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(Steam) Publishers to crack down on cross-region gifting/trading

X05

Upside, inside out he's livin la vida loca, He'll push and pull you down, livin la vida loca
So it makes no sense to make everyone on the same region o_O
Exactly, they are punishing the whole region when the only one with cheap prices and would ""justify"" said action is Brazil.

EDIT:
How does this work, Salsa? We can't gift games at all, even if they are the same price as in the US?
As it stands, you, me, Salsa and everyone else in LatAm will only be able to gift MGRR and whichever game uses this flag to one another.
 
yeah

wichever game uses the flag, we can't gift to regions outside ours

I mean, we can, but they cant activate it.

But we might be able to activate it using a VPN? Anyone tried this? I'd be willing to see if it works if someone from a 'restricted region' gifts me the game (I'll obviously PAYPAL straight away). I'm willing to throw away the money to see if it works.

God this practice is going to suck for many of us....
 
However, the flip side to this is that it allows publishers to attempt lower pricing in regions like Russia where people rarely purchase expensive games. With a flag like this, they could keep the prices really really low on Steam for those customers without risking everyone bypassing "normal" global costs.

To me, when used in this way, this restriction actually makes a bit of sense. Though it is still kind of stupid if you legitimately want to gift something to a friend and are prevented from doing so by this, but yeah.
 

lexi

Banned
However, the flip side to this is that it allows publishers to attempt lower pricing in regions like Russia where people rarely purchase expensive games. With a flag like this, they could keep the prices really really low on Steam for those customers without risking everyone bypassing "normal" global costs.

To me, when used in this way, this restriction actually makes a bit of sense. Though it is still kind of stupid if you legitimately want to gift something to a friend and are prevented from doing so by this, but yeah.

It will be used to extend the current extortion racket that publishers impose on many countries; most of Europe, Australia, etc.
 

udivision

Member
However, the flip side to this is that it allows publishers to attempt lower pricing in regions like Russia where people rarely purchase expensive games. With a flag like this, they could keep the prices really really low on Steam for those customers without risking everyone bypassing "normal" global costs.

Isn't that the thinking behind region locking anyway? "Different prices for different markets." It helps some, hurts others.
 

Momentary

Banned
The people making a big deal about it are the ones who took advantage of the system. Me being one of them. Whatever. It was great while it lasted so just get over it.
 

sprinkles

Member
I could live with the change as long as companies like Konami accept that $:€ parity makes no sense when one Euro is worth nearly 1,40 Dollars.
It will still suck for Germans like me (or Australians) who could easily get uncut versions or games not sold here at all like Typing of the Dead (thanks Xelios!)
 
I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand, I'm Australian; I know the pain and sheer bloody-mindedness of regional price-gouging from personal experience. On the other hand, determining the correct pricing model for a digital product available in regions with vastly different economic circumstances is always going to be a challenge.

The consumer part of me feels as though the publishers should just suck it up, and stop trying to have their cake and eat it too when it comes to globalised markets like the internet. After all, it's not as though it costs them any more to sell the game in one market or another. There's no logistics issues to deal with, so why do they think it's justifiable to charge more? Translations? Then why charge more in regions where the native language of the game is the same?

Then the pragmatist in me pipes up. The above arguments work well to argue against price-gouging, but they don't really work when you include markets like Russia where the median household income is around 3/8 of what it is in the US, and game prices need to be adjusted down in order to be viable at all. In order to truly flatten the globalised pricing you would need to then offer the games for the same price in other regions, which is effectively what happens with gifting were the status quo to be maintained.

So now everyone is paying $10USD for a new game, which sounds pretty sweet in theory. However, to make things fair, you then need to drop the price of the games at retail to match so that people who buy physical media aren't at a disadvantage. At this stage you start to lose money, as your production and logistics costs totally eat away your income and you're left with nothing or less. Obviously this doesn't apply as much in places where retail is effectively dead for PC games, but if I had to guess I'd say that publishers want to have a unified position on this issue across all of their platforms. And even in those places, you would kill it off once and for all with this approach.

I guess I'm saying that I agree with this move but only if it remains limited to markets where games need to be sold at a steep discount because of the gulf between their economy and the US (which is the defacto standard economy for Steam prices). Pricing up is effectively a gouging strategy though, so I remain opposed to it without reservation.
 
How does this work, Salsa? We can't gift games at all, even if they are the same price as in the US?


If it is an anti-consumer practice, you can be damn sure I think it shouldn't matter. Or exist, to say it more accurately.

That's great. I might even agree with you (!). But it doesn't matter what you think should or shouldn't matter. Because it does matter, and that's just the way it is.
 

Sentenza

Member
Because publishers own the copyright, which gives them explicit permission to distribute and price their work however they want.

Which includes removing their product from stores unwilling to keep street dates or pricing guidelines.
Who cares. it was a rhetoric question.
The problem is not how they can do it, the problem is people thinking they have every right to do it.
Because apparently "globalization" is something just corporations can take advantage of.
 

pixlexic

Banned
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.
 
D

Deleted member 17706

Unconfirmed Member
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.

I dunno. Sales tax and such differ between states in the United States and they don't seem to have any problems allowing such gifting.
 

maneil99

Member
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.

No it doesn't, it has to do with sellers like me and iHEO selling our games and stealing sales from higher priced steam regions.
 

Zarx

Member
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.

Actually in New Zealand digital goods including software purchased from a company that doesn't have a local branch of operations (As as i know Steam doesn't and I know that GMG certainly doesn't) based in New Zealand is exempt from sales tax. But we are still charged up to 80% (Call of Duty) more by some publishers, and the same as America by others. Hell most publishers aren't even consistent on their markup across their catalog.
 

