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Odrion
The reasons were sound.
(01-23-2013, 07:03 PM)
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Not too afraid, it's above expectations and every console manufacturer will be using them for the next eight or so years.
patapuf
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:03 PM)
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I don't think the reason they are loosing money are graphic cards. Isn't it mostly because their CPU's don't sell ?
1-D_FTW
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:04 PM)
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Nvidia isn't positioned much better than Intel when it comes to operating without competition. The reality is this: If you want to keep what remains of the mass market, pricing is your competition. If you go too high, you'll simply destroy what remains of the market.
MikeE21286
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:04 PM)
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So weird how they're in the next gen consoles...
lantus
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:07 PM)
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Same reason other companies that put out great products have hard times, public perception of the brand goes a long way. When they are seen as the inferior route to go with compared to nvidia and Intel that's just how the cookie crumbles.
Horse Armour
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:08 PM)

Originally Posted by lantus

Same reason other companies that put out great products have hard times, public perception of the brand goes a long way. When they are seen as the inferior route to go with compared to nvidia and Intel that's just how the cookie crumbles.

They are the inferior route to Intel and nvidia though, especially on the CPU side where there's very little reason to consider an AMD CPU over an Intel one.
Spongebob
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by Horse Armour

They are the inferior route to Intel and nvidia though, especially on the CPU side where there's very little reason to consider an AMD CPU over an Intel one.

Can't help, but disagree.
hwalker84
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by BrokenEchelon

They tried to be both Nvidia and Intel, and failed at being better than either of them.

Nvidia makes better GPUs overall.
Intel makes better CPUs overall.

They fell behind in key areas at important tech shifts (like mobile).

I don't want AMD to die. Both Intel and Nvidia need some form of competitor to prevent them from getting lazier than they are already getting.

Essentially this.
SolsticeZero
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by Horse Armour

They are the inferior route to Intel and nvidia though, especially on the CPU side where there's very little reason to consider an AMD CPU over an Intel one.

I wouldn't call their graphics division an "inferior route". The 7000 series has been performing damn well. Their CPUs though? Yeah, they're simply inferior.
Totobeni
An blind dancing ho
(01-23-2013, 07:11 PM)
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AMD is only good for keeping nvidia prices low,other than that they are pointless.
Seance
Banned
(01-23-2013, 07:19 PM)

Originally Posted by Rad-

They probably got a killer deal out of AMD.

They killed AMD? Fuck you MS/Sony!
Mario007
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:20 PM)
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What chip designs does AMD do for mobile? Aren't they the ones that Apple, Samsung and Qualcomm go to for their chip designs?
derFeef
lil' bit tasty
(01-23-2013, 07:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Totobeni

AMD is only good for keeping nvidia prices low,other than that they are pointless.

Speak for yourself, I will never stick a nvidia card into my PC as long as AMD is around and they are competitive.
Horse Armour
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:25 PM)

Originally Posted by Mario007

What chip designs does AMD do for mobile? Aren't they the ones that Apple, Samsung and Qualcomm go to for their chip designs?

Qualcomm make their own graphics, Samsung uses ARM designed graphics and Apple is currently using nvidia in their macs and PowerVR in their iOS devices.
antitrop
does not much care for
anti-shooter bias
(01-23-2013, 07:25 PM)
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Originally Posted by derFeef

Speak for yourself, I will never stick a nvidia card into my PC as long as MD is around and they are competitive.

Everyone always has their reasons, but for me I've never been able to switch out of Nvidia after experiencing AMD's horrible drivers. The last time I owned an AMD(/ATI) card was in 2005 and it was a nightmare.
Last edited by antitrop; 01-23-2013 at 07:31 PM.
SolsticeZero
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 07:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by antitrop

Everyone always has their reasons, but for me I've never been able to switch out of Nvidia after experiencing AMD's horrible drivers. The last time I owned an AMD card was in 2005 and it was a nightmare.

