[Alligatorjandro]

I thought this was going to be a thread about Florida.

Florida is a nice state

[SouthernDragon]

The fact that we have a country that is so close to our shores and is yet a failed state depresses me. We shouldn't allow that. :(

[Kinitari]

My Irish bartenter was telling me the other night about how many new Irish there are coming Toronto, due to the job situation being (I guess) rather dire in Ireland at the moment, and the ease of moving between the two countries. Nothing wrong with that though, we get along just fine, due to the East Coast being almost identical in culture.

Last winter I was waiting in line for a club/bar (can't remember what it was categorized as, just that it was fucking cold) and there were a group of irish girls who just moved to the city (Toronto) - talking about how they were really digging the atmosphere and really enjoyed how 'laid back' everything was compared to Ireland. I don't really know what that means, but I know that they were wearing far too little in the -25c weather - is Ireland situated in the north pole or something?!

Edit: also, their accents were fun.

[HamPster PamPster]

Could Northern Europe fit me in somewhere? I'm really cool, I post on GAF and stuff

[nubbe]

Could Northern Europe fit me in somewhere? I'm really cool, I post on GAF and stuff

Only if you are prepared to abandon the Hebrew god

[angelkimne]

Damn, why does the UK always rank so disappointingly low on these lists?

I blame The North.

[Draxal]

Damn, why does the UK always rank so disappointingly low on these lists? I blame The North.

What kinda caught my eye, is how the majority of the countries were small ( not in landmass but population) rather homogenous countries in Europe, with Canada being the big outlier. Also, kinda shocked that Ireland was on that list with its fiscal issues right now.

England was 159, USA was 160, France was 161 and Germany was 164 (Inverse Order). That is also intriguing.

[nubbe]

All nations should be divided into states with a populus of no more than 10 million.

[KillerMan91]

What kinda caught my eye, is how the majority of the countries were small ( not in landmass but population) rather homogenous countries in Europe, with Canada being the big outlier. Also, kinda shocked that Ireland was on that list with its fiscal issues right now. England was 159, USA was 160, France was 161 and Germany was 164. That's also intriguing.

Besides Finland (and even here the amount of immigrants is growing every year) Nordic countries are not that homogenous anymore. In Sweden and Norway immigrans make up 15% of the population and the share is growing every year.

[patapuf]

What kinda caught my eye, is how the majority of the countries were small ( not in landmass but population) rather homogenous countries in Europe, with Canada being the big outlier. Also, kinda shocked that Ireland was on that list with its fiscal issues right now. England was 159, USA was 160, France was 161 and Germany was 164 (Inverse Order). That is also intriguing.

switzerland is not homegnous at all, luxembourg has like 40% of foreigners and apart from finnland (and maybe ireland?) all the other european countries have a significant foreign population.

They are only more homogenous in the economic sense -- which is a major reason why they rank so high in the first place

[Acheron]

What kinda caught my eye, is how the majority of the countries were small ( not in landmass but population) rather homogenous countries in Europe, with Canada being the big outlier. Also, kinda shocked that Ireland was on that list with its fiscal issues right now. England was 159, USA was 160, France was 161 and Germany was 164 (Inverse Order). That is also intriguing.

In some cases a relatively strong resource endowment or legal status can (if spread over a small enough amount of people) mean the stats are useless. Norway has a ridiculous amount of offshore oil and less people than Toronto's metropolitan area, hence they can bankroll a very generous state with relatively low taxes and unemployment.

Luxembourg and Singapore have exploited legal status either as a tax dodge or as the most stable capitalist place in East Asia for decades. In a state like Canada or the US that are relatively large many of these effects are spread so thinly that the impact isn't too significant. Hence why some stats only look at states with 10mm people and up.

