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‘The Walking Dead’ – Season 7, Part 2 – Sundays on AMC

Z

ZOONAMI

Junior Member
Godan said:
Have a feeling that Enid is part of the saviours and that's how Negan knows what Rick ans co has planned.
Click to expand...

I had wondered why there wasn't more thought given to the trash people already working for the saviors.

Jadis:
Like, hey, we need a bunch of guns.

Rick: Ok, cool, if you fight with us.

Jadis: .... (you really aren't going to ask why we need the guns? To give them to the fucking saviors you idiot).
 
T

TS-08

Member
ZOONAMI said:
I had wondered why there wasn't more thought given to the trash people already working for the saviors.

Enid:
Like, hey, we need a bunch of guns.

Rick: Ok, cool, if you fight with us.

Enid: .... (you really aren't going to ask why we need the guns? To give them to the fucking saviors you idiot).
Click to expand...

Enid is the girl at Alexandria who hangs out with Carl.
 
D

dustyherb

Member
ZOONAMI said:
I had wondered why there wasn't more thought given to the trash people already working for the saviors.

Enid:
Like, hey, we need a bunch of guns.

Rick: Ok, cool, if you fight with us.

Enid: .... (you really aren't going to ask why we need the guns? To give them to the fucking saviors you idiot).
Click to expand...
Enid isn't part of The Scavengers. She's the girl that lives at The Hilltop now and likes Carl. Jadis is the leader of The Scavengers.
 
jm89

jm89

Member
Eugene is such a piece of shit may you die horribly.

I think all that rick and co will do in the finale is weaken the saviours enough so negan retreats back so alexandria, hilltop and the kingdom are free. I'd be satisfied with that finale.
 
M

mr.beers

Member
Surfinn said:
I think most people like it WOW JUMPSCARES.
Click to expand...


I am ok with Gregory getting snuck up on because he's a noob and frightened add on the noise from Maggie fighting the other. The other times when it's the main group it bothers me.

Don Draper's Hat said:
Why do they always seem to grapple with the zombies too? It's like they purposely wait to get grabbed before deciding to kill. There was no reason for Maggie to be in a tussle. Just trip the fucking thing up and knife it.
Click to expand...

Very true. They proved at Oceanside this episode it's not necessary.
 
D

Don Draper's Hat

Member
Why do they always seem to grapple with the zombies too? It's like they purposely wait to get grabbed before deciding to kill. There was no reason for Maggie to be in a tussle. Just trip the fucking thing up and knife it.
 
J

jett

D-Member
Dem stealth zombies. Not sure what's worse, supply runs or ZOMBIESOUTTANOWHERE

I hope stuff happens next week.
 
B

border

Member
Am I the only one that enjoys Gregory? He's such a spineless, conniving little weasel.....yet I think he's my favorite new character after Negan & Simon.
 
jm89

jm89

Member
border said:
Am I the only one that enjoys Gregory? He's such a spineless, conniving little weasel.....yet I think he's my favorite new character after Negan & Simon.
Click to expand...

I guess shows like this need some plonker that you can just laugh at.
 
Z

ZOONAMI

Junior Member
And no I don't think Enid is a savior. That makes like zero sense. Would be a crazy twist I guess if she is Negan's daughter and that's why Negan let Carl off so easy.

All she really is though is Sophia replacement.
 
H

hatmoza

Member
People have many issues with season 7 being boring. I do not mind the slow burning and actually think it's necessary. My problem is Negan himself. Hear me out.

Negan was introduced as this brilliant, strategic, charismatic leader of a powerful group. Fourteen episodes later and I cannot believe his character contradicts where he has become as that leader. His introduction was flawless, and it matches why he's still in charge with no blow back from his own followers... his decisions since then make him seem like a completely different character and an incompetent leader.

A leader such as him wouldn't have made it as far as he has had he been making his decisions pre-Rick as he has since bashing in Abraham and Glenn's heads.

He's letting threatening opposers off easy:
He let Daryl live after blatantly letting him know on several occasions that he will not bow
He let Carl live after finding his base and killing 2 of his men
He let Rosita live after an assassination attempt on his life
As of now, Sasha is imprisoned for a separate assassination attempt
Yet he kills his own people on a whim:
He killed his doctor
He killed David

Just to keep my point brief i'll wrap it up in two simple conclusions:
1-Negan only started making these dumb decision post meeting Rick's group which makes him a complete moron. Why be so consistently brutal with other communities but suddenly give this random group (that killed a shit tonne off your people) so many second chances? KILL the obvious threats. Kill you Carls your Daryls, and Rositas. That would make it more believable as a leader who made it as far as you. In my opinion, this makes Negan inconsistent, not believable. It's also bad writing.

