UnemployedVillain
Member
I hope you're not trying that both sides are the same shit
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Democrats are losing their most loyal voters: Black Women
- Thread starter Angelus Errare
- Start date
I hope you're not trying that both sides are the same shit
I am pretty sure I answered that. If this was actually important to him there would have been a plan in place by now. His tweet was an empty platitude.
Do you really think that this is something that he is unaware of?
With the way our voting rights are being stripped away, I wouldn't be surprised to see the return of literacy tests, and I'm not kidding.
I'm so sick of, and Black women are as well with what amounts to blackmail. Things are worse under Republicans but why support a party that throws Black people under the bus literally and doesn't listen to our advice or the head of the DNC not meeting with Black women who would be fundamental in organizing a winning strategy.
Black women lead the fight for civil rights in this country and are underrepresented by history for their tremendous accomplishments. They're still alive, they're still here, would more than be happy to give consultations, but dems, as mentioned are fishing for a demographic that was lost 50 years ago.
In 2020, if dems haven't shaped up, I won't vote for whoever they choose for President (I will still vote locally) but why on earth are the dems spitting in the face of their most loyal constituents? Answer that question before offering up another serving of Trump.
Wasn't that a direct reaction to the most progressive piece of healthcare legislation passed in this country's history?
I don't see how this makes any sense within the context of your argument: either the country voted for Republicans because Obama was too conservative, or they voted for him because he was too liberal.
(Or it was the confluence of many factors, including generic ones - like incumbent backlash - as well as ones specific to Obama - unprecedented gerrymandering, weaponizing racial resentment, etc.)
Either take this dick here willingly or we'll just let you get raped elsewhere.
Can't imagine why anyone would have a problem with these choices.
You're missing my point. I have no idea if he has a plan in place and neither do you. You're criticizing his tweet, so my question is what could he have put in his tweet that you wouldn't criticize? I take it from your answers that he would have had to spell out specifics on how he would address the problem and that is fair enough, I just wouldn't use the word disingenuous. Unsatisfactory maybe
Chie Satonaka
Member
"I get it, but I'm gonna talk down to you anyway."
If democrats want minority votes, they'd better fucking work for them. "Because Trump!!!111" isn't going to inspire everyone to rush the polls. It's really that simple.
Instead of people being upset about the perspective shown by black women (and people of color in general), why aren't "liberals" more concerned about making a better Democratic party?
Even as a black man who is fully aware and educated about the detriment that Republicans in power can cause (as my state didn't have a proper budget for two years as a result...) I still at times feel wary just writing a blank cheque with my vote on it.
How much less black women?
It's a dangerous trend, one that Democrats should be aware of.
I was just reading an article that said while voting is up amongst multiple demographics, it's down amongst black people and (regarding colleges) down by 11% on HBCUs. That can be a difference between a win and a loss on the level at the least.
How much less black women?
It's a dangerous trend, one that Democrats should be aware of.
I was just reading an article that said while voting is up amongst multiple demographics, it's down amongst black people and (regarding colleges) down by 11% on HBCUs. That can be a difference between a win and a loss on the level at the least.
TheLaughingStock
Member
If they voted for Democrats and no longer feel they're getting their money's worth then what they're doing is smart by making themselves heard. Supporting Democrats regardless of what they say, do and who they prioritize i.e. white males over blacks is dumb.
I hear what you're saying. But what happens when the African American populous just says "no"? What does plan B look like for the left?
I don't really think anyone wants to really push those chips into the middle.
theCalamity
Member
Deep in the heart of Texas.
I think people vote for Republicans because Obama didn't deliver on the change he campaigned on.
That's true, but there is something to be said for timing too.
I don't like the way this thread has shifted to black people are to blame for Trump though
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Yes, and how many of them have beem viable? There's no point in voting for a 3rd option if that 3rd option can't actually win. I'd rather put dems to task and get them to stop taking minorities for granted.
I was referring only to parties that have actually obtained power
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_parties_in_the_United_States
Even the Republican party has largely shifted to the Tea Party despite not changing their name
Are they the SC/EL populist voter types that are giving us heartburn?
Hard to change things when you vote all the Dems out of congress 20 months later.
I don't think it has?
