Oh, fuck off with this "true fans" bullshit. Liking action RE as much or more than horror RE doesn't make you any less of an RE fan. Again, fuck off with this.
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Resident Evil 7 Ships 4 Million Copies Worldwide (At 500K/2M FY goal by March 2018)
- Thread starter Jawmuncher
- Start date
Shin
Banned
7 isn't even half way of what 5 sold, it's a big difference (though people keep saying 5 isn't RE).
4m shipped isn't bad, but when looking at the previous versions it is somewhat underwhelming IMO.
Auroradawn
Member
So based only on those two elements , Are you saying that MGS4 ( Which had a world record of cutscenes length and numbers and its producer said that it want only a million to turn a profit ) has way more budget than MGSV ( Which needs a magnifier to see its Cutscenes numbers ) ?
https://kotaku.com/5479974/kojima-productions-on-mgs4-budget-claims
From the look of it , RE7 budget is smaller than RE6 , but do we have a Solid Source of that from Capcom or any Solid numbers ? and lower by how much ? Why are people kept assuming it is WAY lower than RE6 without any kind of source from Capcom and how is saying that Engine cutting costs is making it comparable and indicator to RE6 budget by anyway ? Why are People forgetting the cost of developing VR in a Full AAA Game ?
- By Numbers , HTC Vive owners as of june 2017 are 190K , Oculus Rift owners are 1 to 2 compared to HTC Vive , So they are 95K , That makes the overall for both of them equal 285K at June 2017
https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/24/16197888/htc-vive-business-spinoff-sale-rumor
https://www.roadtovr.com/htc-vive-sales-units-oculus-rift-comparison-compared-tim-sweeney/
- You said that RE7 sales are looking Great as Other games had remaster to boost them while RE7 didn't , I just pointed out to you that even without remasters , RE5 and RE6 Day one numbers still are above RE7 ten months numbers
These mere "two elements" constitute an outsized portion of the game's production. The number of voice actors needed, plus the number of recording sessions, takes, edits, revisions, etc. On the music side, the sheer amount of tracks to be composed, arranged, mixed and mastered is another cost. RE6 had very high production values. I mean that in a good way, too. RE7 comes nowhere near that.
What happens at Konami or any other game company has no bearing on what happens at Capcom and is completely irrelevant.
Capcom is never going to reveal the exact numbers for any game they make, and publicly going forward by saying one game is much lower budget than another is not standard practice. That doesn't mean we can't reasonably deduce the fact that RE7 was a much leaner project overall.
The only official word we have is the fact the 2.5 million initial shipment recouped the game's development cost. There's no way in hell RE6 could recoup its dev cost on RE7's numbers alone.
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ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
Thank you for posting that. I was trying to find said comment and didn't realize it was from the official side of things.
Gosh, this forum is full of 14year old kids. Check your tongue, man.
Meanwhile, here's what Capcom had to say about RE6's sales a few months after its launch:
And their guidance from the time:
I'm not sure where the narrative that RE6 was an unconditional success came from. Capcom itself never felt this way. Its catalog sales after 2013 have been impressive, but no one has even entertained the idea of giving RE7 a few years to see how far it can go.
Auroradawn
Member
Really sorry to say that and I agree that RE6 has a high production Value as Capcom themselves said that , but for that same logic , Unless you are from Capcom , Then you can't label RE7 production value "Nowhere" RE6 Production value and what you experienced outside Capcom is irrelevant in Capcom's case , As I said Before from the looks , RE7 Budget looks lower than RE6 , but how much lower ? Labeling it "Nowhere" needs Official numbers or Statements for both budgets to say that word
Sorry if it sounded little rough , But I just counter your logic and I hope I didn't overdid it
It was a leaner project I totally agree based on what I see , but how much leaner compared to RE6 ? That is my point , 10% , 20% , 50% ..etc
How we are so Sure that RE6 didn't Recoup its development costs day 1 ? I mean it isn't like Capcom announced RE7 recouped development costs on their own will , They were asked about it in a the Q3 Conference Q&A and they answered , Tabata said that FFXV recouped its development costs day one when asked about it in an interview 5 months after the game release despite people keep saying rumors in those 5 months it needs 10M to recoup its development costs , Rockstar didn't announce that GTAV recouped its development costs but does that mean 100% it didn't recoup it day one or at launch window at max ?
