RedlineRonin
Member
Are there measurements on the site right now that are wrong?
Who does better TV reviews?
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Television Displays and Technology Thread: This is a fantasy based on OLED
- Thread starter BumRush
- Start date
Are there measurements on the site right now that are wrong?
Who does better TV reviews?
Nothing, really. They are one of the go-to resources for TV reviews online (think Cnet may still be bigger?) and are well-respected on AVSForum and elsewhere. I do find it odd how they attempt to make product reviews objective rather than subjective with their numerical scores and weighted tally but I get the point of this. I've used them, along with other sources, for my last three TV purchases.
RTINGS has caused plenty of heartburn online because, for certain brands, the advantages are more subject to personal opinion (processing and aspects of motion handling with regards to interpolation). For instance, they rate the Sony Z9D and A1E below the LG OLEDs for 2017 and even comparing the LG 2016 models, which many people would probably disagree with due to Sony's processing. When you see criticism of the site, just be careful of the source's agenda if they don't provide specifics.
Theonik
Member
Insane Metal
Member
I really like Rtings overall. I just don't agree with their (ha!) ratings system, but I enjoy their articles and stuff.
Stiler
Member
Yes, you can do a 5.1.2 setup with atmos.
I'm currently using a 5.1.4 setup myself.
RedlineRonin
Member
Why don't they have anything for the 2017 Samsung's? (or maybe I'm missing them...)
How dark does it have to be to enjoy the HDR on an OLED? I live on the third floor of an apartment with lots of windows. At night, when I will mostly use it, it gets pretty dark but there's always some ambient light filtering in from the street and through the shades. I'd imagine it would be OK but some people make it seem like you need pitch black to make it worth it.
RedAssedApe
Banned
It doesn't have to be that dark. Low to medium light is fine. Ambient light won't be a problem. I'd only concern myself with it if the room gets a lot of sunlight, especially if it will be facing the TV screen. In that case, you would maybe want to consider something with a higher brightness than what some of the OLEDs are doing right now.
RedAssedApe
Banned
yup...my kuro was horrid for daytime viewing because it just couldn't get bright enough to overcome the glare. it was fine on overcast or after the sun went down though.
kind of why i haven't jumped on the oled bandwagon yet. i don't necessarily watch movies during the day but i do play games.
Spartancarver
Member
Weren't you the one saying OLEDs had bad viewing angles?
That site you're linking to says they're basically perfect.
LG E6 and Dolby Vision works perfectly thru the Netflix TV App. And it runs ARC to the receiver.
I don't have Atmos Speakers either, but it runs my Onkyo 7.1 speakers great. And that's exactly why I got the 1070 instead of the 1080. The only difference besides being newer is the Atmos feature. I have both my PS4 Pro and XB1 S connected to my tv thru my AVR. Every thing passes thru great, HDR works perfect on both consoles and no noticeable lag. The only thing I can't get passed thru is the HDR from my PC to my TV. I've tried everything and it won't work at all. (NVIDIA 970 via HDMI to AVR) The PC does connect to the TV in 4K though. And while installing the lastest creator update on Windows 10. I noticed the tv went to HDR while installing. But since then the HDR setting in Windows does nothing. When switching it on and off. The 3D feature does work though.
So can some of you help educate me with HDMI ARC. I never used ARC before and realized both my TV and receiver have ARC support. I feel dumb for not realizing ARC stands for Audio Return Channel, but whatevs. So right now I run streaming apps like Netflix, Vudu, and Amazon off my C7 TV and have 5.1 audio via optical input on my av receiver. All my other devices are connected to my Yamaha receiver and I have one optical cable going from my receiver for TV apps. I noticed on my C7 HDMI 2 is the ARC port. So I'm guessing this is how I transmit an Atmos signal from my tv to receiver? Turn on ARC on both devices and then I can have digital audio sent from the hdmi2 port on my tv back to my receiver? Additionally, since I'm only using one hdmi cable from my receiver to TV does this mean all audio signals are going to attempt to run through my TV first and then sent back to the receiver? I really only want to use ARC for Atmos support for streaming apps I run from my TV.
Well then you should be fine then since the TV is doing the processing. I thought perhaps you were trying to set up another device and run it through the receiver first and pass it through to the TV. The receiver doesn't support Dolby Vision pass through so if you get a 4k blu ray player you will have to hook it up directly to the TV.