Yeah take that half loaf and shut the fuck up. So inspiring
This is really a big thing that worries me about the rising popularity of Sanders. You are argue (truthfully) that the Dems have been bad to ignore their key voters, but he has a fetish like desire to win back white voters, and that will destroy the party. The majority of white voters will never come back to the Democratic party.
(because Vermont is the second-whitest, second-most rural state in the US)
Okay? Obviously I'm referencing a national level there.
OG Shaka Zulu
Member
This article reminds me of Malcolm X's "Ballot or the Bullet" speech. The Democrats are fucking up and have been taking the Black vote for granted for decades. I wish that we were all politically active enough to abandon the Democratic Party altogether. Won't happen anytime soon with how widespread voter suppression is.
theCalamity
Member
SC/EC all the way unless it's for national security of course. They seemed to be desperate for help, though, especially for their kids.
True, but people wanted change and didn't get it, so they punished Dems for it.
UnemployedVillain
Member
This sounds like an awful idea. I don't see how this could possibly be better than getting the party to align better with minorities, specifically black women
No, I know you are. I'm trying to expand on it w/ an explanation for what's driving Sanders off this cliff - this rural/white population base that he's always tailoring his speeches toward is all he's ever known for almost the entirety of his political career. And he is old and stubborn and not able to adapt to a message that resonates with an America that doesn't look like Vermont.
old manatee
Banned
I hope we see a more diverse crowd in the 2020 primary.
Muppet of a Man
Member
This. This divide is artificial. You can't have one without the other.
rokkerkory
Member
Why would they vote against their interests?
SliceSabre
Banned
Democrats will always be the party that hasn't the hardest time coming together because Democrats are herding a variety of different interest and groups and trying to keep (X) number of groups happy not to mention some of those groups actively dislike/hate one another. How do you appeal to black women in a way that doesn't upset the rest of the your constituents? Today black women are man, tomorrow Latino men are upset and next week, midwestern whites.
Then throw in the fact that well, Democrats REALLY fucking suck at actually voting despite how much we scream about how important it is. Yea we show up during the presidential election and then disappear in midterms. Of course the catch to all this is if blacks or any other minority group says "Fuck the Democrats they aren't seeing to my needs!" Everyone gets fucked over. Yea you get to feel special voting third party while the Democrats lose, Republicans win and opps there go your voting rights, opps there goes your marriage equality, but you sure felt good doing that protest vote huh?
Republicans got it easy the groups they have to herd are smaller in their differences and generally speaking don't actively hate each other at times and will set aside their differences, usually, and vote.
Then throw in the fact that well, Democrats REALLY fucking suck at actually voting despite how much we scream about how important it is. Yea we show up during the presidential election and then disappear in midterms. Of course the catch to all this is if blacks or any other minority group says "Fuck the Democrats they aren't seeing to my needs!" Everyone gets fucked over. Yea you get to feel special voting third party while the Democrats lose, Republicans win and opps there go your voting rights, opps there goes your marriage equality, but you sure felt good doing that protest vote huh?
Republicans got it easy the groups they have to herd are smaller in their differences and generally speaking don't actively hate each other at times and will set aside their differences, usually, and vote.
Massive Duck. C.M.
Banned
Not voting Democrat doesn't mean voting Republican
Ah, I see. Yeah, said it pretty well.
DontBeThatGuy
Member
Again, he won twice. He would've won again. It's also hard to deliver the world when your party is filibuster proof for a grand total of about 6 months, and much of that time is being dedicated to the fuckery of healthcare. He was essentially relegated to executive orders for the majority of his Presidency. (some of which very important, most of which are now being completely done away with)
People show up every 4 years and think that's all it takes. I see it all the time among liberals. Shit's stupid.
Brawly Likes to Brawl
Member
Republicans shifted because Obama made them slam the panic button and indulge the worst aspects of their party to win.
Despite Trump being a total tire fire, I'm not seeing much happening in terms of a dynamic change for the Democratic party. At least not in any way besides relitigating the primaries every week.
Again, I'd love to vote for third party that has its shit together and can win, but it doesn't exist.
A rousing defense of democracy.
Yeah, not seeing how people are not getting this.
With the way the current system is set up, not voting Democrat has been the same as voting Republican for years.
I agree that it doesn't exist. I guess my argument is that it doesn't exist because they don't have compelling ideas, not because it isn't possible to overcome the 2-party system -- something that has happened several times in our history and even in the last decade.
