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View Poll Results: When should the UK celebrate Independence Day?
June 23rd (Referendum Vote)
92 5.47%
March 29th (Article 50)
69 4.10%
The date Brexit completes
180 10.71%
July 4th (As per 1996's hit film Independence Day)
812 48.30%
Why not all of the above?
528 31.41%
Voters: 1681. You may not vote on this poll


Rhaknar
The Steam equivalent of the drunk friend who keeps offering to pay your tab all night.
(03-20-2017, 03:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Wahey, glad it's finally starting. We're probably in for a rocky few years but think things will return to normal after that. Fuck the EU army and lack of border controls.

I see your political opinions are as bad as your videogame ones. At least you are consistent.
MilkyJoe
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:46 PM)
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Everyone I know that voted to leave, the following morning they were;

pswii60
(03-20-2017, 03:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen

Fuck this shit, I still have to go back to UK for one more year to complete my degree.

God knows what the place would look like when I come back in September.

Exactly the same, but London will have moved to Manchester to save money.
Rodelero
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:47 PM)
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Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Ha, at least I'm being honest. This place is such a left wing echo chamber it's pretty hard to admit voting for brexit, which is pretty odd considering 50%+ agree with me, just wish more posted on here so we could have a more two sided debate other than loltrump lolbrexit all the time.

Is it odd? NeoGAF is a community built around video games, a hobby of the young. NeoGAF is also a community which works hard to ensure high quality discourse (as far as is possible for an internet forum). It's therefore a community that is primarily young, primarily educated, primarily intelligent, and primarily tolerant. The fact that this young, educated, intelligent and tolerant community is anti Brexit and anti Trump isn't surprising, because we know very well that support for Brexit and Trump inversely correlates with those qualities.

There are many gaming communities that are more positive towards Brexit and Donald Trump. They just also tend to also be fairly positive towards harassing women and oppressing people who aren't white.

Even so, you are totally free to debate here. The fact you are on the smaller side doesn't change that you are free to do so. If your arguments are solid, you will have a decent debate. If your arguments are nonsense, you might not.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:48 PM)
Royal_Phalanx's Avatar

Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Ha, at least I'm being honest. This place is such a left wing echo chamber it's pretty hard to admit voting for brexit, which is pretty odd considering 50%+ agree with me, just wish more posted on here so we could have a more two sided debate other than loltrump lolbrexit all the time.

May I ask how Brexit will benefit me as a young person? This is representative of the young and educated demographic as the last poster has said. I have never heard a brexit/trump supporter saying anything that is of substance or can argue why it's a good thing. Even my hardcore Trump supporting dad has trouble explaining away Trump's recent actions.
jelly
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:48 PM)
I explained that border thing to a few people and was just rebuffed, don't believe it.

Also, the zinger. UK not signing up to that EU policy of EU worker rights etc. like they can't stay if they don't have a job and can't receive benefits. All these rules that the UK could have implemented but never did but blame the EU anyway. Funnily enough, that was May's department for a long time.
d9b
Banned
(03-20-2017, 03:50 PM)
UK going Rogue Nation officially.
Xando
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:51 PM)
Xando's Avatar

Originally Posted by Royal_Phalanx

May I ask how Brexit will benefit me as a young person?

You will be able to work on the fields and farm crops for 3 pounds per hour since no eastern europeans come to do it anymore
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:52 PM)
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Originally Posted by Xando

You will be able to work on the fields and farm crops for 3 pounds per hour since no eastern europeans come to do it anymore

But I wanna work in mainland Europe :(
QuicheFontaine
Banned
(03-20-2017, 03:52 PM)

Originally Posted by BibiMaghoo

Britain never signed the EU agreement to give up border controls, and thus never did. We do not allow refugees or migrants accepted into another EU nation to travel here without a Visa, in direct contradiction to other EU states. Our borders have never been insecure.

