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Mechazawa
Member
(09-23-2017, 10:50 AM)
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There is good news today.

And that good news is that Obsidian did not work on the South Park video game sequel.
soundscream
ATTN MEN: visually inspect your condom before disposal
Also GAF's leading millennial
(09-23-2017, 10:56 AM)
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Originally Posted by Mutombo

Jesus.

It seems we can only have Gamergaters on the one hand, and snowflakes on the other? Is there no middle ground possible where it's okay to laugh about (or okay to not laugh but also to not get so easily offended) about things?

Kanye started this; commodifying his dead mother by literally making a game about his mother's death. Once such a game is out in the open; it's out there to get played, it's out there to get criticized, and it's out there to be made fun of. If you didn't want others to get entertained by your mother's death, don't make a fucking video game about it.

As for making it better by not making it a black fish? Is this really still an issue with Trey and Matt? Seriously? They've been going at human stupidity for 20 years now. Surely their agenda must seem at least a bit progressive by now?

I dont give a damn about his mother being dead and being used in a joke.

But I am not ok with that black face shit in 2017.
Outtrigger888
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by soundscream

I dont give a damn about his mother being dead and being used in a joke.

But I am not ok with that black face shit in 2017.

How's it black face? His mother was black and the fish was black? Should they make her white and then what?

I'm asking how would you represent kanyes mom?
excelsiorlef
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:01 AM)
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Originally Posted by Outtrigger888

How's it black face? His mother was black and the fish was black? Should they make her white and then what?

Read the thread.

The face is blatant invocation of minstrelism
King Tubby
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by Gentleman Jack

Holy shit. What the fuck were they thinking?

Originally Posted by Outtrigger888

How's it black face? His mother was black and the fish was black? Should they make her white and then what?

I'm asking how would you represent kanyes mom?

Maybe not like this.

Seriously if you don't get it, just type "minstrelsy" into google images.
beelulzebub
Banned
(09-23-2017, 11:09 AM)

Originally Posted by Outtrigger888

How's it black face? His mother was black and the fish was black? Should they make her white and then what?

I'm asking how would you represent kanyes mom?

Not in a minstrel/Mammy way?

How has this thread been going all day and people are still asking this question?

Originally Posted by Mechazawa

There is good news today.

And that good news is that Obsidian did not work on the South Park video game sequel.

Amen to that.
Compsiox
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:10 AM)
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Well I see the marketing is working.

Not cool though.
soundscream
ATTN MEN: visually inspect your condom before disposal
Also GAF's leading millennial
(09-23-2017, 11:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by Outtrigger888

How's it black face? His mother was black and the fish was black? Should they make her white and then what?

I'm asking how would you represent kanyes mom?

These are 2 40+ year old Americans they know dam well what blackface imagery is. They could have made the fish green like Kanye was, or they could have removed the red lips, but they didn't because they knew what they were doing.

Edit: I wonderd why your name seemed familiar.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/search.p...rchid=31592175

No wonder you would defend this.
Darksol
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:30 AM)
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Loved the trailer - can't wait for this game!
Carl2291
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:38 AM)
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Probably day 1. Heres hoping they dont hold back on the humour to appease some people complaining online.
criesofthepast
Overdue ROH inductees:
Pavel Bure
Sergio Momesso
Kirk MacLean's wife
(09-23-2017, 11:46 AM)
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I don't watch the show much anymore but really enjoyed the first game so will get this eventually.
Claude Augario
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:54 AM)
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Originally Posted by Zaro

She should be green like Kanye, I don't have a PhD in being offended though.

I didn't realize you needed a doctorate now before your soul starts functioning.
Nzyme32
Member
(09-23-2017, 11:58 AM)
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I think many people are forgetting the Kanye "Gay Fish" joke stems from episodes of the show, so they look for a way to continue it - but the joke about the Kanye game was immediate, with both Matt and Trey tearing into the idea at the Ubi press conference
Mutombo
Member
(09-23-2017, 12:00 PM)
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If a black person is offended by a black fish representing a black person; than honestly; I take a few of my statements back. Making the fish green would've brought the same point home and not be needlessly offensive. I give you that.

I think some of the problems in this use of imagery come from the discrepancy between green fish kanye and black fish mom. Either both should've been green, or both should've been black?