So unless Capcom answer the " When did RE6 recouped its development budget" question like they did for RE7 m Then we won't be sure when did it recoup its development costs , I hope cvxfreaks if occasion happened and you made an interview with a Capcom Staff then I hope they clear the " When did RE6 recouped its development budget" If they are allowed to answer this question
Z
ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
He's already answered of your query and Capcoms' stance with its fiscal results just above lol.
Z
ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
Sure beats the unseen image of 6 being a Giraffe in an act of Fellatio!
Aztechnology
Member
Only a few months off from the 12 month PSVR exclusivity window. That was a really dumb decision for an overall VR health perspective, but I understand why Capcom did it. Why turn down free Sony money.
Auroradawn
Member
Here is what they said also
"The flagship title Resident Evil 6 (for PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360), despite recording brisk sales when it debuted, subsequently lost its momentum, resulting in the failure to achieve planned sales and fulfill its role as a driver of sales expansion," admitted the publisher.
Kawata said that from a business perspective , The game was a success
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-01-24-has-capcom-saved-resident-evil
So what the failure lies here if they are saying that the game was a success , The failure lies that the game failed to elevate Capcom to the next level like they said " resulting in the failure to achieve planned sales and fulfill its role as a driver of sales expansion " , The Product itself is a success but They hoped for a specific high role for the game that they hoped to achieve but it didn't achieve it in the specific time , it is like you have a Product in your store that is popular with people so you bet with your next shipment that you will open another branch for your store based on the profits of this product , The product didn't achieve the profits to make another branch but at the same time it was profitable in general , Does this turn it into a failed product ? Nope
Also That report about RE6 is about sold Copies and not Shipments , If you don't believe me then riddle me this
In Q2 , The Table had 3.7M number despite knowing it had shipped 4.5M like the note below the table is saying , Then in the next Quarter which is Q3
It sold an additional 1.1M , making it 4.8M , Which is 3.7+1.1
Sorry but , What do you want to say ?
Heavy's Sandvich
Member
Capcom jebaited again.
Produce a phenomenal game that pays homage to it's roots, to please all those vocal fans and you lads don't even buy it.
Sickheads.
We killed Mega man.
Produce a phenomenal game that pays homage to it's roots, to please all those vocal fans and you lads don't even buy it.
Sickheads.
We killed Mega man.
Z
ZombieFred
Unconfirmed Member
He already added onto why Capcom had deemed 6 being a failure upon their expectations and wishing results before your rebuttal on Six being classed as a great success commercially or from Capcoms' view with the project. The game was heavily discounted after several months and holiday sales.
Auroradawn
Member
It failed to reach its role and target just like RE7 , but it isn't a failed product , and thats what I was saying
I didn't say Great Success , I said a Success , Also Kawata said it was a success
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2017-01-24-has-capcom-saved-resident-evil
So as RE7
£15
$28
$23
You're reading the sentence incorrectly, I'm afraid.
Let's alter the sentence by removing an extra clause:
"The flagship title Resident Evil 6 (for PlayStation 3 and Xbox 360), despite recording brisk sales when it debuted, subsequently lost its momentum, resulting in the failure to [...] fulfill its role as a driver of sales expansion," admitted the publisher.
The game disappointed Capcom at launch, far undershot its original target of 7 million and caused the company to go back to the drawing board for RE7. I do agree that it becoming the 2nd best selling Capcom game is a success in and of itself, but the original plan was for it to become the highest selling Capcom game in history, which it has still failed to do.
RE6 was already $40 by Nov 15 and $20 by the end of December 2012.
Standard price seemed to hit $30 by January 2013.
JimmyRustler
Gold Member
Amazing. Hope we get a least one more RE like it then. Can't wait for the upcoming DLC and also to replay the main game on my new OLED with HDR when I get it next week.
