[EleventhDoctor]

Is there any way to make a modern online FPS that doesn't cater to campers-or is that here for good?

[Yagharek]

Set them on "hot coals", so to speak. So you have to keep moving or your health slowly deteriorates.

[GraveRobberX]

[Kokonoe]

Never know for certain, but it'd be interested to see.

[Odrion]

not suck at the game

[LCGeek]

Is there any way to make a modern online FPS that doesn't cater to campers-or is that here for good?

Camping is and never will be a problem.

Here's how you deal with a camper since most of them never move from the same spots they like to whore out, learn their habits and counter them. Better yet do what most people do who have skill prefire them and move on to a real target worth a challenge. If you aren't doing either of these two don't make such a topic. They do make fps games that favor run and gun types but should I expect a topic about bunnyhopping and aiming being a problem for you.

[Red Arremer]

Tribes Ascend actually has such a fast gameplay and such long-range weaponry that it's actually pretty dumb to stand on one point, even as a sniper.

[Baconsaurus Rex]

The map design needs to toned down. Get rid of alleyways and buildings you can camp in and go back to the simple maps with three routes to the objective. CoD in particular has been doing this since CoD4

[99%]

Have armies solved the problem of "snipers"?

There's your answer.

[patapuf]

The only thing to do against campers is to play objective-based gamemodes and/or good map design without too much chokepoints.

apart from that one will learn the spots where people camp with experience and lets not forget: camping is a legitimate strategy! People just rage about absolutely everything that kills them in online FPS

[GrandHarrier]

Is there any way to make a modern online FPS that doesn't cater to campers-or is that here for good?

Isn't that like asking them to "solve the problem" of passing in (American) Football, because you only like the running game? Honestly, outside of Unreal Tournament, I find the Run-n-gun of modern FPS to be out of place and absurd, but I don't argue against it.

[Spider_Jerusalem]

Set them on "hot coals", so to speak. So you have to keep moving or your health slowly deteriorates.

Never thought of this as a solution, but looks like it could help... do you know of any game that implemented it?

One other solution could be some sort of "reverse-stealth" approach: if you hold your position for more than n seconds, it becomes visible on every enemy radar/hud around (maybe the visibility radius could start short and keep growing while staying still). But this kind of solution would probably have its drawbacks as well...

[scytheavatar]

Have armies solved the problem of "snipers"? There's your answer.

In real life, snipers don't "camp" and staying in one spot for long is more or less a death wish for any sniper.

[EleventhDoctor]

Never thought of this as a solution, but looks like it could help... do you know of any game that implemented it? One other solution could be some sort of "reverse-stealth" approach: if you hold your position for more than n seconds, it becomes visible on every enemy radar/hud around (maybe the visibility radius could start short and keep growing while staying still). But this kind of solution would probably have its drawbacks as well...

I think the recent Goldeneye reboot had a mode like this-would be awesome to try out...

[Yagharek]

Never thought of this as a solution, but looks like it could help... do you know of any game that implemented it? One other solution could be some sort of "reverse-stealth" approach: if you hold your position for more than n seconds, it becomes visible on every enemy radar/hud around (maybe the visibility radius could start short and keep growing while staying still). But this kind of solution would probably have its drawbacks as well...

I cant think of any examples, but a single player example was from Deus Ex IW, where you had some areas you couldnt enter early on because of radiation hazard. Its a simple contrivance to implement it in a multiplayer mode, but your solution is certainly more elegant.

[squall23]

TF2 does this pretty well. Only heavies, engineers, and snipers camp because they're acceptable roles for them.

[snoopeasystreet]

grenades solve it of the most part.

[mr_sockochris]

I think people running about like headless chickens dying 26 times per game is far worse than camping....

[patapuf]

people who camp are already at a disadvantage and they usually don't make as many points/kills as someone who does move around.

And if someone who camps hardcore does make the most points the other players on the servers just suck / are too dumb to lob a grenade/use smoke / flank / use teamplay whatever else there is.

[daviyoung]

Kill cams, airstrikes and explosives all help. As well as metagames like progression and perks. Camping was a lot easier to get away with 10 years ago.

