Not every game needs to cost hundreds of millions to make. Great looking games at a reasonable cost can be made. Just look at games like Yakuza 5, Captain Toad, and to an extent, No Man's Sky. The problem is that those mid-tier games are ignored by publishers and it seems to be that most games that come out these days are either ridiculously expensive AAA blockbusters or bargain bin indie garbage. Not to say that all indies are bad, because they aren't, but most look like proof of concept type games that never got off the ground.
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This is the poorest generation of all time at creative standpoint...
- Thread starter Angel_DvA
- Start date
Not every game needs to cost hundreds of millions to make. Great looking games at a reasonable cost can be made. Just look at games like Yakuza 5, Captain Toad, and to an extent, No Man's Sky. The problem is that those mid-tier games are ignored by publishers and it seems to be that most games that come out these days are either ridiculously expensive AAA blockbusters or bargain bin indie garbage. Not to say that all indies are bad, because they aren't, but most look like proof of concept type games that never got off the ground.
ArtHands
Thinks buying more servers can fix a bad patch
Yah i agree, these are rather short games. I have no idea why they keep promoting batman when you can clear it in an hour.
Spieler Eins
Member
Nioh, Nier Automata, Gravity Rush 2, Persona 5, Yakuza 0, Tekken 7, Tales of Berseria, Metroid Samus Returns, Ni No Kuni 2, arguably Resident Evil 7 compared to budget bloat RE6, Ace Combat 7,...
MehsterChief
Member
What kind of argument is this? Indie games are much more than a distraction and often offer a much deeper experience than big titles. That's like saying that only blockbuster movies are real movies.
AHA-Lambda
Member
This.
Even then in the AAA space with stuff like Overwatch or Alien Isolation, Wolfenstein, The Evil Within, Prey, Nier and you compare that to the last generation that was defined by grey military shooters, sorry I think you're crazy OP.
TheRazielim
Member
Well, I think we'll never get the mid to late 90s creativity in the industry ever again. At the time, you had the introduction of 3D which introduced or elevated so many new genres to new heights. On top of that, you had many new firms entering who were captivated probably by the new possibilities of storytelling and experiences you could achieve with the technology. Those were often people who came from other fields than gaming, and probably did not grow up with gaming as such. The medium just seemed like an exciting venue to explore new stuff.
It's become a bigger business, and people have figured out things such as "good" design and all sorts of Skinner-box hooks, so it's not surprising that it's not as creative anymore.
Virtual reality is interesting, but philosophically problematic for me, personally. It's too escapist.
But alas, OP you fucked yourself over with your initial complaints. Most people will take your statement as an insult to their own tastes, and will react accordingly. Not to mention they confuse quality with creativity, or don't have the ability to objectively evaluate the state of the industry.
It's become a bigger business, and people have figured out things such as "good" design and all sorts of Skinner-box hooks, so it's not surprising that it's not as creative anymore.
Virtual reality is interesting, but philosophically problematic for me, personally. It's too escapist.
But alas, OP you fucked yourself over with your initial complaints. Most people will take your statement as an insult to their own tastes, and will react accordingly. Not to mention they confuse quality with creativity, or don't have the ability to objectively evaluate the state of the industry.
You're wrong, unless you exclusively play only the biggest AAA titles.
Game were never more creative than they are now.
That's a supremely stupid argument. Some games made by smaller studios offer way more than AAA or mid tier productions.
Game were never more creative than they are now.
That's a supremely stupid argument. Some games made by smaller studios offer way more than AAA or mid tier productions.
I don't know, I felt the game was more tedious and repetitive than being better than "99% of games". Core gameplay was marvelous, granted, but that wasn't enough for me.
In fact, MGSV removed most of the tone and direction that made the franchise unique and creative compared to many others.
Pie and Beans
Look for me on the local news, I'll be the guy arrested for trying to burn down a Nintendo exec's house.
I'm playing fully formed entirely new gameplay concepts in goddam virtual reality, m8. We finally there. Maybe yer just bored of them old rectangle display games.
Those are all poor reasons to say this gen is poor. This gen has been fantastic for great games and will continue to be.
This is bang on point. If you've been around since Pong then you've probably seen the biggest leaps in gaming for years.
All the C64,Spectrum games were basically indies (Bedroom programmers). Then we hit 3D visuals etc.
Not saying there's no innovation nowadays. There's fantastic titles out there but I get where the OP is coming from.
I guess VR will probably be the next tech leap that may bring genuinely new experiences etc. Time will tell.
TheRazielim
Member
Wow! How were the physics? And the online multiplayer?
