• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

Arizona cop cleared in hotel shooting

Status
Not open for further replies.

kingwingin

Member
Cop gave him fair warning to not reach behind him or he would be shot.

Its one thing to say after the fact that it was just airsoft rifles and they were in no danger but in the heat of the moment the cop is thinking its either me going home or him.
 

krazen

Member
Cop gave him fair warning to not reach behind him or he would be shot.

Its one thing to say after the fact that it was just airsoft rifles and they were in no danger but in the heat of the moment the cop is thinking its either me going home or him.

Had plenty of time to restrain him, saw he was scared shitless, both cops gave contrary instructions at different times, etc. Its why he got fired before the trial.

The whole idea that every perp is a supervillian who can magically pull out a rifle at any second is bullshit.

So is the idea that "no matter what make sure you get home safe". Thats a broad brush, they get paid to be in possibly dangerous situations.
 

Trojita

Rapid Response Threadmaker
That was straight up murder

The cop that shot him looks like a little bitch with a napoleon complex

KNXV%20Philip%20Brailsford%20_1463448683172_38388155_ver1.0_640_480.jpg


PHILIP_BRAILSFORD_TRIAL__Officer_who_sto_0_4478307_ver1.0_640_360.jpg


Here's his service weapon
http://www.abc15.com/news/region-southeast-valley/mesa/daniel-shaver-update-officer-philip-brailsford-describes-moments-before-he-fatally-shot-unarmed-man

yourefd_1459294715042_35083524_ver1.0_640_480.jpg


Notice the wording?
 

Krappadizzle

Gold Member
Cop gave him fair warning to not reach behind him or he would be shot.

Its one thing to say after the fact that it was just airsoft rifles and they were in no danger but in the heat of the moment the cop is thinking its either me going home or him.

You probably should watch the video. I'm very supportive of police but this guy gave absolutely horrible instructions to the suspect and as a result led to his murder. Cop should be jailed.

Family more than likely has a good case for a civil suit at least.
 
Jesus Christ this is horrible. That cop was a fucking nightmare, I think anybody woud've lost their shit with all that yelling and threats to shoot. Oh my God that poor guy...
 

appaws

Banned
Look, OP. I try to respect the cops and the risks they take...

...but this was fucking awful.

It could be interpreted as reaching to his waistband...but the instructions were so bad, confusing, and the cop took so long and was so unclear....it never should have gotten to that point.
 

MGHA

Member
Anyone in their right mind would know that man was no threat. This has got to be the most "Look mom, I'm playing Army." situation I've ever seen.
 

krazen

Member
Look, OP. I try to respect the cops and the risks they take...

...but this was fucking awful.

It could be interpreted as reaching to his waistband...but the instructions were so bad, confusing, and the cop took so long and was so unclear....it never should have gotten to that point.

Imho, they need (and police dept's do) have very specific instructions when it comes to taking in the instructions. No cursing, etc. Step one, step two, step three. If you deviate from it it should jump straight to firing/criminal liability

Not sure why the crawling, all the extraneous bullshit was. It seemed he was high off adrenaline and was just making that encounter last longer than it should have by his shitty policing. It wasn't a Mexican standoff, it was a drunk guy already on the floor.
 
Look how you can do it better

"Lay on the ground , hands behind your back"

And then you go and handcuff him. None of this crawl to me bullshit.
 

///PATRIOT

Banned
Look how you can do it better

"Lay on the ground , hands behind your back"

And then you go and handcuff him. None of this crawl to me bullshit.

Actually crawling to the officer should have been the right command, he couldn't go to the suspect because there was an open door to the suspect's room and the officer didn't know for sure if there was somebody else inside.

Either way, suspect by himself was not a real threat, this was a murder, trigger-happy policeman.
 

BANGS

Banned
The whole idea that every perp is a supervillian who can magically pull out a rifle at any second is bullshit.

And the whole idea that cops should be superheros that always make the perfectly right decision in extremely dangerous situations is bullshit... No amount training is gonna stop you from getting and itchy trigger finger in a situation where you could potentially die...

I'm certainly not defending this cop's actions, but let's be real and not make it more than it is. It's an unfortunate tradgedy, plain and simple...
 

krazen

Member
And the whole idea that cops should be superheros that always make the perfectly right decision in extremely dangerous situations is bullshit... No amount training is gonna stop you from getting and itchy trigger finger in a situation where you could potentially die...

I'm certainly not defending this cop's actions, but let's be real and not make it more than it is. It's an unfortunate tradgedy, plain and simple...

