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7DollarHagane
Member
(05-19-2017, 09:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Kyne

the beta threads for TF2 were hammered with negative feedback about the game losing its "fluid" motion and the switch to "hero" titans.

then the game came out and the campaign made everyone forget about it (plus they improved it based off the feedback from the beta).

That was due to inexperience and alleviated by fixes made during the beta and before final release.

Maybe bungie can do something similar but I doubt it.
ZombieNapoleon
Junior Member
(05-19-2017, 09:01 PM)
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I want to say "haters gonna hate" but I don't necessarily believe everyone throwing shade is hating, but maybe ,as one early comment suggested, personal expectations were too high.

The visuals didn't seem to change, though I think the engine did to allow for easier modeling or modifications within the world, which is a basic benchmark most people use for game franchises. As a fan and player of D1, I know that the videos I watched showed an improvement, but for those that may have turned away from the game one to three years ago may not notice that improvement at first glance.

The OP is right that there is enough new content suggested at the reveal to clearly show this as a new game, though I'm wary of comparing anything until we know more details as to how much you get to do at the four new worlds. Vanilla destiny had four locations with at least around 8-10 missions on each, but it was still viewed as a hollow/janky story. But, I say that just to clarify I'm not blindly on the hype train, I knew the chances when I jumped on :)
Baleoce
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(05-19-2017, 09:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by mullet2000

I think the UI looking extremely similar goes a long way when it comes to giving people that impression, honestly.

Imagine how many games this would apply to with that line of thinking, though.
SirMossyBloke
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(05-19-2017, 09:02 PM)
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Originally Posted by randomengine

I take it you are not familiar with MMO expansions. All of that reads like the next WoW expansion in terms of new content. A sequel should be an entirely new game built from the ground up - at least it used to be in the Ultima days...

That list would even work with games like Watchdogs to Watchdogs 2. Would you call that an expansion?
SRTtoZ
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(05-19-2017, 09:02 PM)
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Unrealistic expectations. Bungie was working on paid expansions and free updates up until late last year while ALSO working on the game. If Bungie could afford to just go dark for 4-5 years to develop a sequel and then came out with what is currently Destiny 2 then i'd be for sure disappointed but that didn't happen and I don't expect that much of them.
benicillin
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(05-19-2017, 09:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Baleoce

Imagine how many games this would apply to with that line of thinking, though.



Fucking UIs never changing.
VincentMatts
Member
(05-19-2017, 09:04 PM)

Originally Posted by SRTtoZ

Unrealistic expectations. Bungie was working on paid expansions and free updates up until late last year while ALSO working on the game. If Bungie could afford to just go dark for 4-5 years to develop a sequel and then came out with what is currently Destiny 2 then i'd be for sure disappointed but that didn't happen and I don't expect that much of them.

Destiny came out in 2014. D2 will be out in late 2017. Thats 4 years.
StalkerUKCG
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(05-19-2017, 09:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by benicillin

Fucking UIs never changing.

Is that DLC?

Originally Posted by VincentMatts

Destiny came out in 2014. D2 will be out in late 2017. Thats practically 4 years.

4 Years with continued support for Destiny 1 and Taken King doing some fairly large overhauls to the game. I feel like your post is deliberately obtuse.
SilentRob
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(05-19-2017, 09:04 PM)
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Imo, there are two types of sequels.

There are sequels like going from Assassin's Creed 2 to Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood. Mechanically and structurally everything mostly stays the same and the sequel is more of a "content update" than anything else. A few new Features round out the package. Traditionally, expansions take exactly that route for MMO-inspired games, see World of Warcraft for example.

And then there are sequels like going from Assassin's Creed to Assassin's Creed 2, where everything but the core gameplay mechanics are thrown out and the game is being rebuilt around those core mechanics.

