[KuwabaraTheMan]

It still fits the fundamental issue of port-begging which is 'Put the games only on the systems I want them to be on!' The market doesn't bend to your whims. You can buy the system and the game or not, but whining about it isn't productive, and more to the point on a forum, is incredibly irritating.

Yes, I agree. People begging Capcom to put their DS exclusive game on iOS is certainly port begging.

I don't think anyone has been 'whining' on here. People have responded to the idea of a game they want to play being released on another system but not on the one it was made for, and expressed that they would rather play it on the system they have. There's no real 'begging' going on, because the game already exists on that platform.

[wrowa]

In case that Capcom releases AAI2 on iOS (a move I'd welcome, but I strongly doubt that they are still interested in this particular game), I don't see why they wouldn't at least try to offer the game as an eShop download as well. Porting a DS game to the 3DS should be quite an easy task and they should be able to make a decent profit there considering that a large portion of AA fans are probably also Nintendo fans.

Being against digital releases also has reasoning besides collecting (which imo still is a valid argument). If you buy a physical copy (and it's not some Diablo III bullshit), you can be sure that if you handle it well you cann still replay the game ten years later - legally and without any additional hassle. If you buy digital, you are without any kind of guarantee that you will still be able to play the game 10 years down the road. Even if you didn't have to ever connect to the internet ever again after downloading the game to play it - which isn't exactly standard fare - you are tied to your system. If the system breaks - and that's a hell of a lot more common than a game card breaking due to heavy use - you lose your game too. Permanently so if the online service was discontinued in the meanwhile. Whereas if say my 3DS breaks I'll most likely be able to buy another 3DS even if used and play all my 3DS games without any problem. Huge difference.

That's quite a lot of generalizations you are doing there, though. There are physical releases that need to be activated online in order to be playable (not to mention that many games nowdays come with online-passes) and there are downloadable games that are DRM-free in which case you only need to store the .exe and you are good to go for an eternity.

Apart from Nintendo hardware, it's also quite uncommon that software is actually tied to your system and not to your account.

[charlequin]

Usually I'd agree but in this case it's a little bit more complicated than that.

It's really not.

It's 2012. The DS is dead. Nothing else (bar almost-cheating ginormous release B&W2) is coming out for it ever again. What people are talking about here is not "bringing the game out on the same system" (that ship has, by all conceivable accounts, sailed); they're talking about bringing it out in some sort of 3DS iteration, which means the whole "existing fanbase" thing is disingenuous -- the other option is already a new system that the vast majority of the "existing fanbase" doesn't own.

Capcom (and, largely, the industry as a whole) has telegraphed the iOS future of this particular franchise pretty strongly since they first started releasing mobile versions of the games back in 2009. iOS is a widely distributed platform with digital policies that are, in many ways, more suited to Capcom profiting on a franchise like this, and one where they can sell the game cheaper to consumers to start.

A used iPod Touch 4th Gen with 8GB storage would run someone about $130 right now. Adjust for game pricing (an Ace Attorney game is $30 on DS, but would run you $10 on iOS) and it's a $110 additional outlay. If for a given person there were already no other games (or utility functions) that are useful on the platform, and hypothetical future Ace Attorney titles never hit the system, it might not prove to be worthwhile to get one -- but otherwise I think it's pretty plausible for "dedicatd fans" to follow the series here. (And this is ignoring that Capcom says they'll also be putting the series on Android, and increasingly most young, technically-oriented people have an iOS or Android smartphone as their primary contact method, etc.)

