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Wingfan19
Member
(03-20-2017, 10:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by Vermillion

But I don't feel like this show ever hit a lull like the other Marvel shows. It's maybe not as good as Daredevil S1 or Luke Cage Pt.1 S1, but it's still pretty damn good, IMO.

So much this for me as well. I felt like the show was never boring to me, but at the same time never really as exciting as the other 3 shows. The first 2 eps were a bit slow, but I wanted to know what was going to happen and when we get to episode 3 and on, I was fine with what I was seeing. It's like the show ramped up to 60% and just stayed there all the way until the end instead of spiking up to 95% then crashing down to 40%. I don't know what's worse, I've enjoyed all the Marvel Netflix stuff enough to want to keep watching whatever they put out, so it hasn't negatively affected me.
hydruxo
Member
(03-20-2017, 10:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by GuitarAtomik

Also was that supposed to be Bride of Nine Spiders in the tournament episode? I hope not.

yeah it was, such a waste of an awesome character

Originally Posted by Vermillion

I liked Danny himself well enough - can't wait to see how he plays off of Luke Cage.

Also, holy shit, Joy is a level 100 follower. I'd say she's a terrible character, but having to deal with a person like that IRL? She did a good job. Still annoying, and miserably so.

Also, why is it the boy raised by monks that has the most difficult time controlling his anger? Lol.

I loved the drunken fist style fight, and most of the fight choreography was pretty decent, IMO.

I went from hating Ward to thinking he was the goddamn man, so good character development on him at least.

The preachiness about killing got incredibly old, really early on.

But I don't feel like this show ever hit a lull like the other Marvel shows. It's maybe not as good as Daredevil S1 or Luke Cage Pt.1 S1, but it's still pretty damn good, IMO.

8/10 from me.

It never hit a lull because it was just mediocre throughout. Weakest of the Marvel shows by a long shot, really.
Maximo
Member
(03-20-2017, 10:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by SporeCrawler

Danny is supposed to be this naive dumb guy that knows nothing but martial arts

So the only thing he knows hes not good at? Dude is supposed to be a better fighter then DD,LC,JJ combined and yet DD would probably kick his ass.
Kyne
Member
(03-20-2017, 10:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Maximo

So the only know he knows hes not good at? Dude is supposed to be a better fighter then DD,LC,JJ combined and yet DD would probably kick his ass.

honestly at this point Lawyer Trinity would have probably have kicked his ass.
UnemployedVillain
Member
(03-21-2017, 12:27 AM)
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Originally Posted by SporeCrawler

Danny is supposed to be this naive dumb guy that knows nothing but martial art

I don't think this is true nor does it make any sense. If it was then the entire of Kun Lun is a huge enormous joke if some kid who knows nothing is able to reach their highest position and be their designated protector. It completely undermines is 15 years of training if that's the case
suzu
Member
(03-21-2017, 12:56 AM)
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I don't think Danny Rand is suppose to be that straight up bad. That's just excusing the piss poor choreography and inconsistency.
MHWilliams
(03-21-2017, 02:15 AM)
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People were real serious about Danny's race, but I note no one cares about Davos being of Indian descent in the adaptation. (Which, btw, I vaguely enjoyed.)
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
(03-21-2017, 02:42 AM)
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Originally Posted by MHWilliams

People were real serious about Danny's race, but I note no one cares about Davos being of Indian descent in the adaptation. (Which, btw, I vaguely enjoyed.)

It does get into the grey territory of changing a character from one minority to another, but I quite liked that change. I do wish the show had more significant roles for people of East Asian descent, though.

I wonder if he's still the son of Lei-Kung, since that dude was still East Asian in this.
Blackhead
Redarse
(03-21-2017, 02:50 AM)

Originally Posted by MHWilliams

People were real serious about Danny's race, but I note no one cares about Davos being of Indian descent in the adaptation. (Which, btw, I vaguely enjoyed.)

