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Shawn Layden: PlayStation's strengths are creating stories, characters, emotions

There are a lot of nice things to take away from this overall article, as a fan of Sony's story-driven games.

The list showed by SolidSnakex speaks for itself, and while I'm no fan of Sony pulling out of broader indie-funding to support VR instead, I understand and acknowledge the business realities there.. And it's not like there aren't other publishers like Annapurna who's doing a good job supporting indies these days compared to before.

That being said, the GAAS part of it is... part of it is your fault. If we look at San Diego's F2P initiatives, along with stuff like Drawn to Death, it speaks pretty clearly that your GAAS/F2P experiments had a very low budget compared to your flagship studios.

There are a lot of competition in the GAAS space, and while cheap inititives mean failure isn't studio-closing, but when indie devs like Digital Extremes can pull off Warframe, you need big investments to stay in the GAAS space.

Budget is only one piece of the puzzle. The skill and experience of the developer is another. San Diego studio isn't known for huge AAA productions, so it's obvious why Sony might be reluctant to gamble to studio away on hugely risky GaaS project by a dev so unproven. Drawn to Death was made by David Jaffe's studio, who by Jaffe's own admission doesn't seem interested in going back to huge mainstream AAA games. Even if they were it would be the same situation.

Sony's most proven studios, e.g. ND, GG, Sucker Punch etc, likely simply aren't interested in making GaaS games, since Sony seems to give them the freedom to each forge their own path and choose their own projects.
 

Sami+

Member
Their games have been my absolute favorites for a long time for that reason, alongside other games with similar a similar design philosophy.
 
I think their 'on rails' cinematic games, while good, do tend to all merge into one. Also they often have very average gameplay mechanics hidden behind fluff. But they still have very good variety with other games, just famously week on the multiplayer side.

Ugh...

Personally I prefer strong core mechanics, emergent gameplay, multiplayer and more open ended sandbox like design. Nintendo >= Xbox > PlayStation.

But it's all good, each of the 'big three' have a different main style and that's great for options. It would be a shame if they all focused on the same thing.

Well it's a good thing that Sony provides all that as well.
 
Stories in video games never did anything for me, and I never cared about them. It was never the motivation for me to continue playing. Instead, gameplay was.

Except I recently played Read Dead Redemption for the first time on Xboner since I missed it on 360. And this was the first time I ever felt the opposite: where the story was compelling me to continue the game, and not the gameplay (cause the gameplay was sorta shit).

This still hasn't happened with any Sony game made so far, but now that I'm open to the experience, I'm looking forward to more of their output.

Although multiplayer games are still my bread and butter
.
 

jayu26

Member
Stories are usually better with books.

So glad folks still make movies. Even tho other mediums do it better.

Why does everything have to be so black or white, no middle ground?
See I am not sure about that. Best example I can give is the "Hodor thing" from last season in Game of Thrones. As far as storytelling is concerned, it will be very hard to replicate the audio-visual impact of that scene with words alone.

Then there is Bioshock twist. In movies or books that twist would be just another standard twist. It is would pretty good twist in those medium but it would be nothing like impact it has on players and the philosophical pondering that follows because of the fact that you were playing as Jack.

Every medium as its strength in storytelling, question is how well are artists able to exploit those strengths.
Have you played a David Cage game?
Oh no, not a modern day point and click adventure game! Oh the horror!
 
I never got the notion that Story driven games means bad gameplay :/

UC,TLOU,HZD all have good gameplay.

Same.
I mean those three games all have excellent game play in my humble opinion.
Horizon in particulars controls are smooth as fuck, gives me MGS V vibes.

Helps that those titles all have great stories too...
 

Haganeren

Member
Lol, tell this to MLB The Show.

Last of Us is nothing like Uncharted.

... Are you SURE about that ?
I mean, for exemple, i could tell you that Touhou is nothing like Dodonpachi and i would absolutely mean it. But i LOVE shmup, so i can see all the difference which mean i hate when someone tell that. Same with Guilty Gear and Steet Fighter, they are absolutely nothing alike from my point of view but for a lot of people "they are 2D fighting game" and that's it... And i understand that.

I don't like TPS games too much, i loved game like Tomb Raider, Splatoon, Ratchet & Clank which means i can play those game from time to time. I also love Darker Tone and shooting. System Shock 1 & 2 is one of my greatest exemple, i'm sure Project Zero won't count (hey! you shoot ghost from a first person perspective !), but can like a lot stuff like Baroque and i'm actually quite fan of horror point & click (I have no mouth and i must scream, Sanitarium, The Last Door, even lesser game like The Last Chamber)

So i can like TPS, and i can like horror games, but Uncharted was REALLY boring to me. (Even the second opus which is really sad to me.. As i said earlier i would have loved to like those games) If the difference between Uncharted and The Last Of Us is that there is a "little more stealth" in Last of Us. Sorry, but it's still the same game to me... And a lot of other persons... Since I'm not a big fan of TPS game, i won't appreciate little differences even if they seems considerable for a fan.