Once we leave the EU and are no longer part of the Dublin regulation, allowing us to send back undocumented migrants to their country of origin in the EU, we will have to keep them here. We sent back over 12,000 last year. The volume of undocumented migrants here will increase significantly over the years now, not reduce.

Your post is a great example of the ignorance people showed in regards to borders, which probably swayed your vote, like many others.

Well, there's non-EU signatories of the Dublin Regulation. I don't know if it will really survive into the future though. It's not a great deal for southern European countries.
Agent Gibbs
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:54 PM)
Agent Gibbs's Avatar

Originally Posted by Veidt

There is no EU army.
Plenty of EU nations have control of their borders.

I am afraid you have been swindled. Brexit leaders want to take back control of you rights and regulations that they couldn't easily twist to their personal advantage.

Word!

It boggles my mind the brexit campaign was based on lies of staying in the EEC, having 350million a week to put in the NHS, closing borders, controlling our fishing waters and something or other about farmers

When in reality, May's gone full angry divorce and there will be no Single Market, the 350million thing was complete lies, we'll likely have to have freedom of movement (*), we already control our waters and even if we leave we'd still need to fish around EU waters and the Farmers were so heavily subsidised by the EU our agricultural industry will likely die out over night!
Frankly it just should not be legally binding since the campaign was 90% lies!

The freedom of movement/border shit is utterly the biggest joke of all (hard to top the others but it is), watching the news and interviews of brexit voters in the north (where Tory cuts have seen services and jobs fall, but conveniently blamed on immigrants) there were quite a few who went on about now we would be able to stop all the Indian's/Pakistani's/Muslims coming over here...........BUT WE ALREADY CONTROLLED NON EU PEOPLE YOU PLEB! it boiled my blood watching people specifically mention non EU nationals either in isolation as part of their rant on immigrants knowing how they'd been taken in by the lies and mistruths

The fact blatant Xenophobia was allowed to be a campaign point is disgusting and I cannot lay blame solely on the right wing nut jobs, Labour, the Liberals and the SNP all denied their was even any sort of problem when there is - now bare with me - immigration is an issue because spending on infrastructure and housing over the past 20 years has not even met the pace to meet national population growth, let alone immigration and that makes immigration an actual issue! It could easily have been discussed and put back on the Tories that immigration is a problem because of a lack of public spending, but no they went with the flat denial

I despair the national mood in the country and the acceptance of Brexit, it really should be challenged
pswii60
(03-20-2017, 03:55 PM)
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Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Ha, at least I'm being honest. This place is such a left wing echo chamber it's pretty hard to admit voting for brexit, which is pretty odd considering 50%+ agree with me, just wish more posted on here so we could have a more two sided debate other than loltrump lolbrexit all the time.

This shouldn't be a shock for anyone who has spent time in the OT over the years. NeoGAF is made up of young, left-liberal "Guardian-readers" (not literally).

The only thing that confuses me is that the consensus on here is that the UK leaving the EU is bad, but Scotland leaving the UK is good. But I suppose that's the left-leaning liberal sympathy towards minorities at play. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence understands that Scotland leaving the UK would be far more devastating for it than Brexit will be on the UK.

Regardless, all my well educated friends voted to remain, and the lesser-so voted to leave. So, perhaps we're also a slightly more intelligent bunch on here too :)
Sweeney Tom
Banned
(03-20-2017, 03:57 PM)
Goodbye Britain.

And when I say that, I mean it. Don't you ever come crawling back.

Learn from the Trump voters getting (deservedly) no sympathy for the rights they're losing, and take your L you wanted, no matter what.
d9b
Banned
(03-20-2017, 03:58 PM)

Originally Posted by Veidt

Plenty of EU nations have control of their borders.

I am afraid you have been swindled. Brexit leaders want to take back control of you rights and regulations that they couldn't easily twist to their personal advantage.

