CyclopsRock
Member
Of course. But it's the resulting GNP figure that's interesting.
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UK PoliGAF |OT3| - Strong and Stable Government? No. Coalition Of Chaos!
- Thread starter Jezbollah
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Of course. But it's the resulting GNP figure that's interesting.
Theonik
Member
That's not entirely true when trying to analyse macro-economic trends. You are interested in knowing when you are trying to identify trends, especially when it comes to GDP per Capita and it helps inform policy recommendations.
George Osborne urges 'HS3' rail for Northern England.
That's a smart idea, maybe if he gets into government one day he might actually implement something like that.
That's a smart idea, maybe if he gets into government one day he might actually implement something like that.
Northern England? That's a nice concept.
Theonik
Member
Being fair to him. He was involved with HS2 when it was approved in 2012 and this is a pretty long term project. HS2 phase 2 isn't slated to land till 2032.
CyclopsRock
Member
Right, but my original point was....
CyclopsRock said:
I went on to conclude...
CyclopsRock said:
I mean, the policy wonk's making recommendations are, technically, human people, but ya know what I mean.
As Crab said
I know you responded already but I still don't see why this statistic is any more or less abstract than any other to an individual.
CyclopsRock
Member
Well, I'll reiterate my answer succinctly - because one company's productivity has zip all to do with another company's productivity, where as GDP affects everyone, whether you're contributing to it positively or negatively.
But we're going around in circles, so let's change the subject. Chris Bryant sure is a tool, huh?
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
GDP doesn't affect everyone. Say some wealthy guy got £1,000,000 more and I got nothing. GDP went up £1,000,000 - didn't mean shit to me.
The UK's GDP is growing at the moment. The North East's GDP is stagnant, even moderately declining. If I'm from oop North, why do I give a damn about the UK's GDP? None of it comes up here!
CyclopsRock
Member
What do they make in the north? Battered confectionery? Kestrels? Misery? Obviously a person who makes a million has a million more quid than you now, but going forward GDP gives an indication as to how many miserable battered kestrels you're likely to sell (maybe down in Smithfield's market, where people have money) in the future. Low or negative GDP is bad news for your disgusting produce, strong GDP growth is good. Obviously if you're selling a bullshit product no one wants, all the GDP growth in the world won't help. But I can't think of any circumstances in which an averaged productivity figure would be useful to you unless, as Splinter said, you're helping to devise policy. Where as GDP can give you some idea of the state of the market in which you're going to be selling.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
GDP doesn't give you any real indication of what you're likely to sell going forward in and of itself, though. That's a misunderstanding of what GDP is. Rising GDP means that you should have sold more over the period in which that rising GDP was measured. It doesn't say anything about the future. GDP was rising in London in 2007. Was that good for the North in 2008?
CyclopsRock
Member
It was very good! And yes, you're right obviously, but GDP can surely have significant impacts on investment, consumer confidence, etc in a way that productivity never does?
But as long as your fortune is based upon your businesses ability to do it, it's not that abstract. Edit: Anyway, I said "human people."
Why does productivity have to be measured from company to company?
If there is a general decline across the whole country then there is clearly a general problem with investment in technology + staff training, or a lot of people are underemployed - which all seem to me to absolutely be things that the average person would care about
CyclopsRock
Member
Even my own replies are boring me now, so I'm gonna heed my own advice and shut my little cake hole.
In other news, that Nelson CIF thing's a doozy, huh?
In other news, that Nelson CIF thing's a doozy, huh?
JonathanEx
Member
It's been a while since I've had a hate read on CIF, ta for that.
Although speaking of CIF - I quite liked this piece from Burnham yesterday about how govt decisions treat the North, particularly in regards to transport: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/north-powerhouse-infrastructure-andy-burnham
I see the northern Transport Summit today is going well, with Grayling saying it's basically the north's problem to solve. Which sure that works well as they have full control over all these decisions.