Well then you should be fine then since the TV is doing the processing. I thought perhaps you were trying to set up another device and run it through the receiver first and pass it through to the TV. The receiver doesn't support Dolby Vision pass through so if you get a 4k blu ray player you will have to hook it up directly to the TV.
RedlineRonin
Member
Will be very curious if this works on your Yamaha. I'm not sure if Atmos via ARC is standard on most AVRs or not.
E: Looks like Atmos via DD+ (lower bitrate) is supported but TrueHD based (higher bitrate) Atmos is only supported via HDMI 2.1
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Interesting. And the Atmos speakers add a lot compared to basic 5.1, even though you're missing the rear channels? If I were to go this route, I'd definitely have to get up-firing Atmos speakers.
Cool, thanks. Just gotta decide if future-proofing myself with Atmos by getting the 1080 is worth the extra monkey.
How many monkeys we talking?
RedlineRonin
Member
Prolly two chimps at least
RoadHazard
Gold Member
The price difference is around 3000 SEK ($360-ish) right now, but it seems like the 1080 isn't available from all that many Swedish retailers yet, so hopefully this will improve. Still, this shit is expensive as SHIT here. I see that in the US you can get the 1080 for $500-600. Here it's 8000 SEK ($970). Like, wow.
But looking a bit more at what the 1080 does over the 1070, it's actually not just Atmos. Two rather interesting features are phantom back speakers (simulating 7.1 with a 5.1 setup) and virtual speaker repositioning (which supposedly works rather convincingly). I'm restricted to a 5.1 physical setup in my space, since my couch is up against the back wall, so if this stuff works well it could be quite a bonus for me. And then I could add two upfiring reflecting Atmos speakers to get the full (well, virtual) 7.1.2 experience.
Hmmhmm.
Theonik
Member
They have a relatively low volume of reviews they do though they recently started doing more video reviews. In return they produce quality editorial and well written in depth reviews.
?
I didn't say they were bad, of course they aren't perfect and viewing angles are a very iffy thing to measure and depend largely on how you determine them. LG's WRGB OLED panels have very big viewing cones when it comes to brightness shift (~160º) whereas they will colour shift at ~60º. Ultimately that will be sufficient for most viewing especially if you are using larger panels. It is something people should be aware of. Most VA panels produce somewhat narrower but still sufficient viewing cones at about 50º for both brightness and colour shift. What you notice more is somewhat objective. The problem with how Rtings approaches that problem is they try to extract a number out of all this which isn't reflective of the real usecase.
Theonik
Member
A splitter won't work because it will play with the HDMI handshake information and fall back to the lowest common denominator i.e. what the receiver supports. Also, I haven't seen any splitter that works with HDMI 2.1 and HDCP 2.2 yet.
You will need to upgrade your receiver or look to get a newer player. That's why any decent AV device/player will come with 2 HDMI ports one only for audio.
As for ARC that won't do what you want depending on your problem. For up to and including HDMI 2.0 the way ARC works is it opens a single SPDIF link with your TV and the bandwidth restricts it to either 2.0 LPCM or 6ch DD/DTS, that's fine for it's intended use which is Freeview Television but not so great if you want to get surround sound out of your PS4.
Ugh, I have a Xbox 1 S and a soon to be 1 X. But with neither supporting Dolby Vision, (right now) I guess my AVR will last me a few years. I just wish AVRs were more future proof than they are now. I've been thru three AVRs in the last 5 years. And are still on my original speakers.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
The fact that Sony's TVs don't do Atmos doesn't really matter, right? Even if they did (with Netflix, for example), there would be no way of getting that Atmos audio to a receiver, since HDMI ARC doesn't support it? I'm just thinking about what I could really do with an Atmos-enabled AVR. Guess I would need to get a dedicated BD player for it. Or my PS4, but that doesn't do 4K BD. And for Netflix it doesn't do Atmos. Which I don't really get, since the XBO does. So I have no way of getting Netflix with Atmos. It's only on a few titles for now, but that should be going up. Wonder if the Chromecast Ultra will/can be updated to support it. But man, part of the reason why I want a Sony is because of Android TV and all the apps that comes with, so I don't have to use dongles anymore. But those apps will never give let me take full advantage of an Atmos AVR. Sigh.