[Draxal]

switzerland is not homegnous at all, luxembourg has like 40% of foreigners and apart from finnland (and maybe ireland?) all the other european countries have a significant foreign population. They are only more homogenous in the economic sense -- which is a major reason why they rank so high in the first place

The Nordic trio is rather homogenous, (rather is the key modifier here, no nations are purely homogenous at this point but compared to the other larger states, they are more homogenous). But in all honesty the important part is the population, the Nordic Trio has a total population lower than California itself.

[Enkidu]

Norway has a ridiculous amount of offshore oil and less people than Toronto's metropolitan area, hence they can bankroll a very generous state with relatively low taxes and unemployment.

You make Norway sound like some small middle-eastern country completely dependent on its oil, which is really unfair. Norway has, like the rest of Scandinavia, relatively high taxes. And while the oil money is used to some extent, the vast majority of it is invested in the Norwegian oil fund (essentially a large pension fund) and is not used to run the country on a day to day basis.

[Vagabundo]

There is a decent amount of - EU and non EU - immigrants here in Ireland. Our standard of living is pretty good and it's a friendly place, mostly. I just wish the weather was a little better. Darkest, wettest, coldest summer on record this year.

[yn-neko hates a cat]

Personally, I don't see how an island infested by sharks that swim the street (while shitting deadly jelly fish) being ridden by STD carrying kolas whipping people with venous snakes who spit sting rays into people’s hearts can be seen as a stable "nation". It's barely hanging on to reality!

Not sure how the other nine nations are top either when they're countries can be done in by a well-placed ICBM or a poorly constructed sentence :(

Now America, that shinning jewel; there's a country that knows how to hold shit together <3

[Salvadora]

My Irish bartenter was telling me the other night about how many new Irish there are coming Toronto, due to the job situation being (I guess) rather dire in Ireland at the moment, and the ease of moving between the two countries. Nothing wrong with that though, we get along just fine, due to the East Coast being almost identical in culture.

I'm not surprised to hear that to be honest, Some parts of Ireland are terrible for employment at the moment.

[harSon]

Uh... no. The report is called "failed states", this is the top 10: 1 Somalia 2 Congo (D. R.) 3 Sudan & South Sudan 4 Chad 5 Zimbabwe 6 Afghanistan 7 Haiti 8 Yemen 9 Iraq 10 Central African Republic Your list is the "bottom 10".

If I had to live in any of those places, It'd definitely be Zimbabwe. I've actually been to Harare and it was surprisingly quite nice.

[bomma_man]

What kinda caught my eye, is how the majority of the countries were small ( not in landmass but population) rather homogenous countries in Europe, with Canada being the big outlier. Also, kinda shocked that Ireland was on that list with its fiscal issues right now. England was 159, USA was 160, France was 161 and Germany was 164 (Inverse Order). That is also intriguing.

Neither Canada, new Zealand or Australia are particularly homogenous.

Interesting Germany is so low though. Those other countries have poor social mobility as a common factor but I thought Germany was fine.

If I had to live in any of those places, It'd definitely be Zimbabwe. I've actually been to Harare and it was surprisingly quite nice.

Plus the novelty of being a multi trillionaire

[ElectricBlue187]

If I had to live in any of those places, It'd definitely be Zimbabwe. I've actually been to Harare and it was surprisingly quite nice.

if you have american dollars and can buy things I bet its swell

[harSon]

if you have american dollars and can buy things I bet its swell

The economy has actually improved considerably since its hyperinflation from a few years back... Plus, as I said, Harare is surprisingly nice despite the country's issues: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=88987021

[Draxal]

Neither Canada, new Zealand or Australia are particularly homogenous. Interesting Germany is so low though. Those other countries have poor social mobility as a common factor but I thought Germany was fine.

I did list Canada as an outlier for both reasons. New Zealand's demographics are actually pretty homogenous more then I thought (Maori's do throw it off but there's not many of them, so it's not as bad as say California). Austraila is also an outlier (population wise as well). Germany's hurt by it's size (population) as is France/England.

