It was everyone involved in making the game.
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NieR: Automata Spoiler Thread
- Thread starter BRSxIgnition
- Start date
I started to read that article someone linked, but it's just getting so many surface level things wrong, that it's hard for me to take it seriously. Should I just ignore it and stick with the text? Because I can't help but have the impression that more time was spent writing the piece than actually reflecting on the experience if a person can't even get basic stuff right. >_<
Like, they say the final goal of Project YoRHa is to destroy the moon, creating the belief that humans were killed and became gods, but of course it's not, that doesn't even make sense. All it would create is the belief that humans were killed and their efforts were for nothing. They're right about creating an infallible religion, but based on the premise that humans are alive and well on the moon, and that their struggle isn't meaningless, that they'll come back when the earth is secured, even if they don't directly communicate with the remaining androids.
It's openly talked about in YoRHa Disposal, and even in the Black Box if you're playing the localized version because of a fuck up that still wasn't patched.
I know this is incredibly obvious to everyone here, but that's exactly why it bothered me so much when reading that article.
Like, they say the final goal of Project YoRHa is to destroy the moon, creating the belief that humans were killed and became gods, but of course it's not, that doesn't even make sense. All it would create is the belief that humans were killed and their efforts were for nothing. They're right about creating an infallible religion, but based on the premise that humans are alive and well on the moon, and that their struggle isn't meaningless, that they'll come back when the earth is secured, even if they don't directly communicate with the remaining androids.
It's openly talked about in YoRHa Disposal, and even in the Black Box if you're playing the localized version because of a fuck up that still wasn't patched.
I know this is incredibly obvious to everyone here, but that's exactly why it bothered me so much when reading that article.
This game's models being damaged, improperly maintained refugees likely had something to do with it - in addition, Popola deliberately sacrificed herself due to the nature of the Tower system; after which Devola only really wanted to die; they weren't fighting for their lives.
TheChillyAcademic
Member
This really is the end of Nier right? I mean...there's nothing left....not even Emil.
Seems like MGS and Dark Souls theorycrafters have reached Nier Automata lol
Aren't there more Emils than the one we see? Also if going with ending E androids are alive again and all of that...
EDIT: Waaaiit, just noticed... Emil heads story takes place after the game?
Yeah that's what I was thinking, especially considering the credits you shoot up his name along with all the other people involved in creating the game.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3ysCIP3mPQ
When this track played.
sheeeit.
Nier Automata handled fan service in the absolutely most perfect way possible.
When this track played.
sheeeit.
Nier Automata handled fan service in the absolutely most perfect way possible.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Yeah by causing more suffering to the fan service characters.
CesspoolofHatred
Member
Welcome to Yoko Taro's Wild Ride, thanks for hopping on
Snakethesniper
Member
Sooo, is there a complete plot analysis somewhere?
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
https://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/168677-nier-automata/75173624
Someone is writing a pretty big one here(over 150 pages already).
It is not finished but imo the most accurate. It is nice that author actually actively discusses plot stuff with everyone there.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
I'd kind of like to do a long writeup for it, but i do hope people explore how intensely Buddhist this game is.
And it's not the androids who found enlightment.
And it's not the androids who found enlightment.
FlowersisBritish
fleurs n'est pas britannique
Really? Can you elaborate?
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Not to say that it is 100% pro buddhism (the game did inspire a lot of worldly desires 
), if anything it's a pretty ruthless take on what it means to thoroughly observe the world and human nature, but a pretty major theme throughout the game is basically dogma vs empiricism. Androids being dogmatic beings, built in the image of their creators and clinging onto them as divine beings, deliberately averting their eyes to the truth. The machines killed their own gods because they found the human way of life more fascinating, and branched out different evolutionary paths to observe what they deemed as the right path, in about as machine-like way as possible, ruthless and coldly rational. Though I like taro's twist that basing it on the whole of humanity instead of just the teachings of Buddha, machines learnt about conflict instead of kindness.
Of course you could just as well say it's religion vs philosophy, but there are a few aspects that I consider pretty Buddhist. Like the idea of worldly attachments as the main cause for the cycle of suffering. 2B/9S need for each other, the android's attachment to their blind dogma, our attachment to relationships, and not just relationships between 2 people, but society as a whole. Most of chapter A/B is basically exploring how the machines build societies after all, even going so far to assign stuff like gender when it really has no meaning to them. And then in C we basically see everyone suffer due to not losing those attachments, but because they are clinging onto them, unable to let go. If anything the machine consciousness obsession for self-observation is also a form of attachment, but in ending D, they finally concluded that the conflict born from attachments, through the battles between the androids, machines, adam, eve, etc., are ultimately meaningless, discovering the Emptiness of the ideal they are chasing. While the ark is ultimately meant to find a new world, the text also says that the machine consciousness is perfectly fine drifting through the emptiness of space of eternity, because time holds no meaning to them, ultimately letting go of every worldly attachments.
That's a short summary of what I think can be a longer piece because I'm only really good at writing surface level observations, and while I have an interest in buddhism I wouldn't say I'm an expert at it.