Sad. But true.
TTOOLL
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Rodelero

Is it odd? NeoGAF is a community built around video games, a hobby of the young. NeoGAF is also a community which works hard to ensure high quality discourse (as far as is possible for an internet forum). It's therefore a community that is primarily young, primarily educated, primarily intelligent, and primarily tolerant. The fact that this young, educated, intelligent and tolerant community is anti Brexit and anti Trump isn't surprising, because we know very well that support for Brexit and Trump inversely correlates with those qualities.

There are many gaming communities that are more positive towards Brexit and Donald Trump. They just also tend to also be fairly positive towards harassing women and oppressing people who aren't white.

Even so, you are totally free to debate here. The fact you are on the smaller side doesn't change that you are free to do so. If your arguments are solid, you will have a decent debate. If your arguments are nonsense, you might not.

That's quite a bold statement and quite a generalization, my friend. I don't believe there's any proof of that.

On the topic of having a decent debate here, I don't know if it's possible when you see yourself and others here in a superior plane of intelligence and education and when most different opinions are seen as bigotry, intolerance or hate speech. Like, if a English person does not want his country to be so open to immigration, he prefers a more controlled system, is he intolerant? Is he hating other people? For what I read here frequently the answer would be yes, so that makes the debate impossible. You either agree with open borders or you're tagged as racist/intolerant.
Norwegian_Imposter
Member
(03-20-2017, 03:59 PM)
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as a brit living in norway. I is scared (swedish wife though so I'll be able to stay) but my colleagues :/
gypsie
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:00 PM)
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Originally Posted by SirShizznit

as a brit living in norway. I is scared (swedish wife though so I'll be able to stay) but my colleagues :/

I'm a brit living in london with my polish girlfriend of 10 years so I feel ya!

No idea what's going to happen.....
Micael
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by SirShizznit

as a brit living in norway. I is scared (swedish wife though so I'll be able to stay) but my colleagues :/

You are fine, the EU is going to more than happy to brain drain the living hell out of the UK.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:02 PM)
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I hope the EU will make it easier for people like me to emigrate
pswii60
(03-20-2017, 04:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by Sweeney Tom

Goodbye Britain.

And when I say that, I mean it. Don't you ever come crawling back.

And within which EU country do you reside, may I ask?

Originally Posted by SirShizznit

as a brit living in norway. I is scared (swedish wife though so I'll be able to stay) but my colleagues :/

The cliff edge jump will never happen. It's just bullshit rhetoric. You'll be fine. Theresa May will bottle it in the end, and there will be no hard Brexit.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:04 PM)
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Originally Posted by TTOOLL

That's quite a bold statement and quite a generalization, my friend. I don't believe there's any proof of that.

On the topic of having a decent debate here, I don't know if it's possible when you see yourself and others here in a superior plane of intelligence and education and when most different opinions are seen as bigotry, intolerance or hate speech. Like, if a English person does not want his country to be so open to immigration, he prefers a more controlled system, is he intolerant? Is he hating other people? For what I read here frequently the answer would be yes, so that makes the debate impossible. You either agree with open borders or you're tagged as racist/intolerant.

We need immigration. We lack taxpayers as it is.
RangerX
Banned
(03-20-2017, 04:04 PM)
From the Irish perspective there is going to be huge difficulties here too considering the we are now the land border between the EU and the UK. Nobody wants a hard border here again. We also do the vast majority of our agricultural trade with britain so that sector would be in huge trouble. Basically the harder brexit is the worse it is for us.

Sayibg that the EU needs to be reformed. It is incredibly undemocratic, essentially created an unequal Europe with the creation of creditor and debtor states regarding the PIGS countries and the euro was a mistake where the value is tied to German exports. The EU parliament needs to be strentghtened. It is purely ornamental at this stage. Whatever happens the next few years will be rough.
BibiMaghoo
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by QuicheFontaine

Well, there's non-EU signatories of the Dublin Regulation. I don't know if it will really survive into the future though. It's not a great deal for southern European countries.

While that is true, I think the chances of it surviving without FOM is zero. France will open Calais, because why would they now not? We are going to have that jungle in Dover unless we pay for borders in the EU at great expense, and trying to stem that is going to fail. I guess it's kind of ironic that those counties by Dover all voted leave.

Originally Posted by pswii60

This shouldn't be a shock for anyone who has spent time in the OT over the years. NeoGAF is made up of young, left-liberal "Guardian-readers" (not literally).

The only thing that confuses me is that the consensus on here is that the UK leaving the EU is bad, but Scotland leaving the UK is good. But I suppose that's the left-leaning liberal sympathy towards minorities at play. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence understands that Scotland leaving the UK would be far more devastating for it than Brexit will be on the UK.

Regardless, all my well educated friends voted to remain, and the lesser-so voted to leave. So, perhaps we're also a slightly more intelligent bunch on here too :)

I think it is simply a case of "why drag them down with us when they voted otherwise", which is a fair position. I don't think anyone voting remain thinks the UK would be better without Scotland, they just empathise with their position. Being dragged out against their vote, a short time after voting to remain in the UK under different terms. It is a real mess for Scotland.
Dynasty
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:05 PM)

Originally Posted by Sweeney Tom

Goodbye Britain.

And when I say that, I mean it. Don't you ever come crawling back.

Learn from the Trump voters getting (deservedly) no sympathy for the rights they're losing, and take your L you wanted, no matter what.

Going by your logic, we should blame all Americans for voting for Trump. Cool. All gaf members that are American, you deserve Trump even if you voted against it, when Trump reappeals the ACA, you will get no sympathy, again just to clarify even if you voted against Trump you deserve it, when Trump gives the cops more power and cops get away with even more shit, just remember you wont get any sympathy.
Veidt
Blasphemer who refuses to accept bagged milk as his personal savior
(03-20-2017, 04:05 PM)
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Brits will have to take the long, horrible, painful " Non- EU passports " queue when arriving into ANY EU countries.
StayDead
um wat
(03-20-2017, 04:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Ha, at least I'm being honest. This place is such a left wing echo chamber it's pretty hard to admit voting for brexit, which is pretty odd considering 50%+ agree with me, just wish more posted on here so we could have a more two sided debate other than loltrump lolbrexit all the time.


50%+ didn't agree with you. 30% of people who voted did.

The statistics are completely different.

Perhaps it's an echo chamber, because every single expert, you know people who actually know what the hell they're talking about know and have said that Brexit is a bad idea. But, what the fuck do those people who've studied x for decades know anyway.
cartesian
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Royal_Phalanx

"Life will go on" isn't fucking good enough! Life goes on in tons of countries too. When compared to the life opportunities I will lose because of this shitty vote "life will go on" isn't going to cut it. I expect prosperity to even begin to make up for this. Thanks for taking away my EU citizenship and my opportunities to easily work in other countries. Thanks a lot bro.

And I don't give a flying fuck if we rejoin in 10-20 years! I'll be 35-45 at minimum! The best years of my life would be gone.

You will still be able to do those things if you really want to. It will be harder but still possible. There are plenty of Americans, Chinese, and so on attending European universities and working in European countries. If they can do it, why can't you? Brexit doesn't mean you are prohibited from entering Europe. You may need to fill out more forms but this need not be the end of the world.
Jackpot
Junior Member
(03-20-2017, 04:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by TTOOLL

That's quite a bold statement and quite a generalization, my friend. I don't believe there's any proof of that.

You're questioning being tolerant correlating to being anti-Trump? Regardless, here is direct proof that the more educated you were, the more likely you were to be against Trump & Brexit.

The higher the level of education, the higher the EU support

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...ucated-old-an/

Education mattered more than anything else, it appears, even when controlling for economic factors.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics...-house/508703/

On the topic of having a decent debate here, I don't know if it's possible when you see yourself and others here in a superior plane of intelligence and education and when most different opinions are seen as bigotry, intolerance or hate speech. Like, if a English person does not want his country to be so open to immigration, he prefers a more controlled system, is he intolerant? Is he hating other people? For what I read here frequently the answer would be yes, so that makes the debate impossible. You either agree with open borders or you're tagged as racist/intolerant.