I'd have enjoyed it more if he wasn't made 'evil' in the finale
Teknopathetic
Member
(03-21-2017, 02:55 AM)
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"I'd have enjoyed it more if he wasn't made 'evil' in the finale"

The character is generally an enemy to Danny, though.
GuitarAtomik
Member
(03-21-2017, 02:56 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dongs Macabre

It does get into the grey territory of changing a character from one minority to another, but I quite liked that change. I do wish the show had more significant roles for people of East Asian descent, though.

I wonder if he's still the son of Lei-Kung, since that dude was still East Asian in this.

Wouldn't be surprised based on his talk about how he felt he was destined to be the IF. They did mention The Thunderer in the same conversation that they mentioned seeing Davos's father in the nude by accident, but I'd have to watch again to see if they actually connected the two in that convo.
MHWilliams
(03-21-2017, 03:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dongs Macabre

It does get into the grey territory of changing a character from one minority to another, but I quite liked that change. I do wish the show had more significant roles for people of East Asian descent, though.

I wonder if he's still the son of Lei-Kung, since that dude was still East Asian in this.

K'un L'un is probably going to be what I thought: primarily East Asian, but with a smattering of folks outside of that melting pot. It's a legendry mystical city, so it stands to reason that a bunch of folks from the outside world have made their way there.

My guess is Davos will be explained away as half-Indian, half-Chinese.
LotusHD
Banned
(03-21-2017, 05:34 AM)
I just realized, did Danny even beat any of the main villains?

Colleen fought and beat Bakoto, with Davos seemingly landing the final blow. Ward shot and killed his father Harold, who for whatever reason Danny struggled against.

I just watched the show, and shit is already fading away from my memory, so I'm not sure if I missed anything. I guess he successfully kidnapped Gao?
MoeDabs
Member
(03-21-2017, 05:35 AM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

I just realized, did Danny even beat any of the main villains?

Colleen fought and beat Bakoto, with Davos seemingly landing the final blow. Ward shot and killed his father Harold, who for whatever reason Danny struggled against.

I just watched the show, and shit is already fading away from my memory, so I'm not sure if I missed anything. I guess he successfully kidnapped Gao?

Danny punched some doors. I think he won.
caliph95
Member
(03-21-2017, 05:41 AM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

I just realized, did Danny even beat any of the main villains?

Colleen fought and beat Bakoto, with Davos seemingly landing the final blow. Ward shot and killed his father Harold, who for whatever reason Danny struggled against.

I just watched the show, and shit is already fading away from my memory, so I'm not sure if I missed anything. I guess he successfully kidnapped Gao?

I don't think Gao even put up a fight even she easily took out Danny and Matt before
gutter_trash
Banned
(03-21-2017, 06:21 AM)
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i just finished it tonight....

that ending is.... ugh... fuck you


Ward and Harold saved Season 1.... Goa made it watchable, a bit

but man, I am having a hard time carring for Danny Rand.

so, here is how a rank the Marvel Series thus far:
1: Jessica Jones
2: Daredevil S1
3: Luke Cage
4: Daredevil S2 (First Half would have shot it up the 2nd or 3rd place, but the 2nd half really brings it down two notches).
5. Iron Fist (LOL!!!)
More_Badass
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:02 AM)
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Ha, you thought there might be a chance of an Iron Fist outfit in Defenders? Or even in Iron Fist Season 2?

"Hes trying to find his identity. Eventually throughout the series he kind of claims some kind of identity through his clothes but weve got a couple more seasons to go before we get to that point.

http://www.screenrant.com/iron-fist-...comic-costume/
LotusHD
Banned
(03-21-2017, 08:02 AM)

Originally Posted by More_Badass

Ha, you thought there might be a chance of an Iron Fist outfit in Defenders? Or even in Iron Fist Season 2?

http://www.screenrant.com/iron-fist-...comic-costume/

Oh come on... I doubt we're going to get multiple seasons of this show.
caliph95
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:04 AM)
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Seriously how long would it take to give him a costume WW2 Iron fist had one, just make it ceremonial.
Also didn't think we were watching Smallville
MHWilliams
(03-21-2017, 08:05 AM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

Oh come on... I doubt we're going to get multiple seasons of this show.

I think it'll do well despite it's faults, mostly because it's such a light watch. The others are fairly heavy shows. Iron Fist is not.
Nyanmaruz
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(03-21-2017, 08:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by More_Badass

Ha, you thought there might be a chance of an Iron Fist outfit in Defenders? Or even in Iron Fist Season 2?

http://www.screenrant.com/iron-fist-...comic-costume/

So it's going to be like Smallville?
Like we won't be seeing it until the last episode of the final season.
If it even gets another season that is.
NotTheGuyYouKill
(03-21-2017, 08:36 AM)
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lol, I bet you see it in The Defenders.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:50 AM)
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Originally Posted by More_Badass

Ha, you thought there might be a chance of an Iron Fist outfit in Defenders? Or even in Iron Fist Season 2?

http://www.screenrant.com/iron-fist-...comic-costume/

LOL, wow.
I'd be happy with just the WW2 mask at this point.

These shows feel like they are regressing from S1 of Daredevil.
peanutbutterlatte
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:53 AM)
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Fucks sake just make the costume armoured like Daredevil's, as Danny seems to get shot stabbed pretty much as frequently as DD.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:55 AM)
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Originally Posted by peanutbutterlatte

Fucks sake just make the costume armoured like Daredevil's, as Danny seems to get shot stabbed pretty much as frequently as DD.

If they team up why the hell would Matt not introduce him to his tailor.

At the very least some kind of ceremonial ninja-ish outfit.
V_Arnold
Member
(03-21-2017, 12:40 PM)
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Finished the season. God damn it, the ratings are harsh.

People CONSTANTLY mistake "flawed characters" with "bad writing". This must be the case here as well.

Danny was confused as fuck. It needed not to be told that he ran away, it was written all over his actions.

He is not ready, he is confused, and god damn, that anger is SOOO ridicolous on him. But that little character growth we have (like 2*15 seconds in the last episode) was kinda worth it.

If this is a 30% show, then S4 of Arrow is a 5% show, and so is current Flash. Lets drop ridicolousness, please. :D

I liked Davos, but his turn was very forced. I would have liked to see him react to the masters seeing Danny and forgiving him, THEN he would have real reasons to just mad at him. Joy was useless too. Why is it that for every new Marvel series, there has to be a dumb female character too? They have proven with Jessica, with DD S2 Karen, Misty, and heck, even Elektra that they can do good characters well. But Joy was just a shell. I guess I will have to be grateful for Coleen.

I do not care about changes to the plot compared to comics. I am not watching this shows to get the same story that I already read. So I would have been glad to see Davos remain by Danny's side (at least for now), etc.

Overall, it was an enjoyable watch. It was not as polished as the rest of the shows, but it was not as dense either, it can be marathoned easily thanks to this.

Also, Marvel, stop the hand pretense. Please. They are not a good target to moralize on. Really not. Especially when they keep coming back from the dead.

Quick edit: Oh, and the best character was Ward. He had a complete classic drama hero journey from start to finish. He had his ups, downs, got out on the other side a better man. I liked that. The actor nailed the addict parts as well!
Alienous
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(03-21-2017, 12:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by More_Badass

Ha, you thought there might be a chance of an Iron Fist outfit in Defenders? Or even in Iron Fist Season 2?

http://www.screenrant.com/iron-fist-...comic-costume/

Good thing Matt Murdock's blind, otherwise he'd be so embarrassed when The Defenders meet up.