They are trained professionals The officer was completely in control the entire situation and still found a way to fuck it up and kill someone.

The whole idea behind the training is to avoid this outcome, the crux of your argument is that the training is useless?
 

BANGS

Banned
They are trained professionals The officer was completely in control the entire situation and still found a way to fuck it up and kill someone.

The whole idea behind the training is to avoid thoe situations, the crux of your argument is that the training is useless?

Not useless, but certainly not foolproof. What do you do for a living? Have you ever made a mistake despite your in depth training? Hmmm... it's almost like cops are... human...
 

krazen

Member
Not useless, but certainly not foolproof. What do you do for a living? Have you ever made a mistake despite your in depth training? Hmmm... it's almost like cops are... human...

Humans that get paid for a specific job, who get trained to execute that job correctly.

you pull that 'hey, im human' when you fuck up at your job and end up homeless quick.

You pull that, 'hey, i panic'ed' in the military and get court martialed pretty quick
 

BANGS

Banned
Humans that get paid for a specific job, who get trained to execute that job correctly.

you pull that 'hey, im human' when you fuck up at your job and end up homeless quick.

You pull that, 'hey, i panic'ed' in the military and get court martialed pretty quick

Actually when I make a mistake at my job I don't get fired, because my superiors understand that humans make mistakes. Strange that you don't, good thing you don't have any employees...
 

krazen

Member
Actually when I make a mistake at my job I don't get fired, because my superiors understand that humans make mistakes. Strange that you don't, good thing you don't have any employees...

I should clarify; mistake sure. You fuck up, gone. Mistake is getting surprised and accidentally pulling the trigger. Fucking up is giving contrary instructions, confusing the dude, and shooting him as if he was the one being uncooperative when he was clearly doing his best.

At the end of the day can't do the job, you should pay for it. Not sure how every other dangerous profession from military (where the potential for death is considerably larger), construction, etc you get in deep shit.

Erratic policing tho? "My bad bro". Whats your mediocre professin I can join, BANGS?
 

gohepcat

Banned
Actually when I make a mistake at my job I don't get fired, because my superiors understand that humans make mistakes. Strange that you don't, good thing you don't have any employees...

What the fuck? Did you watch that video?

90% of the time I'm with the cops in these situations, but this guy was a fucking asshole who gunned down a sobbing kid crawling on his hands and knees.

Fuck this dude. Fuck him. This the definition of negligent homicide. There is a difference between being curt and direct in your instructions and being needlessly antagonizing.

This motherfucker should have done time.
 

VAL0R

Banned
I'm very pro-police and that was a vile and blatant miscarriage of justice. The cop should face severe repercussions. Disgusting.
 
I've been in this situation before and its shitty. It's a game of simon says where if you mess up they get to shoot you. They're cowards and psychopaths like a lot of cops seem to be here in the US. They get to hide behind their "blue wall" where even the "good cops" wont say anything or stand up for whats right.
 
Actually when I make a mistake at my job I don't get fired, because my superiors understand that humans make mistakes. Strange that you don't, good thing you don't have any employees...


NIce strawman argument!

Let's start an experiment. If you do work at a company, and a company that is
decent-sized, and none of your relatives are executives at said company.

Erase all of your company's databases and tell your boss...

"'oops my mistake"

better yet, come into drunk at work and vomit and your boss, and say
" oops my mistake I thought you were the toilet, and I thought it was Saturday"

According to your logic, both are mistakes and you are allowed to make mistakes at your job. Do that and come back to me.
 
What the fuck? Did you watch that video?

90% of the time I'm with the cops in these situations, but this guy was a fucking asshole who gunned down a sobbing kid crawling on his hands and knees.

Fuck this dude. Fuck him. This the definition of negligent homicide. There is a difference between being curt and direct in your instructions and being needlessly antagonizing.

This motherfucker should have done time.

Totally agree. This was straight up manslaughter, if not murder.
 

Syriel

Member
And the whole idea that cops should be superheros that always make the perfectly right decision in extremely dangerous situations is bullshit... No amount training is gonna stop you from getting and itchy trigger finger in a situation where you could potentially die...

I'm certainly not defending this cop's actions, but let's be real and not make it more than it is. It's an unfortunate tradgedy, plain and simple...

If a member of the US military did that in a war zone, they would be charged with a crime.

Not useless, but certainly not foolproof. What do you do for a living? Have you ever made a mistake despite your in depth training? Hmmm... it's almost like cops are... human...

