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Lynx_7
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(06-17-2017, 02:26 AM)
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People's gripes with 4 are absolutely justified, but I also feel like you have to meet the game somewhere in the middle. Like, the way Rutger described his playstyle of leaving characters behind for pairing purposes and Sigurding the whole map sounds absolutely boring to me. It's the game's fault for allowing such a playstyle to be even viable in the first place, but you can also do the same thing on Awakening, or Path of Radiance, or Sacred Stones, or Birthright/Revelations, so it's something the franchise in general struggles with. I usually play trying to use every single unit to the best of their abilities and while I know that's not the most optimal way of doing things, it makes the whole experience a lot more fun.

It's why I like 4's gigantic maps as I try to maximize my troops' usability in order to save every single village and I enjoy the dynamic it brings when it forces you into some "setpieces" where you have to deal with multiple situations at the same time. I think the best map in this regard is the beginning of chapter 8 if you're trying to defend Leonster. The enemy just keeps sending different enemy formations and bosses your way while you deal with the armors down in the forest and it was legitimately fun doing that section without losing anyone and keeping track of both sides of the battle. There's a lot of downtime and the mission structure is not as tightly woven as some of the more intricately designed, self-contained skirmishes from most other entries, which is why I understand their divisiviness, but I legitimately enjoyed them for what they are and there's quite a few sections which I consider pretty good on their own rights. If there's one thing I would change in the remake is making even better use of the "multiple objectives at the same time" approach to keep players on their toes and force them to not rely so much on a single/few units but rather spread the army to make for a more dynamic experience that takes full advantage of the map's sizes. Also, just better enemy units in general. And a more elegant solution to "you're not supposed to go to this part of the map yet".
Last edited by Lynx_7; 06-17-2017 at 02:33 AM.
Rutger
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(06-17-2017, 03:11 AM)
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Originally Posted by Lynx_7

People's gripes with 4 are absolutely justified, but I also feel like you have to meet the game somewhere in the middle. Like, the way Rutger described his playstyle of leaving characters behind for pairing purposes and Sigurding the whole map sounds absolutely boring to me. It's the game's fault for allowing such a playstyle to be even viable in the first place, but you can also do the same thing on Awakening, or Path of Radiance, or Sacred Stones, or Birthright/Revelations, so it's something the franchise in general struggles with. I usually play trying to use every single unit to the best of their abilities and while I know that's not the most optimal way of doing things, it makes the whole experience a lot more fun.

It's why I like 4's gigantic maps as I try to maximize my troops' usability in order to save every single village and I enjoy the dynamic it brings when it forces you into some "setpieces" where you have to deal with multiple situations at the same time. I think the best map in this regard is the beginning of chapter 8 if you're trying to defend Leonster. The enemy just keeps sending different enemy formations and bosses your way while you deal with the armors down in the forest and it was legitimately fun doing that section without losing anyone and keeping track of both sides of the battle. There's a lot of downtime and the mission structure is not as tightly woven as some of the more intricately designed, self-contained skirmishes from most other entries, which is why I understand their divisiviness, but I legitimately enjoyed them for what they are and there's quite a few sections which I consider pretty good on their own rights. If there's one thing I would change in the remake is making even better use of the "multiple objectives at the same time" approach to keep players on their toes and force them to not rely so much on a single/few units but rather spread the army to make for a more dynamic experience that takes full advantage of the map's sizes. Also, just better enemy units in general. And a more elegant solution to "you're not supposed to go to this part of the map yet".