[EuropeOG]

I think it would be worse if FPS's cater to headless chicken running.

[Stronghammer22]

Shadowrun doesn't seem to have any campers, probably because you can teleport through walls, as well as see where enemies are by using enhanced vision (unless they're equipped with smoke).

[patapuf]

In real life, snipers don't "camp" and staying in one spot for long is more or less a death wish for any sniper.

that's really not true. Usually you have spotter and a sniper who overlook a specific area and they indeed do camp.

[Syril]

I always thought Unreal Tournament was great at that because staying in one spot for extended periods in that game in most cases was suicidal, but a solution like that would never happen today, because it would require someone to make a shooter where you could actually run, jump, and shoot accurately at the same time.

[LCGeek]

One other solution could be some sort of "reverse-stealth" approach: if you hold your position for more than n seconds, it becomes visible on every enemy radar/hud around (maybe the visibility radius could start short and keep growing while staying still). But this kind of solution would probably have its drawbacks as well...

This is dumb it doesn't nothing to help good players who will just use strafing and snaking techniques to keep themselves off the radar for good. No matter what you do all it takes is simple knowledge of the limit to abuse this to no end. Radar is already broke enough in most fps games with them you have a free wallhack if you use sound and timing.

[TheCongressman1]

Camping is and never will be a problem. Here's how you deal with a camper since most of them never move from the same spots they like to whore out, learn their habits and counter them.

This man speaks the truth.

[Absoludacrous]

I'd rather they make modern FPS players aware that they don't have to run down the same damn hallway for the nth time trying to get back at the camper that killed them.

[EuropeOG]

that's really not true. Usually you have spotter and a sniper who overlook a specific area and they indeed do camp.

Yep. I've heard stories of snipers camping for days in one spot.

Obviously in an FPS game if you stay in the same spot it's likely you will get caught, especially if you're firing shots.

[PumpkinPie]

Camping is as legitimate a strategy as hammering the jump button when someone is shooting you.

[MuseManMike]

"Camping" is an inexorable part of gaming. When a player has volition they may choose to camp or not camp. And even the concept of camping is relative: it's poor strategy in, say, TF, but a smart strategy in, say, BF.

[patapuf]

I'd rather they make modern FPS players aware that they don't have to run down the same damn hallway for the nth time trying to get back at the camper that killed them.

so much this, In Battlefield you have people who run down the same path everytime and try to get the camper and then they get shot again, and again and again, never stopping to think how they could change up their tactics.

[PjotrStroganov]

In real life, snipers don't "camp" and staying in one spot for long is more or less a death wish for any sniper.

Finding and getting to a suitable position takes a long time for just a sniper and his spotter. Secondly, snipers often take part in larger infantry engagements. Sometimes they stay at the same place time for a short time and sometimes for a couple of hours. War=/=games.

[Wolf Akela]

TF2 does this pretty well. Only heavies, engineers, and snipers camp because they're acceptable roles for them.

On high level play, only Engies camp if you ever see them, since Gunslinger is normally banned. Snipers rarely stop to charge shots.

[Heavy's Sandvich]

Have better weapons and health/armour dotted around the map.

Or one could stop crying and watch the killcam.

Quake>>>everyone

[pa22word]

1. Design better maps

2. Remove regenerating health

Problem solved.

[tci]

i will never understand the enjoyment of camping. Where is the fun in staying on one spot the entire time? So you killed someone from x meteres away. Wow, that is something isn't it? I guess some players get off on that and the kill ratio.

so much this, In Battlefield you have people who run down the same path everytime and try to get the camper and then they get shot again, and again and again, never stopping to think how they could change up their tactics.

I do that just too keep them busy. Just arm the knife and then see how far I can get. Always fun when you get too close and they panic.

[Sojgat]

In real life, snipers don't "camp" and staying in one spot for long is more or less a death wish for any sniper.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d8Kxc...eature=related

[EleventhDoctor]

The problem I encounter is in objective based games-the entire enemy team is camping-and MY entire team is camping! Even when we're losing. If a FOS had the balls the come out with a game with no K/D stat tracking (other than TF2) it would make a big difference.