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
As I edited into my previous post, those in affected countries can't gift to people outside of these territories as they simply don't show up in the list, and I would assume that attempting to initiate a trade would result in an error... but what about sending the gift via e-mail? I wonder, since Steam obviously can't ascertain the region of an e-mail inbox, would redeeming the e-mailed gift work, perhaps if using a VPN (if need be)? I'm tempted to experiment but I don't want to be left with the digital equivalent of an $11/$12 paperweight.

mgrruinsa7.jpg


Edit: I wouldn't really recommend it, though, since if you knowingly buy a trading/gifting-restricted game from a trader, it's technically using a VPN to skirt region-specific pricing, which Valve doesn't like. I only did this to satisfy my curiosity.
 

Oublieux

Member
My only gripe with this system is how it restricts some users. Certain games are just downright unavailable (incomprehensibly) on Steam based on region. I live in Korea and, although Dragon Age and its expansion, Awakenings, is present; the Ultimate edition is locked out. Many of the Sonic games also cannot be purchased strangely.

It's baffling and the only means around this was via trading or gifting.
 

TheD

The Detective
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.

Please don't make statements about things you know nothing about.

Steam does not collect any tax in a country like Australia (and even if they did it is only 10%), but a lot of publishers charge up to (sometimes even over) 2x the price vs the US!
e.g Bioshock Infinite, $39.99 USD on the US store and $79.99 USD on the Aus store!
 

Anteater

Member
oh god why

I have never used cross region gifting to avoid shit prices, I just won't buy them if it's priced wrong, so we'll see how this goes, I can't buy rising at the moment in my region and if they don't want my money then I guess that's that, I guess I just won't buy it since I'm not allowed to, and wow what a shame.
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
Retail key subs won't be affected by this flag, no, but publishers can still opt for the onlyallowrunincountries flag, which is just as effective (though something you can skirt using a VPN).

I remember Gearbox specifically made moves to ALLOW cross-region trading and selling of keys with Borderlands 2. There's still a separate Russia-only version of the game, but it comes packed with the international version.
 

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
Wonder how this is gonna affect sites that sell Eastern European keys.

This flag applies only to the Steam's own gifting/trading systems. The onlyallowrunincountries flag is enough to deter key resellers.

I remember Gearbox specifically made moves to ALLOW cross-region trading and selling of keys with Borderlands 2. There's still a separate Russia-only version of the game, but it comes packed with the international version.

Yeah, I noticed that when I bought the RU GOTY the other week (I wanted the RU app and its DLC ;)). I pre-ordered the ROW version way back when, but it would have been a nice surprise.
 

catabarez

Member
mgrruinsa7.jpg


Edit: I wouldn't really recommend it, though, since if you knowingly buy a trading/gifting-restricted game from a trader, it's technically using a VPN to skirt region-specific pricing, which Valve doesn't like. I only did this to satisfy my curiosity.

Jase how often are you gonna do this?
 

Grief.exe

Member
Any chance Metal Gear Rising isn't shareable via Family Sharing? Can we tell from preorders?

Yes, there is a way to tell and it doesn't have the specific lock within the database entry.

Could they put it up later? Sure, but I highly doubt it. That implementation would set a precedent for a game using that without secondary DRM.
 
Here in Ireland, Rising is €13.39, in Russia the price works out at €7.42. There's a people selling the Russian version (region locked)for 5 TF2 keys.

If the game wasn't locked, I could buy the game for €8.10 (5 x €1.61 on the marketplace) and save 40%. Buying it this way would net valve €3.45 (profit from buying keys = €1.22 [15‰ of €8.10] profit from buying the game in Russia = 2.23 [30% of €7.42]) and Konami+Platinum would receive €5.19 (70% of €7.42). If I bought the game directly from the store, they'd receive €4.02 (30% of €13.39) and €9.37 (70% of €13.39) respectively.

So doing things means that I save €5.39 but valve lose out on €0.57(14%) and Konami+Platinum lose €4.18(31%). The difference in the amount of money lost through key sellers effects the developers and publishers a good bit more than it effects valve because Valve get a cut of the money twice through the key sales. It's probably why the new system is a flag instead of something that encompasses all trading on steam.
 
you guys it has to do with different countries policies on sales and taxes. Its not a " OMG WHY DO THEY HATE ME" type of thing.

No, it is a download store. Why would the cost be drastically different when you do not have to pay for the retail stuff? This is companies trying to keep regions like Australia from having fair prices.
 

RedSwirl

Junior Member
This flag applies only to the Steam's own gifting/trading systems. The onlyallowrunincountries flag is enough to deter key resellers.

So business as usual. Those key resellers already highlight for you which games are region-free and which ones might need a VPN to activate. Then this new development just takes the same system and applies it to Steam's internal trading and gifting?
 

webtax

Neo Member
this is really bad news, if the publishers start jumping on this wagon... soon all games will have this shenanigans

thing is, you would expect somehow things to get better, but with this it just looks to be getting worse, those EU/CIC countries and AU/NZ have no hope left, and now comes southamerica(-)br.


nos vamos a la b
 

JaseC

gave away the keys to the kingdom.
So business as usual. Those key resellers already highlight for you which games are region-free and which ones might need a VPN to activate. Then this new development just takes the same system and applies it to Steam's internal trading and gifting?

Essentially, yes. As noted earlier in the thread, gifting via e-mail will work but you need to use a VPN to activate the game (not to be confused with redeeming it, which stores it in your inventory -- that you can do sans VPN), but as far as gifting/trading through Steam directly is concerned, with the former Steam automatically removes people from the list who aren't located in the eligible countries and attempting to initiate the latter results in an error.
 
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