Shuffle the deck and quit playing the persecution card. Anyone should be able to adequately defend their reasoning. People don't get banned for having a differing opinion, they get banned when the mask slips and they make some comment about gypsies or wanting immigrants to die.
kmag
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:08 PM)
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Originally Posted by TTOOLL

That's quite a bold statement and quite a generalization, my friend. I don't believe there's any proof of that.

On the topic of having a decent debate here, I don't know if it's possible when you see yourself and others here in a superior plane of intelligence and education and when most different opinions are seen as bigotry, intolerance or hate speech. Like, if a English person does not want his country to be so open to immigration, he prefers a more controlled system, is he intolerant? Is he hating other people? For what I read here frequently the answer would be yes, so that makes the debate impossible. You either agree with open borders or you're tagged as racist/intolerant.

Belief in the false paradigm created by the Leave campaign is a pretty decent litmus test for intelligence, I've found. There are a few cogent reasons for voting leave, but very, very few people I've met have been able to verbalise them to me. It's all anti-democratic unelected EU mandarins, 'EU army', immigration, redtape yadda yadda.

Take immigration, we live in a country where the majority of inward immigration is non-EU and fully 'under' control of the UK government yet the EU has somehow become the lynchpin on the whole debate. And that's before we get to the current demographic and economic necessity for about the current levels of immigration to prevent extreme economic hardship as the boomers increasingly leave employment.
Jackpot
Junior Member
(03-20-2017, 04:10 PM)
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Conservatives have increased their lead despite the White Van Man budget fiasco.

Conservatives: 45% (up 1)

Labour: 26% (down 2)

Ukip: 10% (down 1)

Lib Dems: 9% (up 1)

Greens: 4% (down 1)

Conservative lead: 19 points (up 3)

Chaos2Frozen
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:10 PM)
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Originally Posted by Hollywood Duo

It'll look exactly the same. It will be a long time before they actually leave the EU.

Originally Posted by pswii60

Exactly the same, but London will have moved to Manchester to save money.

Are you guys sure? Are you sure it's not going to look like:

Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:11 PM)
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Originally Posted by cartesian

You will still be able to do those things if you really want to. It will be harder but still possible. There are plenty of Americans, Chinese, and so on attending European universities and working in European countries. If they can do it, why can't you? Brexit doesn't mean you are prohibited from entering Europe. You may need to fill out more forms but this need not be the end of the world.

Except companies in the EU prefer EU citizen applicants. Labour market tests need to be fulfilled and stuff. I know this isn't a North Korea emigration ban but still, a lot of opportunities will be curtailed. Got a bunch of classmates who are doing internships in the EU right now, all things that the next generation will find much, much harder to do. I'm struggling to think of why losing all this will be worth it.
Sweeney Tom
Banned
(03-20-2017, 04:12 PM)

Originally Posted by pswii60

And within which EU country do you reside, may I ask?

Born in Ireland, got out years ago before I could be trapped by a dumb vote from everyone else that kept me trapped. Unfortunately it seems y'all emboldened the world. Merkel is essentially our last hope to maintain a spot of sanity
FreeMufasa
Junior Member
(03-20-2017, 04:13 PM)
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At least Americans have the chance to reverse the trump fuckery in 4 or 8 years. For us it's a wrap. No way back...
pigeon interrupted
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:13 PM)
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It's so sad. Most of the people who voted for this will be first to get chewed up.

From real conversations with muh paw that took place last year:

Me: Dad, did you notice drop in the pound since you voted for Brexit?

Dad: The value of the pound goes up and down all the time and in any case this is probably its true value. It was artificially high.

Me: What do you mean artificially high?

Dad: RARRGLFARRRRRGGGHH!

Me: You know you've condemned the young of this country and the poor will be at the mercy of the rich more than ever before?

Dad: RARRGLFARRRRRGGGHH!

Me: You know this is likely going to hit the NHS when you need it most?

Dad: RARRGLFARRRRR*gets ill from stress of conversation*rrggghhhh...

Me: Oh crap. Time to stop talking about about my dad's politics and xenophobia.

People like him are a lost cause and tbh many of them had it coming. Brexit demographics: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-36619342And they will carry on till the bitter end. Shame they took the rest of us with them. There has been an undercurrent of anti-EU rhetoric (propogated by the right) and simmering xenophobia which has been there building since I can remember. And a genuine sense of exceptionalism and superiority fermented over generations. Like America's dilemma, it was there like a shadow on the horizon. Now it seems like a race to the bottom.

Also, I can't overstate the infuence of the Daily Mail over my dad since he started reading it. Seeking out confirmation bias, maybe. But he's been so much more angry ever since.
RangerX
Banned
(03-20-2017, 04:13 PM)

Originally Posted by Jackpot

Conservatives have increased their lead despite the White Van Man budget fiasco.

I'm genuinely surprised that the Lib Dems haven't gotten a bigger bump considering their position. I thought Tim Farron gave a good speech yesterday.
TimmmV
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by pswii60

This shouldn't be a shock for anyone who has spent time in the OT over the years. NeoGAF is made up of young, left-liberal "Guardian-readers" (not literally).

The only thing that confuses me is that the consensus on here is that the UK leaving the EU is bad, but Scotland leaving the UK is good. But I suppose that's the left-leaning liberal sympathy towards minorities at play. Anyone with an ounce of intelligence understands that Scotland leaving the UK would be far more devastating for it than Brexit will be on the UK.

Regardless, all my well educated friends voted to remain, and the lesser-so voted to leave. So, perhaps we're also a slightly more intelligent bunch on here too :)

I wouldn't say that there is any consensus on Scotland leaving the UK on here, there was quite a lot of arguing about it when the subject came back up again last week. The main difference is that now there are a fair few English remainers who basically think "England is filled with tossers, I don't blame you for wanting rid of us"

Agree with the rest though, GAF is a bit of an echo chamber, but equally it's a website mostly used by young educated people, they tend to lean left. IDK what RoyalFool really expects lol
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:15 PM)
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Plenty of right wing echo chambers to go to.
pswii60
(03-20-2017, 04:16 PM)
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Originally Posted by Sweeney Tom

Born in Ireland, got out years ago before I could be trapped by a dumb vote from everyone else that kept me trapped. Unfortunately it seems y'all emboldened the world. Merkel is essentially our last hope to maintain a spot of sanity

What 'dumb vote' happened in Ireland?
QuicheFontaine
Banned
(03-20-2017, 04:16 PM)

Originally Posted by BibiMaghoo

While that is true, I think the chances of it surviving without FOM is zero. France will open Calais, because why would they now not? We are going to have that jungle in Dover unless we pay for borders in the EU at great expense, and trying to stem that is going to fail. I guess it's kind of ironic that those counties by Dover all voted leave.

The Touquet Agreement isn't an EU instrument, it's a bilateral treaty negotiated separately. It was put in place because it's mutually beneficial, i.e. it speeds up ferry crossings in both directions. I don't see that changing once we leave the EU. In fact, there should be no change at all because the Calais - Dover interface is already an external Schengen border with passport checks in place.

As for the jungle, France has (finally) cleared that all away. If they police the area properly and prevent the establishment of a new camp it should be a non-issue.
Pyramid head
Renowned Richard Harrison scholar
(03-20-2017, 04:18 PM)
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Originally Posted by RoyalFool

Ha, at least I'm being honest. This place is such a left wing echo chamber it's pretty hard to admit voting for brexit, which is pretty odd considering 50%+ agree with me, just wish more posted on here so we could have a more two sided debate other than loltrump lolbrexit all the time.

