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- RetroUSB AVS - Real Hardware HDMI NES Clone Console

R

Rich!

Member
The AVS is a new hardware clone of the NES, developed by RetroUSB, makers of the NES PowerPak flashcart.

oq7Z1FW.jpg


The AVS is an FPGA based hardware clone of the NES that outputs in 720p HD via HDMI. Before I go any further, here's the main points you should be aware of:

- This is a hardware clone and not typical emulation. Therefore, it has 100% compatibility with all titles of all NES regions, no input lag, support for all accessories including the FDS, and full everdrive compatibility. This is not a Retron. This is, for all intents and purposes, a NES.

- This is not designed to compete with cheaper devices and emulation boxes such as the NES Mini. This is for enthusiasts who have a collection of NES carts who wish to play them in the best possible quality with new hardware.

Right, so lets get onto the features:

Features:

- 720p widscreen HDMI output, 60hz and 50hz display modes
- Inbuilt NES four-score (four controller ports)
- 44.1khz HDMI output with full special cart expansion audio support.
- Variable pixel scaling including 1:1 integer mode, 4:3 and 5:3. Optional scanlines with various parameters.
- Front loading NES and top loading Famicom cartridge ports.
- HDMI Type A for video/audio, USB mini B for power and data upload
- Full cheat support (Game Genie, Action Replay, RAW)
- Online leaderboard support for supported games
- Fully upgradable system via USB
- 100% accurate hardware based support for all NES/Famicom carts and accessories including the Everdrive and the FDS.

Price:

$185 US

Where to buy?

Preorders start on Monday 8th August at http://www.retrousb.com/ as per their official facebook page.

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CrAzY FiNgErS said:
Here's Contra playing on this sexy beast:

Contra on AVS via Youtube
Click to expand...

QUESTIONS:

- Why 720p? Why not 1080p?!

dcx4610 said:
For those asking why not 1080p, it's a scaling issue. The NES resolution is 256x240.

240 does not multiply into 1080. 240 does however multiply into 720. For proper/pure scaling, you need 720.

There would be no benefit to having 1080p and it would introduce problems.
Click to expand...

- Does this use parts from real NES consoles?

Rich! said:
No. This is entirely new custom made hardware.
Click to expand...

- Then how does it work?

StAidan said:
While the NES processor (called the 6502) is still manufactured and used today for many purposes, this particular product (the AVS) doesn't use it. It uses a piece of hardware called a Field Programmable Gate Array (FPGA), which is an integrated circuit that can be programmed through firmware to mimic something else.

That's why some folks are referring to the AVS as hardware-based emulation. To some extent that's true, but I think that characterization minimizes the unprecedented accuracy we can expect to see from it.
Click to expand...

Crazymoogle said:
Yep, speed is fine. It's still hardware, just programmed to behave like the exact model of 6502 used. If you used a "modern" 6502 the quirks might not be the same, and the FPGA also offers the flexibility to add features that weren't on the original hardware.
Click to expand...

- Does it output analog RGB?

No. HDMI only.

FLEABttn said:
It'd increase the BOM for a feature that realistically would not be widely used.

If you're spending $200 on an NES with the intention of playing on a PVM, get an original with an RBG mod; this product isn't for you.
Click to expand...

Mega said:
There are very few people who could take advantage of RGB with a compatible CRT, so the omission makes sense. And this console is aimed squarely at playing on HDTVs, always has been.
Click to expand...
 
R

rootbeerafloat

Member
Since it looks like I'll never get to join the Nt club and I'm not satisfied with the Retron 5, I'll be all over this. Excited to have an excuse to get a FDS and start a collection, since I'll finally be able to play one via HDMI.
 
R

Rich!

Member
Chittagong said:
Looks awesome. Huge respect for them for making the product first and *then* opening up the preorders
Click to expand...

yep, anyone who preorders can do so in confidence and knows exactly what they're gonna get. no kickstarter shit here. these units are boxed up and ready to go.

I'm really excited to preorder tomorrow when I get the chance as this is a fantastic alternative to going the RGB NES route - which even for someone like me with a full RGB setup, is just too expensive.
 
K

KelpPlankton

Member
This is the high-end enthusiast device that I think a lot of people wanted when they saw Nintendo announced their NES Classic. Great to see someone making this, hope we get an SNES one sometime in the future.

Being compatible with the Disc System is amazing.
 
N

NoFaceNico

Member
I've been looking forward to this. I just had to pay some university fees though so I might have to wait a couple months, unfortunately.

