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Ascenion
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(08-12-2017, 04:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by ASilentProtagonist

The game director Ashraf Ismail said Bayek is the founder of the Assassin Brotherhood.

That just makes him the first Assassin as we know them today, but technically not the first Assassin. The origin of the brotherhood isn't the beginning. The games as much confirm that I believe.
Exentryk
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(08-12-2017, 04:19 AM)
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I really dislike stealth in games, so really happy we don't need to bother with that crap in this one if we don't want to.
ASilentProtagonist
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(08-12-2017, 04:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ascenion

That just makes him the first Assassin as we know them today, but technically not the first Assassin. The origin of the brotherhood isn't the beginning. The games as much confirm that I believe.

Yeah. That's what i said..
Darklor01
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(08-12-2017, 04:21 AM)
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Ahh... I found this..
"In 465 BCE, Xerxes I was killed by the Persian Assassin Darius with a Hidden Blade, because the Achaemenid dynasty was being supported by the Templars. A century later, the Templar-affiliated conqueror known as Alexander the Great was poisoned by the Assassin Iltani in order to attain a Stave of Eden."

So, Darius was the first.
sjay1994
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(08-12-2017, 04:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by Exentryk

I really dislike stealth in games, so really happy we don't need to bother with that crap in this one if we don't want to.

But the game is called Assassins Creed.

There is a tenent that literally says "we work in the dark"

Sure, improved combat is nice... but these games are supposed to be focused on Stealth.

Not run in and start flailing with a weapon. The games really lost that ever since 2. Unity tried to bring it back, but the game ran poorly and it was impossible to play properly.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(08-12-2017, 04:23 AM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

This was my initial dissapointment with the game, because they seem to have over-focused on combat. It looks much better than what was shown at E3 now, but I enjoy stealth more.

And the stealth seems basically unchanged from Syndicate, which is disappointing.Sure they've added ranged options, but I want more interactions in stealth asides from "mark mans" then "stab guy" and "shoot him in the head".

For the longest time (well Syndicate and Unity) AC has been serviceable with the sum of its parts, with the best gameplay the series has had in years is the Ship gameplay from 3 and 4, and the MP from Brotherhood. So seeing them taking large strides to make combat better, but seemingly doing nothing for stealth feels disheartening.

I wish there was more to stealth than that, but its honestly all they've shown regarding the stealth system. There is the "time of day matters, as it changes patrol patterns" but I want more options.

You do, there's tons of options for distractions, enemies react to sound like arrows hitting the wall, take cover when they see allies killed by arrows, meaning you can move unseen, freak out about fires, animals are now a huge factor ala far cry when you can even tame them for use. Weather also has to be taken into account with sandstorms affection enemy visibility. It's no longer just getting close enough to stab enemies.

Originally Posted by Darklor01

Really? I thought he was the first. I really have to brush up on back story.

This guy invented the hidden blade:


465 BCE. This game is supposed to explain how the brotherhood part came about.
Ascenion
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(08-12-2017, 04:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by ASilentProtagonist

Yeah. That's what i said..

Oh sorry I misunderstood. I'm just used to people equating the brotherhood with the beginning and that's how I took it.
Exentryk
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(08-12-2017, 04:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

But the game is called Assassins Creed.

There is a tenent that literally says "we work in the dark"

Sure, improved combat is nice... but these games are supposed to be focused on Stealth.

Not run in and start flailing with a weapon. The games really lost that ever since 2. Unity tried to bring it back, but the game ran poorly and it was impossible to play properly.

That's probably why I've never played any other AC game, and this will be my first one.
sjay1994
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(08-12-2017, 04:26 AM)
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Originally Posted by Crossing Eden

You do, there's tons of options for distractions, enemies react to sound like arrows hitting the wall, take cover when they see allies killed by arrows, meaning you can move unseen, freak out about fires, animals are now a huge factor ala far cry when you can even tame them for use. Weather also has to be taken into account with sandstorms affection enemy visibility. It's no longer just getting close enough to stab enemies.


.

I wish they would show some of this in action, because what they've mostly focused on showing is combat and the focus on quests and gear.

