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Is Moana the best animated film Disney has ever made?

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BumRush

Member
That's the problem, Disney's been bad for so long the moment they put out a string of competent films they are suddenly back to making classics.

This Frozen-Moana era doesn't really even compete to that late 90's era of Hercules, Hunchback, Mulan.

All these recent films including Zootopia feel half baked. There's great moments in the films but they rushed it out the door instead of taking the time to perfect the film. Which is sad because I want to like these as much as the classics but their flaws stand out too much.

Zootopia feels like an incredibly well-thought-out universe. Not sure I follow the argument that it was rushed out the door at all.
 

Fitts

Member
It was alright, but I thought the songs were kind of meh overall compared to the best Disney films. You're Welcome and Jemaine's song were decent, though.
 

Berordn

Member
Zootopia feels like an incredibly well-thought-out universe. Not sure I follow the argument that it was rushed out the door at all.

I can agree that the narrative seemed a little weak in places (the character development in particular feels like it all happens in a single scene), but that probably has more to do with the whole script being redone pretty late in.

The fact that it came out as well as it did is incredible.
 

JZA

Member
Definitely the best animated Disney musical for the last decade or so. I thought Moana's original songs made Frozen's seem overrated.
 

PsychBat!

Banned
There is nothing timeless about all those purposefully anachronistic jokes. That fuckin Twitter joke sucked right now, much less 25/50 years in the future.

Thats actually my main argument against this latest so-called "Renaissance". Disney films have built themselves up on unironic, self-consciusios classicism. Films that exist outside time, adopting folklore and fables with a remove from any modernity. Snow White feels just the same from 1937 to today, as do Bambi, Little Mermaid, Sleeping Beauty, etc.

But ever since John Lasseter came on board, there's been a streak of slick, marketing-ready modern sense of humor and VERY contemporary self-aware comedies that feel like really good Dreamworks productions or solid Pixar outings instead of Disney movies. Zootopia being the apex of this, like I dont think Disney has ever made a movie so reliant on current cultural touchstones and and awkward movie references and shit. That movie might not survive the next few years, and you're putting it on the same level as Fantasia and Bambi!?!?

ok dude

preach
 

Gallbaro

Banned
giphy.gif


Watched it and it doesn't touch Pinocchio

My man.
 
Zootopia feels like an incredibly well-thought-out universe. Not sure I follow the argument that it was rushed out the door at all.
The Universe is very generic anthropomorphic animals living like humans motif nothing that hasn't been done before. What makes it unique is the message of the story not the world it's presented in.

Zootopia's biggest issue is it's pacing. Something that could be easily be fixed yet there are a number of segments that just feel stitched together, there's no flow at all. It's almost like they were created at different times by different people then someone else had to piece them together so they made sense. It felt sloppy to me.

I haven't seen it in a while so it's no fresh in my head as to specifics. I remember being disappointed by the story after all that praise it was just for the moral of the story not the story itself.

EDIT:

I can agree that the narrative seemed a little weak in places (the character development in particular feels like it all happens in a single scene), but that probably has more to do with the whole script being redone pretty late in.

The fact that it came out as well as it did is incredible.

That actually explains a lot. A hasty script is pretty glaring in that movie but it is a decent film, just not some Masterpiece, the crowning achievement in this "new renaissance"
 
The Universe is very generic anthropomorphic animals living like humans motif nothing that hasn't been done before. What makes it unique is the message of the story not the world it's presented in.

Zootopia's biggest issue is it's pacing. Something that could be easily be fixed yet there are a number of segments that just feel stitched together, there's no flow at all. It's almost like they were created at different times by different people then someone else had to piece them together so they made sense. It felt sloppy to me.

I haven't seen it in a while so it's no fresh in my head as to specifics. I remember being disappointed by the story after all that praise it was just for the moral of the story not the story itself.

EDIT:



That actually explains a lot. A hasty script is pretty glaring in that movie but it is a decent film, just not some Masterpiece, the crowning achievement in this "new renaissance"

which part of it is very generic? name some examples that would be comparable
 

Sunster

Member
I cannot comprehend the love for Frozen. It seemed basic af to me. Just a good song makes it goat? wat? why?
 

digdug2k

Member
I watch a lot of Disney with my kids now. I think I've seen Moana 4 times? It's probably my favorite Disney film. The old stuff I loved as a kid (little mermaid, lion King, etc) hasn't held up as well as I thought.
 