Killing someone is not a mistake, it is a deliberate action.

This was not a case where the suspect was actively doing anything other than being scared.
 

luxsol

Member
And the whole idea that cops should be superheros that always make the perfectly right decision in extremely dangerous situations is bullshit... No amount training is gonna stop you from getting and itchy trigger finger in a situation where you could potentially die...

I'm certainly not defending this cop's actions, but let's be real and not make it more than it is. It's an unfortunate tradgedy, plain and simple...
Geez, I'd normally defend cops shooting people in times of high stress and mistaking certain gestures for reaching for a weapon, but from this video, the cop is straight up wrong for firing his weapon. The guy was following the directions and his hands were completely out in the open.

This is as bad as that time as that one therapist getting shot while he was laying on his back with his arms up in the air.
http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/12/us/north-miami-police-arrest-shooting/index.html
Or even that one kid with a BB gun getting shot in the back at a WalMart because he was wearing headphones.

It's just fucking wrong and there should have been a punishment.
Fucking cops today are way too high strung and i think people calling 911 really need to understand context. Just because someone has a gun or something looks like a gun doesn't mean they're murdering people or even doing anything wrong.
People are being way too paranoid.
 
This is what a society with so many guns and crazy people is like; paranoia, fear, stupidity. We aren't safer because of them.
 

luxsol

Member
This is what a society with so many guns and crazy people is like; paranoia, fear, stupidity. We aren't safer because of them.
Guns were more common with people back before the 70s.
There were fewer shootings/murders and cops weren't using their guns as much despite being less trained with them AND having fewer alternatives (MACE, baton, taser, etc) to incapacitate someone.

As I've said in another thread, the media is fucking brainwashing you into being hair triggered at any sign of perceived danger, despite murder/shootings/crime in general being at its lowest since the 60s and 50s.
People and cops are way too paranoid now thanks to the news over reporting violent crimes.
 

OrionFalls

Member
Anyone in this thread who is even remotely defending the actions of both cops need to take a step back and re-evaluate their lives. By showing even a tiny bit of support or ‘understanding’ of their actions, you are condoning and accepting the cold, brutal murder of an innocent young man. Both cops should - and I don’t say this lightly - take a knife to their throat and fucking off themselves. Scum.
 

BANGS

Banned
Geez, I'd normally defend cops shooting people in times of high stress and mistaking certain gestures for reaching for a weapon, but from this video, the cop is straight up wrong for firing his weapon. The guy was following the directions and his hands were completely out in the open.

Except for when he reaches behind him, ya know, right before he got shot...
 

krazen

Member
Except for when he reaches behind him, ya know, right before he got shot...


At any given time a blubbering drunk perp is ready with the ninja star to throw with perfect aim to take out a cop in a bullet proof vest and AR-15 in BANGS BANGS world where his boss high fives him after a mistake and consequences are but a dream.

tumblr_mghfi0KW2D1qdnqblo1_500.gif
 

BANGS

Banned
That's a great point. No cop has ever been shot by a perp who seemed otherwise harmless. Never happened... ever...
 
He was looking to kill him from the jump, acting like a coward talking shit just because he has a gun. Some idiot will say he was reaching, you know you can see he had nothing when his arm is back right?
 

Garuda1One

Member
Why did he shoot him ? That is just fucking stupid. Shooting a person because he cant crawl correctly, Shooting a person because he made a slight mistake when playing Simon Says is stupid. Why ? Do all of you trigger happy over there ????

Jeezz
 

Flare65

Neo Member
I'm totally with the cop on this. If I saw that guy reaching behind his waistband like that, I'd pull the trigger.
 

drotahorror

Member
It sucks that he reached to pull up his pants or w/e he did. He died for that. Very tragic, and I'm sure the young man being in that situation was scared as fuck and nervous as hell. Being like that can cause you to not be focused on what you're doing, thus making a motion to pull your pants up is a natural response to them falling down. The shooting was not justified but the cop was trained to shoot if someone reaches.

But the problem started right from the get-go. The cops attitude towards the 2 people was beyond aggressive. He let them know they WILL die if they make 1 mistake, setting the stage for them to do exactly what is told or else their life is over.

You can't say whether or not you could be rational and calm in a situation like that where it's a life or death situation while playing Simon Says.
 

Nipo

Member
Tensions are often high in these topics, but this is not an acceptable response to the post you quoted. Do not attack other members you disagree with.

