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Erheller
Member
(08-13-2017, 02:03 AM)

Originally Posted by jb1234

I don't know. I mean, she's funny and all but I don't have a lot of sympathy for her overprotective behavior. She goes off on Agate and the whole time, I wanted to scream, "Yeah, but he was actually THERE. Where the hell were you?"

Hopefully, the game explores this further because right now, it feels like her and Dan dumped Tita on Albert because it was more convenient for them.

I mean, that's what makes her interesting. Erika isn't a model parent at all. She frequently gets absorbed in her work, much to Tita's detriment. Hell, she was gone for a few years, basically dumping Tita on Russel.

And that leads us to her door, where we see that Erika and Tita are on completely different wavelengths. Erika obviously loves Tita, but she treats her like she's a little doll and nothing more. She fawns over how cute she is, but she doesn't take her seriously - not when Tita shows interest in the new project, and not when Tita explains how she could use her experience to help with it. Erika doesn't think Tita is ready to help - she's been absent for the last several years, and it's plainly obvious. Her fascination with engineering and science has created a rift between herself and her daughter.

I'm sure you got all that when you played through the game. But Erika's faults don't make her a bad character (maybe you think she's morally bad, but that's a different argument altogether). Instead, her faults make her believable, and it's what makes her (in my opinion) an interesting and compelling character.

When I was growing up, I went to school in the suburbs, but my dad worked in a rural town about an hour and a half away. It was so far that he would live in that town and only see the rest of our family on Wednesdays and during the weekend. Later, he ended up commuting three hours every day so we could see him more often. But he was so tired that most days he would come back home and immediately go to sleep. Obviously, this isn't as drastic as Erika leaving Tita for years, but the entire sequence really nailed the disconnect between parent and child.

This is what makes me love the Kiseki series so much. In almost every other game, Erika would be reduced to "Party Member 6's mom who's been gone for a long time". They might have left the Agate jokes in for comedic relief, but they almost certainly wouldn't have been able to convey that Erika is a character on her own. That she has her own motivations and aspirations, and that her goals have been interfering with her personal life. Erika has more characterization than entire casts of certain JRPG's.

And she's a side character that gets like half an hour of screen time.

but uh yeah "flawed character" =/= "bad character"


Edit: added spoiler tags
Last edited by Erheller; 08-13-2017 at 02:16 AM.
jb1234
Member
(08-13-2017, 02:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by Erheller

I mean, that's what makes her interesting. Erika isn't a model parent at all. She frequently gets absorbed in her work, much to Tita's detriment. Hell, she was gone for a few years, basically dumping Tita on Russel.

And that leads us to her door, where we see that Erika and Tita are on completely different wavelengths. Erika obviously loves Tita, but she treats her like she's a little doll and nothing more. She fawns over how cute she is, but she doesn't take her seriously - not when Tita shows interest in the new project, and not when Tita explains how she could use her experience to help with it. Erika doesn't think Tita is ready to help - she's been absent for the last several years, and it's plainly obvious. Her fascination with engineering and science has created a rift between herself and her daughter.

I'm sure you got all that when you played through the game. But Erika's faults don't make her a bad character (maybe you think she's morally bad, but that's a different argument altogether). Instead, her faults make her believable, and it's what makes her (in my opinion) an interesting and compelling character.

When I was growing up, I went to school in the suburbs, but my dad worked in a rural town about an hour and a half away. It was so far that he would live in that town and only see the rest of our family on Wednesdays and during the weekend. Later, he ended up commuting three hours every day so we could see him more often. But he was so tired that most days he would come back home and immediately go to sleep. Obviously, this isn't as drastic as Erika leaving Tita for years, but the entire sequence really nailed the disconnect between parent and child.