LOL, that misinformation will never die.Really sorry to say that and I agree that RE6 has a high production Value as Capcom themselves said that , but for that same logic , Unless you are from Capcom , Then you can't label RE7 production value "Nowhere" RE6 Production value and what you experienced outside Capcom is irrelevant in Capcom's case , As I said Before from the looks , RE7 Budget looks lower than RE6 , but how much lower ? Labeling it "Nowhere" needs Official numbers or Statements for both budgets to say that word
Sorry if it sounded little rough , But I just counter your logic and I hope I didn't overdid it
It was a leaner project I totally agree based on what I see , but how much leaner compared to RE6 ? That is my point , 10% , 20% , 50% ..etc
How we are so Sure that RE6 didn't Recoup its development costs day 1 ? I mean it isn't like Capcom announced RE7 recouped development costs on their own will , They were asked about it in a the Q3 Conference Q&A and they answered , Tabata said that FFXV recouped its development costs day one when asked about it in an interview 5 months after the game release despite people keep saying rumors in those 5 months it needs 10M to recoup its development costs , Rockstar didn't announce that GTAV recouped its development costs but does that mean 100% it didn't recoup it day one or at launch window at max ?
So unless Capcom answer the " When did RE6 recouped its development budget" question like they did for RE7 m Then we won't be sure when did it recoup its development costs , I hope cvxfreaks if occasion happened and you made an interview with a Capcom Staff then I hope they clear the " When did RE6 recouped its development budget" If they are allowed to answer this question
The 10 million thing was just a personal goal, not the break-even-point:
Speaking with European press following Uncovered, Tabata said the game needs to sell upwards of 10 million units over its lifetime. This has nothing to do with profitability, however.
In a statement issued to Famitsu, Tabata clarified the 10 million figure is nothing more than a goal for the team. He said the number is probably exaggerated but was put out to demonstrate the team's lofty ambitions. ”We've thought about what we need to do to achieve this number and tasked ourselves with this huge objective."
In a statement issued to Famitsu, Tabata clarified the 10 million figure is nothing more than a goal for the team. He said the number is probably exaggerated but was put out to demonstrate the team's lofty ambitions. ”We've thought about what we need to do to achieve this number and tasked ourselves with this huge objective."
They broke even with FFXV on launch already, yeah:
Tabata-san clarified that not only Final Fantasy XV already has already broken even with its development costs, but it did so on day one, which means when it launched on November 29th.
Square Enix announced almost immediately that the day one shipments, including digital downloads, were over five million copies, marking the fastest selling Final Fantasy game ever at its debut. This means that those five million copies were enough to recoup costs, even if we don't know by how much.
Square Enix announced almost immediately that the day one shipments, including digital downloads, were over five million copies, marking the fastest selling Final Fantasy game ever at its debut. This means that those five million copies were enough to recoup costs, even if we don't know by how much.
As of last month they have sold over 6.5 million copies of FFXV and made good profits:
Tabata: We made quite a lot of money off the game on day one - we made good profits off that - and we thought the best way to use that profit would be to thank the fans who'd played the game, to give back to them and use that to improve their experience. After doing a service model game, you learn a hell of a lot doing that, you realise certain things about games. It's been a rewarding experience doing it like that.
Auroradawn
Member
And that was my point , Sorry if it wasn't that clear or i gave the impression that I meant it fulfilled its role , I just thought people will read the line before the bolded one as it makes sense , I will edit it to include bolding the previous line , What I was meaning is that it failed to fulfill its role as a driver of sales expansion for the company , but Capcom didn't say it was a failed Project , it is a success on its own
RE7 was also $40 in March 2017 , A month and few weeks after release and was $31 two months and few weeks after release
And with all respect to Wario64 , but where is his links and sources ?
And that was what I meaning , People Spread a Rumor based on Personal wish and a lot of people believed it was the break even point , But Tabata said here himself that The Game broke even on Day one
Auroradawn
Member
Thanks Jawmuncher for mentioning my Reddit thread here , I wasn't a gaffer back then but I am glad that you mentioned it here
The game deserves success. It's the best thing Capcom's made in years. I'm even considering buying the Gold Edition despite owning vanilla.
I find the consistent RE6 v RE7 baiting in every RE thread a real downer though. RE fans from all walks of life should be celebrating and rejoicing a really good RE game from Capcom, given their troubles over the last few years with producing real quality (remasters aside). It's a departure from the "action trilogy" so to speak but I like the idea of them trying new things with each installment if possible. There's so much here to be grateful about.
I find the consistent RE6 v RE7 baiting in every RE thread a real downer though. RE fans from all walks of life should be celebrating and rejoicing a really good RE game from Capcom, given their troubles over the last few years with producing real quality (remasters aside). It's a departure from the "action trilogy" so to speak but I like the idea of them trying new things with each installment if possible. There's so much here to be grateful about.
Yautja_Warrior
Member
Glad to see it made it's target, even if it's a little later than first expected. Quality game, especially in VR and it deserves to sell well.
Soul of the Beast
Member
EA be like: UNDERPERFORMED!
Those are 2017 Q1 numbers. Not total.
I'm not saying RE7 VR on PC is going to light the world on fire but I 100% believe it will sell a bit more than 50k.
Not necessarily saying this is what happened, but there are so many ways you can say in PR you "broke even" because of the various accounting methods companies use to manipulate PR spin.
Sändersson
Member
Especially the first couple of hours are INCREDIBLE. Hopefully this does well enough for there to be more resi games like this.
grandwizard
Member
People still jumping through hoops to try and portray RE6 as a commercial failure just because they personally didn't like the game.
Never change RE-gaf.
Never change RE-gaf.
No, just the GC, PS2 and Wii retail releases. No PC, PS3, PS4, 360, XB1, Wii U eShop, iOS or Android.
Likewise the RE5 and RE6 figures dont include PC, XB1 or PS4, or Android for RE5. Those games too have sold quite a bit more. RE1 doesnt include PC, Saturn, DS or PSN, RE2 doesnt include PC, N64, DC, GC or PSN. I suspect all versions of RE3 would also put it ahead of RE7. CV possibly too.
CrichtonKicks
Member
That's just crazy talk. RE7 looks fantastic, especially considering it's 60 fps on consoles.
I'm sorry Jawmuncher, but that Reddit post is actually pretty bad.
Myth 1: Number of Staff
Just comparing the number of people on the two credits lists is meaningless because it doesn't measure man hours. Like I mentioned earlier, it'll take some people longer to watch all of RE6's cut-scenes than to beat RE7 in one playthrough. Volume counts.
There is also a fixed level of overlap in staff from project to project, such as managers, Q&A, the President of Capcom USA, etc.
The credits also don't take into account people not typically listed, like the Sydney Scoring Orchestra. An orchestra usually has at least 50 people on it.
Out of curiosity, I ran a cursory comparison of staff counts between RE6 and RE7. Staff numbers don't matter, but in key categories, the differences are staggering:
Code:
[b]Category RE6 RE7[/b]
Character Artists 15 9
Environment Artists 30 13
Art Directors 1 3
Sound Designers 14 5
Game Designers 15 15
Programmers/Engineers 28 15
MT Framework/RE Engine 39 45
Composers 3 3
Facial Capture/Modeling 56 13
Quality Assurance 106 69Myth 2: Marketing/Production Budget
The "Capcom Head of Marketing" quoted in this section is merely an employee at Capcom's UK office. This doesn't dictate marketing budgets anywhere else, and besides, the statement is so vague that it's virtually meaningless.
As for development budget... well, like I said, go compare RE6 with its 3+ hours of cut-scenes, 150+ tracks and the use of an entire orchestra with RE7.
Myth 3: RE6 Causing Smaller RE7
This is conjecture and difficult for anyone to say either way.
Myth 4: Recouped Budgets
I have no idea what's actually being said in here. The fact of the matter is that Capcom's financial section has verified RE7's profitability, while RE6 went from a 7 million estimate all the way down to 3.7 million at launch.
