Starchasing
Member
ChryZ said:
Mario and Sonic at the Olimpycs
Red Steel
Rayman ravids
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SALES-AGE: Why Wii will be getting Japanese exclusives (but not Western!)
- Thread starter PantherLotus
- Start date
Mario and Sonic at the Olimpycs
Red Steel
Rayman ravids
ChryZ said:
As if such an argument is really fair to say. The day people who use your line can show me a well developed, marketed, and budgeted this might actually be a fair argument. It was true when wii launched, when gc launched, or for that matter when n64 launch. Publishers want sales then they can market and build stuff for nintendo consumers that most of us want, funny enough it hasn't been since the snes where my 1st party out numbered my 3rd party collection.
maniac-kun
Member
i think the ps3 will see its sales when its at a 200 price (maybe in 2-3 years) and still could be nr.1 at the end of the generation but not with a huge difference like in the last gen maybe the ps3 ends up at 55 million the wii with 45 million and the 360 with 39 million
poppabk
Cheeks Spread for Digital Only Future
But the upgrade has to allow you to do new things, not just make the graphics look closer to real life. The PS1 didn't just add more sprite handling capabilities and increased parallax scrolling - the increase in power allowed a move from mainly 2D games to 3D games. The increased power of the PS2 allowed for a game like GTAIII.virtuafightermaster said:
Things like the euphoria and DMM engines in the 360/PS3 version of Force unleashed are going to demonstrate some potential new avenues in games that are only open to the more powerful consoles.
Honestly Id rather play the wiiware game.KTallguy said:The thing is, what KIND of exclusives?
Do you want to play this:
Or do you want to play this:
From what I've seen from Wii console exclusives, Japanese companies have been tailoring their experiences to the supposed audiences of the system.
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
All I know is that if FFXIII is anything like XII, then I want nothing to do with it.
And you should at least compare Crystal Bearers instead of the 40mb download Wiiware title.
worst FF game I have ever played
And you should at least compare Crystal Bearers instead of the 40mb download Wiiware title.
The wii got the casuals right? They're the largest userbase and they grow the quickest right? So why would anyone believe that as far as hardware numbers go wii isn't simple going to stay ahead, especially when nintendo continues to have games like wiifit and such?
Also I love it win people throw their opinion/personal tastes(not that I don't expect a little) into sales threads(wiisport shouldn't be counted, game I like is a big exclusive, etc).
Also I love it win people throw their opinion/personal tastes(not that I don't expect a little) into sales threads(wiisport shouldn't be counted, game I like is a big exclusive, etc).
virtuafightermaster
Banned
vanguardian1 said:
Come on, FF12 is awesome, it had weak story, character, music, but the gameplay is absolutely the best. Now, I can't stand random battle RPG anymore, I wish they can remake all FF with FF12 battle system.
vanguardian1 said:All I know is that if FFXIII is anything like XII, then I want nothing to do with it.worst FF game I have ever played
.
Heh and I thought Square couldn't top the crap that was VIII. Well they proved me wrong and release X-2 and I would sooner play 8 and X-2 before I play the crap Square calls FFXII. So why am I so excited to play FFXIII? Because I'm a final fantasy whore unfortunately.
GitarooMan
Member
Uh, one major point of the thread is that 360 + PS3 > Wii in NA and many devs might look at that to decide on development. So even assuming it stays ahead I think it's a safe bet it won't get broad PS2-levels of software support.Linkup said:
cortland_andrus
Banned
Just another uninformed noob that doesn't know how to look at the big picture, so he doesn't understand or even take into consideration what the console landscape will look like over the next couple of years as the PS3 and 360 slowly march upwards to millions of units in the 20's, and then possibly 30 million+ range, while the Wii continues to skyrocket to numbers of 100 million+ units.