This is what makes me love the Kiseki series so much. In almost every other game, Erika would be reduced to "Party Member 6's mom who's been gone for a long time". They might have left the Agate jokes in for comedic relief, but they almost certainly wouldn't have been able to convey that Erika is a character on her own. That she has her own motivations and aspirations, and that her goals have been interfering with her personal life. Erika has more characterization than entire casts of certain JRPG's.

And she's a side character that gets like half an hour of screen time.

but uh yeah "flawed character" =/= "bad character"

Oh, I completely agree. My observations aren't complaints. I like that the character is loaded with contradictions and is believably messy. Most of her scenes are played for laughs but there's a great deal of subtext too. It's excellent character writing.

I just wonder whether she regrets the choices she's made.
Erheller
Member
(08-13-2017, 02:25 AM)

Originally Posted by jb1234

Oh, I completely agree. My observations aren't complaints. I like that the character is loaded with contradictions and is believably messy. Most of her scenes are played for laughs but there's a great deal of subtext too. It's excellent character writing.

I just wonder whether she regrets the choices she's made.

Yeah, I'd love to see if they ever touch on that in CS3. I have a suspicion that Erika's going to show up again sometime, since she plays a large role in Tita's Star/Moon door (I can't remember which).
Squire
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(08-13-2017, 03:39 AM)
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Originally Posted by PK Gaming

This.

It's a typical "hands off my daughter" type of joke taken to a comedic extreme. The scene prior to that has her insist that people don't call her "professor", and she gushes over Ries's cuteness in a really goofy way. She's a very extra/larger than life character.

It's even funnier because of the role reversal. Erika is aggressive to an extreme while Dan is extremely passive and mannerable.
SatelliteOfLove
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(08-13-2017, 03:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

You haven't seen anything yet.

This is gonna be so good.

Kevin tries to convince us that he is cool.

Don't let him convince anyone that he's cool!

Originally Posted by PK Gaming

Trails is really good with its female characters in a natural, effortless way. Like they didn't set out to create "strong female characters", it comes naturally to them like breathing.

Some writers of large-script works actually watch people and seek to write characters, it's great.

Originally Posted by Squire

It's even funnier because of the role reversal. Erika is aggressive to an extreme while Dan is extremely passive and mannerable.

That scene between him and Agate is amazingly written. They do natural, effortless male characters too!
PK Gaming
Member
(08-13-2017, 03:48 AM)
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Tita's star door



Tita's one of those rare kid characters that actually feels like a kid. Not too hopelessly stupid or overly competent either (despite being a prodigy). She's just great, and you don't really get that kind of character in RPGs anymore.
Squire
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(08-13-2017, 05:49 AM)
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Do I have to do all three fishing matches to get the final star door? This is driving me nuts.
Jolkien
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(08-13-2017, 06:11 AM)
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Nice little video that Easy Allies made on Trails in the Sky, might convinced newcomer to give the serie a try
chaosblade
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(08-13-2017, 06:17 AM)
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I wonder if XSEED is pushing the games (or at least FC and maybe Cold Steel) to some youtube and twitch personalities. I know quite a few people have been encouraging them to do that.
fuzaco
Junior Member
(08-13-2017, 06:30 AM)

Originally Posted by SatelliteOfLove

Kevin tries to convince us that he is cool.

Don't let him convince anyone that he's cool!

Kevin is probably my favorite character in the whole series. He's basically Vash the Stampede.
Nyoro SF
Member
(08-13-2017, 06:43 AM)
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The Cold Steel PC port is so good that playing CS3 is gonna feel like I'm going backwards in time.

I am being spoiled like crazy right now.
Scrooge McDuck
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(08-13-2017, 07:15 AM)
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Playing through Cold Steel again, I have to say that Class VII has more silly interactions with each other than I remember. Like this time Machias is stalked by a girl and drags Elliot around for moral support. "We studied together for the mid-term exam, right? That's a bond stronger than blood!"
PK Gaming
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(08-13-2017, 07:20 AM)
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The free day sections were really good, especially if you just sat yourself down and talked to everyone.

hans_castorp
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(08-13-2017, 07:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

Do I have to do all three fishing matches to get the final star door? This is driving me nuts.