I feel your pain, but believe me when I say Catalyst has gotten so much better since then.
exmachina64
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mario007

What chip designs does AMD do for mobile? Aren't they the ones that Apple, Samsung and Qualcomm go to for their chip designs?

No, that's ARM.
derFeef
lil' bit tasty
(01-23-2013, 07:26 PM)
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Originally Posted by antitrop

Everyone always has their reasons, but for me I've never been able to switch out of Nvidia after experiencing AMD's horrible drivers. The last time I owned an AMD card was in 2005 and it was a nightmare.

For sure, I am not going to convince anyone. Bad experience is bad experience.
But that's also 8 years ago :)
Seance
Banned
(01-23-2013, 07:28 PM)

Originally Posted by Sethos

Yep, definitely one of the reasons. All their shitty CF GPUs, terrible drivers and poor game support turned me to Nvidia.

Oh god yes :(. Built my first PC a few months ago and opted for HD 7850 CF over a GTX670. What a fool I was. So much stuttering, so many incompatible games and then programs like ENB don't utilise CF.
kitch9
Banned
(01-23-2013, 07:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by derFeef

For sure, I am not going to convince anyone. Bad experience is bad experience.
But that's also 8 years ago :)

Isn't 2005 around the time Nvidia was burning cards to death by forgetting to tell the drivers to turn the fan on?

It was around then they used the wrong glue on a few million chips and they slowly burned themselves to death also....
ghst
thanks for the laugh
(01-23-2013, 07:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Seance

Oh god yes :(. Built my first PC a few months ago and opted for HD 7850 CF over a GTX670. What a fool I was. So much stuttering, so many incompatible games and then programs like ENB don't utilise CF.

CF on AMD cards is like taking two wild dogs and tying them together with a spiked lead.
Felix Lighter
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:31 PM)
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My last 2 cards were an HD5850 and an HD7970, I've been happy with both for the most part but I have had a few issues (mainly HDMI audio issues). I'm not sure if I'd have had fewer issues if I went Nvidia but I do know I would probably have more tweaking options, especially when it comes to AA. That being said, I think they're still making some compelling graphics cards that I wouldn't be afraid to recommend to someone building a machine given their budget. I haven't run into the nightmare scenarios some others apparently have.
Last edited by Felix Lighter; 01-23-2013 at 07:34 PM.
kitch9
Banned
(01-23-2013, 07:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by Seance

Oh god yes :(. Built my first PC a few months ago and opted for HD 7850 CF over a GTX670. What a fool I was. So much stuttering, so many incompatible games and then programs like ENB don't utilise CF.

Sli has similar problems.

Also never pick two slower cards over one quicker one of any type, its an exercise in frustration.

Originally Posted by ghst

CF on AMD cards is like taking two wild dogs and tying them together with a spiked lead.

Can I get some more hyperbole with thems eggs?

Dual GPU's have issues full stop.
derFeef
lil' bit tasty
(01-23-2013, 07:31 PM)
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Originally Posted by ghst

CF on AMD cards is like taking two wild dogs and tying them together with a spiked lead.

I love it, if I am able unleash them it's glorious.
antitrop
does not much care for
anti-shooter bias
(01-23-2013, 07:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by Solstice

I feel your pain, but believe me when I say Catalyst has gotten so much better since then.

I believe you 100%, but they lost me young. I just have no reason to go back anymore. I gave them a chance and I found more happiness with the competitor.
SolsticeZero
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 07:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by antitrop

I believe you 100%, but they lost me young. I just have no reason to go back anymore. I gave them a chance and I found more happiness with the competitor.

No doubt. Believe me, I'm in no way trying to convince you. I was merely stating an opinion. No need for bickering among the PC master race.
SolarPowered
Member
(01-23-2013, 07:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by Seance

Oh god yes :(. Built my first PC a few months ago and opted for HD 7850 CF over a GTX670. What a fool I was. So much stuttering, so many incompatible games and then programs like ENB don't utilise CF.