He also doesn't seem to understand how long development lead times take. The Wii became well known as this gen's monster, and market leader as sales continued to dominate through early to middle 2007. Developers haven't had huge profiles of Wii games in development for more than a year. We won't even start to see these big development loads start to come to fruition until this holiday season, and beyond, into 2009. It takes time to switch focus, plan and start projects, and then see them through past development to publishing and marketing. You also don't seem to realize what the 360's launch and development cycle headstart has done to manipulate the short term console landscape.
Most of the games being released now, or late last year were in development well before the Wii launched, or even was known to be such a hit. The one big main thing that is supposed to happen with big software advantages is not only not happening with the 360-- snowball effect with the installed base, but it is actually going backwards -- 8.9 million in 2006 to 7.3 million in 2007, despite also have Halo 3 and big price drops. Now look at how it has slipped to third in the last two months. Look at its horrible presence in both Europe and Japan. The 360 will be known as a system that developers could sell games on in the early part of the generation. As console sales slide, and the competition continues to go up, trends will change.
I'm sure when the Wii has an installed base in a couple of years in the 100 million range, with the 360 skidding to a halt at 30 million, then developers are going to choose the latter over the former.
He also doesn't seem to understand how long development lead times take. The Wii became well known as this gen's monster, and market leader as sales continued to dominate through early to middle 2007. Developers haven't had huge profiles of Wii games in development for more than a year. We won't even start to see these big development loads start to come to fruition until this holiday season, and beyond, into 2009. It takes time to switch focus, plan and start projects, and then see them through past development to publishing and marketing. You also don't seem to realize what the 360's launch and development cycle headstart has done to manipulate the short term console landscape.
Most of the games being released now, or late last year were in development well before the Wii launched, or even was known to be such a hit. The one big main thing that is supposed to happen with big software advantages is not only not happening with the 360-- snowball effect with the installed base, but it is actually going backwards -- 8.9 million in 2006 to 7.3 million in 2007, despite also have Halo 3 and big price drops. Now look at how it has slipped to third in the last two months. Look at its horrible presence in both Europe and Japan. The 360 will be known as a system that developers could sell games on in the early part of the generation. As console sales slide, and the competition continues to go up, trends will change.
I'm sure when the Wii has an installed base in a couple of years in the 100 million range, with the 360 skidding to a halt at 30 million, then developers are going to choose the latter over the former.
This is the most screwed definition of "exclusive" I've ever seen. A PS3/360 "exclusive" game is any game that isn't on Wii, regardless of being multiplatform. While a Wii "exclusive" has to be truly exclusive and appeal to ones own personal tastes. I've seen plenty of people imply this definition in the past, but to see it actually spelled out and still defended is just... "WOW!"PantherLotus said:
poppabk said:
I was just demonstrating how a big bugeted game like COD4 could make more money than a ultra low budgeted game on the DS despite selling less and costing way more. Obviously real pubs don't choose one over the other. They release maybe 2-3 big budget games a year, supported by dozens of low-mid budget releases.
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
virtuafightermaster said:
You can keep it, the difficulty of the game was because of the battle system far more than any other factor involved. And I'd also agree about the other disappointing elements of the game.
Redd said:
I still am a partial fan of the final fantasy franchise, but the *only* ones I'm looking at closely now are the Crystal Chronicles games as well as Tactics A2. The FF games have almost always been my main series on consoles. Thankfully for last-gen jrpg's I was saved by Skies of Arcadia, Suikoden V, Tales of Symphonia, Grandia II, Xenosaga III, and am enjoying Vakyrie Profile 2.
maniac-kun
Member
you cant see into the future so cant i. maybe one of the consoles stops selling at some point because some megaton game was released or a meteor hits nintendo and sony will be destroyed by a vulcano.cortland_andrus said:
virtuafightermaster
Banned
If some company really want to make a big name game for Wii such as VF6, Tekken 6, MGS5, DMC5 on wii. People would expect them match the greatness those games on PS3 or 360, it is just not possible given people already played those kind of games on PS360.
Only real good exclusive games for Wii will come from Nintendo only probably.
Only real good exclusive games for Wii will come from Nintendo only probably.