I think only the first one is required.

Which duel are you having problems? If you are in PC, try increasing the speed with CE and mashing the button with a brief stop every 2-3s. That should do the trick
Squire
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(08-13-2017, 08:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by hans_castorp

I think only the first one is required.

Which duel are you having problems? If you are in PC, try increasing the speed with CE and mashing the button with a brief stop every 2-3s. That should do the trick

I managed to finish it! Thanks anyway though.

I guess I have to do all the arena stages, too? Gonna try to clear Nightmare tomorrow.
hans_castorp
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(08-13-2017, 08:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

I managed to finish it! Thanks anyway though.

I guess I have to do all the arena stages, too? Gonna try to clear Nightmare tomorrow.

For the achievement I think everything is required
For the last door, if a door has several parts, only the first part is required. But don't quote me on this.

Nightmare Arena is amazing. Don't forget to bring Anelace to get her sword upgraded. And FastCraftsMan, you'll need him for the last fight lol.
Taruranto
<3 BioWare <3
(08-13-2017, 10:43 AM)
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Done with Zero's prologue.


A lot happened for a prologue, at one point I completely forgot I was playing the intro lol. It's definitely different from FC and CS's slow starts.

I didn't expect Estelle and Joshua to appear already too, I knew they did, but I thought they were going to appear in some kind of climax, instead they literally just walk into town lol.
Sinh_Magnus
Junior Member
(08-13-2017, 10:53 AM)
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Originally Posted by Taruranto

Done with Zero's prologue.

Yes, it's really something of a prologue. I could swear I put near 10 hours in it lol.

You are in for a wild ride.
SatelliteOfLove
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(08-13-2017, 02:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by fuzaco

Kevin is probably my favorite character in the whole series. He's basically Vash the Stampede.

It's mostly for that prologue, and that description is surpringly accurate.
DXLelouch153
Member
(08-13-2017, 05:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Taruranto

Done with Zero's prologue.


A lot happened for a prologue, at one point I completely forgot I was playing the intro lol. It's definitely different from FC and CS's slow starts.

I didn't expect Estelle and Joshua to appear already too, I knew they did, but I thought they were going to appear in some kind of climax, instead they literally just walk into town lol.

no spoilers but wait until Ao's prologue
escalated quickly would be putting it lightly
Aters
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(08-13-2017, 05:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by DXLelouch153

no spoilers but wait until Ao's prologue
escalated quickly would be putting it lightly

Not just the intro, the whole game. The pace is so fast compared to other Trails game.
hans_castorp
Member
(08-13-2017, 06:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aters

Not just the intro, the whole game. The pace is so fast compared to other Trails game.

The first half of Chapter 2 though...
Ao takes some time to start with the craziness.
Rhapsody
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(08-13-2017, 06:42 PM)
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It's amazing that thinking that Ao's not so crazy parts are pretty crazy relative to other Trails. When things get moving, it really kicked it into high gear lol
hans_castorp
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(08-13-2017, 06:48 PM)
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Indeed. Crosbell is when Falcom truly mastered the formula. It also helps that they didn't have to split a game in two like FC/SC or CSI/II.

The start of Chapter 4 or the battle against Arianrhod have yet to be topped.
Sinh_Magnus
Junior Member
(08-13-2017, 07:10 PM)
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I think Ao has some chapters that were for the most part big set-ups for other chapters.
I almost feel like I was playing two games in only one.
(Ao spoilers) Chapter 1 felt like the true prologue of the game and the first half of chapter 3 felt really slow, probably due to the fact that intermission preceded it. Thankfully things went crazy near the end of that chapter.
Thud
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(08-13-2017, 07:37 PM)
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Replaying FC with turbo mode. I'm into chapter 1 after meeting a certain individual again, this one slayed me:



There's one thing that stuck out for me in the prologue:

See how his eyes lit up. There's also one when Joshua is mentioned.
Palette Swap
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(08-13-2017, 09:06 PM)
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I'm nearly done replaying FC and yeah, there's a ton of other little things about "Alba". In the last two chapters, he even goes out of his way to move the plot forward.

