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Negotiator · Oct 17, 2017

Blam said:
Well a eSports game can't be run on 16Hz tickrate so I don't think anyone wants that. Also seeing as you can literally not post any nintendo content online without getting fucked by them. Then nobody wants to play it and in return we won't have any viewers.

And let's not forget this one as well:

https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoSw...oon_2_has_double_the_input_lag_of_splatoon_1/
http://aresplatoon2controlsfixed.com/

Whenever I hear about "eSports" these days, I know that it's PR bullshit 99.9% of the time.

Hazu · Oct 17, 2017

Nintendo games are doing poorly on Twitch (except during the big Smash tournaments). I see why Nintendo should not waste their time with eSports, since most people just don't care about their games.

Stencil · Oct 17, 2017

It is fun to watch; I just got sucked into that vid for a good ten minutes.

I was hoping it would become popular as an eSport. eSports are something I've never gotten into, as I've mainly been a Nintendo boy all my life. Had ARMs or Splatoon become more popular in that realm I would've liked to have partaken in spectating.

Oh well.

Stormblessed · Oct 17, 2017

There were UK events running concurrent with the Flight Vs Invisibility Splatfest - qualifiers for something bigger, as I recall. I think it does fine - it just won't be as big as LoL, CS or DOTA.

Hazu · Oct 17, 2017

Stormblessed said:
There were UK events running concurrent with the Flight Vs Invisibility Splatfest - qualifiers for something bigger, as I recall. I think it does fine - it just won't be as big as LoL, CS or DOTA.

That tournament had less than 1000 viewers.. it was far from "doing fine".

Sylverstone14 · Oct 17, 2017

There are tournaments and a competitive scene, but it's not "eSports" huge like League of Legends or CS:GO.

Crayolan · Oct 17, 2017

Isn't the Splatoon competitive scene mostly in Japan? I know Splatoon 1 had a bunch of tourneys over there.

Reki · Oct 17, 2017

ScOULaris said:
What happened to the underground Splatoon leagues that the commercials depicted.[/IMG]

They're clandestine in order to avoid getting a C&D, that's why you don't see them.

Jk, but it would be interesting to see the competitive scene develop further.

Heropon Weegee · Oct 17, 2017

Along with the tickrate issue, I think Nintendo's grasp on streamers and youtubers might be part of the issue too imo

VichoCardenas · Oct 17, 2017

Heartskips said:
So thousands of viewers, sponsored players, circuits and decent social media presence? Sounds good.

While Smash isn't a CSGO or Dota, the community is active and there are many tournaments.

Yeah, can't wait for the community to continue supporting Melee having newer alternatives and keep sinking the scene themselves. Sounds really good.

GenericUser · Oct 17, 2017

you've been way to deep into the GAF bubble to believe that splatoon 2 would be an actual esport.

Principate · Oct 17, 2017

Crayolan said:
Isn't the Splatoon competitive scene mostly in Japan? I know Splatoon 1 had a bunch of tourneys over there.

Same with ARMS funnily enough. Nintendo only gives a crap about the Japanese competitive scene.

Griss · Oct 17, 2017

It was just using the wave of e-sports popularity as marketing, I don't think Nintendo ever actually intended to make it a major e-sport. I certainly didn't think so, anyway.

zoukka · Oct 17, 2017

The Switch is a natural deterrant to competitive gamers and streamers.

Heartskips · Oct 17, 2017

VichoCardenas said:
Yeah, can't wait for the community to continue supporting Melee having newer alternatives and keep sinking the scene themselves. Sounds really good.

I was talking mostly about Smash 4 though. Just forget about Melee, it's already it's own thing. These guys wouldn't play newer Smash games even if it tried to appeal to them.

Most of the competitive S4 community came from Brawl and will go to the next Smash game.

plagiarize · Oct 17, 2017

Interesting reading that article about the balance.