Mammoth Jones
Member
UnemployedVillain
Member
I wouldn't quite say it's artificial. While both are linked, the divide is in which will cause a greater effect on the other. Hillary was on the side of fixing social disparity would fix a number of the issues with economic disparity. Bernie was on the side of fixing economic inequality would solve a number of issues with social inequality. Those two opposing methods are at the root of the current schism in the Democratic party.
The issue is that black woman fall largely into the first group, but it seems like the party, mainly spurned on by this recent wave of populism and the growing popularity of Sanders is moving more towards the second group, despite the fact that that bloc consists of young people (who don't reliably vote for anyone) and the white working class (who don't reliably vote Dem) and this is problematic.
The party platform is essentially being guided by wild card voters and the expense of consistent ones, simply because they're louder and more numerous
They're only seeing what they want to see as options. Keep it contained and consequence free. Keeping it safe.
Should have been clear with your neighbors and family about that, no?
Freshmaker
I am Korean.
Dumb thing is you don't have to do anything to court those. Just promise jobs and security. In as simple terms as possible. Verbosity makes them think you're smarter than they are and they run.
Muppet of a Man
Member
What I don't really understand is how courting voters on both social and economic justice pits different interests groups against one another.
There is a small donor group of individuals that leverage the media to play up this divide. After all, the progressive wing of the democratic party is more socially and economically progressive than their left-leaning centrist counterparts by definition. This conflating the vast majority of Bernie supporters with "moderates" is utter tripe. It is literally the opposite of true for registered democrats supporting Sanders by and large.
There is a contingency of independents and other moderates that support Sanders, but they are a tiny group relative to his progressive supporters. This is easily evidenced by the fact that a larger percentage of Bernie supporters voted Clinton during this recent general election than did Clinton supporters in past general elections voting for Obama.
There is a small donor group of individuals that leverage the media to play up this divide. After all, the progressive wing of the democratic party is more socially and economically progressive than their left-leaning centrist counterparts by definition. This conflating the vast majority of Bernie supporters with "moderates" is utter tripe. It is literally the opposite of true for registered democrats supporting Sanders by and large.
There is a contingency of independents and other moderates that support Sanders, but they are a tiny group relative to his progressive supporters. This is easily evidenced by the fact that a larger percentage of Bernie supporters voted Clinton during this recent general election than did Clinton supporters in past general elections voting for Obama.
Zvonimir Boban
Banned
So this is where everyone blames minorities for white voters fucking everything up again yeah?
Cool.
Cool.
Because there's a white/rural section of the party/swing voters that is not very "enlightened" on racial/social issues and actively dislikes when it sees them get airtime. They like programs they perceive as giving benefits to them, but hate programs they perceive as giving benefits to those people.
For instance, when Angus King, currently a Senator from Maine who caucuses with the Dems and is generally viewed as Left/Liberal, left the Democratic Party in '93, he explained his rationale with this:
That is one hell of a dogwhistle, and when you consider Maine elected LePage Governor... you can see that the kinds of pressures he was responding to 25 years ago haven't changed one bit there.
If the black had just voted a little harder it could have offset 65 million crazy white folk.
It's always the black mans fault.
Thanks Obama!
UnemployedVillain
Member
Bruh, the article is literally about Dems not doing enough for black women and it starting to show, not the other way around
Zvonimir Boban
Banned
I think the article is criticising the Democrats, not blaming black women, but it's no surprise that people have responded like that and tried to lay the guilt trip on people most likely to vote Democrat.
Black people have been propping up the Democrats for generations and what's the first thing that happens after a black president is replaced by a white supremacist?
"How can we make the Democrats more appealing to racists?"
Cannot blame minorities, black women in particular, for deciding there's no point and staying home until someone starts giving a fuck about them.
I know you're being sarcastic, but that's been an actual talking point here on GAF by a few folks post-election.
What I'm seeing in this thread is "Democrats can't move right to try to pick up white moderates!" And I'm like... how do you get the white vote without moving right?
I wish we lived in a society where a real left-wing party could get elected. A party dedicated to police reform, equality across racial, gender and class lines, supply-side economics, single payer, the works.
But I don't think that such a party can get elected. And I'd rather have a watered-down Democrat party that can actually win seats than an ideologically correct Democrat party that can't.
Well, as Trump (and the New Deal coalition) proved: just be racist.
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