I still don't understand why remasters have received such negative push back. Films get re-released on new formats all of the time and I don't see anyone saying home video is a symptom of problems in that industry. Some remasters can be rather lackluster of course, but I think overall they're a good thing.
veloxStrix
Banned
oldmanclouds.bmp
There are all kinds of new and exciting games. We had What Remains of Edith Finch, Nex Machina, SUPERHOT, and tons more outside of AAA. We had Nier Automata, Prey, The Last Guardian which were all novel. Just because you decided to only play the most marketed AAA games doesn't mean the generation sucks.
There are all kinds of new and exciting games. We had What Remains of Edith Finch, Nex Machina, SUPERHOT, and tons more outside of AAA. We had Nier Automata, Prey, The Last Guardian which were all novel. Just because you decided to only play the most marketed AAA games doesn't mean the generation sucks.
DR2K
Banned
The general consensus in a hobbyist forum is you need to broaden your horizons.
Why not ask specifically what you're looking for, what you've played and what you consider creatively lacking? If you're looking for an echo chamber that shares your misguided sentiments, then you're not getting it.
Why not ask specifically what you're looking for, what you've played and what you consider creatively lacking? If you're looking for an echo chamber that shares your misguided sentiments, then you're not getting it.
eso76
Member
Games have become too expensive to make, publishers don't want to take risks and still think they can predict a game's economical success by focus grouping the shit out of everything.
Thankfully we've also seen the raise of A and AA (or even BB ) games in the shape of digital downloads, cheaper, smaller titles and indie games.
Its the same old "we need to make a game, let's try to have an idea" vs "I have an idea, I need to turn it into a game"
Thankfully we've also seen the raise of A and AA (or even BB ) games in the shape of digital downloads, cheaper, smaller titles and indie games.
Its the same old "we need to make a game, let's try to have an idea" vs "I have an idea, I need to turn it into a game"
Infernal Monkey
Member
You can't complain about unoriginal games and then beg for more Kojima garbage in the same OP.
Look beyond triple A titles for a change; there are lot of video games being released this gen and you're clearly ignoring most of them.
No online only split screen. Physics were ok though.
Indie and Early Access games are the only ones really pushing the creative bubble these days. And they are only able to do so because the devs making those games can afford it due to the market conditions. VR will get there too eventually once devs stop worrying about finding ways to fund their game and worry more about innovating within the new environments.
AAA devs are stuck in an assembly line to pump out the same stuff over and over again. Or they are stuck reinventing stuff that is already been invented. Unfortunately it will be like this until the formulas stop making $.
MGSV being incomplete actually makes the game more creative than other games. Just saying lol. Not to mention the final mission in MGSV is probably the most creative thing any video game director has done this entire gen.
AAA devs are stuck in an assembly line to pump out the same stuff over and over again. Or they are stuck reinventing stuff that is already been invented. Unfortunately it will be like this until the formulas stop making $.
MGSV being incomplete actually makes the game more creative than other games. Just saying lol. Not to mention the final mission in MGSV is probably the most creative thing any video game director has done this entire gen.
You know its true.
Spieler Eins
Member
No, because indie movies usually still feel adequate and maybe even come to theaters right alongside the blockbusters. You might not even know when a movie is indie. While your average indie game is still miles away from reaching even the scope of something like Nier Automata, hence it costs only a fraction and is clearly separated from other titles in stores. Only seldom is even a good indie concept not handicapped by lack of budget to go full out. Unless you only look at the biggest hits. But even among those, there's way too many retro throwbacks and walking simulators (i.e. the complete opposite of creativity).
Wow good catch.
Everyone and their grandmother knew the "twist" in MGSV was coming before the game was even out.
Crankshaft
Member
Some people only like blockbusters. Not all of us have the time to watch every movie/play every game. It's not too much to ask for AAA to experiment a little more. People didn't buy a ps4/xbx1 just to play the same indie games you can play on a vita. Yeah indie games are great but don't get mad that some people treat them as a snack and not the main meal.
Intheflorsh
Banned
You're gonna have to explain that logic.
Primethius
Banned
Couldn't disagree more. This gen walks over the past couple of gens in creativity and breadth of unique titles available.
This is apparent even within genres, such as FPS, as most FPS games have actually become quite diverse rather than wanting to be just another COD clone like last gen.
This is apparent even within genres, such as FPS, as most FPS games have actually become quite diverse rather than wanting to be just another COD clone like last gen.
Bl@de
Member
Same here. I don't even know what to play next because there are just so many great and innovative games for cheap prices.
Shadowhelper
Banned
Yup, was going to say pretty much the samething.
The games OP is mentioning are all AAA, and obviously that is true. AAA games are boring, repetitive, and unoriginal, compared to past generations. You know exactly what you're getting. Even with original games.
It makes sense. They cost more and take longer to make. You can't afford for it to not sell well anymore, so they just make them mainstream and accesible. Don't take risks as that is dangerous with so much money on the line.