Many people (me included, frankly) expected a jump akin to AC and AC2 from Destiny, with the big, big problems the first game head (basically with everything BUT the core gameplay mechanics) and with how much we heart about them wanting to completely rebuild the game. How the had to start fresh so they wouldn't have to keep building on the less than perfect foundation of Destiny 1. With that knowledge it was pretty disappointing to see that Destiny 2 actually looked like it was built around that very same structure, more in line with a yearly Sequel like AC: Brotherhood or an expansion like WoW: Legion instead of a big, franchise-rebooting sequel.
swearing-circle
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(05-19-2017, 09:04 PM)
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For me it's the amount of reused assets. Especially in regards to enemies.
DryvBy
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(05-19-2017, 09:05 PM)
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I'm a big Destiny fan. I've platinumed the game after 2 years of playing. I've put in some major time. I've bought all the DLC. I even have the Ghost. I've done almost everything in that game except the newest raid because my friends quit playing and I was too lazy to LFG online.

That said, I'm in the camp that feels this is more DLC than a huge sequel from first glance. I see OP pointed out "improved graphics" but I didn't notice a huge jump. It looks like Destiny (which I'm not truly complaining because it's a great looking game). But it's not anything like Uncharted 1 to Uncharted 2 or Halo 1 to Halo 2 jump. I can't say I even noticed a "jump" but more of a "step".

There's a lot more content as mentioned in OP, but that's expected even with DLC. There's more of it, a refreshed universe and all, but going from vanilla Destiny to what it is today feels about what Destiny 2 is. A big jump and nice improvement, but not a full sequel. So from Destiny 1 to 2, yes that feels like a huge sequel.

The biggest issue I had with the previous DLCs is the lack of new enemies. Yes, there's new enemies. But they weren't exactly "new". They were reskinned with different abilities. Or with different elements to kill them.

One of the things I was kind of hoping for was the Destiny 1 that was given in their initial press conference release of Destiny. That game was incredibly ambitious. It sounded like the worlds were going to be huge like an MMO without various load times. A "see that mountain? You can go there" experience.

I like Destiny and I'll more than likely pick up Destiny 2 day one. The pre-order betas will confirm this for me. Overall, Destiny's gameplay is already near-perfect and more stuff to do is worth the "DLC" price for me. :)
yanipheonu
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(05-19-2017, 09:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by DrBo42

Should probably specify with that one. Destiny 2 wishes it could be that jump from AC1 to AC2.

Not necessarily. One could argue "the same game but with a more open world with things that should have been in the first game" could describe both AC2 and Destiny 2.

But that's a devils advocate position, I won't pretend AC is on par with AC2. But it's hard to deny sequels after that (Brotherhood and Revelations) are more iterative than amazing new experiences.

I just don't think Destiny 2 is a particularly egregious sequel. I've seen worse examples. Call of Duty's latest output had been a sore spot for lots of people.
Last edited by yanipheonu; 05-19-2017 at 09:07 PM.
Izuna
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(05-19-2017, 09:05 PM)
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So what you're saying is

It's like TTK?
Vinc
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(05-19-2017, 09:05 PM)
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Everything you mentioned sounds like DLC + patches to me. I guess it makes sense for Destiny 2 to be this way since it's a live game, but I was hoping for a complete overhaul of the game. I feel like the presentation lacked a doc brown spider monster, basically.
VincentMatts
Member
(05-19-2017, 09:06 PM)

Originally Posted by swearing-circle

For me it's the amount of reused assets. Especially in regards to enemies.

yeah that bothered me too. I felt like i was back on venus for a lot of the videos i saw.

Originally Posted by StalkerUKCG


4 Years with continued support for Destiny 1 and Taken King doing some fairly large overhauls to the game. I feel like your post is deliberately obtuse.

Every single game known to man does this. You think any dev actually have to stop supporting a game before they can start working on the next one? Dont be naive.
ornery
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(05-19-2017, 09:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by randomengine

I take it you are not familiar with MMO expansions. All of that reads like the next WoW expansion in terms of new content. A sequel should be an entirely new game built from the ground up - at least it used to be in the Ultima days...