Myth 5: Bomba Bin Pricing
There's plenty of evidence that RE6 and RE7 had price drops within their launches. But RE7 made a profit on Day 1, but no one knows if RE6 did except Capcom. Kawata said offhand in an interview that RE6 was successful, and maybe he's right, but unless we ask him exactly what he means, his statement lacks context.
Myth 6: No One At Capcom Said RE6 Was A Failure
Hey, no one at Capcom ever said bringing RE to the GameCube was a "failure" either. But everyone knows it was.
Auroradawn
Member
Well , Here we go
Point 1 : You went to say that " Staff members numbers " doesn't matter ( Although the +600 staff members was the running joke for RE6 ) and erased a lot of staff member categories and listed only some selected categories then you said that its the man hour that matters more , Do you have a source or numbers from Capcom that compares the man hours between the two ? I didn't say RE7 staff member is higher than RE6 , But saying that they are only 120 staff members or they are a fraction of RE6 is an overkill , They are hundreds just like RE6 based on the Credits , even your " selected " Categories had about 200 staff members working on RE7 , and Can you tell me how much budget , man hours and Staff members that worked on VR ? Also Regarding that you say " it'll take some people longer to watch all of RE6's cut-scenes than to beat RE7 in one playthrough. Volume counts " , Then that bring us to that post again
Also going by a simple credits video length do a simple youtube search for the credits , RE6 is 14 minutes , RE7 is 13 minutes and their Fonts , Spacing and scroll speed are nearly similar
Point 2 : Sorry but , What ? If I don't take Resident Evil 7 marketing director word about marketing budget then who should I take their word ? Also he isn't merely an employee at Capcom's UK office , Search for him and you will see his is a Marketing Director at Capcom and they clearly label him " RE7 marketing director" in the article , sorry but I don't know what to say
Also regarding the second part of the post then I will quote again this post
Point 3 : Name to me a Remaster for a Last Gen game that supposedly " Killed" a franchise and supposedly universally hated and sold more than 1M in less than a year
Point 4 : Capcom didn't say it on their own , They were asked for it in the Q&A and they replied , Just like when Tabata was asked for it , And a Correction , If you want a head to head comparison with RE7 , then RE6 shipments is 4.5M at launch as we only have RE7 Shipments , If you can come up with RE7 Sold numbers at launch then we can say the 3.7M number , Also , Did GTAV recouped its development costs ?
Point 5 : Again , Did GTAV recouped its development costs ? Also What Kawata said is "From a business perspective, Resident Evil 6 was a success," , Basic English , Business for a company = $$$
Point 6 : Capcom didn't acknowledge RE4 on gamecube was a failure , So it isn't a failure until it is acknowledged by Capcom or one of its Staff
I apologize, but I'm honestly having a very difficult time reading your post, but I'll try my best to respond.
Point 1
No, Capcom has never revealed such specific numbers. But it's so obvious from the actual games themselves and anyone who has experience in game development, particularly as a producer, that RE6 was leagues beyond RE7 in terms of budget and cost. I'm not sure what else to tell you. Your argument is essentially, "Capcom didn't say anything, so it can't be true." I actually work at a video game music label, so I'm actually giving you first-hand experience about the realities of production costs.
Total staff numbers don't matter by themselves, but they give hints as to how many man hours are expended in a given part of a game's production. The categories I chose are some of the most intensive and costly aspects of production. Since you're the one who made the original Reddit post, you're free to do a comprehensive comparison. Prove me wrong.
Your Konami question was irrelevant earlier and it's irrelevant now.
Point 2
My point was that you cannot, in any way, deduce the global marketing budget for RE6 and RE7 based on a single comment from a Marketing Director at one Capcom branch office that lacks any sort of context. He makes vague assertions that it'll be similar in size to RE6, but we don't know if that's measured in terms of cost, air time, campaign length, etc.
Point 3
I don't think RE6 killed the franchise either.
