AlucarD.eq
Member
THIS!
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Mother bear KILLS CUB and THEN ITSELF
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THIS!
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Killing one's young when it is unlikely to survive is a pretty common behavior throughout the animal kingdom. Most mammals also experience emotions, more-so if you're a relatively complex mammal like the bear, so if you add these two behaviors you more or less gets the "kills the cubs so that it won't suffer".
Tragic story, but is anyone really surprised?
Sigh.
Interesting. The article says she went to protect it, though. Is it possible she inadvertently suffocated it?
Also the idea of any mammal (besides humans) killing itself is fascinating to me. I wasn't aware they had the emotional awareness / capacity to do such a thing.
Not surprised, wish it was legal to kill the people doing it though.
That cat picture is even worse. Fuck that country.
NinjaBoiX
Member
Chill out, jeez! You're so spiky Zoukka.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Sure, but it's a bit of a stretch that she accidentally suffocated it. The problem of ascribing emotional capacity and human like thought processes to these acts of "mercy killings" is it can be found among almost all mammals (and birds), while cognitive complexity differs greatly across these two animal kingdoms.
With that caveat out of the way, bears are actually pretty intelligent (in terms of observed behaviour, they are quite close to primates) and the mercy killings could in their case consist of more than an instinctual survival mechanism.
Jim E. Rossler
Banned
I wish it was legal to slap the people who want to kill the people doing it
The people running the country aren't stopping it.
Why? Anyone that would do something like this is barely even worth calling human.
AlucarD.eq
Member
Well, I don't think here in China "normal people" can do anything against the government
It's ok if they are grown for food really. Pigs are way more intelligent and would suffer more in similar conditions.
What about you, who just murdered some people because you didn't agree on their national beliefs and practices.
Thanks for the responses. I'm reading up on it now, but it seems to be a hotly contested debate among scientific communities as to whether or not animals actually commit suicide.
But those are cats. Fuck them and fuck their culture for thinking that's acceptable.
The Living Tribunal
Member
Troll post?
Wy is it not acceptable? Do cats have a soul and pigs don't?
Fuck cultural relativity. Countless atrocities are excused in the name of it.
Jim E. Rossler
Banned
You work for PETA or something?
You'll only fix this problem through education, not firebombing Medical centers/Bile farms
You and me both. I've learned a long time ago to simply not say anything about the Chinese, as I simply can't find anything positive to say. I realize it's reprehensible to unfairly judge an entire culture based on personal differences (yes, I know cats and dogs are food), but I just can't seem to care. I hope that will change at some point.
The idea that a bear could envision a sub-standard adult life for its cub and base its decisions on that prediction seems pretty ridiculous to me.
Even assuming the events actually took place as described (which is a stretch imo without further evidence).. There are many reasons for the behavior that seem much more likely to me than some kind of fucking murder/suicide on the bear's part.
I'm not doubting the animals instinct. If anything - I'm just completely blown away that a mammal (non-human) has the capacity to knowingly take it's own life.
Indeed. The story itself raises a lot of questions.
Not that I think it's a great benchmark to decide which animals to breed for food but according to this ranking cats are smarter than pigs.
Personally I don't eat mammals, I just don't have an emotional connection with creatures that lay eggs.
SquiddyCracker
Banned
Plenty of animals kill themselves, but yeah there are questions surrounding that whole topic.
Is it depression, a mental state which result in a loss of the survival instinct or an outright desire to kill oneself?
Or is it instinctual, a consequence of kin selection giving rise to suicidal behaviors when they are beneficial to the kin of the suicidal animal?
So they can help kill the bears and cats and dogs? No.
Like murdering people?
Several search results tell me pigs are smarter than dogs (can operate a simple user interface, unlike dogs), but I think we can agree the intelligence is fairly similar. Like dogs, pigs know many emotions like boredom. Which is why their treatment is all the more cruel.
Sorry but GAF hates PETA and everything they do. Especially the videogames.
More like justice. I'm glad people like you haven't outlawed the death penalty in every state yet.
Your complete obliviousness to your own double standard is delicious.
Actually yes we have. It's called the nordic countries and most of the europe.
I don't see why it's so hard to believe. People are animals too, just with more intelligence. Our defining characteristic is MORE intelligence, not HAS intelligence. People want to make the distinction that humans are somehow better than all other animals. In reality, we're not so different. A lot of what humans do can be found in other animals. A lot of what animals do can be found in humans. I believe there are several instances in nature where mothers will kill their young if they sense danger. And I'm also sure that animals commit suicide. Documenting such things is extremely difficult though.
Each spectrum of the debate is rather intriguing. Particularly considering how little we still know regarding the pathology and certain mechanisms of the human brain. Seems it would be difficult to conclude anything for any mammal.
But you're absolutely right - creatures vary in neurological complexity, that much is certain. On a related note; I found this story fascinating as well (granted it's Daily Mail):
It's not that I believe what you're saying isn't true, I just chose to remain skeptical at this point.
You seem to want to piss off both sides of the argument, what's your problem? Just trolling?
These are not innocent people we're talking about.
Mikey Jr.
Member
Peta is more concerned about what you eat for thanksgiving.
way more
Member
Some much needed cathartic release.
Ghost Dog defends bears.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFMY4jJ6SVE
Ghost Dog defends bears.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iFMY4jJ6SVE
You want it spelled out to you? Your wish to kill these people is completely irrational. It will not change anything. The problem is in the chinese culture, politics and tradition. People are not taught to feel empathy towards certain animals, so they don't feel it. Just like you don't if you eat meat, or use products that have been tested for animals. There'a also aspects like poverty, high demand for tiger penises and bear bile from people in high positions and of wealth.
You come off childish and in bloodlust. Without empathy. So exactly the same as what you are accusing these people of.
NinjaBoiX
Member
scar tissue
Banned
Yeah, fuck 'em.
Sad thing is, China doesn't even believe in human rights, so what can you expect? I'm not even shocked any more.
With you on this. At least my gut tells me that.
Obviously, there are better solutions.
Jim E. Rossler
Banned
Valnen, You ever feel that you were born 700 years too late sometimes?
Ever think that laying down your life for your beliefs engaged in battle would be the most fulfilling death possible?
Or that some cultures are irredeemable and that a swift death is the only fitting punishment?
These are normal thoughts, and we all have them. Who HASN'T wished death on foreigners for their wrong way of doing whatever?
However, these completely normal and healthy thoughts seem to be slightly more prevalent and powerful in your case. All things in moderation now!
Ever think that laying down your life for your beliefs engaged in battle would be the most fulfilling death possible?
Or that some cultures are irredeemable and that a swift death is the only fitting punishment?
These are normal thoughts, and we all have them. Who HASN'T wished death on foreigners for their wrong way of doing whatever?
However, these completely normal and healthy thoughts seem to be slightly more prevalent and powerful in your case. All things in moderation now!
Life in prison works too.
More like 700 years too soon, before all this has been deal with already.
Not everything is okay just because it's tradition or culture. Do you support everything people do if it might be in their culture, religion, or tradition? Do you support honor killings too?
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