Is telling someone to revalue their life an attack? Sometimes that is actually just sensible advice.
 

Flare65

Neo Member
This isn't April Fools Day.


Arizona is a state where you can carry a concealed firearm without a State issued license so as a cop, 100% of the people you encounter 'could' have a gun on them. Cop doesn't know who's around the corner where the 2 people came from and he told the dude 3 times not to put his hands behind his back and he did it twice and the third time he paid for it.
 

BadHand

Member
"He's coming right for us!"

Arizona is a state where you can carry a concealed firearm without a State issued license so as a cop, 100% of the people you encounter 'could' have a gun on them. Cop doesn't know who's around the corner where the 2 people came from and he told the dude 3 times not to put his hands behind his back and he did it twice and the third time he paid for it.

You are fucking batshit insane. NOBODY could follow those shrill panicked orders from a shaky coward pointing an AR-15 assault rifle at you. Most people would be having a panic attack in that scenario and unable to follow any commands.

"Hands up, hands down, cross your legs, crawl sideways like a crab, do the fucking okey-pokey!!"
*BANG BANG BANG*
"i didn't fucking say Simon says!!!!"

if this is normalized then the US is essentially a war zone, and with a comment like:

I'm totally with the cop on this. If I saw that guy reaching behind his waistband like that, I'd pull the trigger.

I can only assume you are a total coward as well.

By the way, this Hero took the time to carve "You're fucked" into the side of his assault rifle.
 

Flare65

Neo Member
Clearly I'm not alone in my opinion. He did get acquitted by a jury of our peers.

Put yourself in the officers boots. If someone who was reported to have a gun was repeatedly going against your orders, then reaches to the #1 spot that people hide weapons, what would you do?

Feel free to call me more names if it makes you feel better.
 

BadHand

Member
Clearly I'm not alone in my opinion. He did get acquitted by a jury of our peers.

Put yourself in the officers boots. If someone who was reported to have a gun was repeatedly going against your orders, then reaches to the #1 spot that people hide weapons, what would you do?

Feel free to call me more names if it makes you feel better.

I judge people by their actions - and you've stated that you would blow someone away for struggling to follow commands to the letter while under immense stress and anxiety. I only hope you don't own a gun and are in no position to fulfill your desire of killing someone for not dancing to your tune.

Please don't let the courts decision somehow let you justify your sick views.The jury and people who share the jury's decision who have given the militarized police (who have none of the discipline of the military) license to kill have blood on their hands.
 

GatorBait

Member
Why is sending in 6 officers armed with assault rifles a proportionate response to a 911 call about someone having a gun? In Arizona it's legal to open carry without a license! A guy "having a gun" should not be an immediate cause for concern of illegal activity occurring by police in Arizona. It's mind boggling how much the police escalated their response to the situation before even getting to the hotel.

Not only that, but the police are so god-damned concerned about there being someone else in the room who is armed and ready to attack them that they attempt to open THE FUCKING WRONG HOTEL DOOR at the end. Did anyone else notice they tried to enter room 500 instead of 502? Yep, I feel totally comfortable with their attention to detail and decision-making under pressure after seeing that...

The shooter should have a manslaughter charge, at least. Luckily, he has been fired and I hope he never works any job remotely similar to law enforcement in the future. The deceased widow has also filed a multi-million dollar wrongful death lawsuit. I pray she gets every penny, if for no other reason than because her 3 and 6-year old daughters have to grow up without a dad because the Mesa police are incompetent.

This entire story is just entirely frustrating to read and hear about. 100% preventable death at so many moments.
 
Actually when I make a mistake at my job I don't get fired, because my superiors understand that humans make mistakes. Strange that you don't, good thing you don't have any employees...

Your bad opinions stretch beyond the VR realm I see.

The cop could have fucking cuffed the dude immediately after he put his hands up. Instead, he gave contradicting orders by saying he needs to leave his hands up NO MATTER WHAT, then proceeds to tell him to CRAWL, which requires putting his hands down.

And when it comes to shooting someone, you damn well better make the right decision. There is no room for error when it comes to someone's life, especially when you're scaring the ever living fuck out of them and they're obviously trying to do what you say. It's not like the cop made some clerical mistake or decided to arrest someone when he shouldn't, he acted like a power hungry asshole by giving shitty directions to the guy, then shot him because the guy was pulling his pants up.

Defending this cop is lunacy.
 
That was like something out of a horror movie. Anyone would be panicked and scared out of their mind getting shouted at and threatened with death like that.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom