• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

How hard is it to make a Star Wars action/adventure game?

Kaizer

Banned
In light of yesterday's news about EA shuttering Visceral & revamping their Star Wars title that was headed up by Amy Hennig, it's made me start thinking about the potential reasons why the game might've been a "mess". With now both, Star Wars 1313 & Visceral's game, we have two Star Wars titles that were supposed to push the franchise into the same AAA, action/adventure gaming space as titles like Horizon, Uncharted, Gears of War, etc. that have either been canned or are going through developmental struggles.

Now, obviously, most of us are not game developers (although I know we have quite a few GAF members who are), but we have all played dozens upon dozens of video games & have a general inclination for how games are designed. So, with that in mind, I thought it would be interesting to have a discussion about a few things:
* What do you think has potentially led to Visceral's Star Wars game being a mess?
* How would you go about making a Star Wars action/adventure game? Would you make it Linear, Open-World, Semi Open World? Straight up action title, Action RPG? Where in the timeline would you place it, etc.?
 

Auraela

Banned
Im genuinely suprised there isnt a star wars game Diablo style. It literally is just money in that universe. N the mobile game really isnt the same by all rights
 

Pie and Beans

Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
I think Hennig did the same thing with this Star Wars game that she did with Uncharted 4: too many gimmicks and trying to re-invent the wheel with ultimately nothing coming together in the end and a lack of strong directing.

A straight Nathan Drake but with a laser blaster game would have been a slam dunk, but you start introducing light-whips and other shit and you lose focus (Ballroom Dancing Mechanic was one thing Uncharted 4 was going to have!). It's a real shame we never got 1313 because that was looking gooooood and had a rock solid concept.

Dark Forces and Jedi Knight were excellent in the past, and while The Force Unleashed's got far too fanfiction nonsense, they were still competent videogames.

It wouldn't be hard to make a great Star Wars action adventure, but sadly a lot of the teams that would have nailed it (Raven, High Moon, etc) got absorbed into Activision and put to work on fucking map packs.

Platinum Games Saito lead Star Wars would be the real answer. (flush the Turtles/Korra team)
 
1. Get Raven Software (developers of Jedi Knight series)
2. Give them lots of money and ample time, as in not constrained to the movie release calendar
3. Don't constrain them to bullshit modern gaming dumbing down of mechanics and gameplay
4. ???
5. Have a good SW action/adventure game
 

JimiNutz

Banned
I don't think it's hard to make one.
I think EA looked at the market and looked at their own successes and failures. They saw that SP only games haven't been a huge success for them recently and they saw that most of the biggest games currently are games that at least have an online/social/multilayer aspect to them.

Rather than take a risk on a SP only action adventure game why not try something with a better chance at success? (based on their own market research and their analysis of the market).

I don't think the problem is the Star Wars IP itself. STAR Wars is a rich enough universe that they should easily be able to make an interesting SP action game if they wanted to.
 

Raven117

Gold Member
I think Hennig did the same thing with this Star Wars game that she did with Uncharted 4: too many gimmicks and trying to re-invent the wheel with ultimately nothing coming together in the end and a lack of strong directing.

)

Need to see the receipts on this one, pal.
 

Comet

Member
I think Hennig did the same thing with this Star Wars game that she did with Uncharted 4: too many gimmicks and trying to re-invent the wheel with ultimately nothing coming together in the end and a lack of strong directing.
What gimmicks did that game have exactly?
 

liquidtmd

Banned
I know people have issues with it, and especially the troubled sequel, but I really enjoyed Unleashed for what it was

An updated Tie Fighter game. A decent new Dark Forces. Hell, even a retro themed TFA based in the vein of the SNES Super Star Wars games. It's bemusing.

We got Battlefront 2 I guess, my experience with the Beta was mixed - veering positive
 

Kyoufu

Member
I feel like it's pointless for me to speculate about the issues Visceral had when I've seen -nothing- of the project.
 

Nicko

Member
Im genuinely suprised there isnt a star wars game Diablo style. It literally is just money in that universe. N the mobile game really isnt the same by all rights

By mobile game, are you referring to Star Wars Uprising? If not, it was a Star Wars Diablo-style game that was online for a whole whopping year before being shuttered. It was alright, but had so many flaws with the core gameplay loop.

Sadly I would guess Disney would never green-light another diablo style game as this one flopped and clearly means that no game ever in this style would be successful :p
 

giapel

Member
I think Disney needs to get a bit more hands on with it. Can't just hand the license to EA and hope for the best. It's baffling really.
 

Wedzi

Banned
Making games is hard no matter the IP. It's hard for me to speculate on what a proper Star Wars action/adventure game would really need.
 
To be fair to Star Wars 1313, it was a victim of the Disney buyout (as well as some rumored Lucas meddling to turn it in to a Boba Fett game).
 
I'm not going to play armchair developer here, so I'll decline to comment on how I would make a Star Wars game. I'll instead weigh in on why I think the game was "a mess". Blood Sweat and Pixels details just how much trouble the Mass Effect Andromeda devs had whilst trying to adapt the Frostbite engine to a different style of game. Given how long this game has been in development, I would not be surprised at all if the team at Visceral had similar issues.
 
What gimmicks did that game have exactly?

well we only know a bit of what Hennig team tried to do before it change hands to Druckley. it's in Blood, Sweat Pixel book. Hennig team tried a lot of new gameplay mechanic trying to reinvent Uncharted 4. they had dancing mini game that will be used only once during auction level. they had mechanic where you shoot wall and used the holes to climb wall. the rope mechanic initially have you manually aim where you want to throw your grappling hook.

these are example for some mechanics that they have, but apparently they haven't manage to make it come together as a whole. like the manual aim for grappling hook don't lend itself well during a shootout where you want to be able to quickly jump and swinging around quickly.

now that I think about it, I guess it kinda similar with Metal Gear Rising, they had this cool mechanic where you can cut anything in the level from stone pillar and watermelon. but that abilities really make designing the level difficult.
 