2-Negan has always made dumb decisions like this which makes it even more unbelievable that no one has taken him out already.

Like I said, Negan was only believable in the first episode of season 7. He even killed what was in fact the most immediate threat to him to solidify his believable role. By killing Abraham he made his character seem intelligent -kill my immediate threats.

TL;DR Negan wouldn't have survived this far if he hadn't killed any immediate threats to him. Everyone in Rick's group who harmed/attempted to kill him should have been put to death to make his character more believable.

PS This is just a criticism. I still watch the show and I'm a huge fan. I love Negan and think he's a unique villain but the show is not making his existence believable.
 
H

hatmoza

Member
border said:
Am I the only one that enjoys Gregory? He's such a spineless, conniving little weasel.....yet I think he's my favorite new character after Negan & Simon.
Click to expand...

I love him but I think its the movie buff in me that recognizes him from several different roles in several of my favorite movies (like GATTACA) and several of my favorite popcorn movies (Airforce 1) that make me like him more as an actor rather than that spineless Gregory.
 
Y

Yabberwocky

Member
The best part of the episode was a) Eric continuing the trend of speaking full sentences, b) Eric bringing the 100% snark. What a wasted opportunity to not have him snarking his way through the last season and a half. Jordan Woods-Robinson has been a really pleasant surprise in the last few episodes.

hatmoza said:
People have many issues with season 7 being boring. I do not mind the slow burning and actually think it's necessary. My problem is Negan himself. Hear me out.

Negan was introduced as this brilliant, strategic, charismatic leader of a powerful group. Fourteen episodes later and I cannot believe his character contradicts where he has become as that leader. His introduction was flawless, and it matches why he's still in charge with no blow back from his own followers... his decisions since then make him seem like a completely different character and an incompetent leader.

A leader such as him wouldn't have made it as far as he has had he been making his decisions pre-Rick as he has since bashing in Abraham and Glenn's heads.

He's letting threatening opposers off easy:
He let Daryl live after blatantly letting him know on several occasions that he will not bow
He let Carl live after finding his base and killing 2 of his men
He let Rosita live after an assassination attempt on his life
As of now, Sasha is imprisoned for a separate assassination attempt
Yet he kills his own people on a whim:
He killed his doctor
He killed David

Just to keep my point brief i'll wrap it up in two simple conclusions:
1-Negan only started making these dumb decision post meeting Rick's group which makes him a complete moron. Why be so consistently brutal with other communities but suddenly give this random group (that killed a shit tonne off your people) so many second chances? KILL the obvious threats. Kill you Carls your Daryls, and Rositas. That would make it more believable as a leader who made it as far as you. In my opinion, this makes Negan inconsistent, not believable. It's also bad writing.

2-Negan has always made dumb decisions like this which makes it even more unbelievable that no one has taken him out already.

Like I said, Negan was only believable in the first episode of season 7. He even killed what was in fact the most immediate threat to him to solidify his believable role. By killing Abraham he made his character seem intelligent -kill my immediate threats.

TL;DR Negan wouldn't have survived this far if he hadn't killed any immediate threats to him. Everyone in Rick's group who harmed/attempted to kill him should have been put to death to make his character more believable.

PS This is just a criticism. I still watch the show and I'm a huge fan. I love Negan and think he's a unique villain but the show is not making his existence believable.
Click to expand...

You make a ton of great points. I always get so frustrated when shows override sensible character decisions over the need to drive the plot (or give character's plot armor), and that's kind of TV!Negan's decisions in a nutshell. TV!Negan seems like a bit of an idiotic joke in comparison to Comic!Negan, which is such a waste, I was really looking forward to seeing him on TV. The only two decisions between the Negans that 100% line up with each other is keeping Carl alive after killing some of Negan's men, but Carl in the comics was a bit younger at this point than his TV counterpart, so it made more sense in context.
 
D

Dereck

Member
Not sure if bad acting or great acting.

LplScRJ.gif
 
J

J2 Cool

Member
Nokagi said:
I like that we're seeing Rick's group, Negan's place and Hilltop in one episode. The show is so much better when it's not focused on one place or one set of characters for the entire episode.
Click to expand...