I watch a lot of Disney with my kids now. I think I've seen Moana 4 times? It's probably my favorite Disney film. The old stuff I loved as a kid (little mermaid, lion King, etc) hasn't held up as well as I thought.

Maybe not The Little Mermaid, but Lion King & Beauty and the Beast are completely timeless IMO. It's also surprising how well the original Toy Story holds up, considering it's 22 years old (!?).
 

Izuna

Banned
I liked it

But did anyone else get serious HTTYD vibes?

Also, as much as I like the representation of an almost unspoken language, it means I can't easily do karaoke.
 

dave is ok

aztek is ok
Moana's songs are much better on rewatch. I didn't like them the first time I saw it, but after the three hundredth time I enjoy them.
 
I liked Moana, but I didn't love it. I preferred Zootopia, which I didn't expect, but seeing how so many other people hail the former movie makes me kind of wonder what I missed. I don't even remember any of the songs.
 
Hell no. Mona the character is garbage, the story is very bland Maui was mostly comic relief character. It's not even the best animated movie of 2016. That goes to Zootopia.
 

Enduin

No bald cap? Lies!
I think it's the best of the 3D films for sure. Didn't love the ending, or more specifically Maui just coming back out of the blue to help her without any development or justification, but overall the structure and development of Moana made her one of the most endearing and empowered characters in Disney film history.

I love the music and listen to it every so often, which I've never done with any Disney film.
 

Sami+

Member
What? No. It was fine I guess.

Man impressions like this are what ruined the movie for me when I saw it the first time. I was expecting something a lot more intimate and emotional, with a love for the culture it's portraying in the same vain as Lilo and Stitch (which imo actually is one of the best- He Mele No Lilo can bring me close to tears at times) and instead all I got was a perfectly decent, serviceable kids movie with jokes about Twitter and animal sidekicks. Which is fine. But y'all are over here talking about how this movie is so bold and inspired and shit and I have no idea if I even saw the same film.
 

XenIneX

Member
But did anyone else get serious HTTYD vibes?
It had a number of very Dreamworks facial expressions.

"How Far I'll Go": o/~ What is wrong with me? o/~ <- very "Hiccup" grimace...

Just before "You're Welcome", while Moana's blustering about not having meant to say "thank you", Maui gives The Dreamworks Smirk.

There's others, but I can't remember them off the top of my head.
 
which part of it is very generic? name some examples that would be comparable

Well the obvious one would the movie that was released in the same year. Sing looks like it took place right down the street in Zootopia.

The last time Disney did the animals dressed up as humans doing human things in a human city was probably Chicken Little.

The oldest film I can think of that I've seen personally is Rock-a-doodle. It takes place in a more rural environment but it does have big city scenes in Las Vegas too.

Those are just films I can think of off the top of my head, I'm sure there are tons of cartoons you can add. Duck Tails, Tail spin both Disney. It wouldn't surprise me if Mickey Mouse or Bugs Bunny were the first to explore the idea.

Zooptopia did a good job to avoid obvious cliches like a Pig as a Cop or Lion as Royalty. But the world is not some completely original idea that's never been seen before.
 
But the world is not some completely original idea that's never been seen before.

and that makes it "Very Generic"?
None of your examples were about evolved animals in a modern socio economic society, rather just talking animals entirely for comical purposes and nothing important to say.

If you cant see the difference between rock a doodle and Zootopia then you must see things at face value, like to an extreme. By that logic every single setting is "Very Generic".

If you used something like Animal Farm as an example it would have at least been comparable.
 

GSG Flash

Nobody ruins my family vacation but me...and maybe the boy!
It's not even the best Disney animated movie of last year, let alone of all time.

I need to watch Moana again to properly judge it, I watched it for the first time a few days ago, but I was a bit underwhelmed. I didn't like the high frequency of songs either.
 
I cannot comprehend the love for Frozen. It seemed basic af to me. Just a good song makes it goat? wat? why?

Frozen was an absolute mess in my eyes, which made me sad as the idea of a self exiled ice queen sounded very romantic to me. Instead I got pop ice queens.