What's kind of obvious but really striking about FC is that I can't think of another game that follows strictly 2 protagonists like that. (The remarkable thing being their character arc, obviously)
sorathecrow
Junior Member
(08-13-2017, 09:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Thud




See how his eyes lit up. There's also one when Joshua is mentioned.

I'm surprised I never noticed that, it's pretty unsettling seeing it again now.
Squire
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(08-13-2017, 09:38 PM)
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These Ao posts are killing me.

Honestly, I'm starting to feel like I'm going to have to deal with the reality that I'll most likely need to rely on emulating the game with the fan TL.
Rhapsody
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(08-13-2017, 10:29 PM)
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I see that the steam release for Cold Steel offers JP subtitles. Not asking about audio, but does the game really allow you to switch the entire text to JP?
Mivey
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(08-13-2017, 10:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

These Ao posts are killing me.

Honestly, I'm starting to feel like I'm going to have to deal with the reality that I'll most likely need to rely on emulating the game with the fan TL.

Did XSeed ever acknowledge the fan translation effort? Would be interesting if they could get in touch.
Scrooge McDuck
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(08-14-2017, 12:52 AM)
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Looking at some Sen III screenshots... is it just me or is Machias's hair actually greener than it was in the previous games?



It even sprouts leaves!
preta
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(08-14-2017, 01:03 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mivey

Did XSeed ever acknowledge the fan translation effort? Would be interesting if they could get in touch.

No, they have not. I don't really feel like it's all that likely they'll collaborate, either. Acquiring the fan translations for Ys Chronicles, Felghana and Origin, which are a lot smaller and easier to re-edit (and all done by the same team to begin with), is one thing, but I feel like if they were to do Zero/Ao, they'd probably want to start from scratch using the same translator and editor they've been using to assure the utmost consistency.

And obviously they'd never promote a fan translation effort for a product they're still trying to get to do officially, that'd just be bad for business.
Last edited by preta; 08-14-2017 at 01:12 AM.
SatelliteOfLove
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(08-14-2017, 01:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by Scrooge McDuck

Looking at some Sen III screenshots... is it just me or is Machias's hair actually greener than it was in the previous games?



It even sprouts leaves!

"I got this new shampoo from some priest named...Onion, was it? Nah, that can't be it... Really works though!"
Squire
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(08-14-2017, 01:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by preta

No, they have not. I don't really feel like it's all that likely, either. Acquiring the fan translations for Ys Chronicles, Felghana and Origin, which are a lot smaller and easier to re-edit (and all done by the same team to begin with), is one thing, but I feel like if they were to do Zero/Ao, they'd probably want to use the same translator and editor they've been using to assure the utmost consistency.

Floofy (RIP) made a good post about this on XSEEDs own forums where she pointed out that even if they got the fan TL, they'd need to do so much editing and consulting of the original JP script, they basically wouldn't even save time vs just translating the game themselves from scratch.
preta
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(08-14-2017, 01:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

Floofy (RIP) made a good post about this on XSEEDs own forums where she pointed out that even if they got the fan TL, they'd need to do so much editing and consulting of the original JP script, they basically wouldn't even save time vs just translating the game themselves from scratch.

Exactly. There'd be no point in going through the extra steps. I think that if they do get the license, they'll likely just C&D the fan translation.
Basileus777
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(08-14-2017, 01:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mivey

Did XSeed ever acknowledge the fan translation effort? Would be interesting if they could get in touch.

They've only commented on how they wouldn't use the Nayuta translation, which is hardly surprising as its machine translated garbage that could never fly in an official release.
preta
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(08-14-2017, 01:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by Basileus777

They've only commented on how they wouldn't use the Nayuta translation, which is hardly surprising as its machine translated garbage that could never fly in an official release.