[GhostTrick]

It's really not. It's 2012. The DS is dead. Nothing else (bar almost-cheating ginormous release B&W2) is coming out for it ever again. What people are talking about here is not "bringing the game out on the same system" (that ship has, by all conceivable accounts, sailed); they're talking about bringing it out in some sort of 3DS iteration, which means the whole "existing fanbase" thing is disingenuous -- the other option is already a new system that the vast majority of the "existing fanbase" doesn't own. Capcom (and, largely, the industry as a whole) has telegraphed the iOS future of this particular franchise pretty strongly since they first started releasing mobile versions of the games back in 2009. iOS is a widely distributed platform with digital policies that are, in many ways, more suited to Capcom profiting on a franchise like this, and one where they can sell the game cheaper to consumers to start. A used iPod Touch 4th Gen with 8GB storage would run someone about $130 right now. Adjust for game pricing (an Ace Attorney game is $30 on DS, but would run you $10 on iOS) and it's a $110 additional outlay. If for a given person there were already no other games (or utility functions) that are useful on the platform, and hypothetical future Ace Attorney titles never hit the system, it might not prove to be worthwhile to get one -- but otherwise I think it's pretty plausible for "dedicatd fans" to follow the series here. (And this is ignoring that Capcom says they'll also be putting the series on Android, and increasingly most young, technically-oriented people have an iOS or Android smartphone as their primary contact method, etc.)

I already have an iPhone 4 with 32GB storage. But I found that the first AA on iOS was a lame port. The game was blurry, the controls weren't intuitive, and it had a bad framerate (yes).
Having the serie in both iOS and NDS/3DS is not a problem, it's cool. But if the serie goes iOS only, it would be pretty bad I think, because it deserves a better fate.

[MidnightScott]

After all the bad publicity Capcom got they could turn their image around by releasing this here, even if it's just on the Nintendo eShop.

[supahkiwi]

I already have an iPhone 4 with 32GB storage. But I found that the first AA on iOS was a lame port. The game was blurry, the controls weren't intuitive, and it had a bad framerate (yes). Having the serie in both iOS and NDS/3DS is not a problem, it's cool. But if the serie goes iOS only, it would be pretty bad I think, because it deserves a better fate.

Isn't Capcom making HD remakes of Ace Attorney 1-3 for the IOS?

[wrowa]

Isn't Capcom making HD remakes of Ace Attorney 1-3 for the IOS?

Yes, it's what I would call the first serious effort in direction of iOS. The AA ports so far have been pretty lazy and I don't think that they filled another purpose than making a few quick bucks.

I believe the HD releases have been released in Japan in early February already and I don't think Capcom USA mentioned them at all so far. Actually, thinking about it, the hesitance isn't really a good sign for a potential release of AAI2.

[Aaron Strife]

It still fits the fundamental issue of port-begging which is 'Put the games only on the systems I want them to be on!' The market doesn't bend to your whims. You can buy the system and the game or not, but whining about it isn't productive, and more to the point on a forum, is incredibly irritating.

Is it really port begging when a game exists for a certain platform and has already been released in one region, only to be released on a different system (with I'm guessing no significant changes other than being translated/localized) in another?

Granted, I don't expect to see AA:I2 on DS even if it was released here. I still think it's super shitty on Capcom's part though. Especially considering there's not really anything stopping them from doing an eShop release or something.

[Yoshi]

That's quite a lot of generalizations you are doing there, though.

Not a lot of it really, I'll explain.

There are physical releases that need to be activated online in order to be playable (not to mention thamt many games nowdays come with online-passes)

thankfully that is totally PC exclusive at the moment and I would not buy a game (save my absolute favourite franchises) that forced me to do that for the singleplayer experience. Online Passes usually also only activate online modes for which I generally don't care and which would be useless without the corresponding online service anyway.

and there are downloadable games that are DRM-free in which case you only need to store the .exe and you are good to go for an eternity.

Not on consoles, at least not usually.

Apart from Nintendo hardware, it's also quite uncommon that software is actually tied to your system and not to your account.

I wasn't referencing the ties to the system, I was talking a day when the online service is discontinued. You can't activate your account on a newly bought console anymore then so you'te tied to the consoles you already owned and which have the account registered. Usually that's just one system.

Oh and obviously I'm only talking console / handheld here. I couldn't care less for PC and mobile phones.