But the true heart of gaming is in indie games now. I'll always play and be interested in AAA games, but they don't excite me at all anymore, and I don't pick them up at launch anymore. Nintendo is a bit different, as I still love their games, but they are different. Not as obsessed with graphics, which is right.
I really don't know what is achieved by better graphics anymore. Uncharted 4 is such a technological showcase, and thats why it works. The game itself takes a backseat, and it would be extremely boring if it wasn't so pretty. Unlike my friends I'm not that interested in technological showcases anymore.
Last gen I had two consoles, this gen three and yet ive purchased probably a third the number of games that I did by the same point last gen. To me that's indicative that this gen is lacking. If youre someone that is pumped to play sequels to last gen series then this gen is probably pretty awesome but for me I burnt out on a lot of those IP so the new stuff is slim pickings outside of the indie scene.
TheRazielim
Member
Can you name those CRPG and adventure games that aren't aping the fan favourites of the 90s?
Clarkus Darkus
Member
Couldn't disagree more, You mention R7 but fail to mention it can be played in VR, Which according to the OP doesn't count as creative. And it is entirely a new experience, And the best i have had for many a year.
Clearly a stealth Destiny OP thread, But the word poor does not belong in the same sentance as VR & creative.
Play Farpoint with the AIM and then come back and say that's not creative and a new experience.
OP says he has the PSVR then proclaims it's point and click and short adventures, But the thread is about creativity not replay value and length.
Has there ever been an indie version of GTA V, GR Wildlands, Uncharted, modern Elder Scrolls or Fallout, etc? As large, feature packed, and as competent as those games? Indie games are fine but in many cases they don't come close to replicating the experiences millions of people are looking for.
Just as Birdman or Super aren't direct replacements capable of satisfying the desires of most Marvel or DC movie fans.
Spiritwalker
Member
Can't say I agree. This generation is up there with the PS2 for me.
HellofaMouse
Member
Everything HAD TO be new in the ps2 era. Devs had finally figured out how to make 3d games and the transition from 2d to 3d was complete.
And this gen is WAY better than ps360 era in terms of creativity imo. Not every fps is a cod clone anymore, we are getting some of the best rpgs on both western and eastern fronts, adventure genre is resurrected, and even open world games are on the brink of change tnx to botw. Then theres indies, a sht ton of creative and exciting indies..
And this gen is WAY better than ps360 era in terms of creativity imo. Not every fps is a cod clone anymore, we are getting some of the best rpgs on both western and eastern fronts, adventure genre is resurrected, and even open world games are on the brink of change tnx to botw. Then theres indies, a sht ton of creative and exciting indies..
TheRazielim
Member
What titles have made you think there is adventure genre resurrection?
Sure but the creativity comes from how that twist is presented and revealed to the player. Even by Kojima standards that final mission is one of his most creative accomplishments as a director. Hate it or not.
Because the game is already more creative than other games. Being incomplete on top of that makes the whole experience extra creative? Everything that happened with Konami after the game released was even more ridiculous and crazy. Plus the game was very polished and had hundreds n hundreds of hrs in content despite being incomplete. MGSV is as a unique of an gaming experience as you can have imho. Especially if you experienced it all accordingly.
I completely disagree. Even without considering indie games.
Bloodborne, Nier Automata and The Last Guardian already made the whole generation worth it, to me. They may not have reinvented the wheel, but 3 games I can safely say will be in my top 10 in such a short amount of time is insane.
And there are many games that already came out and I'm sure I'll enjoy, but still didn't get a chance to play.
Hell, I have a considerable PS3 backlog.
Bloodborne, Nier Automata and The Last Guardian already made the whole generation worth it, to me. They may not have reinvented the wheel, but 3 games I can safely say will be in my top 10 in such a short amount of time is insane.
And there are many games that already came out and I'm sure I'll enjoy, but still didn't get a chance to play.
Hell, I have a considerable PS3 backlog.
family_guy
Member
Look at what sells though. Most of the creative stuff have been commercial failures, so why bother? It's not just a problem in the games industry. Look at movies. Mostly superhero movies, Star Wars, and remakes of old stuff. Consumers made this possible and I don't blame publishers for riding that train until the bottom falls out. Games are products made by people who have to pay their bills.
Divinity OS and and Shadowrun series.
Dawg, the way it's presented is really bad. You're just replaying the incredibly tedious intro with a new cutscene at the end. They didn't even remove the tutorial prompts if I'm not mistaken.
You really need to elaborate on that.
But it's not? It has some really good individual mechanics, but nothing about it is new or creative. It's just a refined version of gameplay we've been seeing since, shit... a decade maybe?
And let's not act like the entire game gets very stale and repetitive in a matter of hours.