This isnt really the case anymore.
StalkerUKCG
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(05-19-2017, 09:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by swearing-circle

For me it's the amount of reused assets. Especially in regards to enemies.

Show me a single one?
NinjaMouse
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(05-19-2017, 09:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Killer Queen

Because none of that is really all that big of a deal and is very much expansion level content. That's the bare minimum to be expected.

Then what would have needed to change or get added and still keep the game a "Destiny" game? To be honest, we saw 10 minutes (45 if you count content captured by youtube/twitch streamers at the event) of a game that intended for people to spend hundreds of hours in. What on earth makes everyone think that Bungie has given away the farm with this reveal? They showed off gameplay with a little story prelude. We don't even know if the ultimate boogie-man in the game is really this Gaol character or not. We only know what they wanted to tell us and really did was set up the story. We have no clue what happens or where it happens next.

Even the map they showed had plenty of open space for new planets to be added as they are discovered. I'd bet the 4 areas they showed are only what's available at the outset of the game.

In my opinion, it's absolutely insane (assuming you're a Destiny fan, of course) to have anything resembling a final opinion of Destiny 2 at this point. Not once did Luke and Co. say, "welp...there it is. All of it."
JareBear
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(05-19-2017, 09:07 PM)
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Originally Posted by swearing-circle

For me it's the amount of reused assets. Especially in regards to enemies.

This is a huge issue imo
border
wears the band's shirts to the band's concerts
can't comprehend the origin of terms
(05-19-2017, 09:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by VincentMatts

Destiny came out in 2014. D2 will be out in late 2017. Thats 4 years.

Might want to check those calculations.
BreezyLimbo
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(05-19-2017, 09:08 PM)
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Because Luke kept saying "we have to emphasize the 2"

Its the reason why the 2 is so big too.
RichiRamjag
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(05-19-2017, 09:08 PM)
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I'm not gonna say that it looks like dlc, but what I saw personally didn't excite me as it seemed very similar to what we've been playing and I'm already burnt the hell out on that. It's definitely a sequel, I'm not disputing that, it just may not be enough to bring me back (plus I'm salty as shit about 4v4 pvp).
Sarobi
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(05-19-2017, 09:08 PM)
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Because it looks like DLC? I feel it does. The UI looks similar me, and I was expecting more classes, better animations, and more emphasis on gunplay rather than abilities that cover your screen explosions.

Also OP Uncharted 2 and Halo 2 pushed ahead of their original games by a good amount. Destiny 2 so far looks like a reboot for the purpose of giving PC players a fresh start.
Familienoberhauptvogel
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by StalkerUKCG

4 Years with continued support for Destiny 1 and Taken King doing some fairly large overhauls to the game. I feel like your post is deliberately obtuse.

Was that even developed by the main team? We know they hired on another dev and there were rumours about a skeleton crew working on updates and such.
SargerusBR
I love Pokken!
(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by StalkerUKCG

Show me a single one?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFSQZKkmetU

Same designs, same AI patterns, same models.
oneils
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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A lot of the features being included in destiny 2 should have been in destiny 1. That partly explains the perception. Also, adding 4 worlds and a raid still falls short of how they sold destiny 1. Bungee created really big expectations for destiny 1 that they will never be able to escape that now.
Last edited by oneils; 05-19-2017 at 09:12 PM.
Interficium
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by benicillin

Fucking UIs never changing.

WOW IS THIS AN EXPANSION???

Originally Posted by VincentMatts

Destiny came out in 2014. D2 will be out in late 2017. Thats 4 years.

Next time count on your fingers.

Originally Posted by VincentMatts

3.5 whatever

No, still not right.
Last edited by Interficium; 05-19-2017 at 09:12 PM.
VincentMatts
Member
(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)

Originally Posted by border

Might want to check those calculations.