[Easy_D]

The original AA trilogy for the Gba was Japan only, so it wouldn't be a surprise if AA:I2 is as well. Now let's hope for a 3DS port further down the line

[SMT]

Sven has no pull, I'm the original Miles Edgeworth number one fan, and I have been posting on the Capcom boards for years, to no avail.

They know only 26,000 of us will get Gyakuten Kenji II, they don't think fan service is worth it.
Also, he kept referencing paying the localization team, lol.

Maybe a project like this should be kept for fans to do.

On that note, I had a dream Megaman Legends 3 was returning.

[charlequin]

Is it really port begging when a game exists for a certain platform and has already been released in one region, only to be released on a different system (with I'm guessing no significant changes other than being translated/localized) in another?

I think a lot of you are focusing way too much on the legalistic definition of the phrase "port begging" (i.e. begging for a company to port an existing game to a new platform) and not enough on the underlying reason that it's forbidden (i.e. narcisisstic complaints about how game X won't be released on platform Y because I bought platform Y and [b]I[/b am the most important person on Earth are extremely annoying and not conducive to good discussion.)

It was definitely extraordinarily lame for Capcom to skip over AAI2 last year -- when it actually came out, when DS games still had at least a bit of retail presence, and when it would almost assuredly have at least paid for itself. It's representative of a new, consumer-hostile approach to localization that companies have recently adopted even though it flies in the face of the globalized, interconnected world they're operating in. It was a bad choice, a bad move for the brand, and a representative stand-in for Capcom's continued decline.

All of that is true, it's just no longer relevant. The chance at a DS release is shot now. If AAI2 is ever to see a US release, it will have to be on a new platform. Given the ground realities, iOS/Android is very much the most likely candidate (though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.) People need to find a way to deal with this reality responsibly, without working themselves into a state of high dudgeon about how they spent $150 on Capcom games three years ago so now they should be absolute lord of future platform decisions.

[Femmeworth]

I think a lot of you are focusing way too much on the legalistic definition of the phrase "port begging" (i.e. begging for a company to port an existing game to a new platform) and not enough on the underlying reason that it's forbidden (i.e. narcisisstic complaints about how game X won't be released on platform Y because I bought platform Y and [b]I[/b am the most important person on Earth are extremely annoying and not conducive to good discussion.) It was definitely extraordinarily lame for Capcom to skip over AAI2 last year -- when it actually came out, when DS games still had at least a bit of retail presence, and when it would almost assuredly have at least paid for itself. It's representative of a new, consumer-hostile approach to localization that companies have recently adopted even though it flies in the face of the globalized, interconnected world they're operating in. It was a bad choice, a bad move for the brand, and a representative stand-in for Capcom's continued decline. All of that is true, it's just no longer relevant. The chance at a DS release is shot now. If AAI2 is ever to see a US release, it will have to be on a new platform. Given the ground realities, iOS/Android is very much the most likely candidate (though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.) People need to find a way to deal with this reality responsibly, without working themselves into a state of high dudgeon about how they spent $150 on Capcom games three years ago so now they should be absolute lord of future platform decisions.

? DS games still have a retail presence, which is/was arguably hurting the 3DS.

[Eusis]

(though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.)

Phoenix Wright vs Professor Layton makes it a very good idea to at least have a 3DS eShop version I think, assuming that comes out here (and doesn't get thrown to iOS only, which WOULD be more insane for that game).

? DS games still have a retail presence, which is/was arguably hurting the 3DS.

Maybe E3 will surprise, but for the most part unless it's Pokemon or a licensed game it seems insane to release DS games now. Though, I actually half expect Atlus would anyway if there were anything worth bringing out, there was that one alchemy game but I think its window closed up without fanfare, and they're busy being more crazy on PSP anyway.

[BassForever]

I've honestly lost any hope at this point of an official localization of this title, maybe like in 5 years we'll get some complete AA collection game (not just AA1-3 HD) for the 3DS/Vita/iOS/nextgen that'll have an official US localization tied to it.

