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Nerdkiller
Membeur
(08-13-2017, 03:20 AM)
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OH MY GOD, the green guy in the boxing game is one of the GAF Line Men!



Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!

Does this include the Jaguar CD games?
kubev
Member
(08-13-2017, 03:28 AM)

Originally Posted by Cow Mengde

It's that good? I always ignored it thinking it wasn't worth my time.

The resolution is pretty low, but it runs really well, and it's a surprisingly solid port of the game, overall. I think it's either missing some of the music or just has some tracks assigned to the incorrect levels, though.
dreamcastmaster
PayPal bishoptl for tags
(08-13-2017, 03:28 AM)
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Excellent episode!
sibarraz
Member
(08-13-2017, 03:34 AM)
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I marked out in the wrestling chapter, the bret hart intro was cool, and the inclusion of a dj max track made me gain even more respect for digital foundry

Btw, it seems that all the space sims in the 32x were decent to good

Originally Posted by Diablohead

The more I watch these things the more I think about the 32X and how awful it was for 60fps 2D gaming, it really was a bodge job extension.

If the mega cd came out with the power of the 32x included the first time around it would have been cool but man, sega were really pulling at different strings at that time.

It they did that at the release time of the 32x it would have been the most expensive console ever
jvm
Gamasutra.
(08-13-2017, 03:43 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!

dave_d
Member
(08-13-2017, 04:09 AM)
I'll have to watch this since I enjoyed the first. BTW they were right, Spiderman Web of Fire is a terrible game.
chubigans
y'all should be ashamed
(08-13-2017, 04:12 AM)
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That was amazing, John you are the best video guy out there right now. Keep up the awesome work and enjoy Gamescom!
broncobuster
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(08-13-2017, 04:20 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!

I'm looking forward to seeing how Wolfenstein 3D stacks up. That's one of the only Jaguar games I spend real time with.

And Club Drive, for all the dumb secrets in Jerome's pad.
Dwayne
Member
(08-13-2017, 04:47 AM)
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Is it possible to play 32X games with smooth framerates via emulation?
PositiveGamer
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(08-13-2017, 05:32 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!


btrboyev
Member
(08-13-2017, 05:38 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dwayne

Is it possible to play 32X games with smooth framerates via emulation?

Yes. Well the same frame rates as they ran on real hardware.
MrCunningham
Member
(08-13-2017, 05:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!

Thumbs up! Can't wait for failed consoles part II!

*starts playing 32x part II*

Also prototypes! Nice.


Shadow Squadron really was impressive too. It was one one of the games I really liked for the console. That 15bit colour depth made the game look pretty smooth too. Zaxxon's Motherbase 2000 is also a nice shooter on the 32x. But shame about the 20fps framerate. Star Wars always looked cool on the 32x, but the game is pretty uneven. I do like that the Star Trek game uses the theme song from Wreath of Khan, and it is a pretty cool rendition.
Last edited by MrCunningham; 08-13-2017 at 06:01 AM.
Havoc2049
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(08-13-2017, 06:04 AM)
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Originally Posted by Agent X

Just off of the top of my head, during the Jaguar's active market life (1993-1996), there were around 70 cartridge games, and around 12 CD games released. There were also another 10-15 cartridges and 2-3 CDs released between 1997-2002 by some other companies such as Telegames and Songbird Productions, which were games that were intended to be released in 1996 if Atari hadn't withdrawn from the market.



Could I ask you what groups of Jaguar games are under consideration for coverage? Will it just be the '93-'96 stuff, or would you include some of the '97-'02 games also? The latter group includes some interesting games like Worms, Zero 5, Protector, Skyhammer, Iron Soldier 2, BattleSphere, and Total Carnage. These were not homebrew developments, but intended to be fully licensed commercial releases.

Hopefully it will include the Telegames and Songbird releases, along with BattleSphere. Most of those games were even shown by Atari at the 1995 E3. The first batch of Telegames releases, Towers II and Breakout 2000 were even released in time for the 1996 Christmas season and sold at Electronics Boutique. Electronics Boutique also carried Iron Soldier 2, Worms and World Tour Racing in 1997.