Also I wish they added stuff like

-Interogations ala MGS and Splinter Cell so you could find things of interest in the assassination ground, figure out where the target is

-Hidden Pathways like in Syndicate and Unity, but not heavily telagraphed like in those game

-A reason to play non-lethal that is compelling (like how MGSV and PW not killing improves mother base)

Hell, even magic powers with pieces of Eden would be fine.
Last edited by sjay1994; 08-12-2017 at 04:32 AM.
Ascenion
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(08-12-2017, 04:32 AM)
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Originally Posted by Exentryk

I really dislike stealth in games, so really happy we don't need to bother with that crap in this one if we don't want to.

You say that as if it's been forced in the other games. You've never really had to be stealthy, it's just that stealth makes aspects of the game easier. But I mean if you want to just openly kill the target you usually can. You just have to kill like 30 dudes too.
Exentryk
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(08-12-2017, 04:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ascenion

You say that as if it's been forced in the other games. You've never really had to be stealthy, it's just that stealth makes aspects of the game easier. But I mean if you want to just openly kill the target you usually can. You just have to kill like 30 dudes too.

Fighting 30 dudes with that paired-animation system would be torture. So yeah, really glad with the change to the new hitbox system, and not needing to worry about stealth.
Frostinferno
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(08-12-2017, 04:51 AM)
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Originally Posted by Darklor01

Ahh... I found this..
"In 465 BCE, Xerxes I was killed by the Persian Assassin Darius with a Hidden Blade, because the Achaemenid dynasty was being supported by the Templars. A century later, the Templar-affiliated conqueror known as Alexander the Great was poisoned by the Assassin Iltani in order to attain a Stave of Eden."

So, Darius was the first.

We really need a game set during the height of the Persian empire. Lots of great hisroty/lore to draw from.
ProgenitorCastle
Member
(08-12-2017, 04:52 AM)
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Impressed with this game so far in general, and impressed by many of the new features for combat in this game, detailed in this video!

Dodging in an AC game, Devil Trigger in an AC game...a heavy attack button with different uses depending on the context are examples of features that stood out to me
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(08-12-2017, 04:57 AM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

I wish they would show some of this in action, because what they've mostly focused on showing is combat and the focus on quests and gear.

Stuff like this is in the plethora of e3 videos they let youtubers make.

Also I wish they added stuff like

-Interogations ala MGS and Splinter Cell so you could find things of interest in the assassination ground, figure out where the target is

I agree this would be a cool feature but would kinda downplay Senu. Also a bit hard to do without contradicting the system where targets don't just hang out in the same area anymore.

-Hidden Pathways like in Syndicate and Unity, but not heavily telagraphed like in those game

These are in the game.

-A reason to play non-lethal that is compelling (like how MGSV and PW not killing improves mother base)

MGSV punishes you for non-lethally, but just as an example, you can't tame animals unless you put them to sleep instead of fighting them. Just the option to play non-lethally is enough for me imho. We even have hand to hand combat back.

Hell, even magic powers with pieces of Eden would be fine.

Don't hold out on this not being a thing just yet.
Vigilant Walrus
Junior Member
(08-12-2017, 05:08 AM)
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I would love for Yves to assemble a team to extract, overhaul and essentially remake the older titles, and retrofit them with all these gameplay improvements.


AC titles have these amazing locations and settings, and if they could go back, and remaster the visuals, and add all these improvements to the combat, so the games would really be awesome to play moment to moment, it would change everything.

It would be amazing if they could make some sort of Hitman style episodic type thing where they chop up all the old Anvil and AnvilNext game up. Overhaul them and release them into one big continuum. Make them open world, introduce the open world elements, crafting elements and rpg elements.

Make the featuresets work across the game like a meta. buying property(2, 3), controlling your fleet(rogue, blackflag), managing your brotherhood(brotherhood, revelations), customizing your gear(unity).

Unify the UI, the meta gameplay, so its sort of like jumping in and out of every era like you're playing a civilization campaign. They could then release the games as they move forward.
And that would be an excellent opportunity to remix a lot of the worse parts of the story as well as getting the in-your-face desmond real world story out of your gameplay disruption.