[Yze]

Honestly this is the dumbest question. Camping is hard to define, especially since the concept of not camping is in direct opposition to the concept of map control in multiplayer games.
The only way one could avoid camping was if every battle was set on flat ground in an arena without cover or walls. And even then unless this arena was infinite people would hang around the edges of it.
If a certain area of the arena is benificial to a competitor he's always more likely to hang out there, regardless of any intent to camp. And if he wants to win it's probably the smart way of going about it.
While it's great imagining a game where everything came down to simple twitch skills and noone could gain an advantage. It'd probably be as exciting to play as a point and click adventure.


Hell, taken outside of the context of videogames, camping is what every great (defensive) strategist that has ever lived did to achieve victory. It's why we built castles, forts, keeps, holds, bases and a million other defensible positions.
If you pick a spot that's advantageous to you, that will essentially make it a harder challenge for an enemy to achieve victory. stated otherwise : "camping tends to win." That said since we are speaking about videogames
and fun is a thing we'd all like to have there has to be a way to shift the balance of power when you're being "camped". Powerweapon drops, Powerups, Killstreaks/Deathstreaks or my favourite, destructible enviroments are all ways to shift the balance of power.
In the end if a game is properly balanced camping is a viable strategy but not the only way to win. Especially not in a game that rewards offense correctly and makes it a viable strategy.

Hell in bf3 you'll only get camped in indestructible hallways and rooms, and that's because there's no way to tip the balance of power in those situations since bf3 is reliant on destructible enviroments. And that's bad map design/gameplay balance not an issue with camping.

TL;DR
-Camping is a legitimate strategy
-Good gamebalance can make other strategies equally effective

[GrandHarrier]

i will never understand the enjoyment of running and gunning. Where is the fun in blitzing around the entire map the entire time? So you killed someone up close. Wow, that is something isn't it? I guess some players get off on that.

SEE WHAT I DID THERE?

[LCGeek]

The problem I encounter is in objective based games-the entire enemy team is camping-and MY entire team is camping! Even when we're losing. If a FOS had the balls the come out with a game with no K/D stat tracking (other than TF2) it would make a big difference.

I tend to only play objective based games in groups or with friends to avoid the bs you mentioned so I rarely experience it. Camping doesn't work in higher skill level of fps games especially against teams with good memories.

K/D is need along with other stats how else do you expect a player to gauge their performance or another player during a match?

[patapuf]

One design choice against camping is also this: more health and/or more speed, games like quake or tribes have hardly any camping

[Raika]

[Glass Rebel]

why did he lose his beard in the second last panel

[DBT85]

Anyone with an interest in Sniping at all should read Sniper One. I enjoyed it.

[LCGeek]

One design choice against camping is also this: more health and/or more speed, games like quake or tribes have hardly any camping

Because it's not beneficial in them. Quake with teh speed of it makes no sense to camp when it's easier to bunny hop and kill. As for tribes you better be a sharpshooter and moving at all times the maps are so big you get nothing camping.

Design usually decides who camps and why.

[tci]

SEE WHAT I DID THERE?

At least when those people die, they don't need to spawn 1 mile from the actual battle.

[iNvid02]

why did he lose his beard in the second last panel

sometimes i think these rage comics do it on purpose, just to try and be funnier

[Dark FaZe]

The map design needs to toned down. Get rid of alleyways and buildings you can camp in and go back to the simple maps with three routes to the objective. CoD in particular has been doing this since CoD4

I agree with this. Camping has never been an issue on maps with solid design.


BF3 is an example of there being way too much going on....and it helps campers.

[Fudgepuppy]

Most games I've played over the years, even though they've contained their fair share of camping, have still been the most satisfying and rewarding to when being agressive and constantly moving.

This is one of the reasons I think people didn't get MW2, as it had so many things that were irritating, but not necessarily gamebreaking. People who were camping only seemed to think that was the best and most fruitful strategy, which made their salty tears so much more salty when you came and bum-rushed them.