I wouldn't include any of the non-Atari modern homebrews though, as that is a rabbit hole of limited releases and is constantly expanding to this day. Hell, in August of this year alone, the Jaguar is getting three physical releases of enhanced Atari ST ports.
MrCunningham
Member
(08-13-2017, 06:07 AM)
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Sega 32x version of WWF WrestleMania was pretty good on the 32X as well, shame about the 30FPS framerate though. But not bad for a port by two people. Though there were much better ports on the PS1 and Sega Saturn. The MS-DOS port was also pretty damn good too.
Last edited by MrCunningham; 08-13-2017 at 06:16 AM.
RyudBoy
Member
(08-13-2017, 06:27 AM)
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Nice work, as always. Looking forward to the Doom episode. Doom was the only game I ever owned for the 32X lol. Rented a bunch of other games but they all sucked.
Sho Nuff
PIN-BOT CIRCUITS ACTIVATED
(08-13-2017, 06:28 AM)
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John this is awesome!!! Your hard work is appreciated by OLD NERDS such as myself
MrCunningham
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(08-13-2017, 06:36 AM)
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That DOOM tease at the end... Will it also include DOOM 64, which was different from the PC game?
Spectone
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(08-13-2017, 06:39 AM)
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A video covering every conversion of doom would take hours. It would be better to just do the official conversions to the consoles.


VIC20 Doom
Pachinko
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(08-13-2017, 06:41 AM)
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Fantastic stuff John/Dark10x !

Still wouldn't mind seeing an FF7 episode, given that it's 20 years old now .. although it would be a shorter one since there's only really 3 versions (PS1, PC, PS4).

Looking forward to seeing whatever next month brings (watch the video people, I ain't spoiling it for ya) as well as a look back at the Jaguar. Not too sure how many more failed consoles you can look at after that though.. Virtual Boy I suppose but there are a couple of other comprehensive looks at that thing (and I imagine it's a nightmare to capture footage properly). I'd recommend against the CDI as well because it has a limited library of super terrible (but very rare and expensive) games. BUT ! how about oddities like the Amiga 32? I recall seeing one in a store promoting megarace but it kind of came and went like a fart in the wind.

Whatever the case though, I'll keep watching !
Dwayne
Member
(08-13-2017, 06:45 AM)
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Originally Posted by btrboyev

Yes. Well the same frame rates as they ran on real hardware.

Eh, I was more meaning something along the lines of 'overclocking', but via emulation, and locking the framerate at 30 to prevent the game running too fast. I'm not really sure how these things work though.
LordOfLore
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(08-13-2017, 06:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by Pachinko

Fantastic stuff John/Dark10x !

Still wouldn't mind seeing an FF7 episode, given that it's 20 years old now .. although it would be a shorter one since there's only really 3 versions (PS1, PC, PS4).

Wasn't there a PSP port as well in addition to the mobile releases?
Timu
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(08-13-2017, 06:52 AM)
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Originally Posted by LordOfLore

Wasn't there a PSP port as well in addition to the mobile releases?

Mobile, yes, PSP, I don't think so.
Nerdkiller
Membeur
(08-13-2017, 07:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by LordOfLore

Wasn't there a PSP port as well in addition to the mobile releases?

Only in homebrew.
ResidentDante
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(08-13-2017, 07:09 AM)
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Great video, once again DF Retro delivers! It's been cool seeing what directions the 32X games pulled the system in. In retrospect I kind of understand this device failing hard, especially when the SNES was pulling off DKC on stock hardware and delivering quite a few 3D games with the FX chips.
sprsk
force push the doodoo rock
(08-13-2017, 07:49 AM)
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The transition from 16 to 32 bit really had a lot of growing pains.

Kids these days really don't realize how lucky they are.
dark10x
60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps
(08-13-2017, 07:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by lazygecko

dark10x, I think you've made a mistake in your examples splitting the 32X audio output from the vanilla hardware. You've disabled the YM2612 FM channels, but the complementary SN/PSG chip is still active, and you seem to be treating it as though it were part of the 32X.

Are you sure? I had to use an emulator to split the audio and I did disable every single option except the PWM audio.

When playing the Megadrive audio, however, I only disabled PWM.
RadioJoNES64
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(08-13-2017, 08:28 AM)
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...Jeb!?
linko9
Member
(08-13-2017, 09:24 AM)
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Good stuff as always, but I'm getting audio crackling/stuttering in the background music throughout this episode.
Spiritual_Chaos
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(08-13-2017, 09:35 AM)
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Will be lovely to listen to you talk about Doom 64! Only had it for 2 days back in the day, before getting stuck and trading it for Super Mario 64. Have wanted to revisit since then.
lazygecko
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(08-13-2017, 09:54 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

Are you sure? I had to use an emulator to split the audio and I did disable every single option except the PWM audio.

When playing the Megadrive audio, however, I only disabled PWM.

