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Aaron Strife
Honk if you love cookies.
(06-15-2017, 06:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ogodei

I have faith in the Reid Machine in Nevada. Assuming they don't completely punt on governor again and just cede the downballot because of that.

That's the thing, we need two solid candidates, one for governor and one for Senate.

It'd be nice if Ross Miller and Kate Marshall both ran for one or the other, though they both have loser stink on them. Still, I'm not sure who else there is.
benjipwns
Every man has a property in his own person. This nobody has a right to, but himself.
(06-15-2017, 06:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by nature boy

Uh, why?

I thought that was Rand and Lee?

Originally Posted by Joe Shlabotnik

I would say this is astounding considering the scope of the special counsel in the '90s but I suppose nothing is astounding anymore

The independent counsel statute that Ken Starr operated under in the 1990's was completely different from the special counsel that Mueller is operating under and everyone else including the Watergate investigator operated under. The IC statute basically meant he could dig forever at anything he deemed even remotely related, take over other cases to fold them into his own, have a guaranteed untouchable budget, etc.

That's why I keep posting about how Congress doesn't want it back, they saw what they unleashed when they let loose the IC on Whitewater.
benicillin
Member
(06-15-2017, 06:48 PM)
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Originally Posted by nature boy

Uh, why?

He doesn't think we should be adding sanctions to Iran right now. John Kerry also said it could imperil the nuclear deal.

EDIT:

“On a day when Iran has been attacked by ISIS, by terrorism, now is not the time to go forward with legislation calling for sanctions against Iran,” Vermont’s Independent Sen. Bernie Sanders said on the floor before the Senate did just that. “Let us be aware and cognizant that earlier today the people of Iran suffered a horrific terror attack in their capital, Tehran.”

The vote also came in the face of warnings from former Secretary of State John Kerry that a new sanctions bill could imperil the nuclear deal.

Carpe Libertatem
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(06-15-2017, 06:51 PM)
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The Iran/Russian bill is a different one from the one where Rand and Lee voted no
BoogieWoogie
Member
(06-15-2017, 06:51 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aaron Strife

We gonna Cruz to a Senate majority, boy.

Assuming we actually get our shit together in recruitment for Nevada and Arizona.

Isn't the Senate basically impossible for Dems to win in 2018?
benjipwns
Every man has a property in his own person. This nobody has a right to, but himself.
(06-15-2017, 06:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by BoogieWoogie

Isn't the Senate basically impossible for Dems to win in 2018?

THIS IS THE YEAR WE TURN TEXAS AND UTAH BLUE

AGAIN
kirblar
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(06-15-2017, 06:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by BoogieWoogie

Isn't the Senate basically impossible for Dems to win in 2018?

Very hard. NOT impossible, though, you just need an absurdly big wave to do it. Normally impossible, but Trump may be a special case.
Bonen no Max'd
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(06-15-2017, 06:54 PM)
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Originally Posted by BoogieWoogie

Isn't the Senate basically impossible for Dems to win in 2018?

Holding every seat while winning NV/AZ/TX and having Manchin not switch parties gives Dems a majority of 51, hence 'Cruz' to the Senate since Cruz is the third likeliest pickup opportunity.
kirblar
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(06-15-2017, 06:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bonen no Max'd

Holding every seat while winning NV/AZ/TX and having Manchin not switch parties gives Dems a majority of 51, hence 'Cruz' to the Senate since Cruz is the third likeliest pickup opportunity.

Jfc hes not going to swap
whyamihere
Member
(06-15-2017, 06:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ogodei

I have faith in the Reid Machine in Nevada. Assuming they don't completely punt on governor again and just cede the downballot because of that.

Apparently recruitment keeps striking out in Nevada, which is worrying.
Kusagari
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(06-15-2017, 06:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bonen no Max'd

Holding every seat while winning NV/AZ/TX and having Manchin not switch parties gives Dems a majority of 51, hence 'Cruz' to the Senate since Cruz is the third likeliest pickup opportunity.