[Shotgun Kiss]

Fuck, at this point, I'd be grateful for them to simply release the iOS HD version of the Phoenix Wright trilogy over here, much less AAI2.

I'm praying we get good news regarding the future of the AA franchise in the west at E3.

[Femmeworth]

Fuck, at this point, I'd be grateful for them to simply release the iOS HD version of the Phoenix Wright trilogy over here, much less AAI2. I'm praying we get good news regarding the future of the AA franchise in the west at E3.

I don't think the HD versions are supposed to be all that great.

[Byronic Hero]

I don't think the HD versions are supposed to be all that great.

That thought that we'd get them at all is enough for me.

Although



Dat Chin

[GhostTrick]

I think a lot of you are focusing way too much on the legalistic definition of the phrase "port begging" (i.e. begging for a company to port an existing game to a new platform) and not enough on the underlying reason that it's forbidden (i.e. narcisisstic complaints about how game X won't be released on platform Y because I bought platform Y and [b]I[/b am the most important person on Earth are extremely annoying and not conducive to good discussion.) It was definitely extraordinarily lame for Capcom to skip over AAI2 last year -- when it actually came out, when DS games still had at least a bit of retail presence, and when it would almost assuredly have at least paid for itself. It's representative of a new, consumer-hostile approach to localization that companies have recently adopted even though it flies in the face of the globalized, interconnected world they're operating in. It was a bad choice, a bad move for the brand, and a representative stand-in for Capcom's continued decline. All of that is true, it's just no longer relevant. The chance at a DS release is shot now. If AAI2 is ever to see a US release, it will have to be on a new platform. Given the ground realities, iOS/Android is very much the most likely candidate (though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.) People need to find a way to deal with this reality responsibly, without working themselves into a state of high dudgeon about how they spent $150 on Capcom games three years ago so now they should be absolute lord of future platform decisions.

But people are talking about a NDS game being localised on NDS, or, with an updated version of 3DS. There's no port here, just backward compatibility.
And about your iOS/Android opinion... it's sounds like port-begging :P
I mean, at the moment, Ace Attorney Investigations is an exclusive NDS game. As I said, people are asking for localisation.

[Femmeworth]

Dat Chin

That's the problem with the HD versions, the characters were designed with the limitations of the GBA in mind.

[faceless007]

I think a lot of you are focusing way too much on the legalistic definition of the phrase "port begging" (i.e. begging for a company to port an existing game to a new platform) and not enough on the underlying reason that it's forbidden (i.e. narcisisstic complaints about how game X won't be released on platform Y because I bought platform Y and [b]I[/b am the most important person on Earth are extremely annoying and not conducive to good discussion.)

I agree that port begging is generally obnoxious and I don't disagree with the rule in general, but I think you're being unfairly harsh toward the mindset behind it. There are perfectly valid reasons to want to limit the number of gaming devices one owns instead of buying every single device that has even one title one even slightly wants (which is what you seem to expect people to do), and one of the many factors that can go into this decision is which system has a longstanding franchise one likes. People (outside GAF, perhaps) generally don't want to buy systems for one game, they look for a larger number to justify the upfront cost. It's not narcissism to balk at the prospect of purchasing another ~$130 device chiefly to follow a series one likes when there might not be any other titles of interest on it.

[Adam Prime]

This sounds like a great game that needs to end up on the DSi shop or something... in a few years. Or if they really want to make me purchase a 3DS, just release it there and I'll buy a system the day it comes out.

[Zenaku]

http://geimin.net/da/db/2011_ne_mc/

AAI2 apparently sold 228,078 units throughout 2011, and came 45th out of all software for all platforms.

[GSR]

http://geimin.net/da/db/2011_ne_mc/ AAI2 apparently sold 228,078 units throughout 2011, and came 45th out of all software for all platforms.

And Apollo Justice did 515,417 in Japan in 2007 - but I'm willing to bet it didn't do anything near that in America.

