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Halo 4 - Valhalla reborn as Ragnarok
- Thread starter Bornstellar
- Start date
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Remakes is fine if they make multiple map packs with more than 3 maps in them. Put 5 in each map pack, 4 new ones and one remake, i dont see a problem...other than if they remake Blood Gultch again then ill really lose it.
Unfortunately they've already confirmed 3 3 map packs. If they decide to do more beyond that I might be okay with remakes, but I'd really prefer maps made with the new gameplay features in mind.
Poker Face
Member
I loved Guardian, but I can't imagine it would play very well with jetpacks, and sprint. Seems too small sadly.
I wouldn't mind another spiritual successor to lockout though
Silly.Mikey
Banned
That fucking sucks. You know those will inlcude spartan ops shit too eventually. 3 per pack really isnt enough.
Spartan Ops is definitely separate, don't worry about those taking up slots in map packs.
I agree 3 maps per pack is kind of disappointing, especially after Anniversary's 6 for $15. I thought 343 would use the reception to that to judge whether to include more maps per pack in H4, shame that doesn't seem to have happened.
The Lamonster
Member
YES
No problem with Best Maps Remakes,but we need more new maps for sure.
Waiting until the next title again =| I mean if Far Cry 2 could do it, I'm sure Halo can, with a lot of space for liberties to be taken if need be.
Most of all I'm tired of the singularly thematic designs of blocks resulting in the same gray or brown looking levels everywhere. I don't even understand how this is still am oversight at this point. Something so simple. This is so frustrating. It's almost like they are intentionally limiting Forge's potential.
Uncharted Waves
Banned
It sucks that the water will not behave the same way as in Halo 3. I'm pretty sure compromises had to be made for the overall look of the visuals but still it sucks. It's actually not the visuals of the water that irks me it's the fact that the water physics seem to have been stripped.
In all honesty why do a remake of Valhalla if you can't make the water right. The first thing people think about is the water when you think of Valhalla. People are here debating the mechs and that's not even the issue. The mechs will be loads of fun. But Dat water. It still looks great but you guys needed to nail the physics to re-capture the spirit of Valhalla.
Frankie can you comment on the compromises and design choices for the water, hardware limitations, etc... I really think if you couldn't capture the true nature of the water in Halo 3 then you guys should of left Valhalla alone and went with a sand trap remake instead . Oh well
In all honesty why do a remake of Valhalla if you can't make the water right. The first thing people think about is the water when you think of Valhalla. People are here debating the mechs and that's not even the issue. The mechs will be loads of fun. But Dat water. It still looks great but you guys needed to nail the physics to re-capture the spirit of Valhalla.
Frankie can you comment on the compromises and design choices for the water, hardware limitations, etc... I really think if you couldn't capture the true nature of the water in Halo 3 then you guys should of left Valhalla alone and went with a sand trap remake instead . Oh well
Might see something like a Halo 2 Anniversary in 2014 that could have a bunch of maps for Halo 4. Microsoft has never shied away from packaging in Halo maps with other games.
It sucks that the water will not behave the same way as in Halo 3. I'm pretty sure compromises had to be made for the overall look of the visuals but still it sucks. It's actually not the visuals of the water that irks me it's the fact that the water physics seem to have been stripped.
In all honesty why do a remake of Valhalla if you can't make the water right. The first thing people think about is the water when you think of Valhalla. People are here debating the mechs and that's not even the issue. The mechs will be loads of fun. But Dat water. It still looks great but you guys needed to nail the physics to re-capture the spirit of Valhalla.
Frankie can you comment on the compromises and design choices for the water, hardware limitations, etc... I really think if you couldn't capture the true nature of the water in Halo 3 then you guys should of left Valhalla alone and went with a sand trap remake instead . Oh well
Insert name quote here.
As someone that thought Valhalla was a poor imitation of the greatly-superior Coagulation, even I can say that the water had little or nothing to do with what made the map the "best" for Halo 3 (which just shows how bad Halo 3 maps were). And Sandtrap was a steaming piece of shit that doesn't belong in any future Halo title.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
It sucks that the water will not behave the same way as in Halo 3. I'm pretty sure compromises had to be made for the overall look of the visuals but still it sucks. It's actually not the visuals of the water that irks me it's the fact that the water physics seem to have been stripped.
In all honesty why do a remake of Valhalla if you can't make the water right. The first thing people think about is the water when you think of Valhalla. People are here debating the mechs and that's not even the issue. The mechs will be loads of fun. But Dat water. It still looks great but you guys needed to nail the physics to re-capture the spirit of Valhalla.
Frankie can you comment on the compromises and design choices for the water, hardware limitations, etc... I really think if you couldn't capture the true nature of the water in Halo 3 then you guys should of left Valhalla alone and went with a sand trap remake instead . Oh well
Of course thats the issue. How will the water physics be a bigger problem than making sure the Mech is balanced properly? Are you serious right now? Water physics..... insane.
Edit: And to the poster who says H3 had bad maps, Vahalla is about 10 times better than Blood Gultch. Halo3 had not only the best variety of maps of any Halo game but some of the best maps period.
Uncharted Waves
Banned
Totally disagree. Loved Sandtrap. But that's your opinion. Also disagree about the water not meaning much.
Not a Jellyfish
but I am a sheep
I am not sure how I feel about the Mantis, need to really play with it before making any judgments.
