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Huge Nintendo Switch exploit (potential hack) found on firmware 3.0.0

T

TangoAlphaLima

Member
AcademicSaucer said:
The new firmware is from August 1 right? I wonder if the new stock that came out this week already has that firmware.
Click to expand...

Highly doubtful, at least in the U.S. Except for that initial rush to get stock on shelves, Nintendo ships Switches via container ship over the Pacific. Those don't come quickly. Units on store shelves likely left the factory well before the latest firmware update earlier this month.
 
D

Diablohead

Member
I only get excited about these things once there are legit things to see and do using it, it's cool and all but i'll enjoy my splatoon 2 online for now.
 
V

Vena

Member
This is why Nintendo has the white hack paid program.

This is what 3.0.1 patched because the details of this exploit were given to them. They even updated their wall of people who'd submitted bugs right before the patch.

But this exploit was found a while ago but kept quiet about until the patch was live. If you updated, there's no going back because the system has hardware-level protection on the version number.

wetalo said:
I think you underestimate how difficult it is to protect a piece of hardware. =/
Click to expand...

This is a legacy 3DS bug. Its pretty dumb that it survived into the Switch despite having been fixed in the 3DS.
 
P

Plum

Member
Psxphile said:
This is on you, Nintendo. People wouldn't have the need to hack their consoles if you'd only made the system region-free!


... wait a minute...
Click to expand...

Yeah, people just wanna homebrew. Excuses are flimsy af. I'll bet this happens for a lot of people:

"I'm only using homebrew because the VC is taking so long to come out."

*VC comes out*

"I won't be buying these games on VC when I have them on homebrew already."
 
V

Vena

Member
Also, considering how *large* and *impactful* the 3.0.1 update was on the back end (it wiped the slate clean on a lot of vulns in 3.0.0 and also completely changed a ton/all keys), this may be the only exploit on the system for a long, long time.

The 3.0.1 patch likely patched multiple levels of vulnerabilities.

This exploit was the gateway to a lot of the current work, now that it's gone FW 3.0.1 are all basically black boxes that need to be broken into all over again.
 
ViolentP

ViolentP

Member
Plum said:
Yeah, people just wanna homebrew. Excuses are flimsy af. I'll bet this happens for a lot of people:

"I'm only using homebrew because the VC is taking so long to come out."

*VC comes out*

"I won't be buying these games on VC when I have them on homebrew already."
Click to expand...

I mean, not justifying piracy here, but why would anyone pay for a game they already have?
 
W

wrowa

Member
Plum said:
Yeah, people just wanna homebrew. Excuses are flimsy af. I'll bet this happens for a lot of people:

"I'm only using homebrew because the VC is taking so long to come out."

*VC comes out*

"I won't be buying these games on VC when I have them on homebrew already."
Click to expand...

The reason this time around is "I can finally back up my save files!". Sounds like a rather silly justification for what will eventually lead to piracy, but whatever floats your boat.
 
E

epmode

Member
How can I tell which version I'm running? I know I'm not on the latest firmware since I keep getting prompted to install it but I don't see it in any of the system menus.
 
SinCityAssassin

SinCityAssassin

Member
With how fast the Switch is selling, what are the chances new batches of Switches will probably already be updated to 3.0.1 anyways?

Like after a while the only Switches left that wouldn't be upgraded are stock in overpriced countries.
 
jobrro

jobrro

Member
This stuff is always tempting but it usually disallows eShop access at some point. That's not a major problem after the console is dead, but I would rather use an open platform (Android, Windows etc.) than kill my ability to get new content legitimately on an ongoing closed platform.

Also Switch is already pretty open to region free and mutliple eShop accounts.
 
P

pretty done

Member
Plum said:
Yeah, people just wanna homebrew. Excuses are flimsy af. I'll bet this happens for a lot of people:

"I'm only using homebrew because the VC is taking so long to come out."

*VC comes out*

"I won't be buying these games on VC when I have them on homebrew already."
Click to expand...

How nice of you to visit us from the future. When exactly is Virtual Console releasing since you know so much?

Crazy it was up on Wii day one in 2006 and here we are, over 5 months into the Switch and Sonic is the only classic game on it :>
 
T

True Fire

Member
This isn't much of a problem. Switch will have killer features under subsequent firmware updates. In a few years 3.0.0 will be unplayable.
 
M

Maxinas

Member
Why are people making it seem like the Switch is suddenly going to stop selling games? Didn't stop the 3ds, ds, psp, ps3, and every other system that's been hacked. Pirates and cheaters make up like 0.01% of the userbase.

I'll admit i even homebrewed my 3ds because of how easy it is, yet i know friends who refuse to do it because they are scared of breaking something, or still think its too much effort.
 
popsicle_sundays

popsicle_sundays

Member
Awesome for homebrew but sucks for those of us that made JP accounts to download the MHXX demo :'(

Don't think I would have stuck on 3.0 for too long anyways, but it's easy to remorse in retrospect :)
 
T

TangoAlphaLima

Member
SinCityAssassin said:
With how fast the Switch is selling anyways, what are the chances new batches of Switches will probably already be updated to 3.0.1 anyways?
Click to expand...

Anything manufactured after the new firmware was released will have it, and many of the Switches owned by consumers will have already updated the firmware, so there won't be a whole lot that can even benefit from a potential exploit.
 
V

Vena

Member
Anth0ny said:
damn I think I updated to play sonic mania

come on homebrew people work your magic
Click to expand...

You won't be downgrading, 3.0.0 and under and basically entirely different beasts from 3.0.1 and forward. On top of that, the Switch is hardware protected from downgrading which is physical and short of modding the chip itself, you're not rolling back.

SinCityAssassin said:
With how fast the Switch is selling, what are the chances new batches of Switches will probably already be updated to 3.0.1 anyways?

Like after a while the only Switches left that wouldn't be upgraded are stock in overpriced countries.
Click to expand...

100%, but not in the current shipment.
 
Kikorin

Kikorin

Member
Counting an homebrew channel will take months if not years, there's no way I don't update for that much time. If someone is not interested at all in e-shop and online play, maybe could wait.
 
SinCityAssassin

SinCityAssassin

Member
Anth0ny said:
damn I think I updated to play sonic mania


come on homebrew people work your magic
Click to expand...
This particular exploit was scrubbed clean slate in 3.0.1 and the Switch has anti-downgrade fuses to prevent easy alteration or you either contact Nintendo by triggering it or it just bricks itself on its own.

So that'd be a while to overcome.
 
spons

spons

Gold Member
True Fire said:
This isn't much of a problem. Switch will have killer features under subsequent firmware updates. In a few years 3.0.0 will be unplayable.
Click to expand...

I'm sure someone will release custom firmware updates with security stripped out. This is the case for many systems with intricate software such as original Xbox and PS3.
 
M

MUnited83

For you.
Plum said:
Yeah, people just wanna homebrew. Excuses are flimsy af. I'll bet this happens for a lot of people:

"I'm only using homebrew because the VC is taking so long to come out."

*VC comes out*

"I won't be buying these games on VC when I have them on homebrew already."
Click to expand...

Considering how garbage VC usually is, you're better off with homebrew, so it's not really a "flimsy" excuse at all.

Not to mention that even when VC is out, Nintendo are still complete dumbasses that will take years upon years to release highly requested titles.
 
V

Vena

Member
spons said:
I'm sure someone will release custom firmware updates with security stripped out. This is the case for many systems with intricate software such as original Xbox and PS3.
Click to expand...

PS3 was locked to 3.55 effectively permanently if you wanted to use homebrew/hack access because, much as in the transition here from 3.0.0 to 3.0.1, a vast amount of the backend was changed to nullify the vulnerability. So new software/eshop calls will all be looking for completely different flags from what they were in 3.0.0.

You'd have to expect someone to code an entirely new firmware for this to work.
 
