For those who don't know, some states in the US offer consumers some protection from buying a defective product (cars, specifically) that can't be repaired within a specific amount of time after purchase. In the last year, some publishers such as EA have released bug-riddled games that can't launch (Sim City) or are so unstable that the game cannot be played as advertised (BF4). However, despite numerous reports online, retailers and publishers are often unwilling to refund money and most often just spin the story away from the problems with tweets of sales figures and accolades. With a gaming press as worthless as these broken games, consumers have no protection or advocates. Perhaps it's time to start discussing efforts to get lemon laws for video games. What are your thoughts?
Seriously though, getting any government to care about the consumer rights of gamers would be extremely difficult but well worth the effort if we pulled together.
Should be a thing with all digital goods. Since the wing-clipped gaming "press" won't do anything, you're on your own.
I think the whole idea of TOS need to be simultaneously tackled as well.
Selling games as licenses instead of items you own blows.
Companies shouldn't be allowed to have us sign a document with the promise of giving us the game they advertised "soon" (TM) when as you stated they launched a broken product.
Arbitration rules currently blow as well.
They prevent customers from filing a class action lawsuits or to combine their claims during the arbitration process so we don't have to individually spend effort fighting against the mega corporation when just a few of us representing our interests would work just fine.
Selling games as licenses instead of items you own blows.
Companies shouldn't be allowed to have us sign a document with the promise of giving us the game they advertised "soon" (TM) when as you stated they launched a broken product.
Arbitration rules currently blow as well.
They prevent customers from filing a class action lawsuits or to combine their claims during the arbitration process so we don't have to individually spend effort fighting against the mega corporation when just a few of us representing our interests would work just fine.
Define a video game lemon. Unlike cars, which, if bought broken, can cost hundreds or thousands to repair for the consumer, there isn't a single thing a games consumer can do to combat a broken game. The limited warranties that come with games are meant to combat the most literal analogy where a defect causes the game to be unplayable, but at what level would the actual data (whether due to incomplete/buggy code or network overload) need to be unusable to trigger such a law? We know devs and publishers will knowingly ship games with bugs, so what's to stop a publisher from just saying, "we know it does that, letting it be this way on release was intentional, and we'll fix it post-launch"? If it works as intended, who's to say the consumer hasn't gotten the product as intended? Because different games try to achieve a broad range of goals, it would be very tough to define a game that is wholly unplayable. Lastly, I'm not personally a fan of legislating the arts because that opens up a point of vulnerability for works to be censored for their content or quality.
So what would a potential law like this look like?
So what would a potential law like this look like?
Last edited by neshcom; Today at 01:44 PM.
Oh my GOD first post
Edit: she is perfection
Edit: she is perfection
Let's have one for films and books too. In fact let's have Lemon Laws for absolutely anything one might buy, and completely absolve consumers of any responsibility for doing research before buying something.
What could go wrong? It'll be a good old fashioned lemon party!
What could go wrong? It'll be a good old fashioned lemon party!
Can you take a big corporation to small claims court? Force them to show up to court in your city and waste a bunch of their money?
There should definitely be more laws in place to protect gamers.
They should mandate that games with microtransactions be sold cheaper than a conventional full-price game too.
GT6 and Forza 5 being sold at full RRP is a disgrace.
They should mandate that games with microtransactions be sold cheaper than a conventional full-price game too.
GT6 and Forza 5 being sold at full RRP is a disgrace.
Poor strawman,Originally Posted by jim-jam bongs
Let's have one for films and books too. In fact let's have Lemon Laws for absolutely anything one might buy, and completely absolve consumers of any responsibility for doing research before buying something.
What could go wrong? It'll be a good old fashioned lemon party!
If the theater where you watched a movie advertised to be 2 hours, suddenly ends the movie at the first hour you'd get your money back.
If a book is missing pages, you'd get your money back.
Why if you cannot play a videogame as advertised you cannot get your money back? What's the difference.
I blame us idiots who buy a game early into launch and think that games will lauch without fundamental issues to stability over and over again.
Next questionable highly-hyped game in the future will be one I just don't buy right away. Every time we rush into purchases like bf4 at launch we just give EA ammo to do the same shit over again.