"I thought we would be wearing superhero suits...".
Cave Johnson
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(03-21-2017, 12:53 PM)
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All in all, it felt like watching a spin-off of IF but with the character still being the focal point of the show. The only significant character here is Ward and his character development. But the writing here is so bad, I'm amazed I was able to binge it through.
Razgriz-Specter
Member
(03-21-2017, 01:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by Alienous

Good thing Matt Murdock's blind, otherwise he'd be so embarrassed when The Defenders meet up.

"I thought we would be wearing superhero suits...".

Embarrassed for them maybe as long as it isn't daylight.
LotusHD
Banned
(03-21-2017, 07:43 PM)
What could have been...
Vermillion
Banned
(03-21-2017, 08:10 PM)

Originally Posted by LordRaptor

Seems like a lot of the complaints about danny not being a great fighter (although he usually always wins in the end anyway) and should have been a minority casting instead of a white guy are from folks who would really like a Shang Chi show.

I'd also really like a Shang-Chi show.
I don't think you need to make Iron Fist into Shang-Chi though.

A Shang-Chi show *would* solve many of the issues people had... I'll take it :p
Rhaknar
The Steam equivalent of the drunk friend who keeps offering to pay your tab all night.
(03-21-2017, 08:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

What could have been...

if he's Asian-American why did he have a australian accent?
BoogieWoogie
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:16 PM)
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I refuse to believe this gets a season 2.
ev0
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(03-21-2017, 08:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by MHWilliams

People were real serious about Danny's race, but I note no one cares about Davos being of Indian descent in the adaptation. (Which, btw, I vaguely enjoyed.)

Honestly I assumed it's because most people didnt or couldnt make it that far in the series.

And I'll say it did bother me. I wasn't bothered so much by keeping Danny white (it is what it is) but I at least expected they'd keep Davos as Chinese. I totally expected it.
I was like "well there's no stupid marketing reason or whatever for them to change Davos". But there it is.

On his own, the I liked the actor but fuck, Marvel really didn't want to cast Chinese people in this. Colleen filled the lead quota and shes technically half.

That said, I actually kind of enjoyed the show, its not as bad as critics say, but the fight scenes were just shit.
LotusHD
Banned
(03-21-2017, 08:19 PM)

Originally Posted by ev0

Honestly I assumed it's because most people didnt or couldnt make it that far in the series.

And I'll say it did bother me. I wasn't bothered so much by keeping Danny white (it is what it is) but I at least expected they'd keep Davos as Chinese. I totally expected it.
I was like "well there's no stupid marketing reason or whatever for them to change Davos". But there it is.

On his own, the I liked the actor but fuck, Marvel really didn't want to cast Chinese people in this. Colleen filled the lead quota and shes technically half.

That said, I actually kind of enjoyed the show, its not as bad as critics say, but the fight scenes were just shit.

Also kind of annoys me that every prominent Asian character throughout the Marvel Netflix shows is a part of an evil organization. Here I was thinking Colleen would just be an owner of a dojo, but nope.

Is she a part of the Hand in the comics?
ev0
Member
(03-21-2017, 08:40 PM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

Also kind of annoys me that every prominent Asian character throughout the Marvel Netflix shows is a part of an evil organization. Here I was thinking Colleen would just be an owner of a dojo, but nope.

Is she a part of the Hand in the comics?

Not really. It was revealed her mother was Hand, and she eventually joined (and betrayed them)- but this was all at Daredevils behest when he was leading the Hand.

And true about Asians being villains- but even in Iron Fist, Gao is moved off as the villain in favor of the non-Asian Bakuto.
HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
(03-21-2017, 09:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Teknopathetic

"I'd have enjoyed it more if he wasn't made 'evil' in the finale"

The character is generally an enemy to Danny, though.

It was the execution.
wandering
Banned
(03-21-2017, 09:53 PM)

Originally Posted by MHWilliams

People were real serious about Danny's race, but I note no one cares about Davos being of Indian descent in the adaptation. (Which, btw, I vaguely enjoyed.)