W

wrowa

Member
Maxinas said:
Why are people making it seem like the Switch is suddenly going to stop selling games? Didn't stop the 3ds, ds, psp, ps3, and every other system that's been hacked. Pirates and cheaters make up like 0.01% of the userbase.

I'll admit i even homebrewed my 3ds because of how easy it is, yet i know friends who refuse to do it because they are scared of breaking something, or still think its too much effort.
Click to expand...

DS actually suffered enormously from piracy. Game sales in Europe fell off a cliff and niche games (like everything from Atlus) stopped getting released here altogether. Same is true for PSP, actually.

Hacking never really became prelavent on Wii U (too late and who owned one anyway), 3DS (soft hacks also came in kinda late), PS3 (was difficult to hack for most of its time), though.
 
P

Plum

Member
pretty done said:
How nice of you to visit us from the future. When exactly is Virtual Console releasing since you know so much?

Crazy it was up on Wii day one in 2006 and here we are, over 5 months into the Switch and Sonic is the only classic game on it :>
Click to expand...

I don't know anything.

ViolentP said:
I mean, not justifying piracy here, but why would anyone pay for a game they already have?
Click to expand...

Well, yeah, there's no sensible reason, I was just talking about how flimsy and non-commital a lot of the excuses for piracy tend to be. Don't want to derail though so I'll stop here.
 
O

Omegasquash

Member
wrowa said:
The reason this time around is "I can finally back up my save files!". Sounds like a rather silly justification for what will eventually lead to piracy, but whatever floats your boat.
Click to expand...

Yeah people totally shell out somewhere around $100 to make ROMS and then distribute them, when you can find them easily pretty much anywhere on the internet.

But you're welcome to your opinion.
 
M

M3d10n

Member
spons said:
It's impossible to downgrade the Switch btw, just like the Xbox 360 it has hardware features to prevent that.



Source

eFUSE on Wikipedia
Click to expand...

Interesting, I didn't know about that. The cat-and-mouse hacking race on the 360 was fierce stuff. Interesting that Microsoft had such success warding off unsigned code execution but left a massive hole in the DVD drive that took ages to close down (somewhat).
 
W

wrowa

Member
Omegasquash said:
Yeah people totally shell out somewhere around $100 to make ROMS and then distribute them, when you can find them easily pretty much anywhere on the internet.

But you're welcome to your opinion.
Click to expand...

I have honestly no idea what you are referring to.
 
N

Naked Snake

Member
Damn, just updated the other day for Sonic Mania.
Worth it.

If I order a new one from Amazon today it would most likely be below 3.0.1, right?
 
spons

spons

Gold Member
Vena said:
PS3 was locked to 3.55 effectively permanently if you wanted to use homebrew/hack access because, much as in the transition here from 3.0.0 to 3.0.1, a vast amount of the backend was changed to nullify the vulnerability. So new software/eshop calls will all be looking for completely different flags from what they were in 3.0.0.

You'd have to expect someone to code an entirely new firmware for this to work.
Click to expand...

Yes, but PSP (Pro CFW, M33), PS3, original Xbox (Avalanche), Xbox 360 (DashLaunch) and even the 3DS in the form of a bootloader have custom firmwares. You can update to them and still access homebrew and games. So hack your 3.0.0 device and wait for someone to create update packages without certain security features to bog it down. This has happened plenty of times in the past.
 
SinCityAssassin

SinCityAssassin

Member
Naked Snake said:
Damn, just updated the other day for Sonic Mania.
Worth it.

If I order a new one from Amazon today it would most likely be below 3.0.1, right?
Click to expand...
If you hurry and don't want to buy it at that third party seller price, sure. That said it's apparent that the newer shipments after this week are more than likely going to be 3.0.1 or above on firmware.
 
P

Pif

Banned
spons said:
This is a leftover exploit from 3DS firmwares older than version 7. They fixed it years ago on those devices. So yes, it's stupid.
Click to expand...
Switch's OS is actually based on 3DS, Holy shit lol.

I always thought it was a stripped down wiiu for protection purposes.
 
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