The term black face is used for white people donning black faces; a make believe of being and appropriating black cultures. I'm not sure if the term can be used if a black person is doing black face?
Ladekabel
Member
(09-23-2017, 12:01 PM)
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By some of the posts in here I'm honestly not surprised any more that the video games community (self called "gamers") have a racism problem. And people wonder why "gamers" have it hard on Tinder.
IrishNinja
(09-23-2017, 12:03 PM)
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Originally Posted by StoOgE

How funny.

They brought back the super dated homophobic Kanye joke from 10+ years ago. Mixed it with a semen joke and then used it to make fun of Kanye's dead mom.

I think the older you get the more eye-rolling the "edgyness" of South Park becomes.

this is my exact take on the entire franchise, right here
i enjoyed the last game but this reeks of another rental-at-best
soundscream
ATTN MEN: visually inspect your condom before disposal
Also GAF's leading millennial
(09-23-2017, 12:07 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mutombo

If a black person is offended by a black fish representing a black person; than honestly; I take a few of my statements back. Making the fish green would've brought the same point home and not be needlessly offensive. I give you that.

I think some of the problems in this use of imagery come from the discrepancy between green fish kanye and black fish mom. Either both should've been green, or both should've been black?

The term black face is used for white people donning black faces; a make believe of being and appropriating black cultures. I'm not sure if the term can be used if a black person is doing black face?

Its not the fact the fish was black it was the racist they choose to portray her
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost...&postcount=655
NHarmonic.
Banned
(09-23-2017, 12:23 PM)

Originally Posted by Ladekabel

By some of the posts in here I'm honestly not surprised any more that the video games community (self called "gamers") have a racism problem. And people wonder why "gamers" have it hard on Tinder.

You should probably grab this kind of conclusions from the Pewdiepie threads, this is really mild in comparison to a guy yelling fucking n in a livestream watched by thousands of children and then being defended by youtuber cunts.

This is just southpark being southpark, as it's always been. People realizing the shit the show does, just now, it's really interesting.
Ladekabel
Member
(09-23-2017, 12:39 PM)
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Originally Posted by NHarmonic.

You should probably grab this kind of conclusions from the Pewdiepie threads, this is really mild in comparison to a guy yelling fucking n in a livestream watched by thousands of children and then being defended by youtuber cunts.

This is just southpark being southpark, as it's always been. People realizing the shit the show does, just now, it's really interesting.

I got to this conclusion quite a while ago but I'm always surprised that "gamers" want their hobby to be accepted in the main stream but always support homophobe, misogyny and racism.

I like South Park (at least older episodes) and while there was stuff that was questionable for me even back as a teen, I don't remember it this bad. Though I haven't seen much of the latest seasons but stuff like Cartman or Butters in racist Chinese costumes made sense to me in the context. But this is seems just mean spirited to Kanye West because he is an easy target that nerds on 9GAG and what other sites there are love to hate/make fun of.
Antiwhippy
the holder of the trombone
(09-23-2017, 12:44 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mutombo

If a black person is offended by a black fish representing a black person; than honestly; I take a few of my statements back. Making the fish green would've brought the same point home and not be needlessly offensive. I give you that.

I think some of the problems in this use of imagery come from the discrepancy between green fish kanye and black fish mom. Either both should've been green, or both should've been black?

The term black face is used for white people donning black faces; a make believe of being and appropriating black cultures. I'm not sure if the term can be used if a black person is doing black face?

I didn't know that the black fish was a black actor and not a cartoon caricature created by 2 white dudes.

The more you know.
NHarmonic.
Banned
(09-23-2017, 12:45 PM)

Originally Posted by Ladekabel

I got to this conclusion quite a while ago but I'm always surprised that "gamers" want their hobby to be accepted in the main stream but always support homophobe, misogyny and racism.

I like South Park (at least older episodes) and while there was stuff that was questionable for me even back as a teen, I don't remember it this bad. Though I haven't seen much of the latest seasons but stuff like Cartman or Butters in racist Chinese costumes made sense to me in the context. But this is seems just mean spirited to Kanye West because he is an easy target that nerds on 9GAG and what other sites there are love to hate/make fun of.

This is shitty, i agree. However Kanye has always been an easy target because he is fucking dumb and has said and done a lot of questionable shit, see Cosby, see Trump support, etc.