It's true that my approach is kind or boring(though I don't actually just let Sigurd do everything, the game has Swordmasters, I'm gonna use them, along with a couple other mounted units because it's more fun to have several units doing things). Early on I even tried to use more of my units, but watching everyone that isn't mounted fall behind while I'm moving everyone across the map so they can reach the next fight was taking more time than I felt it was worth.
CazTGG
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(06-17-2017, 03:11 AM)
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I can appreciate what Seisen was going for, but its ambitious ideas are marred by the overall tedium of trudging through the massive maps and monotonous micromanaging of marriages in preparation for the second generation of the story. Using Sigurd so extensively in the first half isn't because of them being an overly powerful unit, at least not just because they are one of the best units in the game, it's because they're a mounted unit that can cover these gargantuan territories who happens to recruit a good amount of the characters, which doesn't encourage one to take their non-mounted units anywhere but a captured fort. It doesn't help that the weapons triangle is hilariously unbalanced in its initial appearance or that the pacing is all over the place, albeit it does improve in the second half. The music is among the best in the series, i'd daresay it's the best overall soundtrack Fire Emblem has ever boasted and a contender for the best soundtrack of all time, and the spritework has some of the best showcases on the Super Famicom with the gorgeous spells but the game they're designed around...it's rough, to say the least. Say what you want about the GBA games simplifying mechanics from the Jugdral games, at least their ideas (mostly) come together.

Also: Including incest/rape as a major plot point is simply indefensible. What the hell, Intelligent Systems?
Lynx_7
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(06-17-2017, 03:16 AM)
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Originally Posted by CazTGG

Also: Including incest/rape as a major plot point is simply indefensible. What the hell, Intelligent Systems?

This is another thing the fanbase blows way out of proportion. The topic isn't handled with levity nor does the game try to fetishize it in any way like more recent entries have done, so I don't see what's the issue.

Originally Posted by Golnei

...what? That's what you take issue with? It's not like the game uses it for titillation or advocates for it.

Sorry, I'm bad at reading sarcasm.

Was it sarcasm? I couldn't tell. lol
Last edited by Lynx_7; 06-17-2017 at 03:18 AM.
Golnei
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(06-17-2017, 03:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by CazTGG

Also: Including incest/rape as a major plot point is simply indefensible. What the hell, Intelligent Systems?

...what? That's what you take issue with? It's not like the game uses it for titillation or advocates for it.

Sorry, I'm bad at reading sarcasm.
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-17-2017, 04:10 PM)
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https://imgur.com/a/9aMeS

I can't believe Sacred Stones is finally joining Cipher
L95
Member
(06-17-2017, 05:41 PM)
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Yay Myrrh :D
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-18-2017, 05:12 AM)
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Conrad SR looks awesome. He has a unique trait that allows him to be deployed with ease when you're in a pinch!
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-19-2017, 06:19 PM)
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Ranulf

Alm and Celica are getting new promos in the next issues of Nintendo Dream/Dengeki Nintendo!

https://www.nintendo.co.jp/3ds/ajjj/...=3DS_ajjj#set4

The Ciphers look 👌
Lunar15
Member
(06-19-2017, 06:46 PM)
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Just started Echoes finally. My impressions are basically the same as everyone else's so far, so I won't go into detail. I just love the production values in this game. I genuinely wish this artist could do the art for FE Switch, even though we all know that won't be happening. Music is fantastic, but that's to be expected from the team that put out Fates' stellar soundtrack.

Also, I feel like the 3D battle animations are finally approaching the flair and style that's been missing since the GBA sprite days. This is something I hope they focus on for FE: Switch.
theprodigy
Member
(06-20-2017, 12:59 AM)
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In case you didn't see it, May 2017 NPD:

Injustice 2
Mario Kart 8 Deluxe*
Grand Theft Auto V
The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild*
Prey*
Tom Clancy’s Ghost Recon: Wildlands
Fire Emblem Echoes: Shadow of Valentia*
NBA 2K17
MLB 17: The Show
Overwatch**
Tom Clancy’s Rainbow Six: Siege
Horizon Zero Dawn
Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare
Call of Duty: Black Ops III
Mass Effect Andromeda
Farpoint
Battlefield 1
Nier: Automata
Minecraft
FIFA 17
*No digital sales
*No digital sales from Blizzard’s PC app

Japan was a fluke
Draxal
Member
(06-20-2017, 01:01 AM)
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Its weird how Japan soured so much on Echoes, but is carrying Heroes.
spiritfox
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(06-20-2017, 01:11 AM)
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Cause Heroes is the better Fire Emblem game.
Lord of Ostia
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(06-20-2017, 01:15 AM)
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Originally Posted by spiritfox

Cause Heroes is the better Fire Emblem game.