Not that I really think the ultimate message is that all worldly attachment is bad. Ending E really only works because of it. Our attachment to the characters we're invested in, and ultimately our need to connect as a society on a whole.
In the end, not every question needs an answer.
), if anything it's a pretty ruthless take on what it means to thoroughly observe the world and human nature, but a pretty major theme throughout the game is basically dogma vs empiricism. Androids being dogmatic beings, built in the image of their creators and clinging onto them as divine beings, deliberately averting their eyes to the truth. The machines killed their own gods because they found the human way of life more fascinating, and branched out different evolutionary paths to observe what they deemed as the right path, in about as machine-like way as possible, ruthless and coldly rational. Though I like taro's twist that basing it on the whole of humanity instead of just the teachings of Buddha, machines learnt about conflict instead of kindness.Of course you could just as well say it's religion vs philosophy, but there are a few aspects that I consider pretty Buddhist. Like the idea of worldly attachments as the main cause for the cycle of suffering. 2B/9S need for each other, the android's attachment to their blind dogma, our attachment to relationships, and not just relationships between 2 people, but society as a whole. Most of chapter A/B is basically exploring how the machines build societies after all, even going so far to assign stuff like gender when it really has no meaning to them. And then in C we basically see everyone suffer due to not losing those attachments, but because they are clinging onto them, unable to let go. If anything the machine consciousness obsession for self-observation is also a form of attachment, but in ending D, they finally concluded that the conflict born from attachments, through the battles between the androids, machines, adam, eve, etc., are ultimately meaningless, discovering the Emptiness of the ideal they are chasing. While the ark is ultimately meant to find a new world, the text also says that the machine consciousness is perfectly fine drifting through the emptiness of space of eternity, because time holds no meaning to them, ultimately letting go of every worldly attachments.
That's a short summary of what I think can be a longer piece because I'm only really good at writing surface level observations, and while I have an interest in buddhism I wouldn't say I'm an expert at it.
Not that I really think the ultimate message is that all worldly attachment is bad. Ending E really only works because of it. Our attachment to the characters we're invested in, and ultimately our need to connect as a society on a whole.
In the end, not every question needs an answer.
Well Accord is still out there... watching...
So anything ia possible when you have alternate time-lines.
RedlineRonin
Member
Just finished E.
Wow.
So when I agree to sacrifice my save for someone, are those all the peoples gamer tags you see that are helping you in the last credit shmup section where it keeps saying "data lost"?
Wow.
So when I agree to sacrifice my save for someone, are those all the peoples gamer tags you see that are helping you in the last credit shmup section where it keeps saying "data lost"?
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Yeah.
It's from people who also deleted their data.
It's from people who also deleted their data.
Not to say that it is 100% pro buddhism (the game did inspire a lot of worldly desires
Of course you could just as well say it's religion vs philosophy, but there are a few aspects that I consider pretty Buddhist. Like the idea of worldly attachments as the main cause for the cycle of suffering. 2B/9S need for each other, the android's attachment to their blind dogma, our attachment to relationships, and not just relationships between 2 people, but society as a whole. Most of chapter A/B is basically exploring how the machines build societies after all, even going so far to assign stuff like gender when it really has no meaning to them. And then in C we basically see everyone suffer due to not losing those attachments, but because they are clinging onto them, unable to let go. If anything the machine consciousness obsession for self-observation is also a form of attachment, but in ending D, they finally concluded that the conflict born from attachments, through the battles between the androids, machines, adam, eve, etc., are ultimately meaningless, discovering the Emptiness of the ideal they are chasing. While the ark is ultimately meant to find a new world, the text also says that the machine consciousness is perfectly fine drifting through the emptiness of space of eternity, because time holds no meaning to them, ultimately letting go of every worldly attachments.
That's a short summary of what I think can be a longer piece because I'm only really good at writing surface level observations, and while I have an interest in buddhism I wouldn't say I'm an expert at it.
Not that I really think the ultimate message is that all worldly attachment is bad. Ending E really only works because of it. Our attachment to the characters we're invested in, and ultimately our need to connect as a society on a whole.
In the end, not every question needs an answer.
I really doubt Buddhism has much to do with it, the game is much more about nihilism, ACTUAL nihilism then anything else, its something Taro has always used extensively.
Well, if Yoko wants to make a sequel, direct, detached, etc, he'll find a way to do it. No one expected Nier to get a sequel after all.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Eh, I'd say it definitely explores aspects of nihilism, but nihilism is not the point. It is very interested in how we internalise meaning in ourselves, either through self-observation which is pretty buddhist, or through hard coded dogma.
If anything I'd say how it tries to explore the inherent ties we have to the physical world and people pushes it more towards Buddhism than straightout nihilism.
If anything I'd say how it tries to explore the inherent ties we have to the physical world and people pushes it more towards Buddhism than straightout nihilism.
hmmm. I don't really see how you can get through ending E and still feel like the larger point is nihilistic in nature.
Then again I do also see this game as meaning a lot of different things to a lot of different people depending on how you yourself internalize the situations it puts you in and the information it presents.
RubberLuffy
Banned
Guys I still love this game.
I haven't touched it in like a month and yet it's still stuck in my head.