3.5 whatever, its a long time
VanWinkle
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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I wouldn't say it looks like DLC, but I do have to say I'm SUPER disappointed in its visual quality. Destiny 1 looked below average from a graphical standpoint, so it was fair to hope for a big jump in the current-gen-only sequel, and this just isn't a big jump.

The geometry and texture quality/variety is still so firmly rooted in last gen. It makes for a pretty unimpressive look.
highrider
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by HStallion

I thought the original game was pretty weak overall so just giving more of that isn't exactly telling me I need to jump into the sequel.

Yeah, although I enjoyed the first game I guess I was expecting something with bigger changes. I'm not down on it or anything, just not really understanding the hype.
btags
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(05-19-2017, 09:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by StalkerUKCG

Maybe I'm missing something here but this seems like a really silly complaint.

Just off the top of my head

A complete rework of at least 3 sub classes
A complete rework of the weapon loadout
An entirely new story
Improved Graphics
4 entirely new locations
A slew of new strikes
A slew of new MP maps
A reworking of game currency
A reworking of multiplayer across the board
LFG systems and Guilds
Friendly AI characters during gameplay
Improvements to how activities can be launched
Entirely new loot
At least 3 new weapon archetypes
+more I'm very likely missing

Why does Destiny 2 look like DLC but Uncharted 2 or Borderlands 2 or Halo 2 or Mirrors Edge 2 or basically any other sequel doesn't "look like DLC"

Even in Destiny's big DLC Taken King we only got 1 new location and some mild system quality of life improvements. Destiny 1 was certainly a game that evolved but not too the degree that D2 is changing things.

Additionally why does it matter if it looks like "DLC" or more specifically an Expansion.

World of Warcraft gets similar priced "expansions" frequently and that's a game that require a monthly sub to play. People don't really complain then.

I'm basically just trying to understand the perspective of people who feel this is more like a DLC than a Sequel and what basis they are using for comparison

Ok, here are my thoughts. First off, I do not care what people think as I did not buy Destiny 1 and will likely not buy Destiny 2. As for why people think Destiny 2 looks like an expansion, a lot of the bolded from the quote above could be patched into the game, like many games that rework mechanics/systems as the game ages. The italicized from the quote above could easily be added to a game in an expansion.

Now, plenty of people will say that yes many of those things could be patched/added to destiny one but so could a lot of stuff that is in sequels! I understand and agree with that point, but I think the main problem with that argument is that Bungie sold Destiny as being a 10 year game so they sort of expect a continuously updated game (like WoW) rather than a brand new game that does not allow for them to carry their character over. Sure, if Destiny existed on a previous gen, where patching was not that common (especially large patches), I could understand the need for a sequel but with the current console generation all of this could easily be patches/content additions to Destiny 1.

Now, if you still argue that Bungie still has the right to release a new game ok, but again, many people were expecting a 10 year game and being told that a sequel is coming caused many to think this meant a big change in the general format of the game to more closely resemble what Bungie initially promised.

Basically, I understand the frustration of ardent destiny fans that say people are being harsh on the game. That being said, Bungie initally pitched Destiny as a 10 year game, so people hoped for something that could be continuously updated, but then when they announced that the sequel would not allow you to carry over your character they expected something drastically different than the current game and were disappointed when the sequel looked pretty similar to the first game in terms of structure.

That is my take anyway. Not saying I am necessarily right.
Velocity:Design:Comfort
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(05-19-2017, 09:10 PM)
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Considering I've seen dozens of GAFfers saying Splatoon 2 is a port and not a sequel, I don't know if there is an explanation for this. A little bit of feet stamping indignation that D2 isn't a full mmo still, mixed with ignorance and a lack of actually looking into the facts, I think.