Not even close
Draxal
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(06-20-2017, 01:16 AM)
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Both are pretty annoying tbh, tempest maps vs Celicas maps.
CazTGG
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(06-20-2017, 03:46 AM)
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Originally Posted by spiritfox

Cause Heroes is the better Fire Emblem game.

We don't appreciate lies in these here parts.
spiritfox
Member
(06-20-2017, 05:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by CazTGG

We don't appreciate lies in these here parts.

Good cause it ain't lies.
PK Gaming
Member
(06-20-2017, 06:52 AM)
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The fact that Echoes is being compared to Heroes says it all, really
Erheller
Member
(06-20-2017, 06:57 AM)
I'd play Echoes over Birthright

Then again, I'd play Heroes over Birthright too
BkzUzi
Member
(06-20-2017, 07:14 AM)
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Birthright.... One of the most bland and forgettable FE game.
CazTGG
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(06-20-2017, 07:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by PK Gaming

The fact that Echoes is being compared to Heroes says it all, really

Blame Takumi Celica
Last edited by CazTGG; 06-20-2017 at 07:31 AM.
spiritfox
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(06-20-2017, 07:19 AM)
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A pity because I like the Hoshido designs, but Birthright's so boring.
Bonen no Max'd
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(06-20-2017, 07:21 AM)
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Birthright is really easy but it has way more interesting maps than Echoes dunno what you guys are on
BkzUzi
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(06-20-2017, 07:25 AM)
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I don't even remember the maps. Only thing I remember was that I was able to breeze through the entire game with Corrin, Takumi, and the red swordmaster.
The story was forgettable, and none of the characters had a personality besides Takumi, it's on the same level as Shadow Dragon character personality wise.

Birthright might have the better maps, but none of them must be great/memorable since I can't remember any lol. I played Conquest before Birthright, but I still remember levels from that game. Echoes is the better game even if it has the worse maps just due to the story and characters, and at least they were more memorable than the Birthright cast.
Last edited by BkzUzi; 06-20-2017 at 07:28 AM.
PK Gaming
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(06-20-2017, 07:50 AM)
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Originally Posted by BkzUzi

I don't even remember the maps. Only thing I remember was that I was able to breeze through the entire game with Corrin, Takumi, and the red swordmaster.
The story was forgettable, and none of the characters had a personality besides Takumi, it's on the same level as Shadow Dragon character personality wise.

Birthright might have the better maps, but none of them must be great/memorable since I can't remember any lol. I played Conquest before Birthright, but I still remember levels from that game. Echoes is the better game even if it has the worse maps just due to the story and characters, and at least they were more memorable than the Birthright cast.

I believe you.

EDIT:

Echoes is the better game even if it has the worse maps just due to the story and characters, and at least they were more memorable than the Birthright cast.

Worse maps and worse game design, period.
Lynx_7
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(06-20-2017, 07:59 AM)
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The only thing I remember about my experience with Birthright is solving every problem with "send Ryoma over there" and killing the last boss with Corrin and Ryoma and their waifus/husbandos only. When I saw the number of units in that last map I just immediately noped. Lunatic Birthright was so annoying with its enemy density and reinforcements and I was having none of it at that point.
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-20-2017, 09:55 AM)
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The Alm and Celica promos in question.

It recently occurred to me that we didn't get a new guidebook and accompanying promo last set, and I'm not sure if it's happening this time around...
jzbluz
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(06-20-2017, 11:01 AM)
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Birthright wasn't that bad, and I really liked Orochi and Azama.

Originally Posted by Draxal

Both are pretty annoying tbh, tempest maps vs Celicas maps.

At least Celica's maps end, tempest just goes on and on.
Gradivus
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(06-20-2017, 02:31 PM)
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http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...&postcount=549

A little more to add from the NPD thread.
Last edited by Gradivus; 06-20-2017 at 02:36 PM.
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-21-2017, 10:12 AM)
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Playable Necrodragons! I expected to see Revenants join first, but this is still nice. I really like the art style of this one.