I was kind of miffed. But oh well, he's Asian anyway.
RS4-
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(03-21-2017, 09:55 PM)
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If Danny was Asian, they probably would've had a white Colleen lol.
Nyanmaruz
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(03-21-2017, 10:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by RS4-

If Danny was Asian, they probably would've had a white Colleen lol.

Danny being Asian would also defeats the potential of introducing Shang Chi in the future.
Dongs Macabre
aka Daedalos42
(03-21-2017, 10:15 PM)
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Originally Posted by Nyanmaruz

Danny being Asian would also defeats the potential of introducing Shang Chi in the future.

🤔

They would still be completely different characters...
Teknopathetic
Member
(03-21-2017, 10:22 PM)
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"It was the execution."


Ehhhh, he had animosity for Danny throughout the entire show. Joy's turn was definitely wack, but Davos's was relatively consistent with his attitude towards Danny and the events that transpired..
Shaanyboi
Banned
(03-22-2017, 12:04 AM)
The show managed to pick up a bit in that last third. The episode at the Hand facility was an interesting change of pace. I think it peaks with Episode 12, with the fight against Bakuto, then Davos being arguably more compelling of a finale than against Harold.

But the burn to get there is just... ehhh. Most of this falls on Danny. He simply just comes off as petulant rather than someone I wanted to root for. His constant reciting of Bhuddist teachings while in his ratty pajamas just made me think of so many hipster kids you meat in college. He continually comes off as self-aggrandizing with so little to back it up.

"I am the Iron Fist! I am unbeatable!" Proceeds to get his ass kicked in a file room by some random goon.

I think Colleen was fine, but I didn't enjoy her as much as I wanted to. Claire was a ray of sunshine in every scene, and she had some great moments. Davos was a solid late addition who made a lasting impression. Excited to see him again. This is honestly the best Carrie-Anne Moss has been as Hogarth. She's only here for a short while, but she comes off as a far more welcomed presence compared to her drag of a plotline in Jessica Jones.

David Wenham kinda dominates whenever he is on-screen, especially post-resurrection. The dude chewed the scenery wonderfully. I thought Ward was interesting, and while he's a bit of a shitbag at the start, he really does undergo an interesting transformation. Joy however was the opposite. I felt like she was constantly flip-flopping. She does something cruel or cold in a meeting, then goes on to feel sad about it, and is reinforced constantly with how she's a good person. Like they constantly play up this "is she morally compromised? No she's not. I mean yes she is. I mean now she thinks Danny is onto something and-- oh now she wants him dead." Like... huh?

The biggest annoyance is that the fights themselves feel so slow and slapdash so often. Not to say there aren't better ones, but they are so fucking rare. I seriously think the Episode 12 fight in the lobby is the only one I really was impressed by. I empathize with Jones and the crew considering it sounds like he really had zero fucking time to learn these fights, and the fact he can't hide behind a mask (I wonder how we solve that problem!) means he can't have a dedicated stunt guy doing it for him. But this just comes off as piss-poor planning than anything.

I mean there's a bunch of sloppy shit in other ways too. When Danny and Colleen have been framed and Danny spin kicks the cop outside, there are people walking by behind him who aren't even registering what's happening. Stuff like that that just takes me out of it.

Also the degree to which they tone down (or outright remove) some of the cooler mystical elements of this are annoying too. The "challenge" episode where he faces the Bride of Nine Spiders was some Arrow Season 1 shit. And I don't mean that in a good way. I mean that in the "wtf did they do to Count Vertigo" way. I get they have to hide a fucking dragon for budgetary reasons etc. but... I mean come on. Stylize it enough in a quick flash and it may just be enough.