Point 4
I'm sorry, I have no idea what you're saying in this point.
Like Konami, GTAV is irrelevant.
Point 5
But how was it a success? Did it meet Capcom's expectations? Is Kawata talking about the revenue or profit of the game? Is he talking about digital/physical sales numbers, many of which were sold at bargain bin prices? It's also possible that both sides can be right. RE6 disappointed initially, but eventually became successful (even if after 5 years, the PS360 versions still haven't sold 7 million). We don't know based on his comment, which could just be PR speak.
Simple English is not so simple.
GTAV is irrelevant.
Point 6
Capcom didn't acknowledge REmake and 0 as a failure either, but Capcom's actions speak otherwise.
Auroradawn
Member
so let me guess and get it too straight to save time and i am sorry to say that
You classify some talk That was said directly from Capcom as a " PR talk " "Just one small man in a small branch " "Out of context " " Vague " and any example given outside capcom circle is called "irrelevant " while You classify some other talk that doesn't even have a source as being more valid than the one said by capcom themselves because they make sense , and you said you work in a company outside Capcom so going by your logic all your talk is irrevelant just like Konami and Rockstar unless you are a capcom employee
I am sorry , but i won't resume the discussion Like that
BTW regarding GTAV example , Rockstar didn't announce that GTAV recouped its development costs , going by your logic then GTAV 100% didn't recoup its development costs at launch window
BLACK AMERICAN PSYCHO
Junior Member
Bring TPS RE back please. Design the games around having both views so they can keep the VR.
Am I missing something or is this no different from RE7 having also missed all of its targets? RE6 sold a shitton but had a lofty target, RE7 sold considerably less but had considerably lower targets... and missed those as well. From a business perspective, the latter seems *worse*, too, since you don't want your main title not only not missing it targets but also getting smaller and missing smaller targets. That major contraction.
The key difference with RE5/6 is that their catalog sales over the years continued to be strong due to the co-op elements and such, RE7 effectively fell off a cliff wherein it has not only failed its initial forecast but has shown a lack of 'legs' even just shortly after its launch.
As someone who likes both action-heavy and regular Resident Evil honestly this whole discussion comes off as people just trying to interpret the facts in whatever way that paints the game/gameplay they prefer as a success..
RE6 sold more but RE7 was most likely a lot cheaper to develop. Anything beyond that is pretty much just pure speculation since we'll never get more specific numbers.
RE6 sold more but RE7 was most likely a lot cheaper to develop. Anything beyond that is pretty much just pure speculation since we'll never get more specific numbers.
Good news! I'm glad it's at least met Calvin's expectations now. I hope it continues to do well, as it certainly deserves too.
This is a terrible comment and you should feel bad. Just because someone doesn't like the same style of RE as you, doesn't mean they aren't a "true fan". This is an incredibly toxic attitude to have and will only further divide the RE community, here and elsewhere.
This is a terrible comment and you should feel bad. Just because someone doesn't like the same style of RE as you, doesn't mean they aren't a "true fan". This is an incredibly toxic attitude to have and will only further divide the RE community, here and elsewhere.
Mr Moose
Member
I kinda agree with this. I liked most of the RE games, I think Nemesis (RE3?) was my fave. I re-bought the first game on PS4 (didn't finish it). It doesn't mean just because I like the series I owe it to them to buy 7, I would just as easily buy TEW2 (though fuck that, no Pro support?).
I may buy the complete collection at the right price, the Gold (or whatever the fuck it is) right now, even on sale, is overpriced to me (£44.99? Psh).
������
Um... I still don't know what you're trying to say here. I assume you're saying that Capcom's word is gospel in all situations?
It's very different from RE6. RE7 hit its target 6 months later than Capcom anticipated. The game is actually showing similar signs of legs as past RE games, relative to its expectations.
RE6, meanwhile, still hasn't sold its initial forecast of 7 million copies over 5 years later. It's hit that mark if you count the HD versions, but that wasn't part of Capcom's original target.
Mr Moose
Member
Wasn't RE6 shit? Then, good.