkCrayon

No, you can get it through a renegade run as well.

Yeah, it's not really morality-related, just 'positive outcomes'-related. In my Renegade run I destroyed the heretics, yelled my way into Tali and Legion's good books and got Tali off the hook by bitching out the Admirality in ME2, then baited Zaal'Koris into accepting a pickup and took care of the fighter squadrons in ME3 and got the peace options at the end. It was satisfying telling the Quarians that if they insisted on attacking the Geth, I'd stand there and watch them burn.
Bisnic
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(05-11-2012, 10:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by GSR

Yeah, it's not really morality-related, just 'positive outcomes'-related. In my Renegade run I destroyed the heretics, yelled my way into Tali and Legion's good books and got Tali off the hook by bitching out the Admirality in ME2, then baited Zaal'Koris into accepting a pickup and took care of the fighter squadrons in ME3 and got the peace options at the end. It was satisfying telling the Quarians that if they insisted on attacking the Geth, I'd stand there and watch them burn.

Quarians were always assholes anyway, if it wasn't for Tali, i would gladly choose Geths alone everytime.

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