I played like 50 hours of Persona 5 but took a break to binge some shows but I'm having a hard time getting the urge to go back to it but I keep feeling like replaying NieR.
I haven't touched it in like a month and yet it's still stuck in my head.
I played like 50 hours of Persona 5 but took a break to binge some shows but I'm having a hard time getting the urge to go back to it but I keep feeling like replaying NieR.
Because actual nihilism is very often both misinterpreted completely or only giving a surface level context.
"Everything that lives is designed to end. They are perpetually trapped in a never-ending spiral of life and death. However...life is all about the struggle within this cycle.That is what "we" believe."
and
"A future is not given to you. It is something you must take for yourself."
Are both VERY nihilistic, as is basically everything in Ending E said by the Pods, it's just not that surface level trash used by less competent writers to justify there edginess
And Taro wasn't pushing Buddhism, he examines religions in all his works on some level, the game itself brings up multiple, he didn't suddenly decide to encode budda philosophy, he was talking about the struggle to find meaning in a world that's meaningless, which again is Nihilist to the fucking core.
eh, you may think it's "surface level trash" or w/e but I don't think those lines read as *only* nihilistic. I think it says something about you that this is how you're interpreting it, which is maybe worth examining!
Lol misunderstanding, the lines aren't trash at all there great, I was saying there not the surface level schlock that most other writers fall into when trying to use Nihilism.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
To be fair I don't think he's pushing buddhism either, I'm saying that he's using some pretty buddhist constructs to as an examination of how we find meaning, as I've laid out.
Yup!
And the choir that sang for you as you were being helped were all the people that worked on the game, including Yoko Taro, in case ya didn't know.
The Nier craze is truly bad, but I'm still enjoying P5 well enough myself.
EDIT:
Shamelessly stole this screenshot from another thread, it looks dope as hell:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=234297001&postcount=2342
Snakethesniper
Member
I started reading a little but it seems to only describe the game events?
I started Persona 5 and find it a bit .... not all that, especially after finishing Nier
Especially since its english dub, sakamoto forr reallll? Got annoying really fast :-/
Im 5 hours in and the story are still quite standard, will it get better anytime soon?
5 hours are like, nothing at all in Persona 5.
But yeah, story and characterization are going to stay boring. Best not compare both games honestly.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
So xander cage's post in the soundtrack thread had thrown me for a loop. What's the most common interpretation of ending c? To me ending c was about a2 getting rid of the infection in 9s by crumbling the machine consciousness that is connected within him due to the infection? My interpretation is that she says sorry when she heard child noises from that post of light is because it's meant to show that the machine children still resides in the machine consciousness, and it reminded her of her experience with Pascal.
Come on man, that's like only 5/100 way through. You can't judge it yet.
Same here. I keep coming back to the soundtrack and checking this thread. I get excited everytime I hear a friend mention they've started playing Nier: Automata. So much to talk about, but I have to stay quiet. lol
Yeah , I know P5 is more of a traditional JRPG compared to Nier, but at 5 hour mark I believe you get to the amusement park for the first time in nier and go... what the fuck is going on here...
I will keep playing P5 for sure, just wish there are way to have japan dub and eng subtitle
There's a language pack on PSN you need to download, then you need to activate it on title screen on persona 5 and make sure you also have the anime cutscenes also have subtitles in the options.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
The dub for p5 is perfectly fine.
The dub for nier is amazing though.
The dub for nier is amazing though.
Astrael
Member
I really liked Morgana in the English dub so now I'm curious about the Japanese voice, I'll have to find some videos. He made me want to get a cat of my own but my roommates won't allow it
My 3-minute NieR: Automata presentation for my research paper was a success today. Even my professor told me he wanted to play the game now, and somehow I avoided spoiling anything while briefly explaining the core explorations of the story. Almost wish I had more time but probably good I didn't since I could talk for hours about it. The class liked my screenshot of Pascal commenting on Nietzsche lol.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
Kira is generally pretty good even if she didn't stand out too much due to the nature of 2b, but when she had to go for it she really goes for it.
"Oh... Nines..."
"Oh... Nines..."
Awful Falafel
Banned
I really liked Morgana in the English dub so now I'm curious about the Japanese voice, I'll have to find some videos. He made me want to get a cat of my own but my roommates won't allow it
My 3-minute NieR: Automata presentation for my research paper was a success today. Even my professor told me he wanted to play the game now, and somehow I avoided spoiling anything while briefly explaining the core explorations of the story. Almost wish I had more time but probably good I didn't since I could talk for hours about it. The class liked my screenshot of Pascal commenting on Nietzsche lol.
Oh cool, I could never wrangle a game or show I liked to be relevant enough for whatever I'm studying at the time. It'd be cool to see this if you could somehow share it, scrubbing personal info away of course.
Also is anyone else wondering how they're going to do the english dub for the CEOs in the coliseum DLC?
I think they'll either keep the Japanese lines in every version, or just have them record English versions of their lines, like Kamiya did for Wonder-Director in The Wonderful 101. I'm not sure how fluent they are - if at all - but any potential degree of broken English would only be in service of the joke.
How would they translate SHACHOU DESU
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