Aren't stuttering and compatibility issues common problems for both SLI and Crossfire configurations? I've heard nothing, but good things about the 7800-7900 series of cards. This is part of why I just plan on upgrading from my 670 to another single card instead of doubling up when the time comes.
SolsticeZero
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 07:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by SolarPowered

Aren't stuttering and compatibility issues common problems for both SLI and Crossfire configurations? I've heard nothing, but good things about the 7800-7900 series of cards. This is part of why I just plan on upgrading from my 670 to another single card instead of doubling up when the time comes.

They are. A lot of people assume it's only crossfire that does it for some reason.
Tenki
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:08 PM)
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Maybe this is a noob question, but imagine that AMD goes out of business, but the chips for the consoles are already designed. What would MS/Sony/Nintendo do? Give the designs to another company that would make the chips?
iNvid02
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:11 PM)
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everyone should be worried, you really dont want a market where intel and nvidia have 0 competition
SolsticeZero
Junior Member
(01-23-2013, 08:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by Tenki

Maybe this is a noob question, but imagine that AMD goes out of business, but the chips for the consoles are already designed. What would MS/Sony/Nintendo do? Give the designs to another company that would make the chips?

Another company will already make the chips. AMD is just working with them on the actual design.

Originally Posted by iNvid02

everyone should be worried, you really dont want a market where intel and nvidia have 0 competition

This man knows what's up.
alcide
Banned
(01-23-2013, 08:14 PM)

Originally Posted by iNvid02

everyone should be worried, you really dont want a market where intel and nvidia have 0 competition

Hmmm.

Intel's starting to push into the GPU market with Intel® HD Graphics Enriches

Nvidia's starting to push into the CPU market with both their ARM processors and CUDA etc


Correct me if I'm wrong but they're both starting to encroach into each others market.
Conflict NZ
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by shinobi602

Can someone explain to me how AMD is in the shitter so bad but continuously makes killer video cards, mobile hardware, and is the company of choice for PS4/720?

At the moment NVidia makes better, cheaper Graphics Cards. Intel makes better CPUs.
iavi
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by Conflict NZ

At the moment NVidia makes better, cheaper Graphics Cards. Intel makes better CPUs.

Nvidia sure as hell isn't cheaper. Total opposite. Better performing is debatable.


Intel has destroyed AMD in the processor space. There's no debate there.
JaseC
gave away the keys to the kingdom.
(01-23-2013, 08:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by patapuf

I don't think the reason they are loosing money are graphic cards. Isn't it mostly because their CPU's don't sell ?

Pretty much. AMD, despite its best efforts, has never been able to bounce back from the lead Intel gained with Conroe/Core 2 Duo in 2006. AMD's processors are generally better for budget builds, but the enthusiast desktop and high-performance server markets are where the money is and Intel has had them tightly wrapped for the better part of a decade.
Last edited by JaseC; 01-23-2013 at 08:33 PM.
1-D_FTW
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Solstice



This man knows what's up.

It sucks, but this situation is occurring because the market isn't a thriving place. Whether they have competition or not, unless that keep it price competitive, the mass market will disappear and it won't matter how much the fringe lunatic are willing to spend on chips. That's what will keep pricing competitive. Or else they'll join AMD in the grave.
SteveWinwood
Sowing his wild patented oats
(01-23-2013, 08:27 PM)
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Maybe they shouldn't have made shitty cards and terrible drivers.

I type this on my computer with an AMD in it.
grimshawish
Banned
(01-23-2013, 08:29 PM)
Basically all the computing companies should specialise instead of aiming so wide.
Conflict NZ
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by Miizy F Baby

Nvidia sure as hell isn't cheaper. Total opposite. Better performing is debatable.


Intel has destroyed AMD in the processor space. There's no debate there.

The GTX 670 performs on par with the HD7970, better in some games, worse in others but they are roughly equivalent. In my country the 670 is $200 cheaper than the 7970.
oversitting
Banned
(01-23-2013, 08:34 PM)
AMD is losing money because they have to pay Globafoundery for Globalfoundery's mistakes.
antitrop
does not much care for
anti-shooter bias
(01-23-2013, 08:34 PM)
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Going from an AMD Phenom II X6 1100T BE to an Intel i7-2600k was one of the best hardware upgrades I've ever made, in terms of performance. Specifically on CPU intensive games like The Witcher 2 and StarCraft II, as well as programs like XSplit.