They nerfed my Aerospray in 1.4 so I switched to the tri-slosher, mainly because I'd enjoyed using it when it fell into my hands in salmon run. I'm not surprised to hear it's OP, but it's certainly not commonly used yet. I ran into maybe one other player armed with one during 50 rounds on Saturday.

But it definitely took my bad K/D ratio with the aerospray on 1.4 and flipped it the right way around. Still saw loads of aerosprays.

Is there anything inherently bad about an e-sport favoring short range players though? I enjoy watching splatoon pros go at it also, and I find the in your face dog fights more exciting than sniper stand offs. Maybe that's just me, and maybe it is part of the problem.

VichoCardenas · Oct 17, 2017

Heartskips said:
I was talking mostly about Smash 4 though. Just forget about Melee, it's already it's own thing. These guys wouldn't play newer Smash games even if it tried to appeal to them.

Most of the competitive S4 community came from Brawl and will go to the next Smash game.

I think that Melee/Rest separation really hurt the Smash scene. You don't see Marvel vs, Capcom 2 or Street Fighter IV tournaments anymore, why Melee fans keep feeling so special?

Gestault · Oct 17, 2017

In-game communication was such a pain, I dropped off any interest in the mutliplayer a month after release. I was dug in pretty deeply early on, but I know I'm not alone in just sort of giving a frown and putting it back on the shelf.

If the scene has a comeback, I'd love to see it, but the fundementals aren't there.

phanphare · Oct 17, 2017

Blam said:
Well a eSports game can't be run on 16Hz tickrate so I don't think anyone wants that. Also seeing as you can literally not post any nintendo content online without getting fucked by them. Then nobody wants to play it and in return we won't have any viewers.

luckily that doesn't affect the local wired LAN mode but they should address the tick rate for certain modes like league and private battle so online play can be better

DrArchon · Oct 17, 2017

VichoCardenas said:
I think that Melee/Rest separation really hurt the Smash scene. You don't see Marvel vs, Capcom 2 or Street Fighter IV tournaments anymore, why Melee fans keep feeling so special?

I don't see a problem with this. Clearly the Smash 4 scene isn't hurting for lack of players, so who cares if the Melee vets don't switch games? More than likely they'd just stop playing altogether and not move over to the newer game.

The Smash scene is clearly healthy enough to support two games, so ragging on Melee doesn't make much sense to me.

Jarsonot · Oct 17, 2017

Seeing it in a commercial isn't a promise. Using Axe body spray won't actually make women magically drawn to you.

RecRoulette · Oct 17, 2017

WhoaIsThatMars said:
Did you seriously expect regularly scheduled events inside stadiums?

Anyways, Splatoon Koshien 2018 is a thing and there are events all over Japan leading up to the event. I would never expect events outside of Japan as frequent as Japan events

This pretty much.

A lot of people were into Splatoon 2 at NWC, so I hope NoA looks at that and makes something happen. But I can already hear the Smash players laughing.

mugwhump · Oct 17, 2017

Dyle said:
It also doesn't help that the balance is kind of screwed up and Nintendo basically keeps swapping top weapons with each patch. This article by FLC does a good job of explaining how Splatoon 2 is heavily tilted in favor of short range weapons, in a way that Splatoon 1 wasn't.

That was interesting

jmizzal · Oct 17, 2017

Did the big esports game become huge esports games 4 months after release?

Just asking since I dont know how esports popularity works

collige · Oct 17, 2017

This is one of those things where Nintendo's backwards online philosophies really hurts them. Unlike fighting games where you can grind by yourself, organization around a team game really needs a robust online community which is harder to do when there's no voice chat and uploading VODs to Youtube risks having Nintendo getting on your ass.

VichoCardenas said:
I think that Melee/Rest separation really hurt the Smash scene. You don't see Marvel vs, Capcom 2 or Street Fighter IV tournaments anymore, why Melee fans keep feeling so special?

Probably because Capcom didn't intentionally design SV5 and MvC3 around the lowest common denominator at the expense of serious players.

