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Stardock sues former employee for $1,000,000 over the failure of Elemental

P

Psychotext

Member
scy said:
After reading that, however, I'd think there's potentially something there if things were indeed taken and/or destroyed.
Click to expand...
Yeah, and there was just one copy of all of it. Horseshit.

If there really was just one copy of all of this critical material then the company is run by a bunch of imbeciles. Sounds very much to me to be a completely unprovable way of trying to deflect attention away from what really happened.
 
S

Sinatar

Official GAF Bottom Feeder
But if the game sold more copies at launch then they'd have had to give out more copies of this new one for free... so they didn't really lose anything.
 
I

ixix

Exists in a perpetual state of Quantum Crotch Uncertainty.
Sounds like Alexandra Miseta was trying to save us.

Why didn't I listen.
 
D

DaveVoyles

Member
Joe Shlabotnik said:
80,000 registered members and whoever-knows how many lurkers?

Your points are salient but it also stretches belief that the game was three weeks of bug-checking away from being super-special, when they eventually gave away the next game for free as an apology.
Click to expand...

I should have said "stays away when looking for intelligent responses."

But again, no one said that this game was going to be super-special and selling for $1 mil, so I don't know where many people here are getting this idea.
 
1

1-D_FTW

Member
ruuk said:
Stardock is suing an ex-employee for one million dollars.

Link to the lawsuit.

The jist of the suit is that Stardock claims a marketing employee quit three weeks before the game was released and took or destroyed marketing materials for the game on her way out the door. Stardock claims to have lost lost a million dollars in profits because they weren't able to market the game correctly, causing them to spend the three weeks leading up to the release on trying to market the game, which left them no time to program and debug the game.
Click to expand...


That genuinely made me laugh and spit out my sandwich.

"Hey, Bob, quit programming the game you lazy fuck! We got marketing we need you to handle."
 
G

ghst

thanks for the laugh
3D Realms to sue former stationary labeller for $100,000,000 over the delayed release of Duke Nukem Forever: "You can't design a game with nothing to write with!"
 
Woo-Fu

Woo-Fu

Banned
DaveVoyles said:
I should have said "stays away when looking for intelligent responses."

But again, no one said that this game was going to be super-special and selling for $1 mil, so I don't know where many people here are getting this idea.
Click to expand...

Actually when billed as "a spiritual successor to Master of Magic" you need to release something pretty darned special. By special I don't mean delivered by a short bus.

It was a failure of epic proportion that Brad Wardell makes worse every time he opens his mouth.
 
A

alstein

Member
Jackpot said:
Isn't Stardock's CEO rather... nutty and egotistical? Seems expected he'd find an excuse for his game's failure.

Surely all those alleged fixes could have been implemented 1 month after the need for marketing materials had passed. Have they? What state is the game in?
Click to expand...

Actually he's admitted he screwed up bad. He's admitted it so much that he's re-doing the game for free for the folks who bought at launch, and hired some talent to do it right. I think that's admitting you screwed up pretty damn hard, and doing what you can to correct it. For me at least, Stardock's done enough good in the past that I forgave this screw-up, even if it was of SFxTK proportions.

If you read the documents, she quit on zero notice three weeks before the game came out and shredded promotional materials, despite being contractually obligated not to do so.

Now, whether the damages are appropiate is another matter- but if Stardock's allegations are true, then she should have been sued hard, and given what I've heard about Stardock as a working environment, I'm inclined to believe Stardock. (I've heard nothing but good things about how they treat employees)

Also, why would Brad be trying to stir up the old pot when he's got a much better product coming out soon, yeah, I don't agree with his politics much on fiscal issues, but he's not a moron- he's done enough right over the years to be given some credit.

A lot of folks are being blinded by their personal dislike of Brad Wardell here. Yeah, I don't agree with his politics, but outside of War of Magic being terrible, Stardock has been pretty damn awesome the 8 or 9 years I've bought their games.

Fugu said:
It's a shame, too. Stardock had a fine, consumer-friendly reputation until Elemental.
Click to expand...

They are working hard to win that rep back, though it will be twice as hard as earning that rep in the first place.
 
E

EVIL

Member
this whole thing smells like bullshit

27. Additionally, the interruption in availability of the Elemental Materials caused Plaintiff to lose more than $1,000,000 in profits.
How did they reach this figure? to me its an incredible high figure grasped out of thin air without any mathematical base behind it.)