It's pretty sad that we have to discuss this whole topic In multi million dlar industry:(
Next questionable highly-hyped game in the future will be one I just don't buy right away. Every time we rush into purchases like bf4 at launch we just give EA ammo to do the same shit over again.
It's pretty sad that we have to discuss this whole topic In multi million dlar industry:(
You expect the government to protect you from your impulsive $60 entertainment purchases?
Dat first post grabbed my sides.
Seriously though, getting any government to care about the consumer rights of gamers would be extremely difficult but well worth the effort if we pulled together.
The UK and, I believe, the EU have strong consumer protection laws, such as mandatory warranties. This seems like an extension of those, really.
The thing is, with a car, it's typically a single, specific car that is problematic. There are exceptions, where the whole model is a clunker, but usually it's just one out of a batch that is really awful.
Software though, everyone gets the same exact thing. Which on the one hand, makes it worse, but on the other hand, why do people pre-order sight unseen in the first place?
With cars, you take a test drive, read reviews, and unless it's a very rare super-car and you happen to be rich, you don't pre-order them.
And even then, as a general rule, you never want to buy the first year of a given model, you want to wait a year or two for them to work the bugs out.
Software though, everyone gets the same exact thing. Which on the one hand, makes it worse, but on the other hand, why do people pre-order sight unseen in the first place?
With cars, you take a test drive, read reviews, and unless it's a very rare super-car and you happen to be rich, you don't pre-order them.
And even then, as a general rule, you never want to buy the first year of a given model, you want to wait a year or two for them to work the bugs out.
But it isn't a Lemon party without Old Dick!Originally Posted by jim-jam bongs
Let's have one for films and books too. In fact let's have Lemon Laws for absolutely anything one might buy, and completely absolve consumers of any responsibility for doing research before buying something.
What could go wrong? It'll be a good old fashioned lemon party!
I still think it's utterly shameful there wasn't a total product recall for Steel Battalion. This industry's ability to sell -- and continue to sell -- straight-up faulty products is unbelievable. Not entirely sure how that can be policed, but if there aren't going to be any third party controls in place, it'll just continue to lead to the ruin of the industry long-term.
No mate, a game that's broken when you purchase it is your own fault, especially when reviews from reputable sites tell you that it's great and that things were working properly.Poor strawman,
If the theater where you watched a movie advertised to be 2 hours, suddenly ends the movie at the first hour you'd get your money back.
If a book is missing pages, you'd get your money back.
Why if you cannot play a videogame as advertised you cannot get your money back? What's the difference.
I very much agree. Reviewers from the bigger sites seem to just be another cog in the PR wheel in a lot of cases and big sites a lot of the time only state the negative shit once there's a consensus under core gamers that x, y or z about the game isn't that good/broken/etc.
So then we got the likes of EA and Bethesda and so releasing these barely functional games and yeah...Anyways, this needs to be tackled ASAP, they can't continue with this sort of behaviour it's really getting out of hand. It's reasonable to expect a few bugs in a game but not ones that constantly make the game crash or otherwise make it unplayable. This scummy behaviour really has to stop.
So then we got the likes of EA and Bethesda and so releasing these barely functional games and yeah...Anyways, this needs to be tackled ASAP, they can't continue with this sort of behaviour it's really getting out of hand. It's reasonable to expect a few bugs in a game but not ones that constantly make the game crash or otherwise make it unplayable. This scummy behaviour really has to stop.
Because there is no single line which can be drawn in the sand to say "this video game is broken". Using the current Battlefield example, they're basically protected by the fact that they advertise singleplayer content and add disclaimers saying that the game is out of their control online.Poor strawman,
If the theater where you watched a movie advertised to be 2 hours, suddenly ends the movie at the first hour you'd get your money back.
If a book is missing pages, you'd get your money back.
Why if you cannot play a videogame as advertised you cannot get your money back? What's the difference.
So stop reading reviews and use consumer opinions instead? People preorder games and rush out to get them day one without even reading reviews anyway.Originally Posted by Heavy's Sandvich
No mate, a game that's broken when you purchase it is your own fault, especially when reviews from reputable sites tell you that it's great and that things were working properly.
I'm sympathetic to anyone who has bought a game which has non-functioning elements but this is not the way we fix the problem.
Bethesda would hate this lol.
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