If Manchin hasn't' swapped parties yet why the hell would he swap after 18?
Carpe Libertatem
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(06-15-2017, 06:58 PM)
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Daily reminder that the GOP won seats in 2010 in states like Illinois, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, all of which are states that Obama won by more than what Trump won Texas by

They also won in Massachusetts!
Bonen no Max'd
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(06-15-2017, 06:59 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kusagari

If Manchin hasn't' swapped parties yet why the hell would he swap after 18?

he was saying a situation where control of the Senate was up in the air that he'd consider it last election, I assume that wouldn't change next year. I don't think it's likely but Cruz losing also is unlikely.
Diablos
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(06-15-2017, 06:59 PM)
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So how long until Mueller gets canned?
fredrancour
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:00 PM)

Originally Posted by BoogieWoogie

Isn't the Senate basically impossible for Dems to win in 2018?

Very hard, but we're being gifted with a good chance to defend this lopsided class
BoogieWoogie
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Diablos

So how long until Mueller gets canned?

I give it a month until Trump just starts raging through DOJ appointments to try to get at Mueller. Actually, I should look at the line of succession to see who would be the most likely to can Mueller.
Carpe Libertatem
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(06-15-2017, 07:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Bonen no Max'd

he was saying a situation where control of the Senate was up in the air that he'd consider it last election, I assume that wouldn't change next year. I don't think it's likely but Cruz losing also is unlikely.

He never publicly said that. It was only ever reported by Fox News that he told a reporter or something.

Wouldn't doubt that they misconstrued him answering a question about breaking a 50-50 tie in a vote or something.
Aaron Strife
Honk if you love cookies.
(06-15-2017, 07:02 PM)
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Manchin sucks but I don't think he'd pull the ultimate dick move of switching parties to deliberately give the GOP a majority. He's still a firm Democrat on issues like labor and healthcare.

You saw a few Democrats jump ship in 1994 because a) they were already much further out of line with the party than Manchin is with today's Democrats and b) they wanted to be a part of the new majority. There's no advantage to Manchin being in the "majority" of a 50-50 R Senate versus a 51-49 D Senate, especially knowing that Democrats would have a decent chance of expanding that majority in 2020 when the deck is less stacked.
kirblar
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(06-15-2017, 07:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Aaron Strife

Manchin sucks but I don't think he'd pull the ultimate dick move of switching parties to deliberately give the GOP a majority. He's still a firm Democrat on issues like labor and healthcare.

You saw a few Democrats jump ship in 1994 because a) they were already much further out of line with the party than Manchin is with today's Democrats and b) they wanted to be a part of the new majority. There's no advantage to Manchin being in the "majority" of a 50-50 R Senate versus a 51-49 D Senate.

Especially when 2020 would likely break the same way.
Autodidact
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(06-15-2017, 07:04 PM)
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How does Ted Cruz poll among Texans? Everyone else hates him. I just wonder if his constituents feel the same way.
Joe Shlabotnik
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(06-15-2017, 07:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by benjipwns

I thought that was Rand and Lee?


The independent counsel statute that Ken Starr operated under in the 1990's was completely different from the special counsel that Mueller is operating under and everyone else including the Watergate investigator operated under. The IC statute basically meant he could dig forever at anything he deemed even remotely related, take over other cases to fold them into his own, have a guaranteed untouchable budget, etc.

That's why I keep posting about how Congress doesn't want it back, they saw what they unleashed when they let loose the IC on Whitewater.

Oh I know. I just have this hunch there aren't a lot of articles about Newt railing against it back then.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/jake-tapp...s-back-at-him/

However, Tapper went on to say, “But here is what Newt Gingrich had to say about those people attacking Ken Starr back in 1998.”

During his remarks on April 27 of that year, Gingrich blasted the Clinton surrogates’ campaign against the independent counsel:

“The fact is, if he wants to fire Ken Starr, he can do it in the morning. And if he doesn’t want to fire Ken Starr, he can tell his staff to shut up, because…there is something profoundly demeaning and destructive to have the White House systematically undermine an officer of the Department of Justice. And when I watch these paid hacks on television, to be quite honest, I am sickened by how unpatriotically they undermine the Constitution of the United States on behalf of their client.”

why-is-jake-tapper-such-a-dick
Plinko
Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
(06-15-2017, 07:06 PM)
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The AHCA keeps getting better:

Topher Spiro‏Verified account @TopherSpiro

NEW: Trumpcare will impose lifetime/annual limits on 20-27 million in employer plans nationwide.