[zero_suit]

I'm not surprised that we (US) didn't make the top 10 least failed list.

[Tacitus_]

Wot, we made it #1? Suck it Sweden!

It's just the premature ejaculation that lib gaf is accustomed to.

Come on now. Our centre-right parties would be labeled as hardcore communists in the US.

[Acheron]

You make Norway sound like some small middle-eastern country completely dependent on its oil, which is really unfair. Norway has, like the rest of Scandinavia, relatively high taxes. And while the oil money is used to some extent, the vast majority of it is invested in the Norwegian oil fund (essentially a large pension fund) and is not used to run the country on a day to day basis.

Correct but avoiding the fact that Norway has a gigantic revenue stream in the form of oil royalties ignores a major fact. Just like territorial GDP per capita figures for Alberta or Qatar are inflated by resource extraction so too is Norway's. It doesn't indicate a massive wellspring of economic dynamism but a pleasant and extremely useful stroke of luck. I think if the US could safely assume its social security system would be solvent for eternity (or atleast the far future) it would give a lot more wiggle room for more extensive government spending, would it not?

For example a listing of GDP per capita (PPP) sees the US in 7th place, but it's only beaten by small oilstates, Luxembourg and Singapore (as well as Hong Kong and Macau). GDP per capita is typically used as a comparison of economic strength, but ignoring underlying distortions isn't helpful.

[kinoki]

Wot, we made it #1? Suck it Sweden! Come on now. Our centre-right parties would be labeled as hardcore communists in the US.

The Jante-law dictates we can't be in first place. But we know we're better if it actually mattered. ;)

[maniac-kun]

Would be great if the OP would learn to read.

[Jason's Ultimatum]

Uh... no. The report is called "failed states", this is the top 10: 1 Somalia 2 Congo (D. R.) 3 Sudan & South Sudan 4 Chad 5 Zimbabwe 6 Afghanistan 7 Haiti 8 Yemen 9 Iraq 10 Central African Republic Your list is the "bottom 10".

I was just gonna say. I had no idea what I was reading in the OP and the first few posts.

Thanks for the clarification.

[Uncle]

Wot, we made it #1?

Finland was the least failed state last year as well.

[Wafflecakes]

Australia is irrelevant?

To be blunt....in the greater scheme of things.....yeah it kinda is.

Countries with small populations but vast natural resources are heavily favored in this list (though their are some impressive exceptions...Ireland maybe?). When you have so much natural wealth divided among so few people you are bound to get ahead.

Just sayin.

[Kurtofan]

.

[Salvadora]

To be blunt....in the greater scheme of things.....yeah it kinda is. Countries with small populations but vast natural resources are heavily favored in this list (though their are some impressive exceptions...Ireland maybe?). When you have so much natural wealth divided among so few people you are bound to get ahead. Just sayin.

Look at the list & my post.

[Wafflecakes]

Look at the list & my post.

I assume you mean one of these two posts.

Australia is irrelevant?

I'm not surprised to hear that to be honest, Some parts of Ireland are terrible for employment at the moment.

I don't see how either contradicts or has anything to do with the idea that Australia isn't really relevant in the grand scheme of things and that smaller countries with great natural resources have huge advantages.

[Tacitus_]

To be blunt....in the greater scheme of things.....yeah it kinda is. Countries with small populations but vast natural resources are heavily favored in this list (though their are some impressive exceptions...Ireland maybe?). When you have so much natural wealth divided among so few people you are bound to get ahead. Just sayin.

Finland doesn't exactly have much natural resources - we have loads of trees but that's about it. Nor does Denmark. Sweden has (had?) some good mines but I'm not sure if you could call them resource rich. Norway is really the only Nordic country that's rich in resources.

[Presco]

Planning on moving from Toronto to Sweden next year and my wife is Finnish. Brag post.