It was a lot easier 25 years ago...

super_star_wars.jpg
 

Auraela

Banned
By mobile game, are you referring to Star Wars Uprising? If not, it was a Star Wars Diablo-style game that was online for a whole whopping year before being shuttered. It was alright, but had so many flaws with the core gameplay loop.

Sadly I would guess Disney would never green-light another diablo style game as this one flopped and clearly means that no game ever in this style would be successful :p

That and the galaxy one currently.

Marvel ultimate alliance style but star wars.

Jedi/rebel 4 player co op or sith/troopers etc 4 player co op would be awesome shit with Diablo/rpg loot.


Even as an online game that shit would sell

Really am suprised this hasnt been done. Instead its always just shooters or playing as some rogue trooper or saber man lol
 
The MP servers of Jedi knight/outcast are still alive and they had great campaigns too. I'm sure something along those lines would still be welcomed
 
As much as I love Battlefront, I think limiting the license to EA was a mistake in the long run. Its been 4 years and we've seen 1 game released (well 2 very soon). They've got 6 more years of the license. What are they going to do? The only game that we know is in development is Respawn's game.

Criterion made the space gameplay for Battlefront II, why not have them make a Rogue Squadron or Starfighter game?
 

Marcel

Member
Games cost millions of dollars and involve hundreds of underpaid, exploited people who work themselves into exhaustion and mental illness with no safety net if almost anything goes south.

So yeah it's pretty hard dude.
 

Blam

Member
Some of the ideas you guys throw around for game ideas might sound great. But what sounds great is always never easy to make or even good in the end.
 

Crossing Eden

Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
but we have all played dozens upon dozens of video games & have a general inclination for how games are designed.
This is like saying that if you watch animated films you get a general inclination of how animation is made. It's far from the truth. People spend years of their lives learning about this things for a reason. It's hella complicated once you go beyond anything even remotely surface level. It's never easy. Even with the proper tools.
 

jdstorm

Banned
Why was Visceral's title canceled??? I will wait for Press Sneak Fuck to do his thing and get the real story

How hard is it to make a Star Wars Game?

Probably about as hard as it is to make any other game of the same ambition. I'm not a Dev and have no idea.

How would i go about making a Star Wars game?

1. Choose the type of game i wanted to make (TPS,RTS, ARPG, FPS, Flight Sim ect)
2. Talk to the good people at Lucasfilm about posibilities for narative synergy
3. Make a game
 

Roubjon

Member
Making any video game is very hard. I'd imagine making a video game that is funded by EA, while also trying to do something creatively interesting, while also trying to satisfy EA's needs, while also working with all the levels of bureaucracy that are likely involved in these AAA games, while also working with one of the most popular IPs in existence STAR WARS, is a very, very hard thing to do.
 

Marcel

Member
This is like saying that if you watch animated films you get a general inclination of how animation is made. It's far from the truth. People spend years of their lives learning about this things for a reason. It's hella complicated once you go beyond anything even remotely surface level. It's never easy. Even with the proper tools.

It's the same kind of logic that inspires people to shout at a football game and say that they could do a better job or be just as knowledgable as the coach or the professional players because they watch football every Sunday, lol.
 
Considering EA is in charge, it's pretty hard. The easiest way to do it would be to make a sequel or reboot of past great Star Wars games. However, with the exception of Battlefront, they only seek to want original star wars content of their own.
 

Stiler

Member
It still baffles me.

They got Bioware.
Fans want a new KOTOR and have for a long time.

EA: "Lets not give them a KOTOR."

Even if Bioware is focused on Anthem they could get Obsidian to do a new one if they don't want to wait on Bioware to finish Anthem.

I mean, imagine a new KOTOR on the scope of Mass Effect with it's more action focused combat (Jedi Knight style or better) but with the rpg'ness of Bioware's storytelling and dialogue systems that let you shape how your character plays out things.
 

dumbo

Member
The obvious problem is that your title will compared to battlefront2, especially the single player aspect. I suspect that's partly why battlefront1 did not have a proper single player mode.

If you were starting today, then I'd suggest:
- use frostbite so that you can piggy-back on DICE's insane assets/animations.
- focus on RPG aspects as DICE don't really do that.
- make it open-world. (I think making a linear game is unfairly financially penalized).
- make the main character a Jedi to avoid endless comparisons to battlefront's gunplay.
 
Making any game is incredibly hard.

To make a great game you can't screw up even one aspect of it. Everything has to come together. The sum of the parts is greater than the whole.

Game development is like any other skilled occupation. Most people are complete fuckwits and can barely perform in the role they're employed to the correct specification and quality.

So it's far more likely that a game will fail rather than hitting it out of the park. No one sets out to make a bad product but in reality very few people understand and can articulate what makes a good one to the rest of the team. So things eventually go off course during development and very rarely ever come back.
 

jdstorm

Banned
It still baffles me.

They got Bioware.
Fans want a new KOTOR and have for a long time.

EA: "Lets not give them a KOTOR."

Even if Bioware is focused on Anthem they could get Obsidian to do a new one if they don't want to wait on Bioware to finish Anthem.

I mean, imagine a new KOTOR on the scope of Mass Effect with it's more action focused combat (Jedi Knight style or better) but with the rpg'ness of Bioware's storytelling and dialogue systems that let you shape how your character plays out things.

EA clearly want their The Old Republic MMO to replicate that experience.

I will happily talk crap about EA, but i just don't see the point of this. (And i love KotOR 1)
 
Top Bottom