I saw a poster say in another thread about this that there are no new enemy types in D2. Based on what information? Just because there are no new enemy races? I wish there was more variety too, but there's no evidence for there being no new enemy types. Even the expacs introduced numerous new enemy types. Why wouldn't that be the case here?
deadscreensky
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(05-19-2017, 09:10 PM)
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Bungie themselves set up the expectation we would be getting an Assassin's Creed 2-level sequel jump when they made excuses for why stats etc. from the original game wouldn't carry forward.

Originally Posted by Bungie

“We believe this is the best path forward. It allows us to introduce the major advancements and improvements that all of us expect from a sequel, ensuring it will be the best game we can create, unencumbered by the past.”

Destiny 2 doesn't look like a sequel that's been "unencumbered by the past."
Velocity:Design:Comfort
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(05-19-2017, 09:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by btags

First off, I do not care what people think as I did not buy Destiny 1 and will likely not buy Destiny 2.

Then why make this post if you don't actually know what would constitute an expac vs dlc vs a sequel for a game? Wouldn't you have to play it to know that?
gatti-man
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(05-19-2017, 09:11 PM)
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I'm a huge destiny fan. Destiny 2 does look like destiny 1. This doesn't upset me but people complaining about it certainly have grounds to feel that way. I was hoping for new enemies or even new allies personally.
Lingitiz
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(05-19-2017, 09:11 PM)
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I feel like the "we're wiping everyone's characters!" messaging early on led people to believe the overhaul to the game would be massive. It looks more like a better, more fully realized version of Destiny 1 which I'm not opposed to.
benicillin
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(05-19-2017, 09:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by SargerusBR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFSQZKkmetU

Same designs, same AI patterns, same models.

How do you make a game set in the same universe and radically change the design and character models? Of course some of the stuff is the same, it's Destiny?
DancingNalwood
Junior Member
(05-19-2017, 09:12 PM)
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My problem with the complaints is that all these changes could not have been made within dlc. If you've been following destiny and the community over the past 1.5 years you will understand why this needed to be a new game.

More complex/mechanic heavy missions, strikes and raid - they've stated repeatedly that they haven't been able to implement a lot of game ideas because of the systems the game was built with.

Sweeping changes to patrol and exploration - the patrol areas in D1 could not handle anything more than the handful of beacons and occasional public event.

Story - to tell this story you need to remove all the current playable spaces and social areas. I'm sure that would go down well.

Gun and Subclass balance - we still, almost 3 years after launch, have balance issues. These can't be solved with a patch because 1) they've completely overhauled the system with the passive abilities and new kinetic/energy/power gun specifications. 2) one of the biggest problems was needing to remove certain abilities and weapons but couldn't without receiving even bigger backlash than leaving year 1 weapons behind. 3) even if they could it would mean removing old activities or completely remaking them to work with the new ones.

Clans - the current system is basically adding a tag to your name, hardly ready for the new grouping system.

PvP - oh, we're also about to change every game mode to 4v4 and remove every current map from the game because only the new maps suit it and the new abilities/weapons.

They explained the limitations of the old systems repeatedly since taken king launched. Anyone saying it should just be dlc either doesn't understand how game development works or hasn't been following/playing the game. Plus, if you're paying the same amount who cares?
spannicus
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(05-19-2017, 09:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by Warnen

Because Gaf doesn't like anyone enjoying anything.

I saw a family going out for ice cream and the kids looked happy. It made me cringe!
Kor of Memory
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(05-19-2017, 09:14 PM)
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Here is a list of things I think would have people way more excited about than just showing us what they did:

The new sublcasses should either have been a fourth subclass for each Class, or a brand new Class entirely. Either of these would make people very excited.

Show off new enemies. I saw some weird demon dog thing during the presentation. Show that off. I would like to think each enemy group is getting at least two new unit types. Show those off. People liked seeing the Brutes, Buzzers, Flood Pure Forms, Skirmishers, and Engineers. It gave them ideas of how new encounters can be more dynamic.

Show us more of whatever that Tank thing was. Was that a PvE only vehicle? Was it Guardian or Cabal? If the former, then they should definitely have shown it off.