Starchasing
Member
cortland_andrus said:
There will be so many meltdowns when that starts to happen...
Mithos Yggdrasill
Banned
borghe said:
Good post. I second that.
Agent Icebeezy
Welcome beautful toddler, Madison Elizabeth, to the horde!
madara said:
Those who have a 360 aren't crying.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
I've avoided posting here because the insuing discussion is FAR greater than I could have expected and I don't want to potentially derail it with opinions that won't stand up nearly as well as analysis. Excellent posts by many here. But:
I agree actually. I'm using the accepted gafism of "exclusives" = "exclusives that matter to Gaf." The underlying assumption of ALL of those assumptions is thus:
[ ] That this analysis and definitions therein are tailored towards GAF for the purposes of discussion.
(adding to the OP)
JJConrad said:
I agree actually. I'm using the accepted gafism of "exclusives" = "exclusives that matter to Gaf." The underlying assumption of ALL of those assumptions is thus:
[ ] That this analysis and definitions therein are tailored towards GAF for the purposes of discussion.
(adding to the OP)
there are a number of games out already that show that you can take established genres and make them work with the remote/nunchuk.
that said, for most franchises, a new version would have to be completely redone/redesigned/etc to be unequivocally *better* than the previous version.
the remote needs to be considered during basic game design: you've got to deal with possibilities of motion controls, the pointer, and a substantial reduction in accessible buttons compared to other controllers. even things like metroid, which seems like a natural fit for the pointer, needed to use some unfortunate buttons in order to keep the design similar to previous entries.
that said, for most franchises, a new version would have to be completely redone/redesigned/etc to be unequivocally *better* than the previous version.
the remote needs to be considered during basic game design: you've got to deal with possibilities of motion controls, the pointer, and a substantial reduction in accessible buttons compared to other controllers. even things like metroid, which seems like a natural fit for the pointer, needed to use some unfortunate buttons in order to keep the design similar to previous entries.
ChryZ said:
Well according to numbers we received ages ago...
-Super Monkey Ball
-Sonic and the Secret Rings
-Rayman
-Red Steel
-Tiger Woods 07
-Madden 07
-Tiger Woods 08
-Madden 08
-Fifa 08
-Pirates of the Carribean
-Harry Potter
-Game Party
-Carnival Games
-The Bigs
-Family Ski
-Umbrella Chronicles
-RE4
-Dragon Quest Swords
-No More Heroes
-WCW
-PDC darts game
-One Piece
-Dragon Ball Z 2
-Dragon Ball Z 3
All those games have sold better than Donkey Kong Jet Race, Fire Emblem and Endless Ocean.
I'm probably missing heaps more but ye...theres a short list of 3rd party successes.
1 million sales != number for success
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
Agent Icebeezy said:
I would be, considering Eternal Sonata is the only 360 jrpg I want right now.
I will note that the one thing that seems to be missing in the disccusion here is the case of the PS3 or 360 exclusive. If we're going to argue that Western third party games will never be exclusive to Wii due to Wii < 360 + PS3, shouldn't that mean that outside of monetary compensation, there will never be a third party game exclusive to 360 or PS3 once Wii > 360 and Wii > PS3?
Starchasing
Member
before i bail out all i want to say is:
Look at the DS and how it evolved
When the DS and PSP were launched did anyone expect Contra 4 or Etrian odissey to be released on the DS?
What about DQ IX?
Same thing will happen to wii
Look at the DS and how it evolved
When the DS and PSP were launched did anyone expect Contra 4 or Etrian odissey to be released on the DS?
What about DQ IX?
Same thing will happen to wii
OldJadedGamer
Banned
Innotech said:
I didn't want to admit it but me too.
no offense, but a land of generic and pedestrian jrpgs ain't much better than a land of no rpgs. a little, I'll spot you that, but not much. It's akin to telling me I can only paint with white, or I can paint with both white and off-white.Agent Icebeezy said:
BishopLamont
Banned
ChryZ said:
Guitar Hero 3 (Activision)
RE4:Wii, RE:UC (Capcom)
Carnival Games (Take-Two)
No More Heroes (Grasshopper/Suda51)
Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games (Sega)
Rayman Raving Rabbids, Red Steel (Ubisoft)
MySims (EA)
Lego Star Wars (LucasArts)
Cooking Mama (Majesco)
Damn you Lobster.