Anyhow, just saw Moana and it certainly is fantastic from the music and art style to the characters and the sense of a journey, it did it for me.
 
and that makes it "Very Generic"?
None of your examples were about evolved animals in a modern socio economic society, rather just talking animals entirely for comical purposes and nothing important to say.

If you cant see the difference between rock a doodle and Zootopia then you must see things at face value, like to an extreme. By that logic every single setting is "Very Generic".

If you used something like Animal Farm as an example it would have at least been comparable.
The setting they chose was very generic to tell a complex narrative. I don't see what's the problem is in thinking that or hard to understand. You're lumping in this so call Universe with the moral of the story which is not mutually exclusive. You can tell that same story in a Universe with some artistic style and unique visuals instead of this bland safe environment Disney has done in the past and will do again in the future.
 
Nowhere close OP. Disney's 90s output is outrageously good and unparalleled in heart by most movies in general. Moana doesn't even have a villain. Scar, Jafar... Gaston? You can't beat the best without trying.

Like.. the genie alone negates this possibility.
 
The setting they chose was very generic to tell a complex narrative. I don't see what's the problem is in thinking that or hard to understand. You're lumping in this so call Universe with the moral of the story which is not mutually exclusive. You can tell that same story in a Universe with some artistic style and unique visuals instead of this bland safe environment Disney has done in the past and will do again in the future.

Might be the first and only time ive ever seen someone refer to the setting in Zootopia as bland. Do you really believe it doesnt have an artistic style or unique visuals? Im not sure you really understand how many design elements went into this movie.
You might enjoy looking at some of the concept art, even the character designs are very distinct from their other animal related movies
 
Might be the first and only time ive ever seen someone refer to the setting in Zootopia as bland. Do you really believe it doesnt have an artistic style or unique visuals? Im not sure you really understand how many design elements went into this movie.
You can put a lot of hard work into many designs it doesn't automatically make it good. There are probably kids out there that think Sing and Zootopia take place in the same Universe. And you can't blame them, on the surface they are very similar.

The World of Zootopia feels separate from the story told in that world. It's like they built this environment and dropped a story into it as opposed to the story developing this unique and original world.
 
You can put a lot of hard work into many designs it doesn't automatically make it good. There are probably kids out there that think Sing and Zootopia take place in the same Universe. And you can't blame them, on the surface they are very similar.

The World of Zootopia feels separate from the story told in that world. It's like they built this environment and dropped a story into it as opposed to the story developing this unique and original world.

you're welcome to an opinion, but I don't think ill ever agree with anything you're saying in the slightest.
To me its one of the most well realized and interesting settings they have ever done, and the story was a perfect fit for the themes and settings of diversity.

I dont think youre giving kids enough credit when it comes to noticing details. Sing is not a multi biosphere metropolis with each species size and environment taken into account, its just a city with singing animal people (and looks noticeable worse in every visual aspect). Its also not Disney. its like comparing Angry Birds to Moana because Islands.
 
you're welcome to an opinion, but I don't think ill ever agree with anything you're saying in the slightest.
To me its one of the most well realized and interesting settings they have ever done, and the story was a perfect fit for the themes and settings of diversity.

I dont think youre giving kids enough credit when it comes to noticing details. Sing is not a multi biosphere metropolis with each species size and environment taken into account, its just a city with singing animal people (and looks noticeable worse in every visual aspect). Its also not Disney. its like comparing Angry Birds to Moana because Islands.

I'm not trying to convince you or change your mind, you just wanted an explanation of why I felt the Universe was generic.

You'd be surprised at how the mass public just lumps anything animated as a Disney title, like there are no other studios capable of producing quality animation. But that's part of the problem with everything looking the same now. Some suit in a focus group decided that kids won't respond to variety and all 3D animation has to look like this to be successful. So many films look like the same artist worked on character design or they just recycle the characters to save money.

Moana was originally rumored to use the style featured the "Paperman" but I believe it was nixed because the technology hadn't caught up to the level of producing a colored feature film. I'm sure they wouldn't have gone that route even if it were possible.

As visually beautiful as Moana was, I would have loved to have seen Disney try something out of their recent comfort zone.
 
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