I don't think this show is irredeemable, and I think there are strong points, again, towards the end. But it takes too long to get there, and there's just a lot of bullshit in-between. This show makes a fucking awful first impression that doesn't wear off until the last third.
Dominican Power
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(03-22-2017, 12:27 AM)
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I don't like how they watered the down The Hand on IF. There suppose to be mystical ninjas, not some random goons with guns and some martial arts training. When did they ever imply in DD that Gao was part of the hand? Why would The Chinese be a part of The Hand? Gao is not a comic book character, right? Neither is Bakuto? I also don't like Colleen's backstory of being a part of The Hand. I also didn't like Danny having trouble with random goons and fucking Harold Meachum. I wish they would of gone with the comic book origin story of IF. His father actually trained in Martial Arts and went the to go to K'un L'un to become the Iron Fist. And him leaving K'un L'un and returning back with his family and Harold Meachum, and Meachum leaving his Danny's family for dead would of given the character the motivation to went to come back and get his vengeance. We got that in the show but it was fucking vague as fuck because Danny know who was really responsible for the death of his family. So we had Danny running around like a chicken with his head cut off. Pretty fucking stupid.
Dominican Power
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(03-22-2017, 12:30 AM)
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http://marvel.wikia.com/wiki/Joy_Meachum_(Earth-616)

This explains Davos and Joy meeting at the end.
S2
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(03-22-2017, 12:32 AM)
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My favorite part of Iron Fist was when Claire happily third-wheels Colleen and Danny's date. She's accepted the craziness of her life, so she decides to just have fun. Then it gets even better when she proudly takes like 4 boxes of food on the way out lol i related so hard.
Secret Fawful
Banned
(03-22-2017, 12:33 AM)
It really bothers me that Harold and Ward are literally the same as comics-accurate Norman and Harry Osborn, but used on this show as the Meachums.
Brutuspedia
Member
(03-22-2017, 12:34 AM)
It baffles me that in times with The Raid, IP MAN and even John Wick, we still have to deal with a Kung Fu super hero that can't barely land or hold a correct stand, a ridiculous cage fight sequence, terrible choreography throughout the whole show, and that nunchuks scene that looked like a Police Squad parody.

They gave Luke Cage for a black producer so he knows what he was talking about, same with Jessica Jones. Iron Fist? The production team didn't give a dime for martial arts, no research at all, it's not different from the ridiculous american productions in the 70s...

And in this case, I guess it's true to the comics...

Iron Fist, the greatest fighter of the MCU... yeah yeah...
Wingfan19
Member
(03-22-2017, 12:45 AM)
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Originally Posted by Brutuspedia

It baffles me that in times with The Raid, IP MAN and even John Wick, we still have to deal with a Kung Fu super hero that can't barely land or hold a correct stand, a ridiculous cage fight sequence, terrible choreography throughout the whole show, and that nunchuks scene that looked like a Police Squad parody

All I could think of was this scene from the Ninja Turtles movie

https://youtu.be/W7v7avqqzh0?t=14

And I think the Turtles did it far better, even with a dude wearing a god damn turtle outfit.
darkhunger
Member
(03-22-2017, 03:59 AM)

Originally Posted by Brutuspedia


They gave Luke Cage for a black producer so he knows what he was talking about, same with Jessica Jones. Iron Fist? The production team didn't give a dime for martial arts, no research at all, it's not different from the ridiculous american productions in the 70s...

Come on man... that just totally dismissing what the stunt crew did for this show. There are interviews out there that talks about the martial arts research and all of the the training that went into this. Those are real professionals there, and the stunt coordinator for the show is actually Asian American with a bunch of choreography and martial arts experience.

The problem starts up top, not there. When you hire an out of shape dude who's never done martial arts before and give him a few weeks to learn martial arts AND get in shape, then makes it so stunts are planned in 15 minutes at 2AM at night, it's a sign you don't give a fuck. When you don't put together a budget for this stuff and decide to focus a hero known for mystical martial arts on dumb soap drama about rich white people. When there's a clarismatic Asian dude who knows martial arts and you like enough to bring back to the final rounds only to hire a less qualified white dude because of his skin color. That's where the issue starts.

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