Looks OP based on the vid but of course they want to show footage of it destroying everything.
Looks OP based on the vid but of course they want to show footage of it destroying everything.
Uncharted Waves
Banned
But didn't Frankie already reassure us that it won't be OP? It would be gameplay suicide to make it OP. And what can I say? I'm a water freak.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Id like the water to be perfect too, but man, im much more concerned about balance than i am the physics of the water on one map.
Also, i love big maps but one problem Reach had is that there werent enough small ones. I hope they have enough of both cause i played a lot less customs in Reach just because most maps were just too big for 3-4 players.
I NEED SCISSORS
Banned
Just by getting rid of those horrible tiled textures they have already made it look twice as good.
FWIW I'll have direct-feed footage of Ragnarok on IGN on Thursday with commentary from 343 Lead Multiplayer Level Designer Kynan Pearson.
(In fact, we're doing this for all 10 maps every Tuesday and Thursday for the next five weeks, starting tomorrow with...a new map. /shamelessplug)
(In fact, we're doing this for all 10 maps every Tuesday and Thursday for the next five weeks, starting tomorrow with...a new map. /shamelessplug)
Yet it probably made a few thousand Halo fans smile, so I'd say it was more than worth it.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Wait, theres only 10 maps?
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
10 core maps (1 of which is the remake of Valhalla) + 3 forge environments.
Nah. Way too much dead space. Valhalla/Ragnarok is Blood Gulch re-imagined in a design that actually works for good gameplay.
It plays terribly post-Halo 3.
Vire
Member
Only 10? That's a pretty huge improvement over Reach.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Damn, they really went for the bare minimum with that. Thats
. I hope those map packs with the SE come out fairly quickly.Silly.Mikey
Banned
I wouldnt use Reachs maps (or amounts of them at launch) for any type of "bar of quality" for a Halo game.
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
Damn, they really went for the bare minimum with that. Thats
IIRC that number fits with all of the past games. Plus the 3 forge environments are sure to have a few maps here and there (though 343 said they didn't want forge maps to be overwhelming like Reach).
EDIT: Halo 2 had 12 maps, Halo 3 had 11.
See above.
Vire
Member
Blood Gulch really was great in H1, and it also worked well in 2. Valhalla was a nice change with a similar style. There was another H3 map as well (downloadable?) with satellites on it that reminded me a bit of Blood Gulch. I haven't played much Reach multi, but I don't think keepinv OG Blood Gulch works as well now as it used to. Not with all the small changes to the formula. I actually think less popular maps like Prisoner, Lockout, maybe even Rat Race would be better than Blood Gulch with the modern sandbox. I'm just speculating, but the way I see it, the biggest changes in Halo since the series' start have been to the mid to long range weapons combat and vehicles. Short to mid is more or less the same (for a more casual player like me, who's not been keeping up with each new subtlety but notices things like Reach's new melee mechanics). So the maps that play most differently now are those like Blood Gulch, those big arenas. They won't be as good with the new content as they were ten years ago.
I just started playing Halo Anniversary, and I kind of wish there was a redone multiplayer component and not just a Reach map pack. I'd like to see the contrast. Plus I miss grenading weapons to myself from across the map.
It wouldn't be so bad if it wasn't for the gray on gray color palette.
Canis lupus
Member
Looks so good.
Problem is that every Halo sandbox changes, adding old stuff on it is usually for the worse. Either they change too much or forced to change or little is changed (but still plays terrible with the new settings).
New maps all the way.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
So theyll give us around 9 hours worth of spartan ops, but 10 maps is ok with everyone cause the other game shipped with that? Im not ok 10 maps. You know how quickly we will come down to 2-3 everyone selecting all the time, not to mention that at least half are either too big or too small to be in a certain playlist. I wanted at least 12, not counting remakes. God damn, the remake is already designed for chirst sakes, the hard part is already done!
Deadly Cyclone
Pride of Iowa State
I guess there's no set "golden" number for how many maps is a good number. I am fine with 10 (13 with forge). If they are designed well enough we'll want to play them all. Plus, they have crammed so much other content into the game too that I am happy with the overall package so far.
We already know we are getting at least 3 DLC maps packs with 3 maps each, so I think we're good.
Vire
Member
You have absolutely no idea how game development works do you?
I scratch my levels on my disk, it gets on faster.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Hopefully, 2-3 of those are already done. That would help a lot.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Actually i do. What have they changed to this new map to accomodate the halo 4 gameplay? Not much. Only the textures and lighting have changed. The map was basically chosen cause it needs very little changes to accomodate to the Halo4 gameplay, and people are fed up of blood gultch.
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
That's why they carefully chose that particular map though. Sprint mixed with a myriad of other game-changers leaves a lot of smaller map remakes outside the realm of possibility. Valhalla just happened to work with those changes.
Silly.Mikey
Banned
Yes exactly. But theres 4 games and multiple maps to choose from, not even counting Halo PC. Hell, put 2 remakes if you have to. This wasnt the only one available.
Avalanche for example fits perfectly into Halo4.
AllIsOneIsNone
Banned
Maybe it would, and maybe it would be easier to pop some of those out real quick. Hopefully they'll have some sort of some community forge playlist where the most popular maps are selected. I'm sure some remakes would make it there.
Personally I think the game has changed too much between halo 3 and now to get a similar feeling from any of the remakes. I'd rather them focus on working around the current gameplay mechanics rather than the other way around.