Still it hardly matters, we won't be able to afford anything with the inevitable collapse of our economy so I should start building my own Flintstones style car as sustainable transport
Although speaking of CIF - I quite liked this piece from Burnham yesterday about how govt decisions treat the North, particularly in regards to transport: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/north-powerhouse-infrastructure-andy-burnham
I see the northern Transport Summit today is going well, with Grayling saying it's basically the north's problem to solve. Which sure that works well as they have full control over all these decisions.
Still it hardly matters, we won't be able to afford anything with the inevitable collapse of our economy so I should start building my own Flintstones style car as sustainable transport
CyclopsRock
Member
https://www.politicshome.com/news/u.../pro-corbyn-mp-tories-are-enemy-and-i-wont-be
About a Labour MP:
I'm sure they're all devastated.
About a Labour MP:
I'm sure they're all devastated.
Dirtyshubb
Member
Cant argue with her at all.
She is pretty great though, fantastic to get some better representation among MP's.
She is pretty great though, fantastic to get some better representation among MP's.
CyclopsRock
Member
I imagine the many thousands of Tory voters in her constituency that she's also paid to represent will be delighted to hear this too.
More to the point though, by going off to skwawkbox.org, mad conspiracy nutters, for an interview, she's just reinforcing all the stereotypes of a young, Corbynite MP. It'd be like a new Tory having a nice sit down chat with Guido.
Psychotext
Member
Agreed. I find myself strongly opposed to anyone who thinks we can make the country better by making the weakest members of society suffer.
I'll agree to the first sentence but I think the reality-distorting powers of Skwakbox and The Canary are more akin to... certain national newspapers than Guido Fawkes.
I don't think it's helpful to think of other MPs as "the enemy". It's one thing to shitpost in a gaming forum, but she actually has to work with these people for the benefit of everyone. Otherwise we're just following in America's footsteps (probably too late to worry about this, I know).
I think the point is that a Conservative voter would look at Skwawkbox the way a Labour voter would look at Guido, rightly or wrongly.
There are not many people who would state that's what they believed.
Ultimately, as someone whom conservative policies have had a significant detrimental effect on both my life and my family, we cannot call them "the enemy". Partly because that type of hyperpartisanship is utterly toxic, and secondly because on a very practical basis the only way for Labour to win is to get some of those people who voted Tory in 2010 / 2015 / 2017 to switch to Labour. You won't do that by shaming them into voting, or calling them the enemy.
Psychotext
Member
I'm not entirely convinced most of those voters would refer to themselves as "tory" though.
How can Jeremy *unt think going up against someone so well respected will work? https://www.theguardian.com/comment...k-nhs-stephen-hawking-crisis?CMP=share_btn_fb (New Hawking post re his comments).
You'd really hope the UK public would have a hell of a lot more respect Hawking over the man who seems to want slowly destroy the NHS.
Also has the Corbyn Virgin CCTV thing been discussed? Where it showed Virgin misled the public? (Seen a few posts but not read too much into it).
You'd really hope the UK public would have a hell of a lot more respect Hawking over the man who seems to want slowly destroy the NHS.
Also has the Corbyn Virgin CCTV thing been discussed? Where it showed Virgin misled the public? (Seen a few posts but not read too much into it).
Linkstrikesback
Member
Given the facebook post comments regarding Hawking when the first reports came out, you'd be sadly mistaken.
The top comments were mostly a bunch of morons accusing him of being a scam artist.
There's a whodunit joke to be made.
Can this dude get sacked?
https://twitter.com/DavidTCDavies/status/901208645429600256
Saying non English speakers should get no interpreters when being questioned by police.
Dude is scum
https://twitter.com/DavidTCDavies/status/901208645429600256
Saying non English speakers should get no interpreters when being questioned by police.