So i ask again, are you REALLY SURE, i can go play The last of Us and i won't have the impression to play Uncharted again with a darker tone and more situation where you have to be discrete ? I mean, maybe i won't like it, but it's not important, i just ask if i won't have the impression to play Uncharted again.

And if you're THAT sure then... Well... I may give it a shot...
 

Lifeline

Member
How does this mean that Sony games have bad gameplay?

Horizon: Zero Dawn has one of the best gameplay in the open world genre, only below Dragons Dogma for me.

The Last of Us Multiplayer did Rainbow Six Seige style intense battles before Rainbow Six.

If the differnet between Uncharted and The Last Of Us is that there is a "little more stealth" in Last of Us. Sorry, but it's still the same game to me... And a lot of other persons.

No they're completely different third person shooters. You can't even jump in Last of Us while Uncharted is all about jumping everywhere and climbing shit. Last of Us is slower paced, stealth focused gameplay where you have to set traps and distract enemies.

You can't set traps, distract enemies, etc in Uncharted. For the first 3, you could barely even stealth.

Last of Us gameplay is also big on resource management and crafting, while Uncharted you had pretty much unlimited ammo and no crafting or collecting items.

All of this Uncharted and Last of Us are the same comments come from people who haven't played them.
 

jayu26

Member
... Are you SURE about that ?
I mean, for exemple, i could tell you that Touhou is nothing like Dodonpachi and i would absolutely mean it. But i LOVE shmup, so i can see all the difference which mean i hate when someone tell that. Same with Guilty Gear and Steet Fighter, they are absolutely nothing alike from my point of view but for a lot of people "they are 2D fighting game" and that's it... And i understand that.

I don't like TPS games too much, i loved game like Tomb Raider, Splatoon, Ratchet & Clank which means i can play those game from time to time. I also love Darker Tone and shooting. System Shock 1 & 2 is one of my greatest exemple, i'm sure Project Zero won't count (hey! you shoot ghost from a first person perspective !), but can like a lot stuff like Baroque and i'm actually quite fan of horror point & click (I have no mouth and i must scream, Sanitarium, The Last Door, even lesser game like The Last Chamber)

So i can like TPS, and i can like horror games, but Uncharted was REALLY boring to me. (Even the second opus which is really sad to me.. As i said earlier i would have loved to like those games) If the difference between Uncharted and The Last Of Us is that there is a "little more stealth" in Last of Us. Sorry, but it's still the same game to me... And a lot of other persons... Since I'm not a big fan of TPS game, i won't appreciate little differences even if they seems considerable for a fan.

So i ask again, are you REALLY SURE, i can go play The last of Us and i won't have the impression to play Uncharted again with a darker tone and more situation where you have to be discrete ? What's the difference then ? And if you're THAT sure then... Well... I may give it a shot...
The Last of Us nothing like Uncharted.

You can play it like a third person shooter and then you can make a thread about how jayu26 led you astray. But then you are just going to have multiple posts telling you that you shouldn't have played it like a third person shooter. Actually, on hard, which is the correct difficulty to play that game on, you literally can't play it as shooter because you will run out of bullets.
 

Hahs

Member
I agree with Layden on the scaled back presentation this year. Regardless of how excited I get to see new games - the shit shouldn't feel like an early morning lecture, and this time it didn't; I actually was asking for more..so it worked I think?
 

Mosse

Neo Member
... Are you SURE about that ?
I mean, for exemple, i could tell you that Touhou is nothing like Dodonpachi and i would absolutely mean it. But i LOVE shmup, so i can see all the difference which mean i hate when someone tell that. Same with Guilty Gear and Steet Fighter, they are absolutely nothing alike from my point of view but for a lot of people "they are 2D fighting game" and that's it... And i understand that.

I don't like TPS games too much, i loved game like Tomb Raider, Splatoon, Ratchet & Clank which means i can play those game from time to time. I also love Darker Tone and shooting. System Shock 1 & 2 is one of my greatest exemple, i'm sure Project Zero won't count (hey! you shoot ghost from a first person perspective !), but can like a lot stuff like Baroque and i'm actually quite fan of horror point & click (I have no mouth and i must scream, Sanitarium, The Last Door, even lesser game like The Last Chamber)

So i can like TPS, and i can like horror games, but Uncharted was REALLY boring to me. (Even the second opus which is really sad to me.. As i said earlier i would have loved to like those games) If the difference between Uncharted and The Last Of Us is that there is a "little more stealth" in Last of Us. Sorry, but it's still the same game to me... And a lot of other persons... Since I'm not a big fan of TPS game, i won't appreciate little differences even if they seems considerable for a fan.

So i ask again, are you REALLY SURE, i can go play The last of Us and i won't have the impression to play Uncharted again with a darker tone and more situation where you have to be discrete ? I mean, maybe i won't like it, but it's not important, i just ask if i won't have the impression to play Uncharted again.

And if you're THAT sure then... Well... I may give it a shot...