No matter how hard I overclocked that 1100T, I just couldn't get any sort of respectable FPS in many, many games, despite having a top of the line GPU.

This was right before the Bulldozer chips came out, but I made the right choice. Every time I've ever had a piece of AMD hardware in my computer, I've just been itching to switch it out with a superior product.
derFeef
lil' bit tasty
(01-23-2013, 08:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Conflict NZ

The GTX 670 performs on par with the HD7970, better in some games, worse in others but they are roughly equivalent. In my country the 670 is $200 cheaper than the 7970.

670 is not on the same level as the 7970, you mean the 680.
Blinck
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:37 PM)
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Sucks for them. On the other hand, I promised myself to never buy another AMD GPU ever again. I've been switching between AMD and Nvidia for many years, but now I will go Nvidia all the way.
Everytime I buy an ATI card I have hopes that they are now stable, but that is never the case. The last one I bought ( and still own) was an Ati 5850, and I've never had so many problems with a graphic card before, to the point where I have actually wasted a good amount of money in games that simply don't work with it. Never again..never again.
Tenki
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by Solstice

Another company will already make the chips. AMD is just working with them on the actual design.

Oh, I see. Thanks!
Cynar
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:47 PM)
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My next notebook will be AMD, cannot allow this to happen. I'll recommend it to all my friends as well. The future could be a scary place.
Hadoken
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by SolarPowered

Aren't stuttering and compatibility issues common problems for both SLI and Crossfire configurations? I've heard nothing, but good things about the 7800-7900 series of cards. This is part of why I just plan on upgrading from my 670 to another single card instead of doubling up when the time comes.

The stuttering is less noticeable on a Nvidia card.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...x2,3329-8.html

You can reduce the stuttering on a AMD card if you d/l the RadeonPro software and play around with it, but Nvidia seem to do it better on a hardware level with minimal fuss. There's a video I saw of BF3 showing the stuttering between Nvidia and AMD and the AMD was really bad. I'm at work so I can't link the video but try doing a search and see.
Sethos
Banned
(01-23-2013, 08:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by SolarPowered

Aren't stuttering and compatibility issues common problems for both SLI and Crossfire configurations? I've heard nothing, but good things about the 7800-7900 series of cards. This is part of why I just plan on upgrading from my 670 to another single card instead of doubling up when the time comes.

No. Crossfire is very susceptible to microstuttering and I've experienced it first hand back in the olden days of the 4870X2 and the 5970 - It was horrible. Running an SLI setup right now and I have not seen a single shred of stuttering, everything is smooth as butter. Which mainly is because Nvidia cares and they employ technology to reduce stuttering.

I think all people who use an SLI setup from the last few years can attest to that.
Last edited by Sethos; 01-23-2013 at 08:59 PM.
MrCunningham
Member
(01-23-2013, 08:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by ghst

bring back ATI.

That's the biggest casualty right there, if AMD ever goes under. I would hate to see ATi go down in flames with them. It's a shame that AMD can't find a foothold in the CPU market, they haven;t really had a successfully competing CPU since the Athlon/ Athlon 64 days. I know it has always been an uphill battle for AMD in this market, but they really can't find their target audience here.
derFeef
lil' bit tasty
(01-23-2013, 08:59 PM)
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Jumped on Crossfire again in december after I swore I will never get any crossfire setup again because that 5970 was not the best. But those two 7970ghz editions serve me will, smooth as butter.
Proxy
Member
(01-23-2013, 09:00 PM)
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Intel is just a really scummy company. When AMD was on top Intel made sure OEMs weren't purchasing their hardware. It's hard to compete with your competitors when you can't afford it because your competitors are royally screwing you over every chance they can get.

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