28. The date Defendant deleted, destroyed and/or stole Plaintiff’s Analytics, Elemental Materials and Trade Show Information was approximately three (3) weeks before the launch of Elemental.
really.. no backups? I work at an incredible small company and everything gets backed up at the end of the day, and nobody can get access to it without specific permission from management.

29. As a result of the loss of the Elemental Materials and Analytics, Plaintiff was unable to complete marketing efforts vital to the success of Elemental.
Again, why no backups?

30. Additionally, Plaintiff had to spend vital time leading up to the release of Elemental attempting to re-create the Elemental Materials, rather than programming, debugging and otherwise readying Elemental for release.
Yeah, right, as if they put the whole team on one task at a time
 
A

Aselith

Member
Jackpot said:
Isn't Stardock's CEO rather... nutty and egotistical? Seems expected he'd find an excuse for his game's failure.

Surely all those alleged fixes could have been implemented 1 month after the need for marketing materials had passed. Have they? What state is the game in?
Click to expand...

He already took personal responsibility in public for the problems with the game.
 
A

alstein

Member
EVIL said:
this whole thing smells like bullshit

27. Additionally, the interruption in availability of the Elemental Materials caused Plaintiff to lose more than $1,000,000 in profits.
How did they reach this figure? to me its an incredible high figure grasped out of thin air without any mathematical base behind it.)

28. The date Defendant deleted, destroyed and/or stole Plaintiff’s Analytics, Elemental Materials and Trade Show Information was approximately three (3) weeks before the launch of Elemental.
really.. no backups? I work at an incredible small company and everything gets backed up at the end of the day, and nobody can get access to it without specific permission from management.

29. As a result of the loss of the Elemental Materials and Analytics, Plaintiff was unable to complete marketing efforts vital to the success of Elemental.
Again, why no backups?

30. Additionally, Plaintiff had to spend vital time leading up to the release of Elemental attempting to re-create the Elemental Materials, rather than programming, debugging and otherwise readying Elemental for release.
Yeah, right, as if they put the whole team on one task at a time
Click to expand...

Stardock was a mess prior to the launch of Elemental- spread way too thin among various projects. They were releasing betas at 2am, and Stardock prided itself on minimizing overtime. Brad says he was working 100-120 hr weeks , it's quite possible other areas could have been a big mess as well. Stardock got too big too fast.

As for the damage number, it could be in response to another lawsuit (from the defendant).
 
O

old manatee

Banned
I didn't hear a single positive impression about elemental when it came out. Must have been some goddamn incredible marketing materials.
 
P

Perkel

Banned
Dreams-Visions said:
+1 on this.

If they're going to try to convince the court that they shifted DEVELOPERS onto the MARKETING team such that they lost programming time...I'm gonna call 100% Grade-A bullshit on them. Pics or it didn't fucking happen.

That said, it's quite possible that with a proper marketing campaign (if this game didn't have one) would have boosted sales, regardless of how shitty the game was. The loss of promotional materials isn't as big of a deal as a loss of marketing plan. Most materials can be reproduced quickly if necessary, but if she had the only copy of the plan (timelines, contacts, etc.)...that could have caused real problems. The question is how can they quantify that? Or qualify that?
Click to expand...

That's nor really a case. They could allocate more funds for PR from developers pool meaning fewer people could polish game
 
F

faceless007

Member
It's pretty much standard practice in lawsuits for both sides (especially plaintiffs) to severely exaggerate the ramifications and damages done to them by the alleged wrongdoing, with the understanding that the defendant will do the exact opposite. They make a bunch of unsubstantiated claims based on unprovable predictions about what would have happened otherwise, to try to make their side the more sympathetic one, and it's up to the judge to figure out how much is valid and how much is BS.
 
B

BluWacky

Member
Can anyone with a better understanding of the American legal system explain to me how I can find out what this court order has to do with anything? And is there any way to access the filings from the entire civil case that Ms Miseta brought against Brad Wardell and the subsequent appeals process in 2011-2012?

It looks like Ms Miseta brought a case against Brad Wardell of some kind in the Michigan court and apparently won it (if I'm reading the dismissal of appeal correctly). This would give much better context for Stardock now sueing her.
 
A

Aselith

Member
BluWacky said:
Can anyone with a better understanding of the American legal system explain to me how I can find out what this court order has to do with anything? And is there any way to access the filings from the entire civil case that Ms Miseta brought against Brad Wardell and the subsequent appeals process in 2011-2012?

It looks like Ms Miseta brought a case against Brad Wardell of some kind in the Michigan court and apparently won it (if I'm reading the dismissal of appeal correctly). This would give much better context for Stardock now sueing her.
Click to expand...