Dude is scum
JonnyDBrit
Member
Saying this in response to a suggestion that a lack of ability to speak English be factored into someone's presumed vulnerability when prioritising police responses too. Also I imagine the 'fortune' presumed here is actually rather small.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
https://www.theguardian.com/global/...s-for-lengthy-transitional-period-post-brexit
Potentially worthy of a thread in OT? Labour seem to want to use it to bring down the government by picking off pro-EU Conservative MPs with a more coherent soft Brexit plan.
Potentially worthy of a thread in OT? Labour seem to want to use it to bring down the government by picking off pro-EU Conservative MPs with a more coherent soft Brexit plan.
JonnyDBrit
Member
I'd say it deserves some notice. More of a lynchpin for discussion than other news that's for sure.
WhateverItTakes
Banned
Thread might be worth for reacting to how it's taken on the Sunday politics shows as well. Nice to see somebody drawing lines at what Brexit means at least.
Suppose they've calculated now this move won't lose them much/any of the 'leave' Labour people.
Suppose they've calculated now this move won't lose them much/any of the 'leave' Labour people.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
We'd be busy talking about Labour's demise and May's 200-seat majority right now instead.
Yup. They've timed this very well, they can point to the incoherent negotiating position the UK Government has been taking so far, and the high likelyhood that negotiations won't move onto the trade deal in October, and say 'we need to think again'
Jezbollah
Member
Weren't lots of people doing that anyway
it IS good timing as you say Uzzy.
Starmer's played a nice card here.
mmm, that's speculative at best. I put the loss down to the Tories putting in zero effort.
Jezbollah
Member
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-sets-date-shell-quit-11061894
Daily Mirror stating May will quit in August 2019.
Just in time for whoever comes in to face a fucking mess.
Strong and stable.
Daily Mirror stating May will quit in August 2019.
Just in time for whoever comes in to face a fucking mess.
Strong and stable.
I've heard that date now from two seperate Westminster bods, so either it's real and leaking out or it's just a rumour that the press are running with.
Past "Hey, I just gave the people a chioce. What happens next won't be my fault" quits
Present "Hey, I just followed through on the the will of the people. This wasn't my fault" quits
Future "Hey, I'm just cleaning up the mess. It's not my fault" quits?
It's a concerted effort to make sure nobody at any given time is responsible for anything.
Dirtyshubb
Member
While that is true and does help the Tories shift blame, I think it also helps Labour. The Tories have been blaming Labour since they got in power for the results of their own actions.
I would much rather have Labour in trying to do actual good policies instead of the horror show we currently have, even if it is cleaning up the brexit mess.
It's gonna be hard and limit the potential good labour could do but it at least allows them some breathing room.
D
Deleted member 231381
Unconfirmed Member
I'm extremely skeptical of this. If the election had turned into a straight Remain-Leave fight, Labour would have been massacred. Outside of London, over 85% of Labour-held seats voted Leave. The decision to be, uh, flexible on Brexit, and by doing so move the conversation on to other issues - standards of living, healthcare - is what moved the Conservatives onto territory they were not especially good on.
The Conservatives don't just "put zero effort in", they misjudged the election. They thought it was going to be the Brexit election.
To be fair, so did everyone. The reports I was hearing from labour campaigners on the doorstep was that people were only interested in Brexit, and they didn't care about the usual stuff like healthcare and wages.
Between a combination of labours tactical positioning on brexit, plus May's complete fuck-up with her manifesto and her inability to lok even vaguely human, Labour gained an opportunity few thought they would have at the start.
Their manifesto said otherwise. Not to mention May getting stuck in endless Milliband loops, doing U-turns and dodging debates.
CyclopsRock
Member
I think it was the manifesto's fault. The total shit show of its contents meant there were nothing but negative news cycles for the Tories, with no rabbits being drawn out of hats, and they lowered the bar for positive legislation so far that Labour barely needed to do anything to appear better. With a decent manifesto IMO the Tories would have got a majority.
JonnyDBrit
Member
I think it also created the situation where, despite the Tory's efforts ("There's no magic money tree!"), it caused people to take a greater look at the Labour manifesto in contrast, and many found themselves surprisingly liking it.
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