If there is a franchise that would benefit from this, it's AC. I'd buy all the games full price if they could remake them and make as impressive looking as this new. And you'd have to imagine, with all the old games running on the same engine and tech, that if they can extract from one game, they can do it for all of them, and perhaps easily transplant it over into Anvil 2.0.


I'd be almost like reimagining AC as a HItman style episodic delivery mechanism. And it's something so crazy, that I think Ubisoft would be the only ones insane enough to try it.

I see so much potential in the older titles, and I've been looking for an excuse to go back. Particularly AC3. With this new combat system it would be really hard not to!
labx
Member
(08-12-2017, 05:19 AM)
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So this game is looking mighty fine. Do I have to play the other games? I stopped at 2.
Dantis
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(08-12-2017, 06:32 AM)
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Art direction seems severely lacking, especially compared to Unity. Despute being the most technically competent, I feel like it's artistically the ugliest current gen AC game.
AmayaPapaya
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(08-12-2017, 06:33 AM)
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This looks better every time I see it. I wasn't that impressed when I first saw it, but this does look better every time.

I will wait for reviews before I even think about touching this though. If it's good, I'll think about it, then.
Theorry
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(08-12-2017, 10:00 AM)
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Originally Posted by iNvid02

Kinda split on the combat, on one hand i like that its different and souls like. But on the other hand, I don't want to engage in combat in these games most of the time, and now if I do, seems like its gonna take a lot longer to overcome

More incentive to try and play stealthy I guess

Just spec towards more stealth play (Hunter) :)




Btw came across this skill.

"Eagle Harass - While in stationary mode, look at an enemy and have Senu stun them. Senu will also harass enemies during combat."
Last edited by Theorry; 08-12-2017 at 10:03 AM.
IcyRhythms
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(08-12-2017, 10:07 AM)
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I feel like there should be a little gore to this. Some of the weapons clipping through the enemy body as you do "devastating" attacks feels off.
Stiler
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(08-12-2017, 10:16 AM)
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The new mechanics are nice, having dodging/blocking and things actually being meaningful.

However, to me at least, it looks incredibly stupid that you do these "powerful" moves and the enemies aren't killed by them.

It looked absurd to see you literally ram a spear through someone's stomach and pick them up and then you simply let them down and they attack you like it was nothing.....

Those kind of special moves should be executions and something that insta kills the enemies if you pull one off imo.
Exentryk
Member
(08-12-2017, 10:16 AM)
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Adding enemy knockdown for powerful spear and other moves might feel better.

Originally Posted by Theorry

Just spec towards more stealth play (Hunter) :)




Btw came across this skill.

"Eagle Harass - While in stationary mode, look at an enemy and have Senu stun them. Senu will also harass enemies during combat."

Is there a list of all known abilities? Which vid is this from?
Last edited by Exentryk; 08-12-2017 at 10:20 AM.
Theorry
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(08-12-2017, 10:21 AM)
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Originally Posted by Exentryk

Is there a list of all known abilities? Which vid is this from?

I dont know. One of the many vids from E3 people uploaded. Here a breakdown of the skills.

Warrior.

https://imgur.com/a/WU6Bm

Seer.

https://imgur.com/a/NsFCL

Hunter.

https://imgur.com/a/akr8d


Like this one.

Last edited by Theorry; 08-12-2017 at 10:24 AM.
MosquitoSmasher
Member
(08-12-2017, 10:25 AM)
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Combat actually looking great and fun in AC, finally that day has arrived it seems. I don't know but I never could enjoy the combat in the games.
Exentryk
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(08-12-2017, 11:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by Theorry

I dont know. One of the many vids from E3 people uploaded. Here a breakdown of the skills.

Warrior.

https://imgur.com/a/WU6Bm

Seer.

https://imgur.com/a/NsFCL

Hunter.

https://imgur.com/a/akr8d


Like this one.