I saw one of these first hand at PAX South this year and they're deceptively small. As you can see they're not that much bigger than an NES cart. Not that this is a bad thing.
 
Refreshment.01

Refreshment.01

Member
What should have been... This is is an acomplishment, from features to design, they nailed it.

There's a market for Retro gaming in the purest way that at least deserves some research on part of the console manufacturers of the past. Companies like Sega, NEC and Nintendo should take a closer look and decide if it's worth it to properly adress this segment.

Imagine having something like this beauty coming from the official source with the expected attention to detail, from the device itself down right to packaging and manuals. And limited prints of classic games of course.

Prices could be more affordable probably if the original companies where developing these type of classic consoles.
 
L

LewieP

Member
I'm pretty impressed at the price. I was thinking it would be more like $300.

Not for me as I don't have a great deal of nostalgia for the NES, but if they put out a SNES or Mega Drive equivalent, I might be interested.
 
C

CrAzY FiNgErS

Member
This thing is a sexy beast, alas I have no collection of NES carts. To collect all the ones I want at a reasonable cost would be doubtful. If I had the extra money I would definitely splurge on this and start buying NES carts as well.

Until that day comes, I will support retro emulation through VC on the upcoming NX(it better be good Nintendo). This is definitely a brilliant console though and I dig what they are going for here. This is a great big win for all the retro gamers out there. I wish RetroUSB all the success in the world.
 
R

Rich!

Member
cs060mk2 said:
Is not FPGA hardware emulation (emulation in hardware)?
Click to expand...

the distinction I'm trying to make is that it is hardware emulation and not software emulation. As a result it functions 100% as a real NES.

by contrast, devices such as the retron utilise software emulation and android which results in piss poor gameplay, poor support (no everdrive for example) and severe input lag
 
N

Nerdkiller

Membeur
Is there no option to allow for older connections? I'd like to play something like this on a PVM one of these days if I ever get into retro collecting.
 
riskVSreward

riskVSreward

Member
OMG OMG OMG. I thought this would cost over $300. Shout outs to the OP for this friendly reminder, I hope the site doesn't get hammered and I'm actually able to preorder.
 
B

BocoDragon

or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
I do appreciate the classic NES styling while offering totally new features.

Rich! said:
the distinction I'm trying to make is that it is hardware emulation and not software emulation. As a result it functions 100% as a real NES.

by contrast, devices such as the retron utilise software emulation and android which results in piss poor gameplay, poor support (no everdrive for example) and severe input lag
Click to expand...
Most NES clones weren't software emulation either, but NES-on-a-chip designs that still had real issues with graphics and especially sound.

Does a FPGA fare better than those?
 
S

Sir_Crocodile

Member
Fantastic job.

Any chance of someone making a FDS clone, or is the drive system too finnicky? Belts on the old ones are super dodgy nowadays.
 
C

cs060mk2

Member
Rich! said:
the distinction I'm trying to make is that it is hardware emulation and not software emulation. As a result it functions 100% as a real NES.

by contrast, devices such as the retron utilise software emulation and android which results in piss poor gameplay, poor support (no everdrive for example) and severe input lag
Click to expand...

It is still a clone though. Do not get me wrong it is a nice system but it is still FPGA.

For example there is the Minimig, an Amiga FPGA clone, it is not 100%, sound is not 100% same as real hardware and there is (where) compatibility problems.
 
P

Peter Ian Staker

Member
cs060mk2 said:
It is still a clone though. Do not get me wrong it is a nice system but it is still FPGA.

For example there is the Minimig, an Amiga FPGA clone, it is not 100%, sound is not 100% same as real hardware and there is (where) compatibility problems.
Click to expand...
Can the FPGA core be updated to fix any potential issues?
 
L

LucidMomentum

Member
Nerdkiller said:
Is there no option to allow for older connections? I'd like to play something like this on a PVM one of these days if I ever get into retro collecting.
Click to expand...

You wouldn't really need to. I mean apart from scanlines which you can emulate, this one won't have any lag on HDMI displays. Well, displays with low input / display lag, that is.
 
StereoVsn

StereoVsn

Member
LewieP said:
I'm pretty impressed at the price. I was thinking it would be more like $300.

Not for me as I don't have a great deal of nostalgia for the NES, but if they put out a SNES or Mega Drive equivalent, I might be interested.
Click to expand...