However you should rewatch southpark and see for yourself the kind of stuff they've done before. The F word episode, the trans episode with the dolphins, etc. I really like some episodes of the show ("You're getting old" it's such a beautiful piece of reflection in animation form) but their main appeal is generating fuzz, Trey and Matt love making people angry whatever the cost it takes. That's their way of doing comedy, and it's not new.
Harmen
Member
(09-23-2017, 01:01 PM)
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I like South Park and look forward to the game. But Matt and Trey sometimes definitely cross the line and this is, to me, clearly one of those cases. So yes, I agree with the criticism here.
VGdrumCovers
Member
(09-23-2017, 01:06 PM)
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Originally Posted by Harmen

I like South Park and look forward to the game. But Matt and Trey sometimes definitely cross the line and this is, to me, clearly one of those cases. So yes, I agree with the criticism here.

DoctorEkkoUK
Junior Member
(09-23-2017, 01:10 PM)
Can't wait for this game!
spindashing
Banned
(09-23-2017, 01:43 PM)
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Originally Posted by Nzyme32

I think many people are forgetting the Kanye "Gay Fish" joke stems from episodes of the show, so they look for a way to continue it - but the joke about the Kanye game was immediate, with both Matt and Trey tearing into the idea at the Ubi press conference

I don't think anyone is forgetting that dumb as fuck joke and they were more than welcome to joke about it, I'm sure even Kanye's best supporters see that game as weird.

Why the blackface, though? Why the Mammy portrayal?

Originally Posted by NHarmonic.

Kanye defense force is the reason. Suddenly it's not ok because this is dEEp for Kanye and shit. I mean Steve Irwin was depicted with the ray's sting crossing his heart, ffs.

If that is what your take is after all of these pages of conversation, then I feel sorry for you.
Beefy
Banned
(09-23-2017, 02:53 PM)

Originally Posted by Kuhn

How many of you that are mad with this, are actually black people?

What does it matter?
otakukidd
Member
(09-23-2017, 03:05 PM)
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The mammy stuff is super shitty. I'll probably bet they patch it out and just make the fish green. Unlike the show where they are all over it, this is a game they don't have a 100 involvement in and could see it slip by. I believe they came up with the idea but didn't come up with that design.
RumbleHumble
Banned
(09-23-2017, 03:15 PM)

Originally Posted by Carl2291

Probably day 1. Heres hoping they dont hold back on the humour to appease some people complaining online.

YEAH! MORE BLACK FACE PLZ! (You may not be intending it, but if you read the thread, it's how the comment looks on the outside.)

Originally Posted by NHarmonic.

This is shitty, i agree. However Kanye has always been an easy target because he is fucking dumb and has said and done a lot of questionable shit, see Cosby, see Trump support, etc.

However you should rewatch southpark and see for yourself the kind of stuff they've done before. The F word episode, the trans episode with the dolphins, etc. I really like some episodes of the show ("You're getting old" it's such a beautiful piece of reflection in animation form) but their main appeal is generating fuzz, Trey and Matt love making people angry whatever the cost it takes. That's their way of doing comedy, and it's not new.

First point: Kanye does dumb shit. Make fun of him for that. Please. By all means. Make fun of him for Cosby. Make fun of him for Trump. Go to town. But you make fun of him by depicting his mom as a "Mammy" with the only joke being "Lol look at Kanye's fucking black-ass Mammy lol", and that's some fucking dumb shit.

Second point: It's been addressed one billion times in this thread that South Park almost always uses offensive tropes or stereotypes to make a deeper point that "LOL STEREOTYPE". A prime example (and one of my favorites) is the Special Olympics episode dealing with Jimmy's doping habit. What could've been just a whole bunch of route bullshit turned into something far better because Matt and Trey wanted to do way more than just write: "LOL HANDICAPS!".

I grew up with South Park and idoled Matt and Trey for years. I know they're better than this level of fucking bullshit.
Rumblebones
Banned
(09-23-2017, 03:30 PM)
Lame jokes and making fun of someone's dead mother.

Great.
Ninja Scooter
bow down to the
Kings in Raider hats
(09-23-2017, 04:14 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mutombo

If a black person is offended by a black fish representing a black person; than honestly; I take a few of my statements back. Making the fish green would've brought the same point home and not be needlessly offensive. I give you that.

I think some of the problems in this use of imagery come from the discrepancy between green fish kanye and black fish mom. Either both should've been green, or both should've been black?

The term black face is used for white people donning black faces; a make believe of being and appropriating black cultures. I'm not sure if the term can be used if a black person is doing black face?

What in the fuck are you talking about? I guess this:

Isn't offensive since it's portraying a black person and not a white person in makeup? Do you realize how stupid that sounds?