That new PvP mode should have been given a run down during the presentation. I don't like the idea of having to guess which streamer might be playing PvP and just sort of watch to figure it out.


I mean, old Halos typically added new weapons, new vehicles, and new enemy units. These things alone got people excited. Even of this short list alone, we've only really seen 1 of these 3 things, and weren't even given any proper information about them.
btags
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(05-19-2017, 09:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Velocity:Design:Comfort

Then why make this post if you don't actually know what would constitute an expac vs dlc vs a sequel for a game? Wouldn't you have to play it to know that?

Because I have played plenty of games that have had sequels and/or expansions and can judge for myself what constitutes both of them. That, and I have been a fan of Bungie since the original Halo and tried Destiny but didn't like it, but remained interested in the sequel if they could improve certain things. They just announced the game and from what they showed I have decided it looks too similar to what I played of the first and thus I will not likely buy it. I am still giving the game a chance though and discussing it with other people on this here video game discussion forum to see what their opinions are. Shocking, I know.
sleepr
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(05-19-2017, 09:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by SargerusBR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFSQZKkmetU

Same designs, same AI patterns, same models.

Might wanna check those designs and models a little closer.
ExVicis
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(05-19-2017, 09:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Velocity:Design:Comfort

Considering I've seen dozens of GAFfers saying Splatoon 2 is a port and not a sequel, I don't know if there is an explanation for this. A little bit of feet stamping indignation that D2 isn't a full mmo still, mixed with ignorance and a lack of actually looking into the facts, I think.

I saw a poster say in another thread about this that there are no new enemy types in D2. Based on what information? Just because there are no new enemy races? I wish there was more variety too, but there's no evidence for there being no new enemy types. Even the expacs introduced numerous new enemy types. Why wouldn't that be the case here?

I don't know about you man but I find the Cabal the most boring out of everyone we fight in Destiny. They're background is just basically Angry more Brutish Space Rome.

So I was really hoping some super crazy ridiculous invincible seeming servant of the Darkness was coming to destroy the City and kick us out, giving us a new perspective on the Darkness and our relative power to it, not just what amounts to more of Destiny's version of the Halo Brutes.
Detective
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(05-19-2017, 09:15 PM)
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If it's not broken don't fix it.

Don't change for the sake of change.

Like someone who should be nameless.

Can't wait for D2.
InsaneTiger
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(05-19-2017, 09:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by ExVicis

well you don't need to tell us about it, just stop going around and calling everyone not hyped "haters"

You're right. Halo 2 looked like Halo and Destiny 2 looks like Destiny, I think everything is fine.
truestatic
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(05-19-2017, 09:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by yanipheonu

What I wonder is if this complaint be levied against other game sequels.

Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, Far Cry, and Pokemon, are all incredibly similar in each sequel. Usually the changes are to more minute aspects of the game, and the overall game remains mostly the same.

Are these also "DLC Sequels?" If not, why are they different?

Bear in mind, I chose those examples cause I like those series. But i can't deny the sequels are very similar.

I'd argue some games, many games, are incredibly similar for each entry. I see no reason to think Destiny is a uniquely bad case. If anything it does more than other sequels to stand apart.

Call of Duty is most at fault here, and has absolutely got called out for completely derivative sequels countless times. Far Cry 3 and 4 saw a similar but smaller backlash.
jwk94
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(05-19-2017, 09:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by benicillin

How do you make a game set in the same universe and radically change the design and character models? Of course some of the stuff is the same, it's Destiny?