UnemployedVillain · Oct 17, 2017

ITT: OP expecting Splatoon to be at the level of LoL or something despite the SERIES only be on systems with a combined userbase of not even 20 million

collige said:
Probably because Capcom didn't intentionally design SV5 and MvC3 around the lowest common denominator at the expense of serious players.

Jubenhimer · Oct 17, 2017

I honestly have no idea. It's probably up to the community at this point. Also the whole "no streaming" thing only applies to those who are part of the YouTube Creators Program (which is a whole mess in an of itself). Seeing as how most gamers stream to Twitch these days, it makes more sense to start an eSports viewership there.

LordKasual · Oct 17, 2017

I don't know how anyone took an "E-sports" promise from Nintendo seriously. Nothing about any of their games, stances, patching habits, or policies/trends concerning netplay would even slightly suggest that they'd ever setup a decent E-sports scene.

They have self-contained online games that lack even the most basic competitive netplay functionality.

Splatoon's E-sports presence was doomed to be a minor thing. It'll exist where it does (Japan) and likely never be pushed much farther.

Jims · Oct 17, 2017

I think the, uh, rather leisurely paced roll-out of weapons in Splatoon 2 is also hurting the game. Splatoon 2 obviously launched with more content that than the first game, that is just a fact. But its sequel is still kinda struggling to catch up to the first game in terms of variety. We are two months into the sequel and the game is still pretending like the Range Blaster or Hydra Splatling never existed.

Nintendo's games-as-a-service approach to the series is hurting the sequel, in my opinion, and I think it's limiting some of the appeal in competitive settings. I've been okay with their approach in the past, but it's starting to make less and less sense in this new game.

totowhoa · Oct 17, 2017

Its not a popular esport, but theres absolutely a pro/tourney scene. Theyre great to watch for self improvement - some have good YT channels.

It was never gonna become a huge thing though

javac · Oct 17, 2017

collige said:
Probably because Capcom didn't intentionally design SV5 and MvC3 around the lowest common denominator at the expense of serious players.

Melee, the intellectuals fighting game.

Burnburn · Oct 17, 2017

There's going to be a European championship hosted by Nintendo where all countries that have a Nintendo HQ are going to take part of. Right now all the countries are having qualifiers with a lot of them being streamed and getting youtube videos posted on their respectative youtube channel.

Nintendo has done a very bad job marketing this though and they themselves probably dont know how to market it.

Also stealth brag I guess, but me and my team qualified for the dutch finals last week and are hoping to make it to the eu finals

Also; what's the definition of esports, do you have to sell out a stadium for something to be esports? Do you have to make a living off of it for it to be esports? Obviously what Nintendo showed in the switch trailer was never going to happen, but too often people expect too much off a game to be esports.

RoyalFool · Oct 17, 2017

The best players can't get their parents permission to attend.

Just kidding, Nintendo fucked over most of the folks they now need with their stupid takedown policies and profit sharing schemes.

collige · Oct 17, 2017

javac said:
Melee, the intellectuals fighting game.

I mean, Sakurai literally admitted that he made design decisions around lower skill players and the Wiimote-only control scheme (which ended up being pretty shitty anyway). I'll leave it at that though cause this isn't a Smash thread.

pretty done · Oct 17, 2017

javac said:
Melee, the intellectuals fighting game.

They play Rick and Morty to boost the players IQ in the background.

DrArchon · Oct 17, 2017

Burnburn said:
Also; what's the definition of esports, do you have to sell out a stadium for something to be esports? Do you have to make a living off of it for it to be esports? Obviously what Nintendo showed in the switch trailer was never going to happen, but too often people expect too much off a game to be esports.

I was under the impression that a game is "esports" when players can play it competitively as a job. Like, if you're good enough you can totally make a living off of Dota 2 or CSGO or SFV to a lesser extent.

Not really Splatoon though.