Thanks. Abilities seem underwhelming, except a few. Basic stuff like calling a mount and buying materials are also abilities.
But if the combat feels good, it might be enough.
cooldawn
Member
(08-12-2017, 02:10 PM)
I commend the team for trying to modernise Assassin's Creed but I don't like the look of the combat at all. The change to a hitbox system makes the game look like a traditional God of War hacker'n'slasher rather than curated, timed attack. Right now pairing to enemies looks like the better option for a deeper gameplay mechanic. I know it's a few months out but it also looks disjointed/janky. Not impressed.

Then again I haven't tried it myself but by that evidence it's not looking all that compelling.

Generally, I haven't been that impressed by the presentation either. I don't think it looks all that, especially compared to The Division. I just expected a bigger leap from previous generation engines to a game built for the current generation. It doesn't look like XBOX ONE X.

I did have this pre-ordered but now I think I'll wait out for reviews and reception at large.
Drillary Clinton
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(08-12-2017, 02:18 PM)
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Man, this game looks pretty good. I wish October wasn't so packed.
Theorry
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(08-12-2017, 02:48 PM)
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Cant really understand people that are saying it doesnt look that good.
It looks second to Horizon if we look at open world games and better then Witcher 3.
Unity sure looked great but as said in that other thread it has alot of baked lighting, ran crap, lot of pop in, bad draw distance and for the idea it had it was a gen to soon. Sure Division looks also great but not really open world and offcourse a pretty empty world npc wise.
Last edited by Theorry; 08-12-2017 at 02:53 PM.
Skade
Junior Member
(08-12-2017, 03:28 PM)
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I might be the only one here but i'm not liking the idea of this new combat mecanic.

What i always liked in AC games was the smoothness and coolness of the animations in combat. Yes, combat never was very complicated but i never thought that was a problem.

From what i saw in all the gameplay videos, the combat is not really smooth nor cool. Well, not as smooth or cool than previous entries. The dodges are ridiculous, the "super attacks" look like executions but the victim can survive them, the bosses seems to have a ridiculous amount of health to make sure you fight them instead of, i don't know, assassinate them ?

I'm not digging this.

Add to this the brand new mandatory random loot stuff and well... I'm torn... It's the setting i've always wanted for an Assassins Creed game but with those gameplay changes, i don't think i want to play it anymore...
purg3
slept with Malkin
(08-12-2017, 03:31 PM)
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The combat changes sold me on this game. This is what the series needed. Combat was really stale in the past few games I thought.
JaseC
gave away the keys to the kingdom.
(08-12-2017, 03:33 PM)
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Historical tourism has always been the big draw for me, so I don't feel strongly about combat either way, but the revamped system does have me wondering which control method to go with. I'm currently leaning towards the kb&m as the increased level of precision a mouse offers means greater control over the bow.
Last edited by JaseC; 08-12-2017 at 07:26 PM.
Van Bur3n
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(08-12-2017, 03:42 PM)
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This game keeps growing on me more and more I gotta say.
semiconscious
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(08-12-2017, 03:50 PM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

But the game is called Assassins Creed.

There is a tenent that literally says "we work in the dark"

Sure, improved combat is nice... but these games are supposed to be focused on Stealth.

Not run in and start flailing with a weapon. The games really lost that ever since 2. Unity tried to bring it back, but the game ran poorly and it was impossible to play properly.

Originally Posted by sjay1994

I wish they would show some of this in action, because what they've mostly focused on showing is combat and the focus on quests and gear.

Also I wish they added stuff like

-Interogations ala MGS and Splinter Cell so you could find things of interest in the assassination ground, figure out where the target is

-Hidden Pathways like in Syndicate and Unity, but not heavily telagraphed like in those game

-A reason to play non-lethal that is compelling (like how MGSV and PW not killing improves mother base)

Hell, even magic powers with pieces of Eden would be fine.

i'm with this guy. when i think 'assassin', this:



isn't what comes to mind :) ...
AmayaPapaya
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(08-12-2017, 03:53 PM)
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I wonder how close to Witcher 3 this game will be. You can definitely feel the influence, so I'm curious what similarities will show up. I hope the side quests are all, at least, as good as the one they demonstrated a week or two ago. We have seen two in detail, and both have been high quality for side quests. Second to Witcher 3 because the writing just doesn't seem quite as good, but second place isn't bad.