Racist cartoonish characitures of black people go back centuries.
snowmint
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:28 PM)
I thought it was a reference to the Disney movie little mermaid blackfish.
Trup1aya
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:34 PM)

Originally Posted by Bitch Pudding

This is not about if the joke was funny or not - it was not - but that actually doesn't matter one bit, as there's no such thing as a funny racist joke.

This is about a racist and furthermore inadequate and offensive joke, and South Park has a well documented history of those, so I wonder why this one in particular makes people break with the show.

I dunno, i generally get the humor. The absurdity racism is usually the butt of the joke.

In this case, the joke is that she's a black mother.
Berserking Guts
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:35 PM)
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Already pre-ordered, can't wait.
grosvenor_92
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:36 PM)
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If it's as good as Stick of Truth I'm happy although I didn't find the trailer that funny
Yukinari
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:37 PM)
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Everyone who doesnt wanna support a game for whatever reason is in their right as a consumer to do so.

But its just crazy to think that all it took is one trailer to cause a shift like this. A trailer they didnt have to make.
Godzilla's Left Toe
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:42 PM)
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Is Kanye kinda of a dick? Yes. Does he deserve to have his Dead Mother insulted? No.
Devilinthiscity
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:45 PM)
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Originally Posted by Yukinari

Everyone who doesnt wanna support a game for whatever reason is in their right as a consumer to do so.

But its just crazy to think that all it took is one trailer to cause a shift like this. A trailer they didnt have to make.

Well if you compare it to the Stick of Truth trailer this goes full edge lord South Park. I haven’t been really feeling the direction of the game since that Ubisoft reveal at E3. I remember the Giantbomb crew were pretty down on it too and if I recall a lot of them liked the Stick of Truth.
WrenchNinja
Member
(09-23-2017, 04:54 PM)
Unfunny racist trash.
Gattsu25
Banned
(09-23-2017, 04:58 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mechazawa

There is good news today.

And that good news is that Obsidian did not work on the South Park video game sequel.

Yeah, good point.
L Thammy
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:00 PM)
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I'm kind of curious as to what the reaction would be if Trey and Matt made an actual minstrel show. Not a subversive one, but made a straight up 1800s style "look at how dumb black people are, man, don't you miss slavery" thing with a cast of all white actors covered in greasepaint. If people saw that, how would they defend that? Would it be something like:
"It's so ridiculous that I just took it as a joke."

"Sorry, I have no empathy for people with thin skin."

"Trey and Matt have a long history proving that they're liberals."

"They make fun of everyone."

"They've been doing this for years. I can't believe people are still upset about it now."

"Who determines what you can and can't make fun of? Where do you draw the line?"

"How many of you that are upset are actually black?"

"It's okay because it's making fun of Kanye West."

"I don't have a PhD in being offended."

"The actors painted their entire bodies instead of just their face so it isn't blackface."
Why wouldn't those same statements show up then?
Yohane
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:10 PM)
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Is that Kanye West? Lmao
TZchassis
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by blly155

omg i need this game right now.

come on… come on…
JABEE
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:15 PM)
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That was definitely some minstrel, Gone With The Wind "mammy" shit. The design of the character and the lines.

It's fucked up. It looks like someone trying to use ancient blackface humor and get away with it because it is a cartoon.

On the other hand, I can't help but feel like using it in the promotional material of the game is a calculated decision made by whoever signs off on the marketing plans for this game.
t hicks
Banned
(09-23-2017, 05:22 PM)
the Kanye shit is fucking gross man
Wubbyz
Junior Member
(09-23-2017, 05:34 PM)
Hopefully this game is as dope as the first.
hbkdx12
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:39 PM)
Even ignoring where people's sensibilities lie and whether or not you find this offensive, it's comical that people are really standing on the mantle of 'it could just be a fish who happens to be black'

Really, people?

Everytime i see someone defend some egregiously racially insensitive shit i think of this:



and instead change Ja Rule with boogie
Maligna
Banned
(09-23-2017, 05:41 PM)
Fish had the exact same voice as Chef's mother.
Space_nut
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:42 PM)
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I love this shit
Linkura
Member
(09-23-2017, 05:56 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mechazawa

There is good news today.

And that good news is that Obsidian did not work on the South Park video game sequel.

Dodged a bullet.
packy34
Member
(09-23-2017, 06:01 PM)
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Originally Posted by Mechazawa

There is good news today.

And that good news is that Obsidian did not work on the South Park video game sequel.

Wait what

How and why is that a good thing

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