[Salvadora]

I assume you mean one of these two posts. I don't see how either contradicts or has anything to do with the idea that Australia isn't really relevant in the grand scheme of things and that smaller countries with great natural resources have huge advantages.

Of course Australia is irrelevant, It was referring to Austria/Australia.

[kswiston]

Am I the only one who noticed that #10 is Austria and not Australia? Australia is #13 (going in reverse order like the list in the OP).

EDIT: I guess Savadora and a few others noticed too.

[Enkidu]

Correct but avoiding the fact that Norway has a gigantic revenue stream in the form of oil royalties ignores a major fact. Just like territorial GDP per capita figures for Alberta or Qatar are inflated by resource extraction so too is Norway's. It doesn't indicate a massive wellspring of economic dynamism but a pleasant and extremely useful stroke of luck. I think if the US could safely assume its social security system would be solvent for eternity (or atleast the far future) it would give a lot more wiggle room for more extensive government spending, would it not? For example a listing of GDP per capita (PPP) sees the US in 7th place, but it's only beaten by small oilstates, Luxembourg and Singapore (as well as Hong Kong and Macau). GDP per capita is typically used as a comparison of economic strength, but ignoring underlying distortions isn't helpful.

Of course the oil is important, it's the reason Norway's GDP per capita is so high and a good reason why they were barely affected by the financial crisis. I just wanted to point out that Norway is one of the few oil states that uses its money responsibly. And when you consider that all the other Scandinavian countries ranked very high without any oil to help them it seems weird to say that Norway only ranked high because of its oil.

[godelsmetric]

Uh... no. The report is called "failed states", this is the top 10: 1 Somalia 2 Congo (D. R.) 3 Sudan & South Sudan 4 Chad 5 Zimbabwe 6 Afghanistan 7 Haiti 8 Yemen 9 Iraq 10 Central African Republic Your list is the "bottom 10".

Job well done guys, high five.

[Forkball]

In other news, Zimbabwe has just accepted "Better than Afghanistan" as their national motto.

[Fari]

Shame that they don't have statistics for Iraq prior to 2003.

[SnakeswithLasers]

Job well done guys, high five.

Afghanistan would have been on the list anyway. Iraq probably wouldn't have though.

[Hoo-doo]

I wish I could permanently move to northern Europe. Glorious countries.

Huge language barrier though. I'll stick with 11th place for now.

[Kopyii]

Job well done guys, high five.

[Baron Doggystyle von Woof]

But those countries are socialist!

[godelsmetric]

Afghanistan would have been on the list anyway.

Very possibly, but that's hardly an excuse.

[SnakeswithLasers]

Very possibly, but that's hardly an excuse.

I'm not making an excuse, just an observation. The invasion of Afghanistan was not only seen as a war of defense (not aggression), but there was also broad international support, so no real 'excuse' is necessary.

Iraq likely wouldn't have been on the list if not for the US invasion, and, if not for the US invasion of Iraq, Afghanistan would probably also be in a very different position. Iraq is the real fuck-up here by the US. Afghanistan is a casualty of that mistake.

[GCX]

To be blunt....in the greater scheme of things.....yeah it kinda is. Countries with small populations but vast natural resources are heavily favored in this list (though their are some impressive exceptions...Ireland maybe?). When you have so much natural wealth divided among so few people you are bound to get ahead. Just sayin.

Some of the countries on that list don't really have much natural resources. I mean Norway has oil but for example Finland has trees and that's about it. That used to be the backbone of Finnish economy but since the paper industry is shrinking rapidly it has lost much of its importance. There's a lot of minerals in the ground but that market hasn't really been tapped yet.

[GManDH]

Brazil is a lot more stable than they claim it is. Just because it has gangs and mafia doesnt mean the government is going to fail and be taken over.

[lastplayed]

New Zealand: Civil War free since 1872!

[ThoseDeafMutes]

New Zealand: Civil War free since 1872!

They can't have a Civil War because then they'd be even worse than Australia than they already are.