Uncharted and inFAMOUS did just that. Even the Halo games look different as time goes on.
Finnroth
Junior Member
(05-19-2017, 09:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by StalkerUKCG


A complete rework of at least 3 sub classes
A complete rework of the weapon loadout
An entirely new story
Improved Graphics
4 entirely new locations
A slew of new strikes
A slew of new MP maps
A reworking of game currency
A reworking of multiplayer across the board
LFG systems and Guilds
Friendly AI characters during gameplay
Improvements to how activities can be launched
Entirely new loot
At least 3 new weapon archetypes

First of all, I do not hate, my expecations are not hugely dampened or am I otherwise trying to picture the following points as entirely negative, however:

After the introduction of losing everything and gaining new powers, only slightly reworking
the subclasses
, maybe only one of them, seems to be a little on the save side. I think
they missed an opportunity here for a new class, maybe more new subclasses and
innovations to the elements. What we got could very well fit in an expansion.

Weapon loadouts are interesting, but do not merit too much enthusiuasm before seeing the new system in practice. Could be cool, could be bad - it certainly is new enough to differentiate both titles I think.

New strikes and maps are not really interesting to consider imho, they are to be expected - both for an expansion or a sequel and they will, fairly or not, be compared to the quality and quantity of D1. Similarly, while we get new maps - and I am sure they will be interesting, what we saw didn't look too much different from what we had in D1. Just from the trailer alone, it did not give off the appearance of comletely different worlds, and the same goes unfortunately for the factions, which follow a similar pattern to TTK. Doesn't need to be bad, but just doesn't scream *new*, which especially for the enemy types seems a little odd, even boring.

Entirely new loot is certainly a good thing, all things considered! They can go in interesting directions with the reworkd subclass systems I think.

As for the rest, the quality of life improvements certainly don't scream fresh and shiny, but I do think we all will appreciate them in D2. They were however severely outdated in D1, so the difference isn't as drastic because most of us probably expected them to go into that direction.

I don't mean to say any of that is final, that we have seen everything or that all of the above is bad or boring, but I can totally see why people got more of an expansion-ish impression instead of a sequel-ish one. I'll play it no matter what, but I do hope they have some surprises for us!
chronic_archaic
Junior Member
(05-19-2017, 09:16 PM)
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Not sure if somebody mentioned this - but stuff like the Dead Zone and one of the Rocket Launchers used in the trailer were literally Destiny content that was never used. The later is one thing, an entire planet is another. And yeah, everything else that got mentioned. Same UI, engine, mechancis etc.
SilentRob
Member
(05-19-2017, 09:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by DancingNalwood

My problem with the complaints is that all these changes could not have been made within dlc. If you've been following destiny and the community over the past 1.5 years you will understand why this needed to be a new game.

More complex/mechanic heavy missions, strikes and raid - they've stated repeatedly that they haven't been able to implement a lot of game ideas because of the systems the game was built with.

Sweeping changes to patrol and exploration - the patrol areas in D1 could not handle anything more than the handful of beacons and occasional public event.

Story - to tell this story you need to remove all the current playable spaces and social areas. I'm sure that would go down well.

Gun and Subclass balance - we still, almost 3 years after launch, have balance issues. These can't be solved with a patch because 1) they've completely overhauled the system with the passive abilities and new kinetic/energy/power gun specifications. 2) one of the biggest problems was needing to remove certain abilities and weapons but couldn't without receiving even bigger backlash than leaving year 1 weapons behind. 3) even if they could it would mean removing old activities or completely remaking them to work with the new ones.

Clans - the current system is basically adding a tag to your name, hardly ready for the new grouping system.

PvP - oh, we're also about to change every game mode to 4v4 and remove every current map from the game because only the new maps suit it and the new abilities/weapons.

They explained the limitations of the old systems repeatedly since taken king launched. Anyone saying it should just be dlc either doesn't understand how game development works or hasn't been following/playing the game. Plus, if you're paying the same amount who cares?

World of Warcraft: Cataclysm completely destroyed and changed a world infinitely bigger than the one in Destiny and has balancing changes bigger than what you described with literally every expansion. If the only reason for this being a sequel instead of a 40$ expansion is "We had to re-work the backend", I really don't see how that works in your argument's favor (or, really, why consuments should even care).

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