Just head over to the comments section of any digital tabloid shit-rag Brexit article for your 'rounded' conversation.
Syder
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:19 PM)
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We are so fucked.
pswii60
(03-20-2017, 04:19 PM)
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Originally Posted by BibiMaghoo

While that is true, I think the chances of it surviving without FOM is zero. France will open Calais, because why would they now not? We are going to have that jungle in Dover unless we pay for borders in the EU at great expense, and trying to stem that is going to fail. I guess it's kind of ironic that those counties by Dover all voted leave.

That's nothing to do with the EU. UK is already outside of the Schengen area. And checks have to be done before leaving the Schengen area. Nothing will change.
theaface
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by cartesian

I voted Leave and I still feel okay about how I voted. To simplify my perspective, I think it's going to be quite messy but I think that life will go on....

But I hope for the best.

Brilliant. Typifies exactly what I saying earlier. Total uninformed optimism in the face of mounting irrefutable evidence to the contrary. Tell me, what exactly would it take for a bit of introspection and to admit "maybe I made a poor choice"? So far, the tanking currency, 92% decrease in EU nationals applying to become nurses in the NHS, 40% spike in hate crimes or the Leave campaigns promises tumbling like a house of cards within days of the result haven't been enough to sway you,

But still, not to worry, at least we won't be dead! Every cloud, eh?
Agent Gibbs
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by RangerX

From the Irish perspective there is going to be huge difficulties here too considering the we are now the land border between the EU and the UK. Nobody wants a hard border here again. We also do the vast majority of our agricultural trade with britain so that sector would be in huge trouble. Basically the harder brexit is the worse it is for us.

Sayibg that the EU needs to be reformed. It is incredibly undemocratic, essentially created an unequal Europe with the creation of creditor and debtor states regarding the PIGS countries and the euro was a mistake where the value is tied to German exports. The EU parliament needs to be strentghtened. It is purely ornamental at this stage. Whatever happens the next few years will be rough.

Despite voting to remain I agree the EU is incredibly undemocratic in areas and in great need of reform, but to effect change you need to be in the EU, it seems Breiteers wanted to leave the EU and watch it crash and burn, something it may or may not do, but its an awful stance.

I love Great Britain, I don't want to leave my country, but the way people are being misled and lapping it up, the way the left is self destructing and offering no real chance of opposition, I feel myself in a place where the only thing stopping me moving abroad now is family, if I can convince them to go with me, then I've no barriers left.

I'd love a political party that felt right to join and mount a political defence, but they are all awful right now, the centre is a no mans land and everyone's retreating to their own sides, worse still as I look back at the Coalition/Cameron governments they looked positively centrist compared to how May is taking us in her quest to out bitch Thatcher!
TeddyBoy
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dougald

Maybe the rest of the EU can get things done without us whining about every little thing now

That's what I tell myself to keep sane anyway. As for Article 50, I'm fed up of standing on the edge of this cliff. It'll almost be a relief to see this country finally jump

I remember on GAF that there was one poster who genuinely was very pro-EU and wanted Britain to leave just so the EU get start really going for further federalisation and Britain would stop delaying everything and anything.

I hope they turn out to be right, that can be our silver lining.

I actually thought the House of Lords were going to slow Brexit, but even they caved at the slightest bit of pressure. This is going to be hell until Corbyn leaves office.
Conan-san
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:26 PM)

Originally Posted by Syder

We are so fucked.

Maybe but I'm going out the same way I came in, kicking and screaming.
Royal_Phalanx
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:26 PM)
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The EU needs to reform into a 2 speed Europe and to represent its citizens better, but I'd rather build something better up rather than destroy the whole thing
Kabouter
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by FreeMufasa

At least Americans have the chance to reverse the trump fuckery in 4 or 8 years. For us it's a wrap. No way back...

Why not? You can always rejoin the EU if you want.
Jotaka
Member
(03-20-2017, 04:28 PM)
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