I'm quite sure. If you mute PSG in Shadow Squadron the noise and square tone channels go away, so it's obviously coming from there. Which emulator are you using? Gens+ lets you disable FM, DAC and PSG separately. I just tried using Gens+ in 32X mode, and strangely enough it won't even let me uncheck PWM.

Be sure to consult with me before covering technical aspects of audio on the system in the future ;)
Beer Monkey
Member
(08-13-2017, 10:02 AM)
Looking forward to Val d'Isère Skiing and Snowboarding on the Jag (conversion of Tommy Moe's Winter Extreme: Skiing & Snowboarding for SNES) and Power Drive Rally (adapted from Power Drive from the Megadrive ).
dark10x
60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps
(08-13-2017, 10:08 AM)
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Originally Posted by lazygecko

I'm quite sure. If you mute PSG in Shadow Squadron the noise and square tone channels go away, so it's obviously coming from there. Which emulator are you using? Gens+ lets you disable FM, DAC and PSG separately. I just tried using Gens+ in 32X mode, and strangely enough it won't even let me uncheck PWM.

Be sure to consult with me before covering technical aspects of audio on the system in the future ;)

Oh, you know what, for Shadow Squadron I only unchecked the YM2612. For Star Trek, however, I disabled everything except PWM.

I did use Gens+ and it definitely lets me uncheck PWM audio.
Oyashrio-Sama
Member
(08-13-2017, 10:33 AM)
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Aw, He forgot the best feature of Metal Head. You can go into the settings and change the game to Japanese mode and it changes all the portraits to anime characters.
Stop It
Perfectly able to grasp the inherent value of the fishing game.
(08-13-2017, 10:54 AM)
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Originally Posted by Azure Phoenix

Fantastic series, it was great to get a deeper look into a system that ended up passing me by. I really hope they continue this in the future and cover the likes of the Amiga CD32, Atari Jaguar, 3DO, Phillips CDi, Amstrad GX4000 and such that all popped up and flopped around the same era.

The reason I'd love the CD32 to be covered is because it never officially left Europe because of a lawsuit filed against Commodore so while it initially sold ok here in the UK, it was dead within months of launch.

Lots of people know about the Jag and even the 32x, but things like the CD32, And to an extent the CDi were mega bombs, and many people in the gaming scene wouldn't be aware of the games on the platforms.

Still looking forward to the Jaguar episode however!
dark10x
60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps 60 fps 60 fps 30 fps
(08-13-2017, 10:57 AM)
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Originally Posted by Stop It

The reason I'd love the CD32 to be covered is because it never officially left Europe because of a lawsuit filed against Commodore so while it initially sold ok here in the UK, it was dead within months of launch.

Lots of people know about the Jag and even the 32x, but things like the CD32, And to an extent the CDi were mega bombs, and many people in the gaming scene wouldn't be aware of the games on the platforms.

Still looking forward to the Jaguar episode however!

CD32 is one I'd like to take a look at in the future but have to get a hold of a working unit.
LordOfLore
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(08-13-2017, 11:04 AM)
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Up on youtube now as well.
fabricated backlash
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(08-13-2017, 11:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

My friend, you are in luck. Thanks to a poster on Gaf I was able to hook up with a guy that isn't too far from my location who just happens to own basically every single Jaguar game. He's willing to lend me anything necessary to make a great Jaguar episode. So, yes, the Jag is going to get a massive episode all its own this fall!

Cool. The Jaguar is a console I basically know nothing about. Looking forward to an education.
Atolm
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(08-13-2017, 11:17 AM)
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After watching both videos, I think the only 30-fps 3D game is...Virtua Fighter? Everything else runs at 20 or lower.

Both videos do a good job highlighting why the system failed. The hardware design was a mess: not suitable for either 2D or 3D at all. It was simply too underpowered for real 3D, which the lowest minimum I'd say it's the 3DO, and the lack of dedicated chips for 2D also severely handicapped it in that regard.

In the end it was just a hasty product baked by SoA, one of their many bad ideas that ultimately led to Sega's demise from the hardware business.

The 32X leaves in me a similar impression to the Hyper Neo Geo 64 arcade board. This board was SNK attempt to compete with Model 2/3 and Super System 22, but it was just too underpowered for its time, probably due to budgetary reasons.

