NeoGAF

Originally Posted by McDougles

The opening tutorial area for Kingdom Hearts is truly god awful. Holy shit, does it start a great game on the worst fucking foot.

I really like that place. The music's awesome too.

Originally Posted by dancingphlower

Let's just say that most tutorials are bad, Japanese or otherwise.

This right here.

Resonance of Fate did it in a good way imo. No forced tutorial, all optional. You could visit the training center to learn it all or just skip and yeah… probably die really fast.

The actual design annoys me more than verbose text boxes. I just started SMTIV a few hours ago. After being explained some mechanics, I get tossed into a dungeon with enemies rushing me down and taking me out in one shot. I mean, fuck. At least give me time to get acclimated before tossing me into a demonic pit.

The game is cool though.

Originally Posted by sn00zer

Persona for one...incredibly complex fuse system boiled down into "Fuse Personas to make new Personas!"...also I am still unsure as to how the sell materials system works......

I sort of agree with this. You can get by without knowing all the rules of inheritance and stuff, but it'd be nice to have it explained. There's also the fact that the rules of triangle fusion are never explained - that is, what personae result from different triangle fusions. There's some weird rule to do with the relative numbers of the arcanae being used that determines what arcana the resulting persona is. I never knew it till late in the game though, and I didn't even think about it even then. I just randomly triangle fused whatever persona seemed good at the time.

God, that system is so annoying though. Especially when trying to make Orpheus Telos for the Elizabeth fight in P3FES. Inheritance shouldn't be random; took me hours and hours to get the skills I needed. You should be able to select the skills that carry over; that would be a more strategic approach and it would trim the fat of the ridiculous amount of chance involved. It's the same as what you eventually get anyway, the only difference is that you wouldn't have to arbitrarily sit at the screen for hours on end alternating between pressing x and o like you've been lobotomized or something.

I really dislike forced tutorials in all forms, it becomes a huge annoyance when you replay a game. It's a shame developers have to accommodate for players who aren't willing to learn for themselves, read manuals or select an in game tutorial from a menu. It just seems like a mess to include tutorials in the actual game, unless it is contextualized in the game incredibly smartly.

Imagine if it was mandatory to view all of the tutorials in Final Fantasy Tactics.

Binary Domain's tutorial was OK IMO.

Originally Posted by Fimbulvetr

How does the OP feel about optional tutorials? By which I mean stuff like how Vanquish's tutorial can be accessed from the main menu, or how MGR's can can be accessed any time(even during the campaign) via VR Missions, but neither is forced on you during the main campaign.

I love VR mission tutorials...mostly because they work similar to fighting game tutorials, where they show you a video of how the action works, then you repeat that action. I still think though very important mechanics, such as blocking/dodging should be mandatory in the normal game, because most people will skip optional tutorials and then get frustrated they cant do something.

EDIT: My favorite tutorials are the training camp ones..... makes sense in th universe and presents you with most movement situations you will encounter

Originally Posted by Anteater

I just don't like the tutorials that pauses your game to tell you the obvious. I remember trying out GoW1 on ps+ and the tutorial would pause my game to tell me to press O when a O pops up on screen, but press x to cancel the box first.

You would be surprised how many people do not understand this... had a friend get stuck on the first boss in GOW because he didnt get the circle thing

Overall Id rather have no tutorials than ones that I have to fucking sit through which were obviously made for idiots.

Worst thing ever in games is unskippable tutorials as others have also mentioned.

Originally Posted by sn00zer

You would be surprised how many people do not understand this... had a friend get stuck on the first boss in GOW because he didnt get the circle thing

He understood that he needs to look at his pad and press the blue cross button when it appears, but he didn't understand that he needs to look at his pad and press red circle button when it appears?

Originally Posted by gryz

I'll take a japanese tutorial over the horror that is the Need for Speed Rivals tutorial any day

indeed. miss obvious telling me how to play the game. yawn.

Originally Posted by gryz

I'll take a japanese tutorial over the horror that is the Need for Speed Rivals tutorial any day

Not me.