[Amir0x]

I did say wow this time, christ.

More fingers crossed for back-against-wall Nintendo to be as badass as they were during GCN gen.

[MrNyarlathotep]

You say that as though you believe Nintendo planned on NSMB and Nintendoland receiving underwhelming sales. NSMB Wii sold 27 millions copies. They clearly thought they were launching with a big hit right out the gate...

Neither of them are a Zelda or a 'real' Mario though, are they?
They might well both go on to be million sellers, but they're still not Nintendo 'big guns'.

[Steve Youngblood]

Neither of them are a Zelda or a 'real' Mario though, are they? They might well both go on to be million sellers, but they're still not Nintendo 'big guns'.

I think it's much more likely that they simply didn't have the big guns ready as opposed to some situation where they could have launched with a killer app, but decided that they wanted it to be the third parties' time to shine.

[outunderthestars]

Neither of them are a Zelda or a 'real' Mario though, are they? They might well both go on to be million sellers, but they're still not Nintendo 'big guns'.

New Super mario Bros Wii sold more than the four Zelda and 3D mario wii games did combined.

How is that not their "big gun"?

[javac]

NSMB Wii sold 27 millions copies

In a period spanning years, on a console with a colossal user base, with it being the first 2D Mario game on a home system since 1990. Hmmm

[MrNyarlathotep]

You don't think they have finished titles ready that they are holding back for strategic deployment against PS4 / Xbox720 release dates that they could have instead released at launch for a console announced 2 years ago?

New Super mario Bros Wii sold more than the four Zelda and 3D mario wii games did combined. How is that not their "big gun"?

The Wii is self evidently not the WiiU, and the people buying it at launch are not the same people who had the Wii being scalped on eBay for its first year of release.
Zelda is a big gun to the people buying the WiiU right now. NSMB is not.

[Sandfox]

I honestly don't expect much from Europe when it comes to Nintendo due to past history. NoE just needs to find a way to make it more appealing later in the year. The Vita sales may be low but Sony at least included it in a bundle with AC and CoD at its retail price to make it slightly more attractive.

[outunderthestars]

You don't think they have finished titles ready that they are holding back for strategic deployment against PS4 / Xbox720 release dates that they could have instead released at launch for a console announced 2 years ago?

No, no I don't. The fact that this thread exists should be proof enough that Nintendo simply doesn't have anything ready. Why else would they have a Nintendo direct that basically said "Seriously guys, trust us! games are coming at some point!" if they could have actually just shown the games?

[MrNyarlathotep]

They did show games :s

EDIT:
I played Pikmin 3 at the Eurogamer Expo last September. It's not being held back because its not finished.

[Steve Youngblood]

You don't think they have finished titles ready that they are holding back for strategic deployment against PS4 / Xbox720 release dates that they could have instead released at launch for a console announced 2 years ago?

Finished? No. I don't think they had stuff ready to go three months ago that they just refuse to show off, particularly given the dire situation they're in right now. If any heavy hitters were ready to go, I'd have at least thought that we'd see some glimpse of it at the last Nintendo Direct with at least one of them moved up sooner to alleviate concerns at the lack of software coming in the short term.

And just to make sure that we're on the same page, what I'm referring to would be system sellers along the lines of Mario 3D, Mario Kart, Smash, etc. I find the notion that any of those types of games are finished right now and were ready to go at launch to be absurd. The only title I'd maybe believe was ready would be this mysterious Retro title, and that's simply because it's a complete X-Factor. But the others? My assumption is that they're working feverishly as we type to make sure one or more is ready this year. But I highly doubt they're already done.

[Graphics Horse]

Zelda is a big gun to the people buying the WiiU right now. NSMB is not.

NSMB is selling better than Nintendoland, that's pretty big.

[ramparter]

They should bundle it with more titles if they want to keep the same price. This will give them some time and by summer they'll have to release a 250$ sku.

edit
I know many people that bought Wii when Super Mario Galaxy was released, I don't care if NSMBW has sold much more, I still consider a 3D Mario game bigger system seller than another new super mario bros.

[depths20XX]

People still think the Wii U is just a controller with a screen on it.

[MormaPope]

You don't think they have finished titles ready that they are holding back for strategic deployment against PS4 / Xbox720 release dates that they could have instead released at launch for a console announced 2 years ago? The Wii is self evidently not the WiiU, and the people buying it at launch are not the same people who had the Wii being scalped on eBay for its first year of release. Zelda is a big gun to the people buying the WiiU right now. NSMB is not.

They needed to release those now, not when GTA V and everything else comes out.