The series seems to be perfectly healthy as a mid-range franchise in Japan; it's just a matter of if Capcom feels it's viable as a small franchise in the US.

[Hero]

I think a lot of you are focusing way too much on the legalistic definition of the phrase "port begging" (i.e. begging for a company to port an existing game to a new platform) and not enough on the underlying reason that it's forbidden (i.e. narcisisstic complaints about how game X won't be released on platform Y because I bought platform Y and [b]I[/b am the most important person on Earth are extremely annoying and not conducive to good discussion.) It was definitely extraordinarily lame for Capcom to skip over AAI2 last year -- when it actually came out, when DS games still had at least a bit of retail presence, and when it would almost assuredly have at least paid for itself. It's representative of a new, consumer-hostile approach to localization that companies have recently adopted even though it flies in the face of the globalized, interconnected world they're operating in. It was a bad choice, a bad move for the brand, and a representative stand-in for Capcom's continued decline. All of that is true, it's just no longer relevant. The chance at a DS release is shot now. If AAI2 is ever to see a US release, it will have to be on a new platform. Given the ground realities, iOS/Android is very much the most likely candidate (though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.) People need to find a way to deal with this reality responsibly, without working themselves into a state of high dudgeon about how they spent $150 on Capcom games three years ago so now they should be absolute lord of future platform decisions.

While the DS is dead, I find it extremely unlikely that Capcom couldn't have found a way to release the game to the fanbase since the Japanese game came out. Let's be honest that Ace Attorney games are extremely niche and launching it on DS vs 3DS is pretty irrelevant since the fanbase that exists for the game would buy it. Are you saying that Atlus can release niche Japanese RPGs on the PSP in June and July of this year profitably but Capcom wouldn't be able to profit on AAI2 on DS? I don't believe that at all.

As of right now it's very unlikely the game is coming at all and regardless of "port-begging" Capcom has fucked up the possibilities and stifled the potential of the game multiple times through the years.

[wsippel]

All of that is true, it's just no longer relevant. The chance at a DS release is shot now. If AAI2 is ever to see a US release, it will have to be on a new platform. Given the ground realities, iOS/Android is very much the most likely candidate (though it's not like a digital 3DS release would be impossible, just arguably less plausible.) People need to find a way to deal with this reality responsibly, without working themselves into a state of high dudgeon about how they spent $150 on Capcom games three years ago so now they should be absolute lord of future platform decisions.

How is the platform that will very likely be the future home of the franchise (if the Layton crossover and Capcom's general support for the system are any indication) a less plausible option?

[charlequin]

? DS games still have a retail presence

If you count "a big stack of licensed games, shelved spine-out and unalphabetized" as a retail presence, which you probably should not.

I agree that port begging is generally obnoxious and I don't disagree with the rule in general, but I think you're being unfairly harsh toward the mindset behind it.

It's probably fanned by Capcom's aggressively poor handling of the issue (and their unusually poor US regional presence in general) but nonetheless, the complaints about this franchise step over the line of appropriate decorum quite a bit. Inasmuch as people think poor behavior is justified either because of the game's platform on Japanese release or because iOS/Android isn't a "real" platform to which the normal rules apply, they are mistaken.

There are perfectly valid reasons to want to limit the number of gaming devices one owns instead of buying every single device that has even one title one even slightly wants

Sure, and I'm not going to get too hard on anyone's case for "I'll probably be skipping this if it hits a platform I don't own." Nonetheless, it's still a bit... who cares? If someone really loves Monster Hunter but isn't going to play it anymore because they're unwilling to buy a 3DS, well, good for them being able to set reasonable self-boundaries on their leisure spending, I guess, but it's mostly irrelevant to everyone else.

In general, the mature response to this sort of thing is either accepting that you're not going to play everything you want right away in a world with so many dueling platforms, or accepting that you're willing to buy the platform in question for the game.