100x this. I can't stand seeing something like Abraham/Glenn killed, and then we spend an episode hanging out in a retirement home with Morgan and Carol next ep. Was worried Rosita/Sasha incident would happen, and then we hang out with the Mad Max chicks for an episode. Fuck that.
 
B

border

Member
hatmoza said:
Like I said, Negan was only believable in the first episode of season 7. He even killed what was in fact the most immediate threat to him to solidify his believable role. By killing Abraham he made his character seem intelligent -kill my immediate threats.
Click to expand...

I think it's a mistake to assume he killed Abraham deliberately. He's an eccentric, thrill-seeking sociopath. It's entirely possible that his game of Eenie Meenie was entirely random, and he just happened to land on the most physically imposing member of Rick's group.

Logistically, the only reason he picks Abraham was because the character was already dead in the comics and the writers wanted to fake people out into thinking Glenn was safe.

Why does he keep trying to recruit Alexandrians into his gang, instead of murdering them? Presumably because it has worked out before. Obviously he wanted to keep Daryl around as collateral so the Alexandrians would not retaliate.....might as well have him try to earn his keep. Carl's a kid, and Negan probably wants to avoid murdering kids. Eugene is such a soft, whiny intellectual type that could easily be broken and converted into a Savior. Keeping Sasha alive is the only thing that doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Negan has a certain respect for foolhardy bravery, so in some ways I can kinda see why he wouldn't immediately murder Carl or Sasha.
 
R

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
More_Badass said:
So have they even mentioned Heath since that Oceanside episode? No one asked Tara about him when she got back? I can't recall
Click to expand...

The show isn't very good about addressing when a character goes missing - they either make way too big a deal out of it (the Sophia thing spanned half of season 2) or it just gets ignored (Beth, Heath).
 
R

Rehynn

Member
I cringe so hard every time Maggie speaks. I can't believe the actress still can't do an at least halfway convincing Southern accent.
 
FUNKNOWN iXi

FUNKNOWN iXi

Member
mr.beers said:
Very true. They proved at Oceanside this episode it's not necessary.
Click to expand...
Speaking of Oceanside, it felt incredibly forced when they showed the little girl killing a zombie lol. In that scenario no zombie would have broken through the front line or not have been killed by someone else, but hey.. gotta give those moments out, huh? ;b
 
M

MarkMclovin

Member
Don Draper's Hat said:
Why do they always seem to grapple with the zombies too? It's like they purposely wait to get grabbed before deciding to kill. There was no reason for Maggie to be in a tussle. Just trip the fucking thing up and knife it.
Click to expand...

I literally said this just before it happened. They always get right in close enough to have to push it away, and then shove the knife in.

The zombies in this show just need to be nothing but background stuff now.
 
T

tootie923

Member
border said:
Am I the only one that enjoys Gregory? He's such a spineless, conniving little weasel.....yet I think he's my favorite new character after Negan & Simon.
Click to expand...

I've always enjoyed his work, especially on Nikita. I can never remember his TWD name, so I call him Percy.
 
A

Alpende

Member
I enjoyed this episode a lot more than the previous one. Mainly because it had Negan in it. I just hope AMC sees that having multiple storylines in one episode actually works and you don't have to have 1 episode for 1 storyline. That shit drags.
 
H

hatmoza

Member
border said:
I think it's a mistake to assume he killed Abraham deliberately. He's an eccentric, thrill-seeking sociopath. It's entirely possible that his game of Eenie Meenie was entirely random, and he just happened to land on the most physically imposing member of Rick's group.

Logistically, the only reason he picks Abraham was because the character was already dead in the comics and the writers wanted to fake people out into thinking Glenn was safe.

Why does he keep trying to recruit Alexandrians into his gang, instead of murdering them? Presumably because it has worked out before. Obviously he wanted to keep Daryl around as collateral so the Alexandrians would not retaliate.....might as well have him try to earn his keep. Carl's a kid, and Negan probably wants to avoid murdering kids. Eugene is such a soft, whiny intellectual type that could easily be broken and converted into a Savior. Keeping Sasha alive is the only thing that doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Negan has a certain respect for foolhardy bravery, so in some ways I can kinda see why he wouldn't immediately murder Carl or Sasha.
Click to expand...