Is there a chance for SNES I wonder? Or say a combo SNES/Genesis?
 
R

Rich!

Member
I guess...you could easily buy a second hand broken NES, put this inside the shell and hook up the cart port (easy to build an extender and the buttons can be hooked up too) if you really hate the aesthetics.
 
J

jimboton

Member
I'd buy a snes, genesis or amiga version of this

LucidMomentum said:
You wouldn't really need to. I mean apart from scanlines which you can emulate, this one won't have any lag on HDMI displays. Well, displays with low input / display lag, that is.
Click to expand...

It's not just the scanlines, sidescrollers tend to look blurry on lcd displays, even fast ones. But eliminating emulation input lag is a huge win that's true.
 
R

Rich!

Member
yeah, nothing beats gaming on a decent crt

but its understandable why analog output has been omitted here
 
N

Nerdkiller

Membeur
N

Ninja Scooter

Member
Interesting. Price is not too outlandish. I have some NES games but my only hardware is a toploader NES so it's not too ideal.

Aesthetic and design wise though, this is not an attractive piece of hardware. Not sure what they were going for there.
 
L

Lupin the Third

Member
Ninja Scooter said:
Interesting. Price is not too outlandish. I have some NES games but my only hardware is a toploader NES so it's not too ideal.

Aesthetic and design wise though, this is not an attractive piece of hardware. Not sure what they were going for there.
Click to expand...

Based on the name I assume they were trying to match the pre-NES prototype of the American Famicom hardware called the AVS.

TpWF2X1.jpg
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Here's the accessories in the same style: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e9/Nintendo_AVS_display_case_(medium_angle).jpg
 
Tal Shiar Agent

Tal Shiar Agent

Member
This looks pretty good. I'm considering picking it up over the NES Classic.

Though I hope one day we'll get a combo clone hardware system that plays NES, SNES, and maybe GB/C.
 
C

CrAzY FiNgErS

Member
NOLA_Gaffer said:
Not looking forward to secondhand nes and famicom cart prices getting even more ridiculous because of this thing.
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Welcome to the real world my friend. :( Retro console gaming and cartridge collecting will continue to be an expensive hobby for most. As time goes by those $100.00 and $200 carts will turn into $200-$300 carts. :( That's one reason I gave up collecting "retro" because the "rabbit hole" is too deep for me.
 
M

mr jones

Ethnicity is not a race!
Refreshment.01 said:
What should have been... This is is an acomplishment, from features to design, they nailed it.

There's a market for Retro gaming in the purest way that at least deserves some research on part of the console manufacturers of the past. Companies like Sega, NEC and Nintendo should take a closer look and decide if it's worth it to properly adress this segment.

Imagine having something like this beauty coming from the official source with the expected attention to detail, from the device itself down right to packaging and manuals. And limited prints of classic games of course.

Prices could be more affordable probably if the original companies where developing these type of classic consoles.
Click to expand...

I don't think this can be said enough.

It's amazing that this is still considered a niche market. Bruh. All of the folks who played this thing are in their 30s and 40s. They still play games. They have disposable income. And you'd be tapping into their childhood.

Can you imagine if Sega released another Sonic or Streets of Rage title on the Genesis? If Yacht Club released a spin off Shovel Knight game on the Super Nintendo? Capcom released a Mega Man game on the NES? People would lose their shit.

They're cartridge systems. They'll last longer than any Playstation or Xbox. Millions of folks have them. WHY aren't there more than 1 or 2 indie developers making games for them? Why isn't Nintendo and Sega capitalizing on upgraded hardware?

I just don't understand...
 
L

Lupin the Third

Member
mr jones said:
I don't think this can be said enough.

It's amazing that this is still considered a niche market. Bruh. All of the folks who played this thing are in their 30s and 40s. They still play games. They have disposable income. And you'd be tapping into their childhood.

Can you imagine if Sega released another Sonic or Streets of Rage title on the Genesis? If Yacht Club released a spin off Shovel Knight game on the Super Nintendo? Capcom released a Mega Man game on the NES? People would lose their shit.

They're cartridge systems. They'll last longer than any Playstation or Xbox. Millions of folks have them. WHY aren't there more than 1 or 2 indie developers making games for them? Why isn't Nintendo and Sega capitalizing on upgraded hardware?

I just don't understand...
Click to expand...

It's probably more costly than we'd like to think it is, and the average consumer is apparently willing to tolerate the faults of stuff like the Genesis "Firecore" clones.
 
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