I wonder what could have happened if both machines focused on being super-charged 2D hardware. They would have failed anyway almost for sure, as 3D was the rage back then, but at least their game's legacy would be much, much better.
LordOfLore
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(08-13-2017, 11:20 AM)
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Article.
Stop It
Perfectly able to grasp the inherent value of the fishing game.
(08-13-2017, 11:25 AM)
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Originally Posted by dark10x

CD32 is one I'd like to take a look at in the future but have to get a hold of a working unit.

If only I still had mine, I'd gladly send it your way in the interests of the series.

It was an... interesting system considering it's parentage and I'm hoping you can procure one as I'm sure it'll be fun for you to delve into as well.
Jazzem
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(08-13-2017, 11:34 AM)
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Originally Posted by Oyashrio-Sama

Aw, He forgot the best feature of Metal Head. You can go into the settings and change the game to Japanese mode and it changes all the portraits to anime characters.

Ha how odd, some of those are quite nicely illustrated though there's not much of a consistent style between them. Don't know whether I prefer them or the bizarrely animated real faces
Dictator93
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(08-13-2017, 11:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by LordOfLore

Article.

Richard's article is great. Definitely a must read.

I never saw a 32x in person when I was younger, so the fact that this thing flopped, is unsurprising. Although I did remember hearing about the Neptune somehow... I am not sure who told me that or if I read it in a Game mag.

Originally Posted by Oyashrio-Sama

Aw, He forgot the best feature of Metal Head. You can go into the settings and change the game to Japanese mode and it changes all the portraits to anime characters.

Is one of these characters anime Fred Couples?
Last edited by Dictator93; 08-13-2017 at 11:39 AM.
mrklaw
MrArseFace
(08-13-2017, 12:00 PM)
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That unfinished x men game looks a little like Xybots - at least from the the fixed camera angle.

Makes me wish for an Atari arcade collection with games from that era.
cyen
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(08-13-2017, 12:22 PM)
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Loved the episode, i had a megadrive+32x+mega cd back in the day, even though today i can see that the 32x and mega cd were bad i loved the systems.

I loved the motocross game when i was young... it was the game that come with the system, also had VF, Doom, Fifa and VR until i sold all the systems to get the Sega Saturn.

All in all i had great times with both of the systems, one of my favorite mega cd games was Double Switch (very similar to night trap) and Road Avenger.

Loved to relive all those moments with these episode. Thanks dark10x, keep em coming!
harz-marz
Member
(08-13-2017, 12:29 PM)
Another stellar episode John, well done and thanks for this. Looking forward to the Jaguar episode!
Klappdrachen
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(08-13-2017, 12:36 PM)
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This was fantastic, as always. I had never heard of Shadow Squadron before but it looks very impressive.
Diablohead
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(08-13-2017, 12:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by sibarraz

I marked out in the wrestling chapter, the bret hart intro was cool, and the inclusion of a dj max track made me gain even more respect for digital foundry

Btw, it seems that all the space sims in the 32x were decent to good



It they did that at the release time of the 32x it would have been the most expensive console ever

What I mean is if the mega cd was like it is now but had 32x power and not just cd support, you could look at it being expensive if it was the cost of a CD and 32x together but I mean it's a shame the cd did not give the megadrive more power as it was.
Spectone
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(08-13-2017, 01:21 PM)
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Originally Posted by mrklaw

That unfinished x men game looks a little like Xybots - at least from the the fixed camera angle.

Makes me wish for an Atari arcade collection with games from that era.

Yeah I have Xybots for the Atari ST and it looks very similar but the controls on the ST sucked I wonder if they are better on the arcade version.
MightyHedgehog
Welcome to the Wasteland.
I hope you're wearing your flak vest!
(08-13-2017, 02:12 PM)
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Great work and the best overall video covering the 32X on the 'net. Glad to see Shadow Squadron get a good look, though it would have been nice to see deeper gameplay slices, like seeing the smaller craft using its piercing shield to dismantle those large enemy ships piece by piece and witness the pretty decent polygonal destruction that is possible in the game when you do more than shoot. Also, the lack of footage from the 'trace' or replay feature after every successful or unsuccessful mission that could playback as much as fifteen or more minutes and be viewed from other angles on the fly.
Havoc2049
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(08-13-2017, 02:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by Beer Monkey

Looking forward to Val d'Isère Skiing and Snowboarding on the Jag (conversion of Tommy Moe's Winter Extreme: Skiing & Snowboarding for SNES) and Power Drive Rally (adapted from Power Drive from the Megadrive ).

Power Drive Rally is actually the sequel to Power Drive (Megadrive, Amiga, PC) and is exclusive to the Jaguar.

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