How is the platform that will very likely be the future home of the franchise (if the Layton crossover and Capcom's general support for the system are any indication) a less plausible option?

I am extremely skeptical of both Capcom's willingness to develop this franchise in a form that targets the expected qualities of a full-price retail title, and of Capcom USA's willingness to expose themselves to retail for this franchise regardless of where they sell it in Japan. The lack of platform associated with the AA5 announcement stands out to me as pretty significant.

That said, let's say Capcom redoubles their efforts on 3DS -- AA5 hits that platform, AAI + AAI2 re-released as eShop titles, they make a push into the US on 3DS while leaving the iOS stuff as behind as it is now. I'm sure that too will generate quite a bit of kvetching and that too (much like the "won't buy until it's 1/3 price on iOS!" stuff that infects a lot of retail title threads) will not be acceptable.

Really, the underlying point here is: platform choice is something companies do in pursuit of their core business goals, much like the choice of what games to develop in the first place. Absent particularly egregious choices, it's always better to accept and cope with these choices as they're made than to throw a fit that they don't align with your own preferences -- and to make reasoned platform choices based on what's really necessary to play the games you care about.

[wsippel]

I am extremely skeptical of both Capcom's willingness to develop this franchise in a form that targets the expected qualities of a full-price retail title, and of Capcom USA's willingness to expose themselves to retail for this franchise regardless of where they sell it in Japan. The lack of platform associated with the AA5 announcement stands out to me as pretty significant. That said, let's say Capcom redoubles their efforts on 3DS -- AA5 hits that platform, AAI + AAI2 re-released as eShop titles, they make a push into the US on 3DS while leaving the iOS stuff as behind as it is now. I'm sure that too will generate quite a bit of kvetching and that too (much like the "won't buy until it's 1/3 price on iOS!" stuff that infects a lot of retail title threads) will not be acceptable. Really, the underlying point here is: platform choice is something companies do in pursuit of their core business goals, much like the choice of what games to develop in the first place. Absent particularly egregious choices, it's always better to accept and cope with these choices as they're made than to throw a fit that they don't align with your own preferences -- and to make reasoned platform choices based on what's really necessary to play the games you care about.

Capcom ported the first three of six games to iOS. The games in question are nearly a decade old and written off many times over. But I guess we can put our speculations to rest once the platform for AA5 is announced - I personally am almost willing to bet that it won't be iOS and that the game won't hit iOS until at least two years after it appeared on a dedicated gaming platform. And yes, if AAI2 does get ported to 3DS, it would most likely be an eShop release.

[yurinka]

I already have an iPhone 4 with 32GB storage. But I found that the first AA on iOS was a lame port. The game was blurry, the controls weren't intuitive, and it had a bad framerate (yes). Having the serie in both iOS and NDS/3DS is not a problem, it's cool. But if the serie goes iOS only, it would be pretty bad I think, because it deserves a better fate.

I think they have the problem that the DS is pretty much dead, but seeing them porting it to iOS I think they want to find some western / worldwide portable market were would be profitable to move the series without having to spend a lot of money (that would be the case of XBLA/PS3/PC versions, maybe it would be too expensive to remake them and maybe wouldn't be appealing to these markets).

I think they'll continue the series in iOS, 3DS and Android (which means that is also likely to get a PS Suite version which would mean Vita / PS3 versions too) with AA5.
They stated they want to localize AAI2, so I thingk they'll do it inside a AAI HD collection that would include both AAI1 too that would be released after AA Trilogy HD collection in the platforms of this list that already doesn't have it.

It's Capcom, they like to port.

[squall23]

I'll let the DS die..... once Inazuma Eleven 3 comes out in English.

[M3d10n]

AFAIK Capcom's mobile output is completely unrelated to their digital console/PC output. It's a different branch that does it's own thing and gets occasional support from the main branch if they decide to port something.

I find it very unlikely AAI2 will suddenly be announced for localization on iOS before the first game is even ported for iOS in Japan first.