Abraham was no mistake. He was analyzed and chosen deliberately. In interviews, Michael Cudlitz and Jeffery Dean Morgan both said that Negan was observing, studying, and measuring up each character in the line-up and that his pick was Abraham because Abraham came off as highly defiant and as someone who would want to take the fight to Negan if he was let go. Also... your point that he chose Abraham because of the comics is honestly... lol. Many characters in the comics that are dead are alive or outlived their counterparts, deaths have also been swapped on several occasions. Unless you want to use the character's comic death ITSELF as a metric, using the comic as a metric for cause of OTHER types of deaths on the show is silly on so many levels.

Keeping Carl, Rosita, and Sasha alive is stupid from a logistical point of view. They tried to kill him. There are too many red flags that Alexandria is a threat. You don't let threats live and you don't try to recruit them, for example Daryl. Logistically a menacing and convincing Negan would have killed Daryl after his multiple blatant defiances. It's unbelievable, and it's bad writing. I can understand recruiting cowards like Eugene, I even understand using Sasha as future leverage (if that's where the show is going) but just letting Rosita and Carl go was stupid. Point in case, Rosita didn't waste time trying to kill Negan again. Like I said, if Negan regularly lets threats go it's unbelievable that he has survived this long.
 
H

hatmoza

Member
Yabberwocky said:
The best part of the episode was a) Eric continuing the trend of speaking full sentences, b) Eric bringing the 100% snark. What a wasted opportunity to not have him snarking his way through the last season and a half. Jordan Woods-Robinson has been a really pleasant surprise in the last few episodes.



You make a ton of great points. I always get so frustrated when shows override sensible character decisions over the need to drive the plot (or give character's plot armor), and that's kind of TV!Negan's decisions in a nutshell. TV!Negan seems like a bit of an idiotic joke in comparison to Comic!Negan, which is such a waste, I was really looking forward to seeing him on TV. The only two decisions between the Negans that 100% line up with each other is keeping Carl alive after killing some of Negan's men, but Carl in the comics was a bit younger at this point than his TV counterpart, so it made more sense in context.
Click to expand...

Thanks. You are absolutely correct. At the end of the day all the inconsistencies and bad writing are plot devices (and even plot armor) to move the story forward. I still enjoy the show. I'm a huge fan, but I'm not an annoying fan who defends the show blindly. I will criticize it.

Don't get me started on Arya Stark in Game of Thrones. If Negan isn't believable, Arya is imaginary!!!
 
R

Red Liquorice

Member
I just feel like they're not going to kill Negan off until the end of the next season, so basically season 8 will just more of the same as this season. This show has no progress, it goes from one super villain clan leader to the next.
 
J

JoeNut

Member
Next season needs to be the end of this show, next episode will only be the start of an attack, no conclusion or anything worthwhile, next series will be the actual battle between crews and the show needs to end as they've dragged it on waaay too long.

frustrating show which is brilliant at times, but it's surely come to it's end now.

This whole season could've been 6 episodes max.
 
G

GreySquirrel

Member
Wish people would stop openly talking about the previews. I purposely avoid them because I consider them spoilers :/ May go back to avoiding this thread completely but I enjoy reading people's opinions of aired episodes
 
B

Baraka in the White House

2-Terms of Kombat
Red Liquorice said:
I just feel like they're not going to kill Negan off until the end of the next season, so basically season 8 will just more of the same as this season. This show has no progress, it goes from one super villain clan leader to the next.
Click to expand...

They're not gonna kill Negan. Rick will probably assume leadership over what's left of the Saviors but contrive some dumb reason to keep Negan alive.
 
A

awesome_pants

Banned
I think the big issue with this show is a mix of spanning out the narrative so it does surpass the source materials (the comics) mixed with writing for the large ensemble cast. Since the comics are still on-going, the writers have to find ways of focusing more on character development instead of plot development. This is polar opposite of something like Game of Thrones in which the source material is "somewhat" complete i.e. the story (even though the books are not done). This allows the writers to focus more-so on different characters arc interweaved with the overarching plot development. I think this episode worked is because we got a taste of that format in which we focused on 3 different groups (Saviors, Hillside, Oceanside) each contributing a little bit to the plot of the oncoming season finale.

It starting to sound like if ratings and viewers keep falling due to dull filler episodes, the writers need to decide if they should introduce an entirely new plot point/story point or keep moving forward from the comics with Kirkman focusing on progressing the story of the show over the comics.
 
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