[MrNyarlathotep]

And just to make sure that we're on the same page, what I'm referring to would be system sellers along the lines of Mario 3D, Mario Kart, Smash, etc. I find the notion that any of those types of games are finished right now and were ready to go at launch to be absurd. The only title I'd maybe believe was ready would be this mysterious Retro title, and that's simply because it's a complete X-Factor. But the others? My assumption is that they're working feverishly as we type to make sure one or more is ready this year. But I highly doubt they're already done.

I'd be surprised if Mario Kart isn't ready to go, and could have been a launch title (although that would then have the 'rushed' feeling that NSMBU does of launching so close to its handheld cousin) but I agree a new 3D Mario and Smash aren't close to ready.

I'd be surprised if a new Smash is even shown in video form this year tbh.

EDIT

They needed to release those now, not when GTA V and everything else comes out.

I half expect GTAV to fuck up launch sales of the next xbox / playstation if they are in that window

[SykoTech]

Beyond abysmal sales. At first I was like "it's just UK, surely it's doing very well in Japan or something right?" Then I looked in the Media Create thread...yikes.

Can't say I feel any sympathy at all for me, but ouch.

More fingers crossed for back-against-wall Nintendo to be as badass as they were during GCN gen.

Ooh, same here. Would love that.

[Sandfox]

They needed to release those now, not when GTA V and everything else comes out.

They're probably going to have games coming out every month after February.

[Steve Youngblood]

I'd be surprised if Mario Kart isn't ready to go, and could have been a launch title (although that would then have the 'rushed' feeling that NSMBU does of launching so close to its handheld cousin) but I agree a new 3D Mario and Smash aren't close to ready.

Mario Kart is the title I most expect to be ready for holiday 2013, but I'm pretty skeptical that it's already in the can. Mario Kart 7 was completed a mere 14 months ago, and it took Retro's help to get it done. I doubt they were working on the Wii U version simultaneously, or they completed that one in a year.

[Mario]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled.

Platform is in serious trouble.

[MormaPope]

I half expect GTAV to fuck up launch sales of the next xbox / playstation if they are in that window

Not if the Durango/Orbis launch games trump GTA V in a variety of different ways, I absolutely adore the GTA series but the limitations that are on GTA V due to these consoles will end up showing in one way or another.

They're probably going to have games coming out every month after February.

Nintendo better clarify or elaborate on the release schedule for Wii-U this year, Q1 seems like a nightmare for them.

[Wynnebeck]

In all seriousness though, what games could Nintendo release in UK to get it to sell?

[Sandfox]

Not if the Durango/Orbis launch games trump GTA V in a variety of different ways, I absolutely adore the GTA series but the limitations that are on GTA V due to these consoles will end up showing in one way or another.

GTA is probably the biggest release of the year so that's easier said than done.

[farnham]

In all seriousness though, what games could Nintendo release in UK to get it to sell?

Wii Fit, Mario Kart, Wii Party and Wii Sports (also to a lesser extent mario and sonic, zumba fitness and just dance)

[MormaPope]

GTA is probably the biggest release of the year so that's easier said than done.

After a good few months of GTA V mania people will fall back on other software. I probably won't be picking up next gen consoles for a good while, but the people that have the money to do so will probably dip in for both.

[BruceLeeRoy]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

Wow really? I guess that's to be expected

[Vire]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

Ouch...

Straight from the horses mouth.

[Sandfox]

Nintendo better clarify or elaborate on the release schedule for Wii-U this year, Q1 seems like a nightmare for them.

They seem to be doing it by the quarter so we'll probably get all of the Q2 games next month and then find out more dates at E3.

[H_Prestige]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

So, are people still going to spin the wii u launch as no different than any other launch?

[Steve Youngblood]

So, are people still going to spin the wii u launch as no different than any other launch?

It's better! Would you like some numbers devoid of meaningful context to back that claim up?

[Guymelef]

[Foffy]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

What country were these developers from? I can only manage Nintendo has been able to court indie teams and the Japanese to their platform.

Thinking the western developer community would embrace the Wii U, based on how they embraced the Wii, is pretty silly. That system will make it or break it based on if Japan brings anything to the table, just like the handheld market.

[Snaku]

I did say wow this time, christ. More fingers crossed for back-against-wall Nintendo to be as badass as they were during GCN gen.

Seriously. I was going to get a Wii U, but I'm not gonna be burned again like I was with the Vita.

[-Pyromaniac-]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

thanks for the tip on the inside. That's pretty interesting, but I guess expected.

[outunderthestars]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

Ouch. That is not good news. :(

I don't want a gaming landscape with only MS and Sony consoles.

[H_Prestige]

It's better! Would you like some numbers devoid of meaningful context to back that claim up?