In Uncharted you are running and gunning, jumping around from cover to cover and playing through cool and explosive set-pieces. In The last of us you always have to plan every encounter and make every bullet count since there are few of them. While Uncharted is more like a playable action/adventure movie, The Last of us is more personal and grounded in both story and gameplay. I can see how they may look similar on the surface since they are both third person shooters from the same developer, but they play nothing alike.
 

Haganeren

Member
No they're completely different third person shooters. You can't even jump in Last of Us while Uncharted is all about jumping everywhere and climbing shit. Last of Us is slower paced, stealth focused gameplay where you have to set traps and distract enemies.

You can't set traps, distract enemies, etc in Uncharted. For the first 3, you could barely even stealth.

Last of Us gameplay is also big on resource management and crafting, while Uncharted you had pretty much unlimited ammo and no crafting or collecting items.

All of this Uncharted and Last of Us are the same comments come from people who haven't played them.

The Last of Us nothing like Uncharted.

You can play it like a third person shooter and then you can make a thread about how jayu26 led you astray. But then you are just going to have multiple posts telling you that you shouldn't have played it like a third person shooter. Actually, on hard, which is the correct difficulty to play that game on, you literally can't play it as shooter because you will run out of bullets.

In Uncharted you are running and gunning, jumping around from cover to cover and playing through cool and explosive set-pieces. In The last of us you always have to plan every encounter and make every bullet count since there are few of them. While Uncharted is more like a playable action/adventure movie, The Last of us is more personal and grounded in both story and gameplay. I can see how they may look similar on the surface since they are both third person shooters from the same developer, but they play nothing alike.

Hum, ok, personally i never saw Uncharted as a game with a "lot of jumping" to be honest. (Ratchet & Clank is totally different on that aspect for exemple) So i only have reserve on that, but the "survival" aspect on Last of Us seems more developped than i thought so i'm convinced.

I'm even glad i asked since i have some advice about how to play the game now. (Hard difficulty, always go to stealth apporeach if i want to enjoy the game more, etc)
I will give it a play, one day... The PS4 version without a doubt.

How do people not know what the Last of Us plays like?

It's one of those games that everybody can't stop talking about.

Well, easy, since i was disappointed in Uncharted i only watched people play The Last of Us and from an exterior perspective, it looked like a TPS game with a little more stealth... (And i always try to play "stealth" in Uncharted.... And always fail by the way...)
So yeah, i had my doubts.
 

Diablos

Member
There is also brilliant gameplay within what he describes as strengths... he could have worded it better.

TLOU for example. Yes, the story, setting and characters suck you in. But the game is also really fun to play and keeps you on your toes.

Same can be said for HZD... in fact I found that game more fun to just play and was not so interested in the finer details of the story outside of the main plot. Not that it was bad, but to me it's just first and foremost a really fun game to play and explore
 

jayu26

Member
Hum, ok, personally i never saw Uncharted as a game with a "lot of jumping" to be honest. (Ratchet & Clank is totally different on that aspect for exemple) So i only have reserve on that, but the "survival" aspect on Last of Us seems more developped than i thought so i'm convinced.

I'm even glad i asked since i have some advice about how to play the game now. (Hard difficulty, always go to stealth apporeach if i want to enjoy the game more, etc)
I will give it a play, one day... The PS4 version without a doubt.
With Uncharted if you don't like shooting, do what Vinny Caravella does. Drop difficulty to easy and always run and gun. The idea is to be always on verge of dying but making it through just in the nick of time. That means don't always go for headshots and don't be afraid to dump an entire clip because there is always more ammo. And always be jumping and rolling and moving around. You can also keep shooting while you are doing crazy acrobatics. Too often people play it like Gears, Uncharted is not Gears.
 
And neither is GaaS system failing.

Microsoft, Nintendo, EA, Ubisoft, Activision, Blizzard, they all can make it work.

And who even claimed that? You're moving the goal-posts.

Your point was about the viability of SP games. The market for SP games is in many ways independent of that for MP or GaaS games.

SP games, however, being narrative-driven experiences, require relatively larger investments in production (i.e. writing, voice talent, animation, set-piece design etc), whereas GaaS games being primarily MP and systems orientated, can be comparatively less capital-intensive, and yet more lucrative because of the higher sales ceiling (being mostly MP games).

So it's no reason why big AAA pubs are moving towards GaaS, since there are more opportunities to monetize consumers, unit sales tend to be higher and the more systems-oriented design templates can be re-used to provide projects that overall carry far less commercial risk.

That GaaS games carry comparatively less risk than traditional SP games, doesn't mean there isn't a market for AAA SP games.
 

Sotha_Sil

Member
I respect their strategy and talent, even if their games don't interest me much. I wish all developers released games with the level of the polish WWS does.
 

Lifeline

Member
I'm even glad i asked since i have some advice about how to play the game now. (Hard difficulty, always go to stealth apporeach if i want to enjoy the game more, etc)
I will give it a play, one day... The PS4 version without a doubt.

I played in Hard mode and manually turned off listen mode. I naturally try to play games in stealth as much as possible, in UC1-3 it was basically impossible. The Last of Us does it much better.
 
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