A new effort (by a different team) has actually recently begun to retranslate Nayuta from scratch. Hopefully it turns out well this time.
Basileus777
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(08-14-2017, 01:31 AM)
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I just took a look at my Erebonia pin from my Cold Steel CE and I have never taken notice of how the Erebonian coat of arms is a really doofy looking horse. It looks like something from a meme, man that facial expression.
Tonton
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(08-14-2017, 01:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Rhapsody

I see that the steam release for Cold Steel offers JP subtitles. Not asking about audio, but does the game really allow you to switch the entire text to JP?

Didn't play much in Japanese but that's what it should do

Ys SEVEN should have it too
Last edited by Tonton; 08-14-2017 at 01:35 AM.
Squire
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(08-14-2017, 01:39 AM)
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Originally Posted by preta

Exactly. There'd be no point in going through the extra steps. I think that if they do get the license, they'll likely just C&D the fan translation.

If they needed to. I can't see them not just reaching out to the group and them ending things amicably themselves.
preta
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(08-14-2017, 01:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by Squire

If they needed to. I can't see them not just reaching out to the group and them ending things amicably themselves.

Well, yeah. I meant that or just asking them to stop working on it without formally sending an actual C&D notice.
Rhapsody
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(08-14-2017, 01:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by Tonton

Didn't play much in Japanese but that's what it should do

Ys SEVEN should have it too

That's pretty cool that it's offered. Ended up missing the Steam sale for the first weeks, but if I ever do get around to getting the steam port, I might mess with that setting a bit.
Thud
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(08-14-2017, 02:02 AM)
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Originally Posted by Basileus777

I just took a look at my Erebonia pin from my Cold Steel CE and I have never taken notice of how the Erebonian coat of arms is a really doofy looking horse. It looks like something from a meme, man that facial expression.

The golden stallion sounds like a perfect venture for stand up Erebonian comedy.
PK Gaming
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(08-14-2017, 02:04 AM)
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Originally Posted by Basileus777

I just took a look at my Erebonia pin from my Cold Steel CE and I have never taken notice of how the Erebonian coat of arms is a really doofy looking horse. It looks like something from a meme, man that facial expression.

Noticed this at the very beginning and boy could I not take it seriously

It looks like it has a filthy grin
kagamin
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(08-14-2017, 02:22 AM)
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Starting up on Cold Steel since I recently finished both Trails in the Sky SC and the 3rd in short succession, gonna take my time with this one so I don't burn myself out too badly though. That way I can fill the void within me until I can play Zero. :P
ThatChairMan
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(08-14-2017, 04:31 AM)
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Ao is amazing so far. Seeing the Trade Conference mentioned in CS firsthand was really great, as well as all the setup and references it makes to the other games.
Bowlie
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(08-14-2017, 05:04 AM)
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I finished Ch. 6 in SC, it finally happened T.T

I feel so happy with where the story is going, I hope I'm not done with it yet.
Gu4n
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(08-14-2017, 07:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by preta

Exactly. There'd be no point in going through the extra steps. I think that if they do get the license, they'll likely just C&D the fan translation.

In The Dark Revenant's case, I got a kind message from Tom suggesting I 'miiiight want to work on something else'.

Since no Western publisher owns the rights to the Crossbell games per Kondo's statement last month, a C&D would mean a publisher acquired the rights of the game(s). As I have said before, if XSEED (or another publisher) makes such an announcement, I will step away the project immediately like I did with The Dark Revenant.
Jolkien
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(08-14-2017, 08:50 AM)
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So I managed to ''get'' my hand on Zero and Ao fan translation, at first glance Zero seems pretty well done, no where near Xseed standard but the sentences flows well, Ao though is terrible, barely comprehensible.

I think I'll have to wait, and it's killing me.

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