You jest, but you know someone is seriously going to come in here with meaningless launch statistics and tell all of of us doomsdayers it's far too soon for a verdict.

Oh, and Mario Kart will save the Wii U. The last one sold 30 million after all. It's only natural for the series to sell that much from now on.

[Yawnier]

At DICE, nobody has been talking about the new Wii U projects they have started, only the Wii U projects that have just been cancelled. Platform is in serious trouble.

This doesn't sound too good, at all (in terms of 3rd party support, mostly).

[BruceLeeRoy]

So, are people still going to spin the wii u launch as no different than any other launch?

Is anyone even honestly doing that anymore?

[MrNyarlathotep]

it's far too soon for a verdict.

It is far too soon for a verdict though.

[H_Prestige]

Is anyone even honestly doing that anymore?

I saw it in this thread earlier today.

I wonder if sony fans were like that back when ps3 was getting its ass mangled.

It is far too soon for a verdict though.

Not really. It's not too soon to say it won't be another wii like phenomenon. And it's not too soon to say third parties will largely ignore it. Add those two facts together and see what the result is.

[Mario]

What country were these developers from?

Publishers and developers from the US, UK, France, Germany, and Australia mainly.

[Foffy]

Publishers and developers from the US, UK, France, Germany, and Australia mainly.

I figured. Nintendo's only going to really be able to get a hand with Japanese studios. This is why they're willing to bring over more Japanese IP on 3DS, and want to do more collaborations. Nintendo is banking on the Japanese game industry for their platforms.

Let's hope that works.

[beast786]

Publishers and developers from the US, UK, France, Germany, and Australia mainly.

Is the sentiment worse than early PS3 days?

[Mario]

Is the sentiment worse than early PS3 days?

Pubs and devs never recoiled from PS3 like they seem to be with Wii U (though this is anecdotal). There was always the confidence that the numbers would get there over time with PS3. I'm not sensing that with Wii U.

I had a data point yesterday at lunch with a high budget Wii U game that was hoping to sell "millions" over time. It only managed "tens of thousands".

[TheJollyCorner]

I saw it in this thread earlier today. I wonder if sony fans were like that back when ps3 was getting its ass mangled.

they were for the most part, but hope continued to exist.

The whole "games on the horizon" is a powerful ray of light that got PS3 supporters (I was one) through those rough times.


I can only tell the Nintendo faithful to try having a similar outlook.


Then again, Sony restructured and busted their ass to claw back into the fight. Nintendo really has to make some big moves/adjustments. Putting all of their faith in millions upon millions of consumers flocking to Wii U just because the Wii was a market phenomenon is the same kind of arrogance that got Sony into trouble when PS3 launched.
Again, the key to Sony surviving was their ability to make the right adjustments to survive. Nintendo has to do the same thing, because riding the Mario/Zelda/Smash wave alone might not be enough to keep their console afloat this time.

[liger05]

Pubs and devs never recoiled from PS3 like they seem to be with Wii U (though this is anecdotal). There was always the confidence that the numbers would get there over time with PS3. I'm not sensing that with Wii U. I had a data point yesterday at lunch with a high budget Wii U game that was hoping to sell "millions" over time. It only managed "tens of thousands".

COD?

[Mario]

COD?

I can't say, sorry.

[Echoenigma]

GodDAMN son, just what the fuck is going on in the UK? It's like the entire area has given up on video games.

[Steve Youngblood]

It is far too soon for a verdict though.

It's too early to bust out the Kenshrio "already dead" gifs. But in terms of assessing the launch, unless you're really married to the idea of only measuring the performance in terms of how the raw hardware numbers stack up against the PS3 and 360, I think it's becoming increasingly difficult to argue that current indicators suggest anything other than an abject failure at this point in terms of launch success. That doesn't mean that it can't have a good holiday 2013. That doesn't mean that Nintendo can't go to the 3DS playbook and improve the situation. But as is, the situation is pretty gloomy.

[Hoodbury]

COD?

I can't say, sorry.

CoD sold a couple hundred thousand I believe on Wii U. My guess is probably AC III. I understand you can't tell us though. Thanks for the insight.

Doom...

[javac]

It's too early to bust out the Kenshrio "already dead" gifs. But in terms of assessing the launch, unless you're really married to the idea of only measuring the performance in terms of how the raw hardware numbers stack up against the PS3 and 360, I think it's becoming increasingly difficult to argue that current indicators suggest anything other than an abject failure at this point. That doesn't mean that it can't have a good holiday 2013. That doesn't mean that Nintendo can't go to the 3DS playbook and improve the situation. But as is, the situation is pretty gloomy.

Agreed. Things can change, things just need to actually happen.