This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.
hammysaurusrex
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:06 PM)

Originally Posted by Autodidact

How does Ted Cruz poll among Texans? Everyone else hates him. I just wonder if his constituents feel the same way.

Terrible, but he milks the evangelical coalition on wedge issues very well.
whyamihere
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

Wow.
sc0la
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by fredrancour

Very hard, but we're being gifted with a good chance to defend this lopsided class

Like my grandmother always used to say, "don't look a gift cheeto in the tweet".
ShadowSwordmaster
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

Holy shit.
Diablos
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(06-15-2017, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by BoogieWoogie

I give it a month until Trump just starts raging through DOJ appointments to try to get at Mueller. Actually, I should look at the line of succession to see who would be the most likely to can Mueller.

This is a huge threat to the investigation imo. I fear we will never get to the conclusion because he's going to do everything he can to stop it before they can state that yes, that he did something bad
barber
Junior Member
(06-15-2017, 07:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by benicillin

He doesn't think we should be adding sanctions to Iran right now. John Kerry also said it could imperil the nuclear deal.

EDIT:

If i remember correctly the sanctions that affected Iran the most were the EU ones which won't be reinstated. Still yeah, Iran sanctions ARE stupid and shouldnt even be thought about after the nuclear deal but GOP is gonna GOP and gonna put it into a more popular bill

Originally Posted by Bonen no Max'd

he was saying a situation where control of the Senate was up in the air that he'd consider it last election, I assume that wouldn't change next year. I don't think it's likely but Cruz losing also is unlikely.

It was just bipartisan lipservice, if he didnt change before why would he change now?
Autodidact
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:12 PM)
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Shit, going after middle-class people on employer-sponsored health care. They have lost their fucking minds.
BoogieWoogie
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(06-15-2017, 07:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Diablos

This is a huge threat to the investigation imo. I fear we will never get to the conclusion because he's going to do everything he can to stop it before they can state that yes, that he did something bad

If it was a huge threat, Trump's allies wouldn't be begging him not to do it. Yes, it might stall it a little, but the IC would absolutely destroy him. No question.
TestOfTide
Banned
(06-15-2017, 07:22 PM)

Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

Um.....that's fucking suicide of the GOP to actually do that. Like, that's not just a fuck over of lower and middle class people. That would fuck over upper-middle class people who have 'cadilac' healthcare plans too.

Originally Posted by Diablos

This is a huge threat to the investigation imo. I fear we will never get to the conclusion because he's going to do everything he can to stop it before they can state that yes, that he did something bad

What led to Mueller getting appointed in the first place? Oh right. He got appointed because after Comey got fired the IC and FBI were going all in on leaking shit daily which created so much public pressure on everyone that Rosenstein was pretty much forced to assign Mueller.
Last edited by TestOfTide; 06-15-2017 at 07:24 PM.
balladofwindfishes
(06-15-2017, 07:25 PM)
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Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

What in the world

This directly effects white middle class voters lol

Which moron had the bright idea of throwing this onto the bill
JP_
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

What the fuck
Joe Shlabotnik
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(06-15-2017, 07:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by Diablos

This is a huge threat to the investigation imo. I fear we will never get to the conclusion because he's going to do everything he can to stop it before they can state that yes, that he did something bad

I mean the last time he tried to stop it it literally earned him an obstruction of justice investigation
Snowman Prophet of Doom
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(06-15-2017, 07:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by Autodidact

Shit, going after middle-class people on employer-sponsored health care. They have lost their fucking minds.

The GOP has convinced people ACA already goes after these people in the form of increased premiums. I think they're hoping this will be an abstract enough way of screwing people over, and affect few enough people, people won't mind because they'll be back to paying less for shitty plans that cover very little.
sc0la
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(06-15-2017, 07:31 PM)
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When trump complained the house version of AHCA was "mean" I guess that wasn't a call to make it nicer? "Super fucking mean. Inhumane." seems to be the benchmark they are aiming for currently.
balladofwindfishes
(06-15-2017, 07:34 PM)
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Originally Posted by Snowman Prophet of Doom

The GOP has convinced people ACA already goes after these people in the form of increased premiums. I think they're hoping this will be an abstract enough way of screwing people over, and affect few enough people, people won't mind because they'll be back to paying less for shitty plans that cover very little.