Negotiator · Oct 17, 2017

phanphare said:
luckily that doesn't affect the local wired LAN mode but they should address the tick rate for certain modes like league and private battle so online play can be better

What's the tick rate of the local wired LAN mode?

commish · Oct 17, 2017

LordKasual said:
I don't know how anyone took an "E-sports" promise from Nintendo seriously. Nothing about any of their games, stances, patching habits, or policies/trends concerning netplay would even slightly suggest that they'd ever setup a decent E-sports scene.

They have self-contained online games that lack even the most basic competitive netplay functionality.

Splatoon's E-sports presence was doomed to be a minor thing. It'll exist where it does (Japan) and likely never be pushed much farther.

Yes ,this sums up how I see it. It's unfortunate but N just doesn't take online play seriously, let alone to the extent necessary for the esports scene.

BlackBuzzard · Oct 17, 2017

Remember when people thought Arms should be at EVO good times.

iKhameleon · Oct 17, 2017

It's maybe not as big as some were (unrealistically) expecting, but there are quite a few tournaments. DUDE (thatsrb2dude) from Team Olive frequently streams their tournaments on Twitch. They competed in 2 seperate tournaments this past weekend.

Trup1aya · Oct 17, 2017

Splatoon could have a major esports presence if it had developer support. Smash can do the grassroots thing because it's 1v1. But in this day and age , aren't going to be able to maintain a high-level team sport without a sturdy infrastructure.

Jubenhimer · Oct 17, 2017

RoyalFool said:
most of the folks they now need with their stupid takedown policies and profit sharing schemes.

While Nintendo's handling of YouTube is a mess, keep in mind, I don't think it's them being overloards considering plenty of channels who aren't part of their MCN can upload Nintendo content just fine. The problem is also how YouTube in general works. Their broken copyright system, and Content ID bullshit is the real root of the problem. I think it's more that Nintendo thinks they're helping when in reality, they're just making a convoluted series of polices even more convoluted, and that's probably what pisses people off.

I'd be more upset about this if gaming on YouTube wasn't such a big joke these days. Seriously, it all feels like one big circle derp where nobody has any idea what they're doing, and has no solution on how to fix it.

phanphare · Oct 17, 2017

RoyalFool said:
The best players can't get their parents permission to attend.

Just kidding, Nintendo fucked over most of the folks they now need with their stupid takedown policies and profit sharing schemes.

what are you talking about?

Heartskips · Oct 17, 2017

Burnburn said:
There's going to be a European championship hosted by Nintendo where all countries that have a Nintendo HQ are going to take part of. Right now all the countries are having qualifiers with a lot of them being streamed and getting youtube videos posted on their respectative youtube channel.

Nintendo has done a very bad job marketing this though and they themselves probably dont know how to market it.

Also stealth brag I guess, but me and my team qualified for the dutch finals last week and are hoping to make it to the eu finals

Where can I watch this? I wasn't even aware this tournament was happening and I do try to watch Splatoon sometimes.

BlackBuzzard said:
Remember when people thought Arms should be at EVO good times.

ScaryBrandon · Oct 17, 2017

Have a look on Twitch or youtube. If your game is not PC centric, its irrelevant these days. Sorry console folk but your days are truly numbered.

NSESN · Oct 17, 2017

It exists, it isn't as big as it could be if Nintendo avtually tried, but it exists.

MrRixter said:
Have a look on Twitch or youtube. If your game is not PC centric, its irrelevant these days. Sorry console folk but your days are truly numbered.

What?

Principate · Oct 17, 2017

Heartskips said:
Where can I watch this? I wasn't even aware this tournament was happening and I do try to watch Splatoon sometimes.

Biggest fighting game in Japan outside of smash too.

WaterAstro · Oct 17, 2017

It won't be a successful esports if it doesn't happen regularly.

It's up to Nintendo to make it happen, but I doubt they will.

Raysoul · Oct 17, 2017

Heartskips said:

It actually outsold Mahvel.

DrArchon · Oct 17, 2017

Raysoul said:
It actually outsold Mahvel.

A wet paper bag could've outsold Marvel, so that's not really saying much.

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