If you wanna see all the cards, you can find them here.
kuroneko0509
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(06-28-2017, 06:47 AM)
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sprites on musou premium boxart


PK Gaming
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(06-28-2017, 06:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by kuroneko0509

sprites on musou premium boxart


So Lissa and Male Robin are a lock huh? Nice
DecoReturns
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(06-28-2017, 06:59 AM)
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Originally Posted by PK Gaming

So Lissa and Male Robin are a lock huh? Nice

I hope they give Lissa a sword
CazTGG
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(06-29-2017, 12:45 AM)
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Originally Posted by DecoReturns

I hope they give Lissa a sword

Why would they do that, exactly?
Draxal
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(06-29-2017, 01:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by CazTGG

Why would they do that, exactly?

Because she's out of place there being the only one without one.
CazTGG
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(06-29-2017, 02:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by Draxal

Because she's out of place there being the only one without one.

Don't people criticize the Fire Emblem reps in Super Smash Bros. for, among other factors, using the same weapon type i.e. swords? That aside, we're good for sword users based on who we know is in Warriors. Let's have someone who uses magic or another weapon type before adding in more sword wielders.
spiritfox
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(06-29-2017, 03:00 AM)
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Originally Posted by CazTGG

Don't people criticize the Fire Emblem reps in Super Smash Bros. for, among other factors, using the same weapon type i.e. swords? That aside, we're good for sword users based on who we know is in Warriors. Let's have someone who uses magic or another weapon type before adding in more sword wielders.

I think it's a joke on how the developers where saying there were too many sword users then showing only sword users at E3.
CazTGG
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(06-29-2017, 03:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by spiritfox

I think it's a joke on how the developers where saying there were too many sword users then showing only sword users at E3.

Fire Emblem Warriors |OT| Yo Laguz, I Heard You Like Swords!
Chrom
Junior Member
(06-29-2017, 09:43 AM)
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FE Heroes confirms Elise > Sakura
Aveyn Knight
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(06-29-2017, 11:14 AM)
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Originally Posted by Chrom

FE Heroes confirms Elise > Sakura

Pfft, only that Elise fans outnumber Sakura fans : P

Either way, you could've reached that conclusion from all the previous popularity polls and Choose Your Legends.
kuroneko0509
Member
(06-29-2017, 12:18 PM)
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don't be sad aveyn. who knows there'll be a rerun battle in the future :p
Rutger
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(07-05-2017, 03:31 AM)
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Finally, I'm done with FE4.

Some weeks back while playing through Echoes I thought to myself "If I can put up with these maps, then FE4 shouldn't be a problem", so I finally sat down and started up my old save file with the goal to finish it. I know I how some of my posts looked, but I've never hated this game, I've just had a really hard time staying motivated during the slower parts of the large maps along with the repetitive enemy encounters(nearly everything is grouped up in a formation in order to rush us down). Sadly those issues never left the game, but I'd have to say that I enjoyed the second half more than the first, the maps opened up a little bit(they were still fairly linear, but often there would be times with more than one castle to seize at the same time, something I felt was a missed opportunity during the first half) along with some pretty overpowered characters and weapons.

I think the best way I could describe the gameplay and the maps is that FE4 is a playground. It allows us to go crazy with building powerful characters and the game throws a massive amount of helpless enemies our way to cut down, and there's certainly something fun to be found in that.

It is a surprisingly low stress game given its rather dark plot, which I enjoyed for what it was. It has an impressive amount of world building with a large number of kingdoms at play, but I'll have to admit that I don't remember the names of most or what they added to the story, so it might not have been enough for how large a world it's going for. Still, it has some interesting politics going on, making it feel more Gundam than usual.

The playable characters were rather flat, though they can occasionally talk with one another to make up for supports not existing yet. On the villains side though, Arvis and Travant manage to be some of the most interesting in the series despite being given very little screentime to work with, a shame that they get overshadowed by a generic cult that is laughably evil.

For the aesthetic stuff, the music was nice, but only a handful stuck with me after hearing them. While the artstyle for the characters, I certainly can't call bad, but they are pretty 90s anime in a way I don't care for, haha.


That's about it I guess. The game is pretty old so I doubt I'm saying anything new in this long post, but I wanted to gather my thoughts. I'm glad I played through it, it's a unique experience for the series and there is plenty to enjoy, but the slow parts are really slow, so I don't think I'll be returning to this game anytime soon.

I guess that means FE5 is next, but I'm going to take a bit of a break before starting that. I need to finish up some other games I've already started first.
Lynx_7
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(07-05-2017, 04:47 PM)
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I'm trying to give Revelations my best shot but I don't know, every time I go back to it I can't commit for more than a couple chapters before my motivation fades away. The narrative isn't compelling, the maps aren't particularly interesting so far, the characters are whatever. This might be the first FE I end up actively disliking. I'll persevere but there's just nothing there for me.

Originally Posted by Rutger

I guess that means FE5 is next, but I'm going to take a bit of a break before starting that. I need to finish up some other games I've already started first.

I really want to play 5 but the lack of a "definitive" patch like 4's ProjectNaga really bums me out. It'll probably take years before before they finally move on to 5 and finish it. There's the new menu patch I guess but I'm really not fond of playing story-heavy games without understanding a word of what the characters are saying, specially with this being a Jugdral game.
Hours Left
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(07-05-2017, 08:05 PM)
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Frederick is finally getting his time in the spotlight. Now start cranking out the merch.
Lynx_7
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(07-18-2017, 04:48 PM)
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Izana's death in Revelations may just be the stupidest, most pointless "sacrifice" scene I've ever seen. I'm surprised Revelations doesn't get nearly as much shit as Conquest because so far I'm finding its story to be even worse. It's as much of an excuse plot as you can get. At least Conquest has something going for it with the hoshidan siblings.
Golnei
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(07-18-2017, 04:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by Lynx_7

Izana's death in Revelations may just be the stupidest, most pointless "sacrifice" scene I've ever seen. I'm surprised Revelations doesn't get nearly as much shit as Conquest because so far I'm finding its story to be even worse. It's as much of an excuse plot as you can get. At least Conquest has something going for it with the hoshidan siblings.

I still think Lilith is worse - though it's not like Fates is particularly short on idiotic contrivances.
Xbro
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(07-18-2017, 05:11 PM)
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At one point it felt like they were killing characters for the sake of killing characters. Problem was I didn't care about the characters. Didn't help that most of the deaths were poorly executed.
Lynx_7
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(07-18-2017, 05:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by Golnei

I still think Lilith is worse - though it's not like Fates is particularly short on idiotic contrivances.

You mean her death in Conquest? It's unremarkable if nothing else, but it's not offensively bad or anything, just your bog standard "emotional sacrifice" without any of the emotion involved. Everything about Izana's is just contrived and presented in an almost funny "so bad it would actually be good as a parody of pointless death scenes" manner:

"Hey, Takumi, it's your time to join. Gods told me or whatever."
"Takumi: Nope"
"K, what if I'm all fancy about it though?" *takes out crystal ball and recites some medieval fantasy bubblegum*
"Takumi: Nah"
"Hmm, fine, I'mma talk to some really old gods then, be right back"
*Literal seconds later*
"Go see a dragon. By the way, I'm dying" *falls over*
"Sakura: OH no!! But we care so much about you!!!"
"Yeah, I literally died to tell you these three pointless words. Takumi?"
"Takumi: What"
"Just fucking go with Corrin"
"Takumi: But I don't wanna"
"I'm dying, Takumi"
"Takumi: Sheesh, fine"


It's so nonchalant lol
theprodigy
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(07-18-2017, 05:28 PM)
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Originally Posted by Lynx_7

Izana's death in Revelations may just be the stupidest, most pointless "sacrifice" scene I've ever seen. I'm surprised Revelations doesn't get nearly as much shit as Conquest because so far I'm finding its story to be even worse. It's as much of an excuse plot as you can get. At least Conquest has something going for it with the hoshidan siblings.

Too busy shitting on Revelation's gameplay instead.
Bonen no Max'd
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(07-18-2017, 05:53 PM)
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Does Lilith die in Revelation? Honestly can't remember.

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