It sort of looks like it will be like Witcher 3 with more focus on combat, and less on everything else. If it's consistent, which Assassin's Creed hasn't really been recently, it could be a really great game. I'd be down for a Witcher 3 + Egypt + Assassin's Creed + Dark Souls hybrid that this seems to be.
BadWolf
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(08-12-2017, 04:09 PM)
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That opening was kind of embarrassing to hear.

Such basic combat concepts that have been in games since forever are being added to the series a decade after it started and trying to sound like it's something impressive.
Alienous
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(08-12-2017, 04:20 PM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

But the game is called Assassins Creed.

There is a tenent that literally says "we work in the dark"

Sure, improved combat is nice... but these games are supposed to be focused on Stealth.

Not run in and start flailing with a weapon. The games really lost that ever since 2. Unity tried to bring it back, but the game ran poorly and it was impossible to play properly.

I agree.

To me the promise of Assassin's Creed was tracking a target down, killing them, then getting out of dodge. That was a unique gameplay loop they've lost over time.

But doubling down on combat, and 'boss battles', seems like the opposite of that. How many targets will trigger a fight against an extended lifebar when confronted? How often will they be beyond your ability to assassinate?

I want to have to scale a building, jump on a horse, and hitch a ride on a boat after killing a target - all while being chased - not hunker down and get into a sword fight.
JaseC
gave away the keys to the kingdom.
(08-12-2017, 04:30 PM)
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Originally Posted by BadWolf

That opening was kind of embarrassing to hear.

Such basic combat concepts that have been in games since forever are being added to the series a decade after it started and trying to sound like it's something impressive.

I think you're getting the wrong end of the stick there. He's clearly proud of the project, but he very firmly contextualises the changes within the AssCreed franchise. At no point does he suggest they're revolutionary or trail-blazing.
Jedi2016
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(08-12-2017, 04:32 PM)
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Originally Posted by Alienous

I want to have to scale a building, jump on a horse, and hitch a ride on a boat after killing a target - all while being chased - not hunker down and get into a sword fight.

You mean, like every other AC game in recent memory? I've been playing several of them recently, and there does tend to be a shitton of direct combat.

And what makes you think you won't be able to simply escape after an assassination? This is merely a change in the execution of combat, not a massive change in how the game approaches combat situations. They're showing the combat because it's one of the big things that's changed, it doesn't mean the entire game centers around it.

Watch some of the other videos, for cryin' out loud, stealth is still the main way to play this game.
Theorry
Member
(08-12-2017, 04:35 PM)
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If anyone wants to see more stealth. This one i believe is pretty good.

Assassins's Creed: Origins - Exclusive Gameplay Mission #1 "Sobek's Gold" Complete Stealth

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hAF7OudU3gU

Assassin's Creed: Origins (4K) - Night time Gameplay / Hunting / Infiltrating

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WauNAVudo3s

The second one also show how by infiltrating at night he can kill the boss in his sleep if he wants. He wakes him up tho because he wants to fight him. But if you you can easy kill him there and bail.
Last edited by Theorry; 08-12-2017 at 04:46 PM.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(08-12-2017, 04:46 PM)
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Originally Posted by cooldawn

I commend the team for trying to modernise Assassin's Creed but I don't like the look of the combat at all. The change to a hitbox system makes the game look like a traditional God of War hacker'n'slasher rather than curated, timed attack. Right now pairing to enemies looks like the better option for a deeper gameplay mechanic. I know it's a few months out but it also looks disjointed/janky. Not impressed.

Then again I haven't tried it myself but by that evidence it's not looking all that compelling.

Impressions are quite positive and read my post on the last page, objectively, a non pairing dark souls system has more depth than the old system as it automatically opens up a lot of factors for the player.


Generally, I haven't been that impressed by the presentation either. I don't think it looks all that, especially compared to The Division. I just expected a bigger leap from previous generation engines to a game built for the current generation. It doesn't look like XBOX ONE X.

Last gen didn't have any games with this scale, let alone without loading screens and that level of lighting.
JP
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(08-12-2017, 04:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by sjay1994

But the game is called Assassins Creed.