EDIT: Wait, the Z9 does pass Atmos via the ARC? But not the X900E, right...?
EDIT: Wait, the Z9 does pass Atmos via the ARC? But not the X900E, right...?
I'll give it a try then when I get my Atmos speakers.
Yeah it sucks but Dolby Vision is still new. I'm still holding out hope MS updates Xbox with Dolby Vision as they did update with Atmos support recently. If they don't update to Dolby Vision I'm getting rid of my Xbox One for a 4k uhd player that supports the format.
Regarding receivers, not sure what Sony is doing but a couple manufacturers are updating their lines with Dolby Vision support late 2017/early 2018. Denon and Marantz 2016 and 2017 models are getting updates:
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-re...rs/2815193-pass-through-dolby-vision-hdr.html
No specifics on which ones, so maybe all?
Certain Yamaha models are getting updates as well:
http://www.avsforum.com/yamaha-firm...on-hdr-tidal-deezer-streaming-to-select-avrs/
Sony hasn't really said anything so maybe they will offer a firmware update? Dunno if you can swap out your Sony with another model if you want DV pass through. Can you just use ARC to get audio? For example have your 4k uhd blu ray player in HDMI1 of the TV and then use ARC to send digital audio back to your receiver? I'm not sure if that's how ARC works.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Sony STR-DN1080 is being updated with DV later this year. Not the 1070 I believe.
MosquitoSmasher
Member
I was mostly referring to another forum where people are complaining. Sadly it's a very real issue for my B6 as well. Gears 4 was ridiculously dim with HDR Game mode. Ratchet and Clank too and that game doesn't even have a brightness slider, so basically you're fucked. Horizon ZD was way too dim as well. Contrast and OLED light both were are max.
For games like Skyrim SE and Fallout 4 it's really going to suck because these games don't have a brightness slider.
RedlineRonin
Member
Anyone using ARC with their C7?
Mine seems to really not one the "auto" setting. Everything works fine when it's set to "PCM", but for some reason I got audio dropouts every three to five seconds when it's set to auto (bitstream).
When the Anthem shows the bit rate when sound is working it's really really low also (32kbps).
Hmmmmm
Mine seems to really not one the "auto" setting. Everything works fine when it's set to "PCM", but for some reason I got audio dropouts every three to five seconds when it's set to auto (bitstream).
When the Anthem shows the bit rate when sound is working it's really really low also (32kbps).
Hmmmmm
Kleegamefan
K. LEE GAIDEN
Paramount just announced support for dolby vision uhd blu ray
http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1500554934
http://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=1500554934
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Hmmmmm... According to this reference guide for the Sony X900E, it supports up to DD+ over ARC. Unless I'm mistaken, that should mean that there isn't any technical reason why it couldn't also do lossy Atmos. Seems like Netflix (for example) would just have to support it in their Android TV app. They do support it on LG's 2017 OLEDs, in this exact way (with lossy DD+, since lossless isn't supported through ARC until HDMI 2.1). So do they just have some weird exclusivity deal?
Stiler
Member
Atmos basically creates a bubble-like sound to it, gives things height, overhead, etc.
The main drawback is that not a ton of things are in Atmos (yet) but luckily most 4k movies are also getting Atmos included so it's constantly growing.
There are also some games that support it, like Battlefront/Battlefield 1.
I Eat Thumbtacks
Neo Member
I just got an OLED B6 from Fry's for $1200. XD
Now why isn't YouTube showing in HDR?
Now why isn't YouTube showing in HDR?
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Games are a very interesting use case for it for sure. But some Googling tells me the PS4 (and Pro) doesn't support it? Very odd, as it DOES support it on BDs. But of course it doesn't do 4K BD, so that's not super interesting.
But now that my eyes (ears) have been opened up to the fact that I could actually do a reasonable 5.1.2 Atmos setup (I previously thought you basically needed full 7.1 + Atmos speakers for it), I would really like to ensure I can do streaming with it as well, since I do a lot of that. Netflix has started adding Atmos to some of their content, and that's only gonna increase. And if I get a new TV, I would like to take advantage of the apps on it. Currently, the Sonys don't do Atmos over ARC, for some reason I don't understand. If LG can do it, so can Sony (lossy DD+ Atmos). And then there's HDMI 2.1, which will enable lossless Atmos over ARC. My slightly annoying situation is that I really need to get both a new TV and a receiver. And how fun if I get them now, and then next year's models all support HDMI 2.1. Then I can't just replace one of them, but have to replace both if I want to take advantage of that.