We would need to look up the docket number but it at least tells us that it's a countersuit not Stardock initiating.
 
U

udivision

Member
A million dollars in profits is about 30,000 copies sold or something? That's assuming pubs get 75percent of the 60... And probably a math error or two.
Was the game even 60msrp?
 
C

Cave Johnson

Member
nsmb21000000coin.png
 
M

Mudkips

Banned
The employee destroyed the advertising samples out of legal and ethical requirements because they portrayed the game as being good.
 
blu

blu

Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
Kaijima said:
So...

They selected an imaginary amount of money and claimed that hypothetical customers would have given it to them if a PR staffer hadn't turned over a magazine rack on their way out of the lobby. And it took everyone at Stardock so long to pick the magazines back up, that they couldn't make the game work.
Click to expand...
You don't understand - you can't debug with a magazine rack tipped over next to you. It's just not possible.
 
shaowebb

shaowebb

Member
Um...this sounds kind of contrived. I mean if they sabotaged marketing then YES sue them for damages, but claiming you didn't get to work on code due to having to spend those 3 weeks working to replace marketing? Since when are your coders in charge of your marketing work?

:\
 
A

Aselith

Member
shaowebb said:
Um...this sounds kind of contrived. I mean if they sabotaged marketing then YES sue them for damages, but claiming you didn't get to work on code due to having to spend those 3 weeks working to replace marketing? Since when are your coders in charge of your marketing work?

:
Click to expand...

Since the person quit three weeks before they shipped? They're a small company. They had to adjust quickly and the personnel would have to come from somewhere.
 
X

Xero

Member
piratepwnsninja said:
Three weeks? Come on, it's taken months to get that game to where it should have been at release.
Click to expand...

Its still not where it should have been at release. Their are fundamental problems with the core of the game that don't work. Like the Ai. As everyone has said brad profusely apologized, and I'm looking forward to fallen enchantress for free. That said the only parts I agree are questionable on this lawsuit is the 3 weeks not debugging the game, which anyone that played it when it released clearly knows wouldn't have changed anything, and the projected amount. I'm still ok with this. I still love how much stardock communicates with its customers, this doesn't change that.
 
T

Tempy

don't ask me for codes
Aselith said:
Since the person quit three weeks before they shipped? They're a small company. They had to adjust quickly and the personnel would have to come from somewhere.
Click to expand...

BS.

Stealing & destroying marketing material when leaving is bad and grounds for suing. Claiming development/QA being affected by this reeks of fabrication. And if it's standard procedure to make baseless claims like this, that shit has got to stop.
 
C

CecilRousso

Member
As much fun as you have can have with these news, and as much as I dislike Brad Wardell, this is not Stardock explaining or excusing the failure of the game to the public. They already done that.
 
G

GoofsterStud

Member
Where is this happening? The big evidence they quite a few weeks ahead. They should think about there hiring/contracting process. Are they at a location where you can quite whenever? This is a huge blow against workman rights. I find the whole situation unsettling.
 
A

Aselith

Member
Tempy said:
BS.

Stealing & destroying marketing material when leaving is bad and grounds for suing. Claiming development/QA being affected by this reeks of fabrication. And if it's standard procedure to make baseless claims like this, that shit has got to stop.
Click to expand...

It's bullshit why?

GoofsterStud said:
Where is this happening? The big evidence they quite a few weeks ahead. They should think about there hiring/contracting process. Are they at a location where you can quite whenever? This is a huge blow against workman rights. I find the whole situation unsettling.
Click to expand...

Not being able to destroy company property on your way out the door is a huge blow against worker's rights?
 
T

Tempy

don't ask me for codes
Aselith said:
It's bullshit why?
Click to expand...

Like others have pointed out - programmers/QA are not affected by any fuckups in the marketing front. That claim is complete and utterly bogus.

At most some trailers have to be captured and some screenshots to be made, but anybody can do that - 3 weeks before launch there's definitely content lock, so you might have some designers/artists/producers free to do those.
 
A

Aselith

Member
Tempy said:
Like others have pointed out - programmers/QA are not affected by any fuckups in the marketing front. That claim is complete and utterly bogus.

At most some trailers have to be captured and some screenshots to be made, but anybody can do that - 3 weeks before launch there's definitely content lock, so you might have some designers/artists/producers free to do those.
Click to expand...

Again they are a small company. I doubt they have anyone just sitting on their hands. Someone gets pulled from some part of the project to cover for her malicious destruction of company property and from what I understand, they were already stretched thin due to running Impulse at the time.
 
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