There is a tenent that literally says "we work in the dark"

Sure, improved combat is nice... but these games are supposed to be focused on Stealth.

Not run in and start flailing with a weapon. The games really lost that ever since 2. Unity tried to bring it back, but the game ran poorly and it was impossible to play properly.

This is a large part of what's gone wrong with the franchise for me, it's almost like it's lost its way from the original Assassin's Creed vision. It's lost a lot of what made it Assassin's Creed for me, sneaking around having to a avoid combat because you know you're probably going to die if you take on more than one at a time.

It's nice that they've given it a bit of a break but I can't help but feel that it needs more time than it's been given. maybe it would just do the series good to wait until the next generation of consoles and to surprise us with a return to form.
Theorry
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(08-12-2017, 04:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by JP

This is a large part of what's gone wrong with the franchise for me, it's almost like it's lost its way from the original Assassin's Creed vision. It's lost a lot of what made it Assassin's Creed for me, sneaking around having to a avoid combat because you know you're probably going to die if you take on more than one at a time.

It's nice that they've given it a bit of a break but I can't help but feel that it needs more time than it's been given. maybe it would just do the series good to wait until the next generation of consoles and to surprise us with a return to form.

A bigger break isnt gonna help tho if thats not their vision anymore. :)
Alienous
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(08-12-2017, 06:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by Jedi2016

You mean, like every other AC game in recent memory? I've been playing several of them recently, and there does tend to be a shitton of direct combat.

And what makes you think you won't be able to simply escape after an assassination? This is merely a change in the execution of combat, not a massive change in how the game approaches combat situations. They're showing the combat because it's one of the big things that's changed, it doesn't mean the entire game centers around it.

Watch some of the other videos, for cryin' out loud, stealth is still the main way to play this game.

I've probably watched all of the videos. Including enemies that have an assassination level requirement. Including a focus on direct combat.

These elements inform my impression that the game isn't going for a 'shank and escape' direction. I don't expect that they'll allow their boss battles to be circumvented purely by stealth, given systems that restrict assassination. I don't expect chase gameplay as I haven't seen it represented in a video.
gbland
Junior Member
(08-12-2017, 06:28 PM)
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Ash Ismail is awesome. He seems so down-to-earth about the game. I haven't been excited about an AC game in a long time (maybe AC4?). Looking forward to Origins!
daftstar
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(08-12-2017, 06:49 PM)
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I feel like it's one of those combat systems that are more fun to play than to watch so I'm excited for it. Wish we'd get to see more outfits though, I'm a sucker for cool-looking armor/cloth designs.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
(08-12-2017, 07:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Alienous

I've probably watched all of the videos. Including enemies that have an assassination level requirement. Including a focus on direct combat.

These elements inform my impression that the game isn't going for a 'shank and escape' direction. I don't expect that they'll allow their boss battles to be circumvented purely by stealth, given systems that restrict assassination. I don't expect chase gameplay as I haven't seen it represented in a video.

They specifically said that you can do this.
Alienous
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(08-12-2017, 07:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by Crossing Eden

They specifically said that you can do this.

I should have rephrased that. I more concerned about a level requirement dictating if you can stealthily take put a target.
Raptor
Santa sees your bad GAF threads.
(08-12-2017, 07:36 PM)
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Originally Posted by IcyRhythms

I feel like there should be a little gore to this. Some of the weapons clipping through the enemy body as you do "devastating" attacks feels off.

OIh my god yes1!!

Some dismemberment too, heads flying or something for finishers.
Duchess O'Death
Junior Member
(08-12-2017, 07:42 PM)
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Looks like blood stains on characters are back. They took that out of Syndicate for some reason.

Did they ever talk about mod support for this game? The world looks like a great modding platform.
dex3108
Member
(08-12-2017, 07:45 PM)

Originally Posted by Duchess O'Death

Looks like blood stains on characters are back. They took that out of Syndicate for some reason.

Did they ever talk about mod support for this game? The world looks like a great modding platform.

Anvil engine was never moddable so don't expect mod support.

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