This is all gonna end up with me not getting anything, even though I seriously need the upgrade. Sigh.
Yappadappadu
Member
Because the B6 lacks the necessary hardware to support VP9.2 for Youtube HDR.
Among the 2016 sets only the G6 does.
Among the 2016 sets only the G6 does.
jstevenson
Sailor Stevenson
And with that only 20th Century's fox has yet to commit to dolby vision on UHD.
Terrific stuff. Dolby Vision going software solution has quickly and swiftly brought its adoption
I Eat Thumbtacks
Neo Member
Damn, I thought it had that. Oh well, no biggie.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
Aaand that's making me think I should go for the X930E over the X900E just for that reason, even though the 900 seems to be a much better value overall.
Just need Sony to update their X800 player with DV for me to jump in.
Is Disney supporting Dolby Vision on disc? Guardians 2 won't have DV on disc.
I figured Dolby wouldn't let themselves get pushed out. Especially with the Atmos push they are also starting. I know it's not identical but marketing can start to happen to get the "theater experience" at home with Atmos and Dolby Vision. A year from now hopefully DV will be included with every hdr movie.
I figured Dolby wouldn't let themselves get pushed out. Especially with the Atmos push they are also starting. I know it's not identical but marketing can start to happen to get the "theater experience" at home with Atmos and Dolby Vision. A year from now hopefully DV will be included with every hdr movie.
Does Dolby Vision discs also contain support for HDR10?
Is there any chance that X900E will get the support for YouTube HDR?
Is there any chance that X900E will get the support for YouTube HDR?
Of course.
I use it on my B7, and I also had audio skipping on my Yamaha AVR. I've since replaced it with an HDR enabled Pioneer, and now ARC is working perfectly fine.
To add to the other discussion, Atmos shows up as DD+ on my receiver via ARC.
RedlineRonin
Member
Hmmmmm. Another guy on AVS with an Anthem has the same issue with his C7 so I figured maybe it was an Anthem problem but maybe it's a generic HDMI CEC issue.
HDMI is the worst thing to happen to home theater in the last 20 years.
Yeah I was reading up on ARC and it seems like it's the luck of the draw to getting it to work properly, regardless of what AVR you own.
So I think I'm going to wait to upgrade to "atmos speakers" until I can get a 4K UHD player that outputs Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, and hosts Netflix, Amazon, and Vudu apps that also are updated to output DV and DA. Which might be awhile because it seems like only TV specific Netflix apps right now support Dolby Vision:
https://help.netflix.com/en/node/42384
No devices outside of LG, TCL, and Vizio TVs support DV Netflix. The way MS updates their box though I'm hoping Xbox will be the first non TV device to update to Dolby Vision. They are are already halfway there with atmos support.
So I think I'm going to wait to upgrade to "atmos speakers" until I can get a 4K UHD player that outputs Dolby Vision, Dolby Atmos, and hosts Netflix, Amazon, and Vudu apps that also are updated to output DV and DA. Which might be awhile because it seems like only TV specific Netflix apps right now support Dolby Vision:
https://help.netflix.com/en/node/42384
No devices outside of LG, TCL, and Vizio TVs support DV Netflix. The way MS updates their box though I'm hoping Xbox will be the first non TV device to update to Dolby Vision. They are are already halfway there with atmos support.
If you did get a dedicated UHD Blu-ray player, most of them also include a Netflix app, which I assume would also support Atmos. So, that would solve two problems in one (though, I'd research each model to make sure I'm right about the Netflix Atmos support).
RedlineRonin
Member
Right I think we'll see it in some of the better roku stuff and shield tv too, as those already support atmos. Just a matter of time hopefully
This is the main issue holding me back from buying a C7. I have been reading about a lot of people complaining that game mode is too dim. Do people think this is fixable via f/w, or is it dim because thats what it takes to achieve the low lag numbers?