So? The argument is that third parties can't find success on the Wii, and that's false.LCGeek said:
armchairANALystdoodle.jpgmaniac-kun said:
virtuafightermaster
Banned
borghe said:
But xbox 360 has a ton of Western RPGs that are really good.
the quote in my post was jrpgs.... but even western RPGs you are left with Obvlivion, Mass Effect, and again a bunch of generic pedestrian boring efforts. granted I'm not complaining. RPGs are ALWAYS slow to consoles thanks to development time of a game of such length. I was just more commenting on the attempted troll that the 360 is somehow a fountain of RPG goodness... no current gen console is.virtuafightermaster said:
vanguardian1
poor, homeless and tasteless
If you have access to a good PC, the console version of Oblivion is a complete joke. And I look forward to trying Mass Effect.
virtuafightermaster
Banned
borghe said:
Sacred 2 is coming, should be very good game, Fable 2, Fallout 3 this year too. More than I can ask for. So what protential AAA RPGs are coming out for Wii this year?
BishopLamont
Banned
Yes all 20 million Wii owners should just defy logic, taste and sense and go buy every single third party title. :lolChryZ said:
Seriously why do people expect third party titles to sell more then they do just because it's on the Wii.
virtuafightermaster
Banned
BishopLamont said:
Out of those games, I don't think any can be called big name games other than GH3 or maybe No More Heroes.
If you have Both Wii or PS360, did you buy GH3 on Wii instead of PS360?
sakuragi said:So when will they release those big games for the Wii? in 2010? Resident evil 6 Wii 2010 and FF14 in 2012 confirmed
I think we should expect big games in 2009 and 2010 yes. 2008 not so much maybe. There still could be some cool projects like No More Heroes or Bloom Blox but for the most part I don't expect a Final Fantasy or Metal Gear budget game to come to the Wii before 09.
And obviously, since its the most succesfull console ever, it will last that long.
but this stupid argument can be made for the 360 as well. :\ChryZ said:
The fact has been pretty well illustrated that companies that have put modest efforts into development AND marketing on Wii have been rewarded with decent sales. If you don't market it or it sucks, you're not going to see sales.
And the complaint "What 3rd party games receive as strong of sales as first party" completely glosses over the related question "how many 3rd party 360 and PS3 games see as strong of sales as nintendo first party games?".
Really, the sales argument is just stupid. You get what you give. If you don't give shit for an effort you won't get shit back.
I count games that are out or known as being close to going gold. everything else is subject to delays.virtuafightermaster said:
But why do they have to be big names? Isn't it acceptable for NEW TITLES to have great sales also? I mean does the top 10 or top 20 really need to be packed with sequels every month in and out? Personally I don't think Capcom cares if their next million seller on Wii is RE6 or Bud's Road Trip The Game. They are in it to entertain and make money. This thought that a system NEEDS the FFs and Halos and MGSes and so forth is exactly what the Wii is eschewing as we speak. Obviously a system DOESN'T need those games to a) sell hardware and b) sell software.virtuafightermaster said:
virtuafightermaster
Banned
ksamedi said:
I would believe if a game is exclusive for Wii it would be some kind of spinoff game like Soul Calibur Legend, or complete new game designed for Wii. If you expecting RE6, MGS5, NG3, not going to happen.
virtuafightermaster
Banned
Salazar said:
I want it to be good too, I spent like 100 hours on Scared 1, I sure hope it doesn't suck.
maniac-kun
Member
if only sega could do a sonic jumpn run in the quality of super mario galaxy and the awesomness of sonic 1 & 2... but that day will never come (but it would fit perfectly on the wii)
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