This doesn't affect "few enough people"

Most people use their employer's insurance
Kevinroc
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(06-15-2017, 07:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Snowman Prophet of Doom

The GOP has convinced people ACA already goes after these people in the form of increased premiums. I think they're hoping this will be an abstract enough way of screwing people over, and affect few enough people, people won't mind because they'll be back to paying less for shitty plans that cover very little.

Looking at the polling, it seems more like the GOP believes it has convinced people these untruths about the ACA.
Fenderputty
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(06-15-2017, 07:35 PM)
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Originally Posted by Plinko

The AHCA keeps getting better:



This is just a massive handout to the insurance industry and rich people. Any lower or middle-class person who votes for them after this is a complete moron.

I'm pretty sure various unions with Cadillac plans would be safe, but if you work in a non union setting and are getting good coverage, this could be insane. That graph hits Texas and Cali the hardest.
Ernest
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(06-15-2017, 07:38 PM)
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Oh, snap.

Lobbyist for Russian interests says he attended dinners hosted by Sessions

An American lobbyist for Russian interests who helped craft an important foreign policy speech for Donald Trump has confirmed that he attended two dinners hosted by Jeff Sessions during the 2016 campaign, apparently contradicting the attorney general’s sworn testimony given this week.

Sessions testified under oath on Tuesday that he did not believe he had any contacts with lobbyists working for Russian interests over the course of Trump’s campaign. But Richard Burt, a former ambassador to Germany during the Reagan administration, who has represented Russian interests in Washington, told the Guardian that [b]he could confirm previous media reports that stated he had contacts with Sessions at the time.

Caught!
TestOfTide
Banned
(06-15-2017, 07:41 PM)

Originally Posted by Snowman Prophet of Doom

The GOP has convinced people ACA already goes after these people in the form of increased premiums. I think they're hoping this will be an abstract enough way of screwing people over, and affect few enough people, people won't mind because they'll be back to paying less for shitty plans that cover very little.

Yeah I don't think that's going to actually work if the AHCA actually passes and becomes law.

People don't like having their healthcare fucked with, ESPECIALLY when it involves rising costs or losing coverage. And from the looks of things this bill is going to do a shitload of things that will make people immediately notice a loss of coverage AND there are recent reports that this won't even decrease premiums at all.

This isn't like "Trump/Russia", "immigration", or "Climate Change" where people will easily have a mental disconnect from the issue. This is healthcare. We may still have some uninsured people in America, but the vast majority of people in America rely on SOME kind of healthcare that they tend to keep track of and they WILL notice changes to.
You Know Nothing
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(06-15-2017, 07:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ernest

Oh, snap.

Lobbyist for Russian interests says he attended dinners hosted by Sessions

Caught!

I have nevuh and I don't recall.
Joe Shlabotnik
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(06-15-2017, 07:46 PM)
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Originally Posted by Snowman Prophet of Doom

The GOP has convinced people ACA already goes after these people in the form of increased premiums. I think they're hoping this will be an abstract enough way of screwing people over, and affect few enough people, people won't mind because they'll be back to paying less for shitty plans that cover very little.

It's not abstract at all. You get information about your employer coverage every year. 27 million people will suddenly see caps on their coverage for the next year.
IggyChooChoo
Member
(06-15-2017, 07:56 PM)

Originally Posted by Ecotic

What I think of whenever a politician says he can't recall.

I assumed that would be the "I have no recollection, senator" scene from Clear and Present Danger starring our 48th president Ben Affleck.
Stinkles
Clothed, sober, cooperative
(06-15-2017, 08:00 PM)
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Is this the fastest moving PoliGaf thread(s) in a non election cycle?
Teggy
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(06-15-2017, 08:02 PM)
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Don't cross the streams!

Ogodei
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(06-15-2017, 08:07 PM)
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lifetime limits is as much a death sentence for some people as dicking around with Guaranteed Issue is.

It's also a giant fuck you to anyone who has the temerity to have a premature baby.
whyamihere
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(06-15-2017, 08:09 PM)
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Imagine sucking as much as Theresa May.
balladofwindfishes
(06-15-2017, 08:12 PM)
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The government is putting life time limits on health care.

That's pretty rich considering the